8 functions correlated with biological parameters for life

[crazedrat]

my first day in biology class.
According to the teacher there are 8 characteristics all living things have.
here are my thoughts on the correlations:

1: life must consume and expend energy: Ne
2: life must respond to changes in its environment: Se
3: life must maintain a homeostatic environment: Si
4: life must have a plan for its growth encoded in the form of DNA: Ni
5: life must reproduce: Fi
6: life must evolve and descend from previous life forms: Fe
7: life must consist of a cell or cells: Te
8: life must be highly organized: Ti

in my opinion they correlate perfectly ...

I may update this thread with more biology findings, just cuz it helps me remember the shit this way.

[ArchonAlarion]

Hahaha cool.

[tcaudilllg]

I'm seeing some problems. I think some of those may be connected to the same element.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[crazedrat]

Assuming statement 6 is true, how is life supposed to appear on Earth? Did the teacher explained this as well?

My subjective opinion: I'd inverse Ne with Se and Fe with Fi.

You might be right about the Ne Se reversal. I have to think more about it.
Life is presumed to appear on earth as elements naturally organize together as an emergent phenomenon. Number 6 identifies inheritance. Inheritance is part of the emergence process.
For the Fi Fe reversal I think you are wrong. Reproduction, I think, is discriminatory; certain conditions have to be met for it to occur. The process of inheritance is cathartic similar to Fe.

Edit: I have decided you are also wrong about Ne Se. Reason is consuming and expending resources is opportunistic and takes an active role. Responding to changes in ones environment is passive. You are a product of your circumstances.

[krieger]

I think there is a general phenomenom of people that are familiar socionics trying to connect the functions to anything they find in life that comes in 8 catagorical varieties no matter how baseless the connection is in the end.

[crazedrat]

lol. if you want to criticize please follow up with a suitable explanation. Otherwise your criticism is egocentric and worthless.
in my experience you can apply socionics soundly to almost anything. we're dealing with fundamental logic, after all.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[Crispy]

It seems baseless in that whoever made the 8 biological parameters had socionics nowhere near their mind at the same time. But that doesn't mean that there can't be one function for each parameter that seems closer to it than the other functions. In fact you can probably apply it to 8 of anything and have interesting musings. Just imagine what would happen if enneagram only had 8 types, CHAOS!

[crazedrat]

you fail to realize how universal the functions are.

[Crispy]

Probably, but are the biological parameters also universal enough to have very close matches?

[krieger]

About what labcoat said, he's trying to point at my association with Ba-Gua elements, don't worry. I also found that the principles which govern the human psyche are to be found elsewhere in the nature.

Actually, no. I hadn't even noticed you posted in this thread or that had ever made a statement on the topic you mention (wherever you did). On the whole I spend very little time thinking about you and wouldn't mind keeping things that way.

lol. if you want to criticize please follow up with a suitable explanation. Otherwise your criticism is egocentric and worthless.
in my experience you can apply socionics soundly to almost anything. we're dealing with fundamental logic, after all.

1: life must consume and expend energy: Ne - why not Se? Consume refers to an animalistic top-dog/under-dog paradigm
2: life must respond to changes in its environment: Se - sounds more like a Dynamic element
3: life must maintain a homeostatic environment: Si - hm, ok.
4: life must have a plan for its growth encoded in the form of DNA: Ni - plan and encoded could refer to something more Ti/Te ish.
5: life must reproduce: Fi - could be argued to be more Si/Se ish.
6: life must evolve and descend from previous life forms: Fe - any association with functions would be forced
7: life must consist of a cell or cells: Te - ???? I'm phased. Same as the above
8: life must be highly organized: Ti - ok, but Te should also work here

So, yeah. Your associations seem almost random.

[crazedrat]

1: life must consume and expend energy: Ne - why not Se? Consume refers to an animalistic top-dog/under-dog paradigm
Because consuming and expending energy is opportunistic and takes direction. There is the issue of intention. It's more of an active role to take.
2: life must respond to changes in its environment: Se - sounds more like a Dynamic element
It's really the same thing as when you hit a ball with a baseball bat. Responding to changes is reactive. The organism is afflicted with changes by the environment. Reactions are prescribed. In this sense the organism is static.
3: life must maintain a homeostatic environment: Si - hm, ok.
4: life must have a plan for its growth encoded in the form of DNA: Ni - plan and encoded could refer to something more Ti/Te ish.
plan is Ni, plain and simple. it's a course of events. with DNA this plan is dynamic; its expression depends on environmental factors. the complexity of DNA does suggest Ti, but focusing on that aspect here is missing the essence of this point. Instead I delegate that to point 8.
5: life must reproduce: Fi - could be argued to be more Si/Se ish.
refer to the discussion we had up there about discriminatory conditions. I don't see where you're getting Si/Se, you'd have to explain
6: life must evolve and descend from previous life forms: Fe - any association with functions would be forced
inheritance and catharsis seem pretty easy associations to me. the point basically operates on tradition and expression.
7: life must consist of a cell or cells: Te - ???? I'm phased. Same as the above
consider a fact the same thing as a cell. it can be used as a building block, it can do work in the world. a cell emphasizes operation.
8: life must be highly organized: Ti - ok, but Te should also work here
no, this is a framework. Te is not a framework, it's more related to operation. If we looked inside the cell at all the parts, that is Ti. But if we consider it a cell; a discrete unit which performs tasks, that is Te.
So, yeah. Your associations seem almost random.

^

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[krieger]

I can't believe you're asking me to do such legwork for you. Get off my back already.

[crazedrat]

You are being closed minded and it may be related to narcissism.

Probably, but are the biological parameters also universal enough to have very close matches?

parameters for all life? Pretty universal. I duno, you decide. Maybe these parameters will be modified as we discover new life, but I suspect the operating principles will remain the same and only the wording of the parameters will change.

[Crispy]

I guess what I meant to say was the number of parameters could have easily been 6 or even 10, but it shouldn't matter all that much. I agree with most of the correlations anyway.

[crazedrat]

yet they are eight..
Anyway, if they were 6 or 10, I'd apply my modified model of socionics to them

[Crispy]

Fuggin' sneaky Ni dominance!

[Jarno]

I think there is a general phenomenom of people that are familiar socionics trying to connect the functions to anything they find in life that comes in 8 catagorical varieties no matter how baseless the connection is in the end.

Yes, I noticed it too

[crazedrat]

i think you two may have a behavioral understanding of the functions instead of a logic understanding

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[FDG]

labcoat (and Jarno): where the hell did you get that?

Is it legwork to paste 3-4 links to justify your argument, labcoat? I'm not inventing anything, you've taken on me with every crap you could imagine since I posted these days, any not dumb person with a bit of intuition (as in intuition) can tell that. But since you are unable to prove that, I was technically right when I said you were pointing at me, so better shut up.

Lol you're an idiot

[Gilly]

Seriously, I wish he had enough of a social conscience to be laughed out of this place...

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

On the whole I spend very little time thinking about you and wouldn't mind keeping things that way.

lol. Lose the bitchy behavior. Attack the man's ideas, not the man.

I don't see anything really wrong with this though, btw. Fi being reproduction makes sense because it's about relationships between individuals, so it already incorporates the 'individuals are selfishly desired' thing.

[Wrong Way Ticket]

lol. Lose the bitchy behavior. Attack the man's ideas, not the man.

I don't see anything really wrong with this though, btw. Fi being reproduction makes sense because it's about relationships between individuals, so it already incorporates the 'individuals are selfishly desired' thing.

There gets a point when attacking the idea is a pointless exercise. Upon which attacking the man can be really rewarding.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[Wrong Way Ticket]

Personally, I think what you're doing is great. Keep it up big man.

[Gilly]

If you were not a popularity-driven puppet your unjustified condescending comments would affect me more. But it affects me anyway, just for your information...

Oh come on, these people don't even like me

So, do you want me to quit posting here, or something? I don't know how to interpret your modernist irony.

No, I'm actually glad that you came back; you stir the pot If I really wanted you gone, I probably either wouldn't respond to you much at all and would come out of nowhere insulting you, or I would really harangue you constantly and make sure you knew it.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[Wrong Way Ticket]

I'm not desirable.

Poor choice of wording, have you ever been desirable?

[Aiss]

Just imagine what would happen if enneagram only had 8 types, CHAOS!

Whatever makes you think that Enneagram having 9 types stops people from doing the same with it?

Inventing Enneagrams -- The Cycle of Drama

[Wrong Way Ticket]

Whatever makes you think that Enneagram having 9 types stops people from doing the same with it?

Inventing Enneagrams -- The Cycle of Drama

A good example of Confirmation Bias if you ask me.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

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[mu4]

Life is based in thermodynamics
So is Socionic theory

I this this may fit better. I'm not sure about Ethics but mate selection is probably more Fi where as mating and intercourse is probably Fe.

1: life must consume and expend energy: Se Kinetic Energy
2: life must respond to changes in its environment: Te Dynamic Behavior
3: life must maintain a homeostatic environment: Si Ok
4: life must have a plan for its growth encoded in the form of DNA: Ni Ok
5: life must reproduce: Fi Maybe Fe
6: life must evolve and descend from previous life forms: Fe Maybe Fi
7: life must consist of a cell or cells: Ne What are cells but storage mechanism for potential energy, DNA, etc.
8: life must be highly organized: Ti

So what life is is Cells Organizing Moving In Time Expanding Looking to Reproduce Acting Towards Homeostasis

So , which is the socionic representation of the thermodynamic cycle.

It's iffy which one fits Fe or Fi but the cellular basis for life is the static material of life, where as acting/reacting is the external dynamics of life.

[Jarno]

There gets a point when attacking the idea is a pointless exercise. Upon which attacking the man can be really rewarding.

that's mean.

[Jarno]

labcoat (and Jarno): where the hell did you get that?

it just a general theme I sometimes encounter, people see connections in everything.

I don't even have to mention Mcnew, he sees 8 wind directions correlated to socionics :-)

[crazedrat]

I think you're way off base hkkmr. I've already posted my thoughts on this so I'll just let any reader decide for themselves. As for the insult hurling skeptics in this thread: seriously, I get it: you don't see the connection. I don't need any further advice from you.
wrongwayticket: I have never seen you contribute something insightful to this forum. Hell, I don't even know if you know anything about socionics, at all.

lol. Lose the bitchy behavior. Attack the man's ideas, not the man.

Yeah, I like criticism which has something to it. Empty criticism is what gets me. What is it even for? It's an ego game.

[crazedrat]

the way I have it set up, if you pair opposite functions together, intuitively you can see duality between the organism processes. It is mildly interesting:

Ni/Se:
Must have a plan for growth encoded in DNA / must respond to changes in environment
The common discussion on interplay between genetics and environment
Si/Ne:
must maintain a homeostatic environment / must consume and expend energy
consuming and expending energy is done to maintain a homeostatic environment, and changes in the balance of the internal environment dictate the consumption of resources or expenditure of resources
Te/Fi:
life must consist of a cell or cells / life must reproduce
for cells, reproduction is the final stage of operation. work is done to create ideal conditions for replication. reproduction can only occur in ideal conditions and relies on the work of cells to satisfy these conditions.
Ti/Fe:
life must evolve and descend from previous life / life must be highly organized
The process of evolution is responsible for the complexity we see in life. The need for such complexity demands evolution.