Misconceptions because of socionicsus

[CheGuevara]

I have realized that a lot of people on this forum are not sure about their type or have obviously mistyped themselves.

In my opinion the reason for this disaster is socionics.us which seems to have a strong influence on many or most people on this forum.

What's wrong with socionics.us? I will tell you.

socionics.us offers a lot of useless information but no type descriptions at all. That's what I call an absolutely misguiding website about socionics.



I tried to convince ArchonAlarion that he is ILI. He didn't believe it. I said, just compare the type descriptions, forget all the other useless stuff. He is of the opinion that type descriptions are not very important for typing. I almost fell down from my chair.

Another person said that type descriptions were just one aspect and that one aspect was not enough for typing. I thought: "what the heck is wrong with the people on this forum?"

Gilly said socionics.com was a bad website and that I should read everything on socionics.us. I have read a lot on socionics.us but this site is just miguiding because it emphazises useless things and offers no useful type descriptions. Gilly even told me he was INFP but ENFj. Again, I almost fell down from my chair.



The most important thing about understanding socionics is knowing the type descriptions, of course. The descriptions by Victor Gulenko on socioncs.com are very good. Everyone who is interested in socionics should know them very well. Typing requires an intuitive understanding of all 16 type descriptions.

The descriptions on wikisocion are not bad but they don't emphasize the main points as the descriptions of Gulenko do.

So would anybody who does not know all the 16 type descriptions very well stop typing immidiately, please...

[Simon Ssmall]

I think for you it would be a great idea if you could use safety belts on your chair. Would probably solve a lot of your problems.

[somavision]

How old are you Che?

[JuJu]

In general, the site has good info--especially on the blog.

Unfortunately for many visitors to the site, hoping to learn about Socionics, there are A LOT of incorrect celebrity typings on that site, e.g. echoes of old Russian typings (which are, in many cases, surprisingly incorrect,) and even among his own duals he types, I'm not sure if he even gets one correct.

This is not to say that every typing is incorrect--there are some good ones, (especially in beta, but not in delta) which strikes me as strange for a self-typed ENFp.

[Galen]

I have told you this time and time and time again: nobody cares. You have stated your opinions, and nobody believes you. There's really nothing else you can do now. Nobody else here believes that things such as quadra values, functions, etc are useless, and you will never convince anybody on here that they are.

[CheGuevara]

I have told you this time and time and time again: nobody cares.

Thank you for telling me that. I have already realized that there are a lot of misguided and ignorant people on this forum, of course.

Nobody else here believes that things such as quadra values, functions, etc are useless, and you will never convince anybody on here that they are.

I never said that! Quadra values are interesting, functions are the explanation for types and relationships. But interesting things like quadra values don't help if you don't really know all the 16 type descriptions. Functions are important but Model A is just a model. The behaviour of the types is the important point.

[Galen]

I never said that! Quadra values are interesting, functions are the explanation for types and relationships. But interesting things like quadra values don't help if you don't really know all the 16 type descriptions. Functions are important but Model A is just a model. The behaviour of the types is the important point.

Well this entire subforum is about Model A. You have come to the wrong place to discuss other non-Model A related things.

[krieger]

Even on the basis of type descriptions calling Archon an INTp is very dubious. He is not a person that condemns passion like the description on socioniko.net says, nor is he in any way "unapproachable". He does not display any tendency towards pedantry like the Gulenko descriptions imply INTps do. He is not noticably pessimistic either. All of these are traits that keep surfacing in INTp descriptions, yet aren't exhibitted by him.

[CheGuevara]

Even on the basis of type descriptions calling Archon an INTp is very dubious. He is not a person that condemns passion like the description on socioniko.net says, nor is he in any way "unapproachable". He does not display any tendency towards pedantry like the Gulenko descriptions imply INTps do. He is not noticably pessimistic either. All of these are traits that keep surfacing in INTp descriptions, yet aren't exhibitted by him.

Do you know him personally? Or just here on the internet? Some people may behave completely different than in real life. So that's not the important point. The interesting point is: Look at his avatar and you see no ILE at all.

Unfortunately people often don't use subtypes. That's another mistake on socionics.us (and also socionics.com), of course. In my opinion Archon is Ne-INTp. Gulenko's subtype description of an intuitive ILI fits very well.

[Simon Ssmall]

Nobody else here believes that things such as quadra values are useless.

I think there are quite a few people who believe that. I wouldn't say they are unreasonable.

[CheGuevara]

I think for you it would be a great idea if you could use safety belts on your chair. Would probably solve a lot of your problems.

Yes, especially because I expect some strange answers here...

How old are you Che?

26

Unfortunately for many visitors to the site, hoping to learn about Socionics, there are A LOT of incorrect celebrity typings on that site

The problem is that many people on this forum seem to believe that DeLong is good at typing celebrities. Lenin, Powell, Cheney = SLE? I don't think so.

This is not to say that every typing is incorrect--there are some good ones, (especially in beta, but not in delta) which strikes me as strange for a self-typed ENFp.

Yes. A mistyped "authority" as Gilly thinks of him would be really laughable. But that is not very likely, of course.

[tcaudilllg]

Yes, especially because I expect some strange answers here...

26

The problem is that many people on this forum seem to believe that DeLong is good at typing celebrities. Lenin, Powell, Cheney = SLE? I don\'t think so.

Yes. A mistyped \"authority\" as Gilly thinks of him would be really laughable. But that is not very likely, of course.

I want to make the point that all three of those probably do have SLE EM types. Powell certainly, as most militant people are beta at the EM level. (yes, I concede I am militant). Because there is no official representative of dual-type theory (that is, no one with psychology qualifications) he feels unable to risk qualifying his intuitions with a system that is representative of their breadth. Which means, he ends up in this excruciating middle ground of conflicting intuitions and bouncing back and forth between typings.

Now look at Expat, you see he tacitly accepts the premise of dual-type theory while not formally acknowledging it. From his perspective, it\'s just another reason to study the core theory all the harder, and to abstain from assumption.

[ArchonAlarion]

I didn't say descriptions are unimportant for typing, I said I have issues with most descriptions, especially the ones on wikisocion.

[Jarno]

I didn't say descriptions are unimportant for typing, I said I have issues with most descriptions, especially the ones on wikisocion.

do you mean the descriptions of types that describe the eight elements of the type, or the general descriptions?

[leckysupport]

Another person said that type descriptions were just one aspect and that one aspect was not enough for typing. I thought: "what the heck is wrong with the people on this forum?"

Why are people of one type so different? This question has for a long time disturbed each sober-minded socionics-practitioner. Why can two carriers of one and the same psychological system, which has an identical structure, demonstrate in one and the same situation such different models of behavior?

Conduct a simple experiment. Gather 3-4 people of a single type, it unimportant which type their school’s specialist determined. Give them any mutually accessible task (a jointly solved intellectual puzzle or a game and such) and observe their behavior. And you will see that in spite of the identity of their type, some of them will be more active, others more passive, some more resourceful, others more conservative and so forth. The most interesting thing is that the greater the number of representatives of the same type which you gather, the greater the large number of differences will you reveal between them. Thus, the depth of the typology is possible to increase even further.

The entire purpose of DCNH was to account for differences in expressed type which aren't accounted for in type descriptions. That means it is possible to have two people of the same type who express their type differently, and if that is possible it is only reasonable to assume that it is possible that a type description doesn't account for every manifestation of particular type.

[Krig the Viking]

The most important thing about understanding socionics is knowing the type descriptions, of course. The descriptions by Victor Gulenko on socioncs.com are very good. Everyone who is interested in socionics should know them very well. Typing requires an intuitive understanding of all 16 type descriptions.

The descriptions on wikisocion are not bad but they don't emphasize the main points as the descriptions of Gulenko do.

Dude, how do you think Gulenko came up with those descriptions? I've read enough Gulenko to know how he works: everything is based on his theoretical understanding of Model A and the rest. Do you think Gulenko himself uses his own type descriptions to type people? Or does he simply rely on his own detailed understanding of the functions and elements?

Type descriptions are a crutch, to be used until you've developed your understanding of the theory well enough that you don't need them.

[Azeroffs]

Dude, how do you think Gulenko came up with those descriptions? I've read enough Gulenko to know how he works: everything is based on his theoretical understanding of Model A and the rest. Do you think Gulenko himself uses his own type descriptions to type people? Or does he simply rely on his own detailed understanding of the functions and elements?

Type descriptions are a crutch, to be used until you've developed your understanding of the theory well enough that you don't need them.

+1

Che, why do you think descriptions are the most important method for typing/understanding?

[thePirate]

Type descriptions are a crutch, to be used until you've developed your understanding of the theory well enough that you don't need them.

Exactly.

Type descriptions don't always fit to a T. Relying on them soley, you would be prone to mistyping.

[Jarno]

I have realized that a lot of people on this forum are not sure about their type or have obviously mistyped themselves.

yes, and it's often because people mainly focus on information elements instead of dichtomies or type descriptions.

[xkj220]

yes, and it's often because people mainly focus on information elements instead of dichtomies or type descriptions.

And they are doing the right thing, IMHO.

On the topic: I find the information at socionics.us more than satisfying.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

Differences in opinions of peoples types is more a problem of socionics than just any one socionics site or method.

[UDP]

I have realized that a lot of people on this forum are not sure about their type or have obviously mistyped themselves.

In my opinion the reason for this disaster is socionics.us which seems to have a strong influence on many or most people on this forum.

YESSS that's exactly it. You've figured it out!

[Galen]

Hoh man, you never know what he's gonna say next, that Che

[Ezra]

I have realized that a lot of people on this forum are not sure about their type or have obviously mistyped themselves.

In my opinion the reason for this disaster is socionics.us which seems to have a strong influence on many or most people on this forum.

What's wrong with socionics.us? I will tell you.

socionics.us offers a lot of useless information but no type descriptions at all. That's what I call an absolutely misguiding website about socionics.



I tried to convince ArchonAlarion that he is ILI. He didn't believe it. I said, just compare the type descriptions, forget all the other useless stuff. He is of the opinion that type descriptions are not very important for typing. I almost fell down from my chair.

Another person said that type descriptions were just one aspect and that one aspect was not enough for typing. I thought: "what the heck is wrong with the people on this forum?"

Gilly said socionics.com was a bad website and that I should read everything on socionics.us. I have read a lot on socionics.us but this site is just miguiding because it emphazises useless things and offers no useful type descriptions. Gilly even told me he was INFP but ENFj. Again, I almost fell down from my chair.



The most important thing about understanding socionics is knowing the type descriptions, of course. The descriptions by Victor Gulenko on socioncs.com are very good. Everyone who is interested in socionics should know them very well. Typing requires an intuitive understanding of all 16 type descriptions.

The descriptions on wikisocion are not bad but they don't emphasize the main points as the descriptions of Gulenko do.

So would anybody who does not know all the 16 type descriptions very well stop typing immidiately, please...

LMAO

sounds like phaedrus

ETA: at least you admit you're LII.