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Thread: Duality: feeling unworthy or intimidated by your dual?

  1. #1
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    Default Duality: feeling unworthy or intimidated by your dual?

    Do you feel "unworthy" of or intimidated by your dual's awesomeness? And if you do, is it mostly [or only] in the beginning stages of the relationship?

    I have read before in duality description someplace that it can happen, but I'm curious about people's irl experience with this... so, do ya?

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    Landlord of the Dog and Duck Subteigh's Avatar
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    I've generally considered myself to be a worthy person, I just don't expect others to be able to know that, so I can be taken aback when someone thinks highly of me when it seems to me there hadn't been a lot to judge me on. Alternatively, I rue far too much about how much I should push my cause in order to show my worth, especially seeing as doing so may well give an inaccurate representation of myself that I will be unable to sustain.

    In my limited experience, my relationships are formed after it is already established what sort of people we are...I suppose it would be more correct to say that a relationship starts as soon as you encounter the other person.

    I've never felt unworthy or intimidated because of any awesomeness on the part of the other person - it has only ever been feeling full of worry in the grand scheme of things that has brought me down.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    Do you feel "unworthy" of or intimidated by your dual's awesomeness?
    lol, yes. These thoughts don't really affect RL relationships much, but it's not uncommon for me to wonder if I'm offering anything equally awesome or valuable to them.

    "His feeling that this world is not his Fatherland, and that it does not represent his proper condition, so to speak—his feeling that, basically, he 'comes from afar'—will remain a fundamental element which will not give rise to mystical escapism and spiritual weakness, but rather will enable him to minimise, to relativise, to refer to higher concepts of measure and limit, all that can seem important and definitive to others, starting with death itself, and will confer on him calm force and breadth of vision." — Julius Evola

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeAnte View Post
    lol, yes. These thoughts don't really affect RL relationships much, but it's not uncommon for me to wonder if I'm offering anything equally awesome or valuable to them.
    I know what you mean lol
    Moonlight will fall
    Winter will end
    Harvest will come
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    Half the time I feel inferior to them. The other half is spent worrying about them getting the idea they are inferior.
    It was in the reign of George III that the aforesaid personages lived and quarrelled; good or bad, handsome or ugly, rich or poor, they are all equal now.

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    in a word, yes.

    Even though I consider myself an awesome person, I do have the feeling of how can I possibly measure up to them? And I don't think it affects the relationships negatively. I think it causes an underlying respect between both parties which aids the relationship in the long run. So it's a good thing.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

  7. #7
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    I tend not to notice my duals, in that they seem to be fairly average and unexceptional people. Then duality kicks in, and they're cool, fairly average, and unexceptional people that I like a lot and get on very well with

    Interestingly, though, my mysterious SLI totally went through the insecurity thing with me, and I definitely followed suite, strangely. Anyway, I think what happened was Gul, in his shining armor of loving-ness, atop his dazzling steed of kindness, appeared during a pretty rough time for her. This brought about mixed awe (or something overpowering... I think that's what the "love" was) and feelings of inadequacy, or so I understand. My issues were internal and not really brought about by any traits or behaviours of the SLI. My point is I don't think it necessarily has anything to do with duality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coolanzon View Post
    My point is I don't think it necessarily has anything to do with duality.
    well maybe not in your experience. But I can totally see how it would have plenty to do with duality. look at it this way: the thing you need most (dual-seeking function) is what they ARE without even thinking about it. Therefore they come across as being, well, awesome and offering what you're looking for without even trying. You, in turn, are doing the same for them, only it's hard for you to see this, as you are only being yourself, not "trying" to be awesome or meet their needs or any of that. This is the beauty of duality. You being you=someone else thinking you're amazing and vice versa. ahhhhh....
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    @rb: I meant that my situation and the feelings of inadequacy within that were not related to duality. I can't speak for in general.

    I think I'm just in a really flat mood today, too. No DUALS ARE MAGICAL is readily springing to mind, therefor.

    EDIT

    I lied. In general, my duals do not make me feel unworthy.
    Last edited by male; 11-16-2009 at 02:31 AM.

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    Can I feel like my dual is unworthy?
    3w4-5w6-9w8

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    I am the same way. I wonder whether this is particularly common among extraverts....
    Yeah that's what I was thinking too. idk.
    It was in the reign of George III that the aforesaid personages lived and quarrelled; good or bad, handsome or ugly, rich or poor, they are all equal now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    Ah, SXIs... if only you knew how much we IXEs adore just spending time with you.

    Similar to the question I asked SubT: does this cause you to question the IXE's sincerity when they seem to show great interest in you?
    No. The ENFps I've had relationships with were easily the most sincere people I've ever known. The subject of their sincerity has never been a question, as their judgements were always expressed after actual time spent together.

    The portion of SubT's post you quoted and bolded had to do with being the object of praise (or just high opinion) based on some bystander's limited observation. At two different work places I've experienced that exact situation with two different EXFjs. Both cases involved them complimenting (my) work which they had either never seen or knew nothing about.

    Anytime anyone does this, it feels extremely fake and annoying and I feel insulted that they even expect me to feel flattered by that bullshit. I just ignore them as if they never said anything at all, but you'd be surprised how many times after, they repeat that same tired approach as if thinking they'll eventually "win" me over before finally accepting that I have no interest in what they offer.

    I could probably never view someone who behaves (compliments or expresses interest/high opinion of me) in that manner as truly sincere.
    Last edited by Nebuchadnezzar; 11-16-2009 at 04:05 AM.

    "His feeling that this world is not his Fatherland, and that it does not represent his proper condition, so to speak—his feeling that, basically, he 'comes from afar'—will remain a fundamental element which will not give rise to mystical escapism and spiritual weakness, but rather will enable him to minimise, to relativise, to refer to higher concepts of measure and limit, all that can seem important and definitive to others, starting with death itself, and will confer on him calm force and breadth of vision." — Julius Evola

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    Slippery when wet Simon Ssmall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    Do you feel "unworthy" of or intimidated by your dual's awesomeness? And if you do, is it mostly [or only] in the beginning stages of the relationship?

    I have read before in duality description someplace that it can happen, but I'm curious about people's irl experience with this... so, do ya?
    The idea of me not being worthy of some person is alien to me. I also do not understand the fact that I can be "too good" to someone, the idea is strange and hardly understandable to me but I know some people felt that way.
    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

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    Oh, no, no way, I am so awesome.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    [...] But, dual or not, I think anyone would be crazy to want to be with me, so if they seem to think they do - I assume they're just somehow deluded and will wake up soon, don't really know me very well, or they're lying. I want to be loved, but I don't trust that anyone would for very long, if at all.

    Some sort of weird complex or something? Maybe. Probably better not to dwell on things like that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Akra
    Ditto.
    I offer one more ditto.
    Ceci n'est pas une eii.




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    Not really.... if anything it's actually the opposite, I overvalue myself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    Do you feel "unworthy" of or intimidated by your dual's awesomeness?
    I don't feel unworthy nor am I intimidated.
    I am however motivated to become a better version of myself. Just like in "As good as it gets" I think something on the lines of: "You make me want to be a better man".


    I view unworthiness and intimidations as "decoupling" or "alienation" feelings. Duality never felt like that to me.
    "What is love?"
    "The total absence of fear," said the Master.
    "What is it we fear?"
    "Love," said the Master.

    I chose Love

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    I think I've read somewhere that in duality the Introvert feels somewhat unworthy of their dual at first. However I think that if you feel unworthy of someone then you might have a sense of low self-worth...
    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Stromberg
    Let's stop using this outdated measure - which has about as much scientific validity as your astrological sign.

  19. #19
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    I wouldn't date or befriend someone who I felt better than or worse than, it's not really the way I think, and i'm not too fond of people who try to "act" better than me somehow... not saying the dual would do this intentionally, but if there's an unfriendliness or something about the person that would make me feel this way whether they mean it or not then i'd have to think twice about the person, as I try to be friendly to pretty much everyone and treat them equally no matter who they are, so the answer is nope.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
    I wouldn't date or befriend someone who I felt better than or worse than, it's not really the way I think, and i'm not too fond of people who try to "act" better than me somehow... not saying the dual would do this intentionally, but if there's an unfriendliness or something about the person that would make me feel this way whether they mean it or not then i'd have to think twice about the person, as I try to be friendly to pretty much everyone and treat them equally no matter who they are, so the answer is nope.
    You can treat everyone equally even if they are above or bellow your level.

    I would also prefer someone my level BUT I don't see it so low resolution as you might. I see multiple levels and I would date/befriend people below and above my level but... not much below and not much above. Think about a scale from 1 to 10. If I am a 7, I would definitely date/befriend 6, 7 and 8 with 5 and 9 as maybes.
    "What is love?"
    "The total absence of fear," said the Master.
    "What is it we fear?"
    "Love," said the Master.

    I chose Love

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by sigma View Post
    You can treat everyone equally even if they are above or bellow your level.

    I would also prefer someone my level BUT I don't see it so low resolution as you might. I see multiple levels and I would date/befriend people below and above my level but... not much below and not much above. Think about a scale from 1 to 10. If I am a 7, I would definitely date/befriend 6, 7 and 8 with 5 and 9 as maybes.
    This is true, for instance at an extreme case, I don't think i'd date a homeless alcoholic person (OK, if some drawn out scenario they could be a "really nice person", but realistically, it's unlikely to happen), but that sort of extreme (or less than that sort of extreme), isn't really dual related I don't think, maybe just people related.

    On thinking about it, I know a dual who by many accounts would be regarded as pretty great - extremely good looking, good job, dresses and presents herself well, all that sort of stuff, also seems to have a lot of the dual function abilities about her, but strange as it may sound, don't think i'd like to date her as i'm not so keen on someone who puts TOO much emphasis on their appearance - not that I want to date a scruff, but it's just, know that way when maybe you just want to chill out a night, watch a movie, eat crap food and cuddle up on the couch, then the girls like, "I can't eat that because i've got to fit into such and such a dress so have to watch what i'm doing ALL THE TIME..", I mean... gotta live a little, lol. Could be sub type related though, too much of the first function not enough of the second in this case.... I think it's different priorities with her and I for a few things, but we get on well enough when we converse. Hmmmm. See what ya mean though Sigma.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post

    I have read before in duality description someplace that it can happen,
    I think if you reread it, that it says: the introvert thinks he's not good enough for the extravert, the extravert thinks that the introvert is not good enough for him.

    So it sucks to be an introvert. You have to persuade the extravert a bit.

    And yes, in reality, in the beginning it works like this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    I think if you reread it, that it says: the introvert thinks he's not good enough for the extravert, the extravert thinks that the introvert is not good enough for him.

    So it sucks to be an introvert. You have to persuade the extravert a bit.

    And yes, in reality, in the beginning it works like this.
    I don't think that extroverts feel that way. I'm pretty sure I never felt that way - but I have seen and experienced introverts feeling that way. It doesn't really make initiative easier for us, since the I will be even more shy than how he-she normally is.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    I've actually always liked SLIs. There have been many in the past I've had a crush on, but my biggest problem was figuring out what to say to them. We never seemed to have much in common, and they were super quiet, so that just made it worse...

    Oh, and yeah, in the beginning I usually feel like I have nothing to offer them. I'm jabber-y, distracted, restless...
    IEE

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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    I don't think that extroverts feel that way. I'm pretty sure I never felt that way - but I have seen and experienced introverts feeling that way. It doesn't really make initiative easier for us, since the I will be even more shy than how he-she normally is.
    I'm pretty sure the extroverts I know don't/didn't feel that way, even in the beginning.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Not at all. How can anyone survive without a square or a circle? It seems like they need me more than I need them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
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    The Soul Happy-er JWC3's Avatar
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    Fuck to the no.


    Does peanutbutter feel unworthy of jelly?
    Do peas feel unworthy of carrots?

    No, they just go together, and that's that.
    Easy Day

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiny_dancer View Post
    I've actually always liked SLIs. There have been many in the past I've had a crush on, but my biggest problem was figuring out what to say to them. We never seemed to have much in common, and they were super quiet, so that just made it worse...

    Oh, and yeah, in the beginning I usually feel like I have nothing to offer them. I'm jabber-y, distracted, restless...
    I'm pretty similar to this. Jabber-y is an excelellent word! I was like that in the beginning w/ my bf, just rambling on and on, and I wondered how he could possibly stand that. I still talk a lot, but not that much. I wondered if he thought I was an idiot for a while, since I was saying such random/absurd things. Luckily he didn't think that, to my surprise.

    But I guess there was a stage where I thought he was way smarter/more logical than me and that sorta intimidated me a bit.

    It's true that I don't notice SLIs in groups at first...or if I do notice them I think "what an awesome person (that other people would get along with), and I prob wouldn't have much to say to them."

    Though after learning this, I'm much faster to spot SLIs and also to see past that exterior and realize that there is in fact someone really fun/nice underneath that cold exterior thingy.

    The only time I really feel "less than" is if someone starts playing games w/ me, or not wanting to see me, or blowing me off. Then I will start to think maybe I suck, but at that point things are pretty much over anyway.
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akra View Post
    That massive deflating sound you just heard was the multitude of Diana-like NFs out there who just sighed reading this.
    why?

    it's just quotation of russian duality description.

    Diana is ESI not NF.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    Does this make you question the person's sincerity?
    It depends on who it is...and generally, I only consider them to be slightly exaggerating, in much the same way I would. But usually, the fear of not being able to keep up to a person's expectations is what completely kills me. (and related to this: the mental strain of whether I should push and push and push even when I'm seemingly getting little or nothing in return. Or even, the mental strain of whether to start a relationship knowing there could be this mental strain).

    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    That feeling of worry is one of the things I was wondering about - whether one or both duals might think something like, "Well, he/she seems to like me, but this can only last so long... and then he/she will surely get bored and move on...."
    Yes...I never know whether to do more of the same or to try and reinvent myself...but I think in at least one dual situation, the decision not to pursue a relationship was because of a combination of low self-esteem and a feeling that there would always be time at a later date. So personal failings certainly do play a large part as well!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Akra View Post
    I was referring to the string of NFs who did the "ditto" thing to her comment, not that she's NF herself. It looks like my attempt at lightheartedly commenting on the convergence of the two pieces of information was missed.

    Basically, it's kind of a disheartening combination: being a person of a type that has to self-advocate to their dual to be noticed, but also being a person who'd never self-advocate in the first place.
    I've never had to self-advocate to be noticed by my dual, whether male or female. I've only known four SLEs in my life but they all sort of found me.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    I wonder if the Caregiver/Infantile and Aggressor/Victim dichotomies play any role in this. It seems, from reading this thread so far, that Infantiles tend to feel unworthy of Caregivers at first.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krig the Viking View Post
    I wonder if the Caregiver/Infantile and Aggressor/Victim dichotomies play any role in this. It seems, from reading this thread so far, that Infantiles tend to feel unworthy of Caregivers at first.
    hm, good observation.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    I've never had to self-advocate to be noticed by my dual, whether male or female. I've only known four SLEs in my life but they all sort of found me.


    *goes on dual hunt...*

    Never, haha.
    IEI, sp/sx 4w3.

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    My duals are clumsy.

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    Mine talk intermittently about the weather.

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    Mine do not exist.
    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

    ENFp - Fi 7w6 sp/sx
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    johari nohari
    http://www.mypersonality.info/ssmall/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ssmall View Post
    Mine do not exist.
    they DO. But the problem is not being able to see them. They exist, but are invisible to us.

    But I found one!! (finally). And he has bunches of SLI friends (guys and girls), who I also wouldn't have noticed if they weren't right in front of me.
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

  39. #39
    Haikus
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    Does peanutbutter feel unworthy of jelly?
    Do peas feel unworthy of carrots?

    No, they just go together, and that's that.
    This.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by jewels View Post
    they DO. But the problem is not being able to see them. They exist, but are invisible to us.

    But I found one!! (finally). And he has bunches of SLI friends (guys and girls), who I also wouldn't have noticed if they weren't right in front of me.
    The trick is don't look for someone who sweeps you off your feet, but for someone who'll catch you if you do.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    But you love it :wink:
    WHO TOLD YOU!?

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