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Thread: Enneagram Directional Theory and Integration/Disintegration

  1. #1
    Creepy-male

    Default Enneagram Directional Theory and Integration/Disintegration

    Directional Theory

    Above is the link you need to understand directional theory, if you don't have forever to read up on every detail just make sure you look at the chart at least.

    Anyways once you've got the basic idea notice at the bottom its applicaiton to stress and security points... this I find interesting.

    The basic principle you can ellicit from this is the following:

    Moving Towards Integration
    Withdrawn types become Confronting
    Confronting types become Embracing
    Embracing types become Withdrawn

    Intuitively this makes an interesting observation, withdrawn type apparently need to learn to leave their inner worlds and face the world, confronting types need to learn to be less antagonistic and make peace with the world by acceptance, and embracing types need to learn to stop worrying so much about outside expectations and take more time to look within at their own desires.

    Moving Towards Disintegration
    Withdrawn types become Embracing
    Embracing types become Confronting
    Confronting types become Withdrawn

    Intuitively this also makes an interesting observation, withdrawn types apprently quit worrying about their individualism and inner worlds and simply embrace outside expectations, embracing types reject the expectations they once held high and become rebellious against them, and confronting types lose their fighting spirit and fall into withdrawl

    What I find particularly interesting about this, is that these basic observation were not conciously incorporated into the construction of the enneagram personality types nor in the direction theory. This all is a surprising deductive result of the theory, and it matches up well with common experience.

    Whats even better is that their is some "flow" to the idea, their is a cycle that can go in two directions...

    one is Embracing -> Withdrawl -> Confrontation and that is the flow for Integration

    the other is Confrontation -> Withdrawl -> Embracing and that is the flow for Disintegration

    No matter what type you are these flows are the same. Its almost like some type of psychological pattern or cycle. The other interesting thing is both of them are complete opposites, its like clockwise and counterclockwise, not matter where you are on the clock if your going to reach 5pm and your going clockwise you MUST pass through 4pm first always and 6pm always comes after. There is no possible way to work it so that you hit 6pm first if your going clockwise, it doesn't matter where you come from. This is the same... if you going to arrive at a healthy state of confrontation, you must first go through a state of withdrawl according to this theory, if you go through a state of embracing first, you will be on the pathway to psychological disintegration.

    Of course this interpretation is only a logical extension of this theory, and may not hold up to common observation. In my opinion I think it holds up quite well at first glance.

    Discuss.

  2. #2
    Creepy-

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    Nice - I like the way you've broken it down....

    This article was discussed here as well: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...m-article.html
    Last edited by female; 01-06-2010 at 11:45 PM.

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    crazedrat's Avatar
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    it's the neverending interplay between linear and parallel processes. Si Te Fe Ni are linear, and they coincide with disintegration, Se Fi Ti Ne for integration. a linear process gives an illusion of exceeding circumstances, following a trail which carries things forward. but the trail can only be within the space deemed available by parallel process. you can stay in your room and do the same thing every day while the world changes around you. that's basically disintegration. integration is like exploring new lands. disintegration errs on the side of safety and routine. as the world changes around you, disintegration occurs. the value of disintegration is it allows you to build up power, which you use to conquer new realms. the word withdrawal is only used to describe the transition between disintegration and integration, but its presence is unnecessary.
    Last edited by crazedrat; 01-07-2010 at 11:20 AM.
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    When I first learned about Enneagram, it was a very stripped-down version - no connections to chakras, no instincts, directions etc. According to it, everyone has both wings (though one is usually stronger) and they can integrate or disintegrate in both direction, making everyone a combination of 5 types (one basic, two unconsciously influcencing wings, two conscious directions of integration or disintegration). I'm probably biased by the fact I've heard it first, but I've never been convinced by directional theory. I think withdrawn type (like 5) needs to both confront (8) and embrace (7) the world... imbalance in one direction is probably when disintegration occurs. Maybe it's more natural to move in one of them, so it's considered disintegration, but we don't stop moving there when we try to integrate, so it works somehow.

  5. #5
    Creepy-male

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazedratXII View Post
    it's the neverending interplay between linear and parallel processes. Si Te Fe Ni are linear, and they coincide with disintegration, Se Fi Ti Ne for integration. a linear process gives an illusion of exceeding circumstances, following a trail which carries things forward. but the trail can only be within the space deemed available by parallel process. you can stay in your room and do the same thing every day while the world changes around you. that's basically disintegration. integration is like exploring new lands. disintegration errs on the side of safety and routine. as the world changes around you, disintegration occurs. the value of disintegration is it allows you to build up power, which you use to conquer new realms. the word withdrawal is only used to describe the transition between disintegration and integration, but its presence is unnecessary.
    Your asserting that confronting is the natural state of integration

    and embracing is the natural state of disintegration

    with withdrawal being the transition ?

  6. #6
    Creepy-male

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
    When I first learned about Enneagram, it was a very stripped-down version - no connections to chakras, no instincts, directions etc. According to it, everyone has both wings (though one is usually stronger) and they can integrate or disintegrate in both direction, making everyone a combination of 5 types (one basic, two unconsciously influcencing wings, two conscious directions of integration or disintegration). I'm probably biased by the fact I've heard it first, but I've never been convinced by directional theory. I think withdrawn type (like 5) needs to both confront (8) and embrace (7) the world... imbalance in one direction is probably when disintegration occurs. Maybe it's more natural to move in one of them, so it's considered disintegration, but we don't stop moving there when we try to integrate, so it works somehow.
    Heres the 5 dollar question of course; Is there a difference between a person whose type is just a 5 and a disintegrated 8?

    If there is then you technically can't say a person is a combination of 5 types. By this I mean that the 5 types you end up with are not an indepedent subset of 5 types, they are an interconnected dependant subset of 5 types.... defining one type will naturally tell you the place of the other 5 types... so really you arrive back at the idea of just one type. The dominant wing though gives two variations for this one type though.

    As to types both needing to disintegrate and integrate.... I'm not sure about this I've never considered this. To me my interpretation has always been more along the lines of types naturally integrate and disintegrate... I've never considered it really a need like a desire but more something that happens naturally. Though in alot of writtings I've always inferred through the way its presented that disintegration corresponded to a psychologically unhealthy and destructive state for the type.

    Personally I've always taken the ideas of integration and disintegration as a specific personal struggle... every person finds their focus in life in a specific enneagram type and they struggle to become more integrated at that location while struggling to avoid disintegration. For example 5's are the withdrawn power seeking, competency triad, thinking/anxiety triad... their kind of role they play is to stave off anxiety through developing a kind of cerebral competency, the challenge with this pursuit is that they occasionally get over anxious when stressed and become scattered at seven, so naturally they have to learn to manage their stress by learning to stay calm and collected, further their natural focus into their inner mental worlds presents a challenge to them with being more assertive and confident participating in the world, so naturally for security and integration they must learn to be more assertive like 8's. To me I've always taken it like an inner quest for each type. The 5's inner quest is basically to be calm, collected, confident and not give into their fear/anxiety/dread of incompetency.

    Now expanding this out to a social perspective is difficult, because everyone is running around out their with their seperate "inner quests" .... and really for some reason I am drawn to think everyone shares the same issues/problems fundamentally. Like a 1 may even share the same inner quest as a type 5, but because they are a 1 and not a 5 they simply are not focused in on the concerns the 5 has... they are so pre-occupied with the "inner quest" of a 1 that they are highly ignorant to the "inner quest" of the 5, but they still share it at some subconious fundamental level.













    Disclaimer
    For those that may quote this
    Most of what I've written in the last three paragraphs is just a personal interpretation and thought development and not established enneagram theory so don't get too bent out of shape if the ideas seem odd or un-natural to what you've seen or been taught.
    Last edited by male; 01-08-2010 at 12:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    Heres the 5 dollar question of course; Is there a difference between a person whose type is just a 5 and a disintegrated 8?

    If there is then you technically can't say a person is a combination of 5 types. By this I mean that the 5 types you end up with are not an indepedent subset of 5 types, they are an interconnected dependant subset of 5 types.... defining one type will naturally tell you the place of the other 5 types... so really you arrive back at the idea of just one type. The dominant wing though gives two variations for this one type though.
    Not so much a combination as in a sort of subset, more like the elements which influence a person. Enneagram types are very "clear", they're centered around different motivations and one-dimensional. I don't mean it like in dichotomies, more like a book character - some of them seem more real, some completely unnatural/boring. In the end none of us is just like that, with no other influences. The only thing I'm questioning are limitations which sound artificial (like directions or only one wing). Since wing(s) rarely change, but we can develop along the lines within the circle, subconscious/conscious influence makes sense (this is just a hypothesis of course).

    As to types both needing to disintegrate and integrate.... I'm not sure about this I've never considered this. To me my interpretation has always been more along the lines of types naturally integrate and disintegrate... I've never considered it really a need like a desire but more something that happens naturally. Though in alot of writtings I've always inferred through the way its presented that disintegration corresponded to a psychologically unhealthy and destructive state for the type.
    Not so much needing as being able to integrate and disintegrate in both directions. Notice that unhealthy 5's are sometimes described as becoming bossy and overly controlling... just like unhealthy 8's. Yet 8 is said to be only integration direction for 5. It's the direction I've got a problem with. To put it simply: I think 5's need both to act (8) and go out and have some fun (7). The latter is easier. The easier way might be overused when stressed (in this case becoming scattered and overindulgent). Thus it was named "disintegration", and condemned.

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