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Thread: Differences between enneagram types 1 and 6

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    Default Differences between enneagram types 1 and 6

    I am having a difficult time picking between the two. I don't think I am expressive enough to be a 1w2 or passive enough for a 1w9. I'm not sure what a 6w7 looks like or a 6w5.
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    Expressive? I'm a 1w2, and I don't consider myself very expressive. I don't know what a 6w7 or a 6w5 looks like either, or even a 6 no wing. Maybe you're a 6-1-X or a 1-6-X. Have you heard of tritype?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bardia View Post
    I am having a difficult time picking between the two. I don't think I am expressive enough to be a 1w2 or passive enough for a 1w9. I'm not sure what a 6w7 looks like or a 6w5.
    First I wouldn't worry about the wings, they are like added zest or flavor to the root personality. The personality type is like say chicken, the wings are like, sweet and sour chicken vs sesame chicken vs ginger soy chicken vs you get the point.

    Anyways its very hard to determine your type by expecting all the pieces to fall into place right at the start, the enneagram has a lot of ways to add additional flavors to the same types and for this reason on the surface people of the same type may look completely different. I mean just consider the instinctual stackings, tritype, triads, and wings.

    So I'd suggest you first peg yourself as one of the nine types in a very straight-foward practical manner or at least rule out some types or come to a set of types that matches you then play through figuring out which one is your match from this set.

    Anyways enough of that, lets get down to the way you can split the differences between 6's and 1's.

    -Sixes are part of the Thinking Triad
    -Sixes are part of the Intensity Harmonic Group
    -Sixes are part of the Compliant Triad
    -Sixes are considered Embracing Approval Seeking by the Directional Theory

    Contrast this with

    -Ones are part of the Instinctual Triad
    -Ones are part of the Competency Harmonic Group
    -Sixes are part of the Compliant Triad
    -Ones are consider Confronting Ideal Seeking by The Directional Theory

    What all this means I'll post in a while, don't have the time to explain these differences, but they are all key to drawing the line and illuminating the differences between the two types.

    Also sorry if it seems like I am taking a long time to get to the good part, I have to crank it all out from the basic principles to get to it, give it a little time and you will see.

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    My husband is an E6. that's all I have to say.
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    You might want to check out my 6w7 thread.

    1s are not known for being terribly expressive--actually it's the opposite. 1w9s are like vulcans, 1w2s are like nuns/clergy.

    6s are very distrusting of authority and don't like the 1ish tendency to make up arbitrary rules. The conflict between God and Eve from the bible is sort of like the conflict between a 1 and a 6. Who is he to tell me I can't eat from the tree of knowledge???
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    Quote Originally Posted by electric sheep View Post
    6s are very distrusting of authority and don't like the 1ish tendency to make up arbitrary rules.
    That is not ALL 6's, its can be a 6, but it also can be a 1-9 really. Distrust of authority is not a major concept of the 6, issues with trust yes, but distrust of authority; No.

    6's are likely to actually put their faith into a system for security purpose to alleviate anxiety. They may even ally with another authority if they fear a competeing one. Then again they may ally with a revolution or movement of people if they are afraid of an oppresive system. Sixes are security based though and compliant embracing approval seekers, they are out to form allegiances for security. This is characteristic of sixes because sevens deal with anxiety by a sort of special brand of positive thinking and denial and fives deal with anxiety by intellectual mastery and withdrawl. Sevens are too free-spirited to be bound by an authority for securit and Fives are too withdrawn to be bound by an authority (they care more about their inner cerebral worlds).

    In other words 6's are just as likely to trust authority as mistrust it, thats why they have issues with trust, they struggle to figure out which people/authorities are trustworthy and which aren't.

    1's also don't make arbitrary rules, 1's fear that without some kind of system of justice rage/anger and instinctual desire will run rampart unchecked. For them the contrast is that its not about security, its about controlling the visceral instinctive animalistic fiery rage/anger/desire primal energies people have and subordinating them to a productive system where people can coexist.

    6's don't care if they lived in a debauch evil system of primalistic taboo, as long as they feel protected and safe and not anxious - 1's do care, in fact a one would likely see it as morally heroic to place ones need for safety below ones need for morality/justice/order - a 6 would see it as stupidity in most cases.

    Saying something like 1's are the arbritary rule meisters and 6's are the mistrusting anti-authoritians is a gross over-simplication of the motivations that bely the types. While I see where you were going with it, a major way to circumvent confusion is to ask WHY the person mistrusts authority... if its out of a kind of paranoid feeling that the government is out to get them, then a 6 fits, but keep in mind alot of 6's are also gaurdians of social institutions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    6s, from everything that I've read just sound unbalanced - sort of neurotic and fearful, or banty roosters trying to prove they're not. Probably better to get someone who actually is the type to talk about them instead, because descriptions make them sound a bit insane.
    6's are just security oriented anxious/thinking types.

    While at their worst they may seem neurotic, alarmist, and paranoid. At their best they are very proactive, loyal, stable/secure. There is no type in the enneagram personality system that is considered to be just naturally great or naturally bad, all types have their low states and high.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Expressive? I'm a 1w2, and I don't consider myself very expressive. I don't know what a 6w7 or a 6w5 looks like either, or even a 6 no wing. Maybe you're a 6-1-X or a 1-6-X. Have you heard of tritype?
    No, I don't really know anything about tritypes. I'll have to look into that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mimosa Pudica View Post
    E1s:
    - Prefectionism
    - look for correctness, put things in order, like rules/regulations/systems
    - see too that people do as they should
    - can be critical, focused on what can go wrong, look for what's missing
    - often focus on numbers/facts (rather than people) [This is a hard one because I focus on both equally I feel]
    - often think they are right and others wrong


    E6s:
    - Looking for safety
    - want to belong, feel safe and secure, need to trust their opinions/see consistency of thoughts
    - careful, responsible, good citizens, often tradition oriented
    - often pessimistic and suspicious of people: fear problems and look for things that can go wrong
    - can bend to others to fit into a group, but can also be very stubborn if they have made up their mind about something.
    I relate to all of these ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by electric sheep View Post
    1s are not known for being terribly expressive--actually it's the opposite. 1w9s are like vulcans, 1w2s are like nuns/clergy.

    6s are very distrusting of authority and don't like the 1ish tendency to make up arbitrary rules. The conflict between God and Eve from the bible is sort of like the conflict between a 1 and a 6. Who is he to tell me I can't eat from the tree of knowledge???
    I guess I relate more to the one definition you gave.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    Where'd you get the idea that 1w9 is passive? Or that 1w2 is expressive? Neither is correct.
    I read some descriptions a while ago and I guess that was the impression I got from them. I should probably go look them all up again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    Ones: Do you feel like everybody else is a little wanting in most categories, and they'd better leave things to you, someone who will do it right? Do you get irritated that you always have to be the responsible one, because clearly you're the only one who will be? Do you get words like "dependable, responsible, has-it-together, reliable" heaped on you all the time, and sometimes you're a little sick of it and wish you could be called something that sounds slightly more interesting?

    Do banks, lawyers, teachers, and all arbiters of regulatory nonsense love you and wish everyone was like you? Do you purposely screw up and do things wrong, acting scatter-brained and ridiculous just to escape all of this from time to time? Do you find that you end up avoiding romantic connections because nobody ever measures up to your standards anyway? Did you ever watch Dexter and think that Lila before she was discovered to be a little nuts was pretty much exactly the kind of person who'd you like to be around and would be good for you - gleefully breaking rules and bringing you into it, allowing you to not have to be so careful and responsible, bringing you out of your self-imposed perfection, and forcing you to let yourself be almost a normal person? Do you make decisions quickly and directly, and then any evidence that they weren't right, makes you almost sick for a short while until you've worked through this?

    Then, you're either a one, or you're as ridiculous, contained, self-critical, and crazy as I am.
    All of the first paragraph lol. I don't relate to the purposefully screwing up part. Though sometimes I just kind of say screw this assignment or whatever because I don't feel like perfecting it. Sometimes I think I'm never going to find the one because there is something wrong with everyone. I've never seen Dexter but Lila sounds interesting. I wouldn't say I make decisions quickly most of the time. I usually try to think things through carefully, but when they do go wrong I do get upset somewhat. I'm working on controlling my anxiety due to perfection though. I might just be a 1 with anxiety issues that make me think I'm a 6 sometimes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post

    6's don't care if they lived in a debauch evil system of primalistic taboo, as long as they feel protected and safe and not anxious - 1's do care, in fact a one would likely see it as morally heroic to place ones need for safety below ones need for morality/justice/order - a 6 would see it as stupidity in most cases.

    Saying something like 1's are the arbritary rule meisters and 6's are the mistrusting anti-authoritians is a gross over-simplication of the motivations that bely the types. While I see where you were going with it, a major way to circumvent confusion is to ask WHY the person mistrusts authority... if its out of a kind of paranoid feeling that the government is out to get them, then a 6 fits, but keep in mind alot of 6's are also gaurdians of social institutions.
    Are you confusing 6 with sp/so?

    I don't see things like that at all...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    Yes, of course, that goes without saying. But, looking at where you go when you're not in the healthiest state of mind I think is the best way to determine your own enneagram type.
    Yea there are many techniques to e-typing, that is an effective one considering you take time to observe your own weaknesses/downfalls/disintegrations from time to time.

    Also I am not so sure it goes without saying, I think a lot of people can get tripped up by the whole strength/weakness idea. They type based on weaknesses to look for a rationalization for their errors and they type based on strengths to make themselves feel better or have themselves believe that they have some great potential in some area. Ideally people shouldn't type with these in mind imo, they should just try to be objective and accurate and then after they have come up with a type they can use the knowledge of their weaknesses/strengths to help manage themselves better through a higher amount of knowledge about their personalities.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    Are you confusing 6 with sp/so?

    I don't see things like that at all...
    Well its likely you don't see things like that at all, because I wasn't writting a person account of your personality.... I was aiming to illustrate a basic concept, I was working on the theoritical level and not the practical.

    Either your typing is incorrect or we have our wires crossed... or perhaps both, at any rate you need to elaborate on how you conflict with this so I can actually figure out which is the case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    That is not ALL 6's, its can be a 6, but it also can be a 1-9 really. Distrust of authority is not a major concept of the 6, issues with trust yes, but distrust of authority; No.

    Isn't distrust part of issues with trust? I experience anxiety about about where I've placed my trust, and I actively distrust authorities I am "against".


    6's are likely to actually put their faith into a system for security purpose to alleviate anxiety.
    Yes.

    They may even ally with another authority if they fear a competeing one. Then again they may ally with a revolution or movement of people if they are afraid of an oppresive system.
    Yes.

    Sixes are security based though and compliant embracing approval seekers, they are out to form allegiances for security. This is characteristic of sixes because sevens deal with anxiety by a sort of special brand of positive thinking and denial and fives deal with anxiety by intellectual mastery and withdrawl. Sevens are too free-spirited to be bound by an authority for securit and Fives are too withdrawn to be bound by an authority (they care more about their inner cerebral worlds).
    Okay, that's pretty much it, but understand that as head center it is felt as an actively practical/logical/principled decision to ally with an authority, rather than a fear based or emotional choice (although it is rooted in that). So, a 6 would come up with explanations and reasonings for their strategizing.

    Just clarifying

    In other words 6's are just as likely to trust authority as mistrust it, thats why they have issues with trust, they struggle to figure out which people/authorities are trustworthy and which aren't.
    But my decisions to trust are not random or un-thoughtout.

    1's also don't make arbitrary rules, 1's fear that without some kind of system of justice rage/anger and instinctual desire will run rampart unchecked. For them the contrast is that its not about security, its about controlling the visceral instinctive animalistic fiery rage/anger/desire primal energies people have and subordinating them to a productive system where people can coexist.
    A 1's rules are not arbitrary to the 1, but they are to the 6.

    6's don't care if they lived in a debauch evil system of primalistic taboo, as long as they feel protected and safe and not anxious - 1's do care, in fact a one would likely see it as morally heroic to place ones need for safety below ones need for morality/justice/order - a 6 would see it as stupidity in most cases.
    maybe an unprincipled cp 6...

    Saying something like 1's are the arbritary rule meisters and 6's are the mistrusting anti-authoritians is a gross over-simplication of the motivations that bely the types. While I see where you were going with it, a major way to circumvent confusion is to ask WHY the person mistrusts authority... if its out of a kind of paranoid feeling that the government is out to get them, then a 6 fits, but keep in mind alot of 6's are also gaurdians of social institutions.
    What about someone who mistrusts the government because of the nature or centralized power, and of historical demonstrations of state corruption? Healthy 6's (moreso 6w5) are probably the most careful and analytical out of all the enneatypes in choosing beliefs, values, and ideaologies, etc.

    The guardian of social institutions sounds like an sp/so or so/sp 6.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    Isn't distrust part of issues with trust? I experience anxiety about about where I've placed my trust, and I actively distrust authorities I am "against".
    Your completely correct, sixes are going to actively distrust authorities they are "against" or they suspect of being untrustworthy.

    I probably didn't take the greatest effort to shed out exactly what I mean but all I am saying is that by no means are sixes on autopilot, always mantaining an attitude of distrust to all authorities in all cases. Sixes only distrust authorities they feel threatened by or anxious of, at other times sixes may turn to authorities for protection and support, especiall when they have logically evaluated those authorities to be worthy of trust.

    (Also its not just feeling threatened, I implicitely assume that they also spend time thinking intelligently to evaluate the threat in a logical manner)

    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    Okay, that's pretty much it, but understand that as head center it is felt as an actively practical/logical/principled decision to ally with an authority, rather than a fear based or emotional choice (although it is rooted in that). So, a 6 would come up with explanations and reasonings for their strategizing.

    Just clarifying
    Yes thats correct, I didn't mean to imply otherwise. To elaborate I think the exact way this works for sixes is they are likely to spend a lot of time thinking to evaluate the nature of the security that will arise from their decision. This differs for example from a 5's thinking in that a 5 wants to understand how something works to alleviate anxiety. 5's think to have mastery and control, 6's think to have security and support.

    This may sound like a partiality to 5's but really 5's can have their problems that 6's don't have.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    But my decisions to trust are not random or un-thoughtout.
    Alright, I can see how what I said seems to imply that, but it isn't. When I wrote that I wasn't talking about an individual six bouncing randomly and uneducated from place to place. I was talking about a large group of sixes, that they will end up in different places each for their own individual thought out reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    A 1's rules are not arbitrary to the 1, but they are to the 6.
    Alright, fair enough, but I was taking arbitrary to mean "without a deeper motivation". The 1's rules do have a motivation, they are not so much rules as they are expressions of their personality in a sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    maybe an unprincipled cp 6...
    Yea definitally, I was using an extreme example to draw a parallel... sixes in some extreme cases could possibly ally themselves with someone they instinctively knew was "evil and morally debauch" if they offered them protection and support. But a one would never, as it essentially goes against the whole basis of the one.

    I could do frame the same argument switching the roles if it disturbs you that I am kind of giving the 6 a hard time.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    What about someone who mistrusts the government because of the nature or centralized power, and of historical demonstrations of state corruption? Healthy 6's (moreso 6w5) are probably the most careful and analytical out of all the enneatypes in choosing beliefs, values, and ideaologies, etc.

    The guardian of social institutions sounds like an sp/so or so/sp 6.
    Agreed, I wasn't saying 6's are needy and cling to authority (maybe 6-2-1 so/sp)... I was just saying that 6's come in a variety of packages. Some for their own individual reasons believe government A to be safe and trustworthy while others believe government A to be distrustful and oppresive. Being a six only defines a psychological motive, not what your actual beliefs about a particular government or person is.
    Last edited by male; 01-20-2010 at 12:35 AM.

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    When a 1 wants to implement a rule, they usually are unable to explain the rationale well enough to a 6. The 1 being a gut type, it's not all that clear to them so they just look for the easiest way to justify themselves. The justification is sought after the initial gut feeling.
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    @Haveluciddreamz: Okay, thanks for the clarifications.

    @e-sheep: Right. A 1 is pushing around themselves and objects/people in their jurisdiction to satisfy the yearning for an ideal state of order and suppression of chaotic rage (like Lucid described). This is -/0 or "confronting/ideal seeking". The 6's analytical reasoning aims to be objective; their surface direction is towards (attached) and their inner direction is acceptance seeking. The product needs to be something that is consistent/reliable that others can be "convinced of" (that others can accept). The 1's ideal seeking on the other hand is not for you, me, they, or we; it's for the 1 and it doesn't need to satisfy anyone else's reasoning, harmony, or desired image (as with the 6, 9, and 3).
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    Quote Originally Posted by electric sheep View Post
    When a 1 wants to implement a rule, they usually are unable to explain the rationale well enough to a 6. The 1 being a gut type, it's not all that clear to them so they just look for the easiest way to justify themselves. The justification is sought after the initial gut feeling.
    Funny I've never seen it exactly that way, I mostly agree but I've always seen for 1's the instinct playing into the actual concept of having rules in general and not so much concerning a specific rule.

    In other words the gut is concerning the issue and deeper philosophy of "Why society needs rules", rather than concerning the issue of "Why society need THIS rule", they are more than willing to explain out the reasoning behind a specific rule, but this reasoning may be perceived as flawed because on the deeper level because a person may not share their philosophy on "Why society needs rules" that seems self-evident and instinctive to them.

    Basically even one's think to some extent, every type is capable of thinking, not just the thinking types.

    Thats the practical answer, upon deeper inspection the reason for this is fascinating. Consider the presence of a thinking type in the one's tritype. This thinking deals with issues of anxiety/dread/uncertainty/confusion, whereas their instinct deals with the more instinctual and visceral issues of anger/rage/lust/desire. The question is though; does the thinking type serve the instinct type or is the thinking type merely a seperate entity in and of itself? I personally am intuitively drawn to think of it as interconnected, that their can be anxiety/dread/uncertainity/confusion generated by the presence of something instinctual that requires thinking through and vice versa, that their is issues of anger/rage/lust/desire generated by the presence of certain anxieties, neurosis', feelings of dread/uncertainity. This observation cements the interconnected nature of the two triads and explains why in all practicality people can both think, feel, and have gut instincts with still being only one type. The e-type doesn't define so much a strict division in their subconcious, but identifies a sort of hub for all of the interconnected motivations of the subconious, a hub that is most strongly connected to their outward ego and affects their behavior the most.

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