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Thread: Hypothetical DCNH subtype descriptions

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    Default Hypothetical DCNH subtype descriptions

    The following DCNH descriptions are based on an assumption in this thread.

    They were not supposed to be DCNH descriptions by their authors!


    Alpha Quadra


    ILE - ENTp - Seeker

    Dominant subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype tries to project the impression of a serious person. Can be sharp and, from time to time, even inconsiderate. They are self-assured and speak quickly, usually with a categorical tone. Are unduly categorical in their judgments and tend to impose their opinion on others. Sometimes appears energetic and self-confident; are impatient and cannot always wait for a speaker to finish before interrupting. Often take great new interests and try to find these a practical embodiment; will actively and vigorously defend their interests but after they flare up and offend someone they will consciously make note and try to correct their position. Very ambitious and prone to take offense to mere trifles, however, after a while will again return to an affable and benevolent state. Behaviors are unpredictable and full of contrast. Appear tenacious, gait and gestures seem confident but are poorly coordinated. Pose without restraint, capable of quickly closing a distance, may embrace or kiss the interlocutor.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) They differ in their excellent sense of novelty. They frequently become the originator of many inventions and discoveries. Unsurpassed generator of ideas. In their suggestions they is very daring. However, they easily drop a project if they are bored with it and they then feel drawn to a new, more captivating project. Capable of working well in business. Dynamic, talks rapidly, with many gestures. Frequently of stocky built, courageous appearance, whiskers (if a man). Great significance is attached to external appearance.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Self-centred and pensive. Their ideas do not have direct connection with reality, for example philosophy, religion, bioenergetics etc. Their favourite occupation is comparing different logical systems. A type of office scientist. A very slim figure is characteristic for them. Angular in their movements, does not pay attention to external appearance, worry little about their health.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) Give the impression that they’re flying in the clouds, may appear childish/naïve. A socially adept conversationalist; read much and are inquisitive, willingly discuss new information with associates and are interested in their opinion. Their seemingly shy demeanour combines with coolness and obstinacy when they begin to defend their point of view. They like to discuss but rarely ever end these disputes in conflict. Often smile at associates without need of an occasion. Use an identical smile when they speak about both, ridiculous and serious, subject matter. Attempt being kind to all and do not take personal offence to remarks. In employment they are patient and, despite forgetfulness, tend to finish work which interests them. Gestures and speech seem either slowed down or accelerated. Pose with ease, appear absent-minded, gait and movements seem uncertain/weak-willed.



    LII - INTj - Analyst

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Concrete and regulated, an organizer in science, does not entrust too [outlandish?] ideas. Scholars, but only in their own narrow area of competence. Their behaviour is dry, restrained; they can be authoritarian. Does not love discussions and frictions in a group; operates from a distant psychological distance. Strict adherent of reasonable systems. Clothing is strict.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Analyst; a good scientist and conceptualist. Their primary attention is given to global issues. A generator of ideas. Achievements with potential are more important to them than the result of the current moment. Soft, correct and careful in his social contacts. Outwardly frequently very slim, gives more attention to external appearance and health than Logical subtype.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentina Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype is usually quiet, serious and constrained, are often uncompromising, even categorical, in their judgments. When they are not interested by the theme of a conversation they remain silent and severe, however, this cold demeanor is difficult to sustain. If the interlocutor behaves disdainfully they can be put in their place. Able to clearly and laconically, without superfluous emotions, express their ideas; does not enjoy long discussions. Spend lots of time in reflection: analyzing and comparing various phenomena, figures and facts. Give the impression of a strong-willed person. Lips are densely compressed, speech precise, abrupt, but their voices are not deep with varying intonations. Facial expression makes them seem as if they’ve recently awoke from sleep; internal emotions are reflected in unexpected and impulsive movements of muscles.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentina Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype appears a bit uncertain, and even soft, in dialogue. Not always absolute in statements, but obstinate and uncompromising in their actions. May keep silent, refrain from discussion, but their opinion will not change. Their latent emotions become visible during moments of extreme nervous pressure within intonations of their voice and impulsive gestures. In conversation are constrained, pay close attention to the interlocutor in order to give advice and to impress with their knowledge and conclusions; in such cases their serious demeanor is softened and goodwill penetrates their voice. Gait is quiet, synchronous, movements, on the contrary, are a little slow and nervous.. Pose appears restrained, gestures are avaricious and constrained, occasionally are unconsciously impulsive and badly coordinated.



    ESE - ESFj - Enthusiast

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Very expressive, it is difficult to withstand their emotional pressure. Possess high fitness for work; however, their uncontrollable feelings prevent their work from realizing its potential. Very scattered; jumps from one thing to another. Straightforward, not average, Are characterized by their explosive choleric temperament. Outwardly – has a desire to draw the attention of the opposite sex by bright clothing, which presents an element of demonstrativeness.

    Creative subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype is vigorous, efficient and practical. Emotionally striking, but sympathetic and benevolent towards people. Able to correct impressions caused by sharp statements. Self-assured and skillful; coquettish and pleasant, create an intimate atmosphere with their dialogue. Projecting tenderness, they often embrace those that act nicely and courteously towards them. Attentive to people, careful and obliging, yet may react suddenly if they find something unpleasant. Their speech, as a rule, is fast and emotional, willingly forming compliments. Prone to fussiness and restlessness, but able to occasionally relax cheerfully. Hospitable, are able and willing to prepare a gourmet for others.. Their fast, graceful movements mimic liveliness. Charmingly puts on a show and loves expensive things.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype is kind and affable, but obstinate and pig-headed when significant questions are directed towards them; because of this they appear to show excessive persistence. Are inclined to finish what they start, find it difficult to stop doing something after starting it and subsequently may waste time and regret it later. Try to be serious, restrained and polite in dialogue, but often render strong emotional pressure upon those that challenge their point of view. Like to take the interlocutor by the hand, to touch his/her clothes. Able to receive visitors in their homes but is more keen of interacting with others in public. Like give gifts to friends and relatives and for this purpose find suitable occasions. Dresses tastefully, but is rather modest. Gait is projected in quick actions, as if about to jump up; more often thin and a little angular. Their face can easily replace signs of discontent and indignation with a radiant smile.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Aesthete, loves to provide pleasure to themselves and to those around them, loves to give gifts. Good at maintaining household – knows how to make do even with a minimum of conveniences. A man of business, can be a successful manager in the leisure and entertainments industry. Women of this type knit and sew well, know how to be charming, possess a good taste in colour matching clothing. Undemonstrative behaviour. Very bad at enduring pain and poor health.



    SEI - ISFp - Mediator

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Emotional ethics are intensified. They are emotionally expressive and sociable, enters easily into any company, appears to be an extrovert. Loves practical and spacious clothes, about which they are not very choosy – they can also walk around shabbily. Artistic, frequently performs the role of instigator. They easily find themselves in amateur artistic activity, can be a musician, actor, advertising agent, or poet.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Possess a good aesthetical taste; this can manifest in their clothing, interior decoration, and job. This artist is frequently drawn to depicting landscapes and still lifes. They are a judge of the savoir vivre; for them, comfort is very important. They are sybarites and take care of their external appearance. They are hedonists, and they love to provide pleasure both to themselves and to others. Outwardly, they are a bit more stout than the ethical subtype.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) They appear alive, emotional and free in their dialogue. They are able to easily string together lines of dialogue while willingly paying compliments; this ease carries a shade of familiarity. Shyness can be overcome by playful remarks; they easily speak ironically in a serious/valid tone. They often joke and can speak even of unpleasant things with a smile, but they are sure not to offend the person; they are precautionary and careful. At times they are impatient and restless, from time to time they quarrel with others but are easily appeased and forgiving. Usually optimistic; like to give and receive pleasure; often gives people compliments and often renders various services; are able to cheer up and encourage others. Seem serene for they are prone to hide negative emotions from strangers/simple acquaintances. They speak quickly and confidently, at times categorically, with imperative intonations. Appears noticeable and quick, at times significant; movements are assured and graceful but a little bit gusty.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) Their dialogue provides the impression of a quiet, soft person. They love rest and comfort, and they are practical and attempt to portray refined taste. They are often engaged in fine art as a hobby. They are benevolent and tactful, their presence pacifies others. They try to sympathize with others, assist them and provide advice. They like to speak about sensations and attentively questions the interlocutor in regards to his/her affairs. They are often sluggish in behavior, slow in conversation, and they can slightly stretch out their words; sometimes without any formulated idea. Even when speaking rapidly, they will not hasten to end the conversation; They are able to speak long about the same thing repeatedly. They constantly smile with confidence, nod their head as a token of support, have lazy, smooth movements and refined, graceful gestures. May appear to waddle, or have “duck” gait, but their clothes and accessories are sometimes able to draw the attention of others.
    Last edited by CheGuevara; 11-13-2009 at 06:24 PM.
    Ni-INTj --- Harmonizing Analyst --- -
    DCNH rox

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    Beta Quadra


    EIE - ENFj - Actor

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Emotionally excited, sharp. Demonstrates fervent feelings, is decisively artistic. Easily yields to flattery. Characterized by aristocratic manners. Frequently a good speaker or a political leader with patriotic leanings. Is internally dramatic and spontaneous, loves to demonstrate his opinion. Outwardly they can shock those around them by extremes in clothing – a hobo with soiled sleeves. They can, on the contrary, dress in vivid or aristocratically choice clothes.

    Creative subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) An original and creative person, they’re both extravagant and unpredictable. Very inquisitive and talkative; emotional enough to be impressionable. Internally intense/strained, frequently they doubt their decisions. Emotionally liberated and artistic, they easily express their feelings. Aware of the moods of others and are skilled in positively manipulating them. Speaks with feelings and enthusiasm, yet prone to irony and criticisms they sometimes project a venomous and haughty image. When in a good mood can command the center of attention within any company. Though able to fulfill practical obligations, often lack confidence in this regard. An active and social person, can switch between dressing unusually/extravagantly and simply/modestly. Movements are gusty and impulsive, lacking in restraint.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype tries to behave according to the rules of good form in society. Are internally emotional, but usually modest and constrained in their emotional expression. Sensitive and vulnerable, alone in a shower may often experience dramatic emotions, but in front of strangers they restrain themselves. Find it difficult to relax due to internal strains, wounds, and overarching ambitions; while internally suffering from a set of complexes, externally they appear proud and aloof. Usually cautious and prone to think actions through beforehand; nervous with themselves but patient and persistent they are able to achieve their goals. Exacting in enforcing that their associates observe ethical standards of behavior and prone to rashly provide remarks and advice when they see people conflict with these ethical standards. Mood varies: cold, haughty, obstinate and exacting, then soft, sincere, affable and seemingly defenseless. Movements are smooth, sometimes demonstrative, when they want they can dress effectively, yet modestly for the occasion.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Predisposed to reflection, internal fluctuations and doubts. Thinks descriptively, is inclined to philosophy. Not very critical of external appearances, not exacting of their food. Reserved, sensitive, fragile, speaks out unobtrusively, They are popular and punctual. A good educator and teacher; can entice their listeners. Outwardly calm. Eloquent when recounting material.



    IEI - INFp - Romantic

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Flatters and is charming and communicable. If they see negative emotions in the people around them, they will try to arrange things so that people will calm down. They will mobilize well in dangerous situations. Loves to be in the centre of attention and dramatize proceedings, possesses a sense of humour. They easily manipulate by intonation and voice; can work successfully as a journalist --- They easily succeed in enticing the person they talk to. Outwardly they can appear extravagant; frequently takes a bohemian and bright form.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Facial expression is typically interrogative, and they seem calm, dreamy, and contemplative. Their line of behaviour is frequently passive. Romantic spirits. They live in the world of illusions, and they attempt to avoid negative emotions. They can be optimistic. They shrink away from conflict situations and support compromises. They are restrained in their clothing, elegant and refined. They can fulfill the functions of an abstract thinker, work in psychology and psychotherapy.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype provides the impression of a soft, charming and emotional person. Usually look inspired and optimistic. Possess a fine sense of humor allowing them to list their problems and failures while smiling. Are ironic, crafty, unpredictably and inconsistent in behaviour and conversation. Creating original contrasts, they can unexpectedly prick and then just as quickly embrace/kiss. Artistic and charming; are eloquent in dialogue, occasionally portraying shades of familiarity and impudence. They’re generally affable, kind and careful. Easily draw attention and thereby attract people; talent towards persuasion: states requests in such a manner that it is difficult to refuse them. Movements are graceful as is their gait. Speech is emotional, rich with shades, sometimes melodious.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype appears as a quiet, tactful, languid and diffident individual. They seem torn off from reality, inert and poorly adapted to life. However, such impressions are erroneous, for they possess a fine intuition, which aids them in establishing useful connections and obtaining support from influential people. Seem externally serene but sentimentally are disposed to experience moodiness and bouts of melancholy. While their voice at times seems monotonous they often induce a light surprise, even full interest, from the interlocutor. Outwardly are pensive, slightly strained/intense.. Prone to emanate sadness masked in sardonic irony. Speech is measured, smooth and intimately heart-felt. On their face they almost constantly exude a polite half-smile that easily wins people’s trust. Gestures are modest, shy. Gait is ponderous, elegant.



    SLE - ESTp - Conquerer

    Dominant subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype constructs an impression of quiet force and confidence for themselves. They are rational and sequential in affairs; hardworking and hardy. Usually appear cool, sustained and collected, however, in moments of irritation they express their fury in demonstratively sharp, absolute gestures. Within a quiet atmosphere they are kind and polite, while keeping the interlocutor at a distance. Their humor is sharp, sometimes rude, and they bare a quick, mistrustful glare from under their eyebrows. They’re kind but also serious and guarded. Their gait and gestures appear harmonious, smooth and precise. Tends to dress rather monotonously, however, from time to time can also clothe themselves brightly, even extravagantly. Appreciate quality in apparel and often creates many outfits from a few articles. Thus they show concern for both their behaviour and appearance; though they often seem cold and inaccessible they themselves try to appear proper, equal and benevolent, while maintaining their advantages.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Sharp, demonstrative, attacking style of behaviour. Expressive and expansive to the point of being aggressive. Feels at home in emergencies; find themselves in conflicts; can pressure people in order to rapidly introduce order. If conflicts do not occur, they can provoke some in order to then take the initiative into their own hands. Emotional and sociable, will want the attention of more than one person of the opposite sex. Women also display initiative in their acquaintances with men. This subtype is sinewy, mobile, often thin, has a well developed taste, is an epicure. In fashion are drawn to refinement and prestige.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Prefer to remain in the shadows, not to demonstrate their aspirations, but constantly hold their hands on the pulse of all proceedings around them. Outwardly appears balanced and phlegmatic. Before acting, checks all versions of possible consequences and only then enters into the game. Distrustful and careful, skeptic, conservative and realistic. Because they are not very sociable, may appear to be introverted. If they have their aim on a victim, they act slowly, by the method of the "compressive ring".

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype is witty and impulsive… while seemingly concealing within them latent threats they appear unappeasable. However, they are sharp, aggressive and persevering people. Notably resourceful, they are able to manifest vindictiveness in doses that make life for their ill-wishers simply intolerable. Their character appears full of contrasts and unpredictability. Towards those whom they love they are often tender, even sentimental. Their sense of humor easily incorporates sarcasm and caustic irony. Are talkative, charming, witty, critical and sharp, love epithets and slang expressions. Their movements are fast and gait centered, When walking their slightly bent knees provide them with an ingratiating feline resemblance. Appreciate life and tend to watch over their health, periodically exercising through sports/gymnastics. Dresses tastefully and expensively. Usually provide a bright impression of a self-assured and prospering person.



    LSI - ISTj - Inspector

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Most rational logical type. Very constructive. Their aims are in hierarchy; works thoroughly and brings everything to its end without missing a detail. Not very dynamic and does not transfer confusion. Outwardly is strict, sustained, somewhat single-minded. In working situations is official, and even with close relatives can manifest a barrack style of behaviour. Clothing is conservative, for males: his suit is often in a strict, dark tone.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Irregular and impulsive, does not always follow the order they require from others, in this case they are capable of condemning those who disrupt this order. Communicable and courteous from a distance, but on closer observation, can prove to be intolerant. When caught, they can answer with aggression. Their aim is leadership, but they are better at leading small associations. Outwardly appears strong. The men frequently have facial hair. In their clothing they prefer a free style.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype is self-assured, quiet, constrained, dry, correct and impenetrable. At times seems haughty but is moderately kind and imperturbable. Very polite and attentive to details in conversation, likes that all specify and explain their opinions, but sometimes is prone to get stuck up on nonessential details. When they ask questions they want answers to provide exhaustively detailed information. Dislikes uncertainty and is internally quite collected. They never lose their presence of mind and try to encourage those that require their support. Appears like a straight line, motionless, seeming to look through, rather than at, the interlocutor. Movements are measured but restrained, tendency to shuffle footwear when walking; when they turn they do so suddenly; their neck rests squarely on their shoulders and appears stiff.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype appears comparably restless in their behaviour and internally emotional when compared with the logical subtype. They are reticent yet also obstinate and willing to enter conflicts whenever their opinions are not honored; in such cases they flare up and become unduly sharp and absolute in their statements. Constrained and cold in demeanor, dislikes objections and long explanations. They constantly observe the actions of others in order to try to assist them or to point out their mistakes. Although their remarks may appear rather indignant, and lacking in tact, their intentions are usually constructive, as they wish to help; when their instructions are listened to and carried through successfully they will then offer a kind smile. Dresses conservatively although they sometimes aspire to appear fashionable. During conversation they approach the interlocutor without coming into direct contact. Whether at work or at home they are not inclined to practice superfluous rhetoric or manipulation.
    Last edited by CheGuevara; 11-13-2009 at 06:21 PM.
    Ni-INTj --- Harmonizing Analyst --- -
    DCNH rox

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    Gamma Quadra


    LIE - ENTj - Enterpriser

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Most dynamic of all psycho-types, a pioneer in their region of activity, searches for supporters with whom it is possible to realize his own or general ideas. Very emotional and impulsive; therefore can be inconsistent in their actions. Trusting; because of their carelessness they can unintentionally land themselves into complicated affairs; seems spontaneous. Works well in free market activity; if they lose, they do not lose spirit and optimism, but again go forward. Pays little attention to external appearances and health, is outwardly thin, very mobile, sometimes wears beard and whiskers(if male), prone to disorderly conduct.

    Creative subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype is affable, kind and pleasant in dialogue. They possess a developed sense of humor that frequently makes them the soul of the company. Very mobile, restless and scattered; always hurrying to make use of time. Inspired, vigorous and optimistic. Enterprising: safely takes risks and applies new ideas. They have difficulty focusing their attention on one thing for a long time. Diplomatic and gallant with everything, especially the opposite sex, but can show familiarity towards closer acquaintances. Due to their propensity towards impudence they often change steps within their plans and when they make ethical mistakes are quick to correct them by means of jokes and various services. Behaves simply and naturally. In conversation they like concern the interlocutor, to embrace/kiss and joke. Gestures and gait, when deprived of their underlined solidity, appear quite natural.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype offers the impression of mobility despite being a strict and efficient person. Their expression lacks emotion and focuses directly, in a fixed manner, on the interlocutor for the sake of emphasis. They are a little timid but try to hide this; also a bit mistrustful, critical and unduly categorical. They are only distracted with great difficulty and they work diligently to complete tasks. Despite a habit of reflection they are resolute and impulsive in their words and actions. Inclined to long conversations; a desire to seem constant, cautious and serious causes them to portray stiffness in their dialogue.. Their seeming calmness can quickly be replaced by unexpected haste. In most cases their figure is thickset and their movements are angular. Try to hold themselves confidently so as if to maintain advantage. When they joke their serious expression is hardly disturbed by the indistinct smile that manifests itself solely on the corners of the their lips.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Calm and balanced, conducts a regulated life, knows when to take advantage of opportunities. Quietly selects what idea it is better to follow, will always find the most optimal and advantageous output, which will give the greatest return. They are frequently a natural scientist, an experimenter, acting with their mind and hands simultaneously. Can interest themselves in chemistry, and in painting, in this case they try to bring everything to the end. Excellent hygrotechnician and experimenter. Gets along well with children, easily carries them along through their interesting actions. Outwardly more restrained and stocky than the other subtype; tries to dress well and pay attention to their health.



    ILI - INTp - Critic

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Practical and operational, they dislike any useless activity. They try to extract benefit from everything, does not allow industrial wastes - everything must be reasonably used. Loves company, friends, a good table. A sense of humour is well developed. Knows how to get along with those around him. They are outwardly elegant, sociable; however, sometimes of a weakened constitution.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Ascetic, grumbling, loves to emphasize deficiencies, searches for opponents. Criticizes sometimes with a dose of biliousness. Frequently have a very slim figure; they can provoke conflicts and actions, including commercial ones. Possesses large erudition and memory, frequently gets stuck in details. A scientist and theorist that makes fundamental developments and who also has an eye for social-economic tendencies. Using analogies, frequently they can predict the development of an ongoing process. Outwardly slovenly and negligent. Little regard to their health.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype provides the impression of a self-assured, sane and judicious person. Sometimes seems haughty and derisive, but is usually kind and often smiling, despite their smile seeming monotonous and tired. Possess a critical mentality coupled with a sense of humor; skeptical, ironic and mistrustful. Trying to be polite they often limit which ideas they project aloud. Constantly subject everything to analysis and trusts more in figures and facts than in early conclusions. A respectable rationalizer, able to detect and abandon useless affairs. Sometimes heavy-set, however, gait is usually quick while movements are purposeful and resolute. Can gesticulate, appears gusty and impulsive when doing so; usually remains still with silent advantage.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype seems to be a quiet, counterbalanced, even sluggish person. Their movements are smooth and slow. They’re internally timid but they attempt to hide this under a mask of irony. Are tactful, polite, and scrupulous. Tries to avoid straightforwardness and criticisms in their conversations; are affable and kind but seldom smile. Despite their attempts to hide weakness they are, nonetheless, internally rather sensitive, inconsistent and vulnerable; thus they often find themselves suppressed and dissatisfied, and from this stems negative moods and emotions. Their moods may further be afflicted due to the state of their health; they rarely discuss such problems with anyone. They keep people, psychologically, at a distance. Like to talk and tell things to people, meanwhile they possess good figurative thinking for they read/reflect much. Gait and movements are smooth, barely ever shaken.



    SEE - ESFp - Politician

    Dominant subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The active, mobile person. Willingly moves to establish useful social connections. Able to give compliments by speaking to others, in detail, about the opportunities and/or abilities that they’ve perceive; value their ability to make impressions. Intimate intonations in their voice, coupled with the confidential manner of dialogue, charmingly allow them to win the favor of the interlocutor quickly. Often have convex eyes; gestures are smooth and confident. They’re inclined to dress unusually, brightly and extravagantly, however, their tendency to corpulence may limit their liberty to dress as they please. Gait is elastic and proud.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Very active, energetic, enterprising. Adventurous, loves competitions and risks, loves playing with the law. If they feel defeated they tend to give up. Is one of the most unpredictable types. Works well in the intermediate trade structures, but not in production. A sharp change in mood is characteristic for them: if something is good for me, then everyone should be happy; if something is bad for me, then let the rest suffer too. Can exert powerful emotional pressure. A good executive and works well in the service industry, for example as a waiter; a good actor (but only in the easy genres like comedy or operetta). Easily manipulates relationships; able to attract people who do not yet know him. Is emotionally unstable; therefore is frequently unsociable (may provoke something and in the case of failure - rapidly retreat into the shadows).

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Appears influential and reliable, gradually attracted to others if they are useful. Possesses a specific snobbery, the status of impressiveness. For them, everything must become better and better – their office, car, etc... A good worker; can lead people and relationships; calculates well; is pragmatic. Is not adventurous. Are good politicians, since they wonderfully sense people and draw their attention when necessary. Plays the role of a thoughtful person who works on the key problem. Dresses more with restraint than the other subtype.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype resembles an emotional, gusty and nervous person. Behind their anxiety and sincere discomfort the constant thirst for vigorous activity appears. Undertakes too much and thus wastes much energy in vain. Despite their efforts to be diplomatic, they often seem critical and categorical. Sometimes indignant but nonetheless does not forget to give compliments. While on one hand they are able to look down on the interlocutor and touch him/her with their prickly jokes; on the other hand can be very kind and willing to prove their kind nature if necessary. Possess good artistic abilities with which they amuse visitors. Usually thin and conscious of figure, periodically playing sports. Eyes are often small or deeply planted. Gestures display impatience and movements are nervous, gusty. Often change their pose; their gait appears weakened/shaky; speech tends to be either muffled or rapid.



    ESI - ISFj - Guardian

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Subtle, sensitive nature, is a good judge of character and a reliable friend, is capable of compromise. In their softness and ease of contact he sometimes resembles IS(F)Ps. This subtype is more frequently better at putting ideas into practice than at organizing things: since others are included, their opinions are important to him. Very good with small children; sensitive, thoughtful and attentive. Can also manifest applied skill and cultural activity. Outward appearance is modest; rarely follows fashion and prefers a freer style.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Characterized by luxury in their close circles, Can even be aggressive if people do not agree with them. Dutiful, active and hardy. In conflict situations is never the first to seek reconciliation. Can lead groups well enough, maintain discipline and order, and apply sanctions to those misbehaving. Demonstrate affection through their eyes. Businesslike and purposeful, gravitates towards administrative activity. Can give rebuff and marshal, if that creates a mafia-like structure, since they will easily recognize the results of this activity. Prefers a prestigious style of clothing, sometimes in bright, but unexciting tones.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype usually makes a modest impression of being a delicate and gentle person, but internally are basic, exacting and mistrustful. Can be obstinate and pig-headed in refusing to allow others to persuade them. Internally wounded, and critical they are scrupulous and do not like to impose themselves. However, when they approach a situation with high moral measures they show character, and become sharp and uncompromising. They are hardworking and practical, careful/methodical and laborious in work. Display good manner and try to be graceful. Dress with subdued taste (a hint of monotony). Appear soft and, from time to time, timid. In dialogue with others they are sincere, careful and affable people.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype is strict, critical and ironic; absolute in conclusions and uncompromising in decisions. Despite being internally wounded and emotional they try to appear as the strong, cool and self-assured person. Conservative in dress and habits and diligent in work, though sometimes lacking enough assiduity that they fail to complete tasks. At times haughty, unapproachable and prickly; their face, from time to time, portrays a guarded expression. Benevolent and attentive, yet they keep others at a distance. Dislike being examined by others and are afraid of estimations directed towards them; self-conscious they work to maintain their appearance. Dress elegantly with taste but also with strictness. When confident of their external appearance will wear additional accessories.
    Last edited by CheGuevara; 11-13-2009 at 06:35 PM.
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    Delta Quadra


    IEE - ENFp - Psychologist

    Dominant subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype is artistic, impatient and a little extravagant. Unpredictability rules their actions and statements. Like to surprise/entertain friends, in which case even insignificant events can present them with sensations. Frequently the soul of the company, they’re self-assured with a good sense of humor, are easy to get along with and very impulsive. Are able to create familiar (i.e. home) conditions of dialogue, even among unfamiliar people. Willingly pay compliments while admiring (and being admired by) friends. Optimistic and friendly, charming and coquettish, they give the impression of theatricality. When focusing directly on something or someone they rarely blink. Their movements are sharp and resolute, their gait prompt and assured, though a little angular. Love originality and dress tastefully with the purpose of making an impression.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) A very sociable, spirited, mobile person. The initiator of many things; however, They are characterized by great restlessness and changeability. Very creative, but scattered and undisciplined. Capable of letting others know of his dissatisfaction, also, shows disrespect towards authorities. Outwardly, they frequently have complete rounded forms. In their clothing they can be demonstrative and bright, sometimes even loud.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Sees in people their concealed gravities and attachments. Prefers to work on a short psychological distance (unlike the other subtype). They love to give advice, and they gravitate towards psychoanalysis, in this case counts on manifestation in people of their positive qualities. They can stand up for others, defending their interests, but find it difficult to stand up for themselves. Is outwardly more frequently thin and elegant. In their clothing, they prefer comfort and soft colours.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype gives the impression of a person that has been torn off from reality. Internally focused and at the same time disseminated, they’re inclined to unexpected contrasts of behaviour where shyness and apathy are replaced by emotional elevation, determination and activity, a melancholic look – or inspired/joyful. Thoughtful and impulsive, optimistic and suppressed, timid and energetic, they provide various impressions. Internally inconsistent, sensitive and vulnerable, they hid their problems under a mask of carelessness. Try to be affable with everything, aspire to understand and favor everyone with a smile. They are attentive, soft and tactful. Willingly they explore the problems of others, try to find ways out of difficult positions and give useful advice. They protect their emotions and can threaten their opponents with notable psychological pressure. They’re impulsive, a little bit angular and their movements are badly coordinated. Gait is fast and a bit clumsy; their chins are often pointed, appear attentive, interrogative or surprised.



    EII - INFj - Humanist

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Is sincerely religious or adheres to any ethical system. Unobtrusive and restrained. Ascetic. Strict towards themselves and others when it comes to disturbances of moral standards. Not likely to take the initiative. Little interested in the fact that they’re not connected with their persuasions. In their work they are sluggish and scrupulous. With them it is possible to have a talk, to pour out one’s soul, to receive simple, but efficient advice. Outward appearance: self-absorbed, ascetic.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) A good eye for people; immediately sees who does or doesn’t feel drawn to them by the looks in people’s eyes / have similar views to them. They love to be in a close circle of friends and adherents, and to discuss with them the novelties of literature, skill, humanities. Frequently behave unsure of themselves; They are scattered. The aim is humanitarian activity, but they can work in the service industry. Works well both in medicine and in pedagogy. Knows how to reconcile those disputing, to smooth out sharp situations. Knows how to create a pleasant situation, how to create a comfortable home. Dresses with the taste, frequently follows fashion.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype appears polite and tactful, constrained and passionless. They tend to keep some distance in dialogue and may seem strict and/or cold. Gradually, however, this impression dissipates as during dialogue their sincere sympathy and desire to assist is revealed. Serious, quiet and benevolent people, are usually scrupulous and tactful, they lack the ability to joke or flatter. In times of dispute with others they prefer to leave silently rather than resort to diplomacy. Are very hardworking, laborious, patient and assiduous. Will not stand for violence and injustice. Consecutive and firm in their principles. Ably creates comfort by decorating the home with hand-made articles – work well with their hands. Countenance is guarded – they seldom smile.. Pays attention towards maintaining a thin figure; dresses modestly with taste and elegance. Their movements are smooth yet firm, their gait quick yet restrained. They sit straight and seldom gesticulate while in conversation.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype is emotional and strict, yet shows kindliness, goodwill and affability toward those with whom they sympathize and hold in good esteem. Sometimes like to joke, they try not to speak with people about unpleasant things but will at times feel forced to state their disagreement/indignation or risk feelings of regret at a later time. Serious and scrupulous, approach others when they feel needed/useful. Internally nervous, sensitive and vulnerable despite their attempts to hide it. Have good figurative and creative abilities and are able to interpret various symbols, dreams and mystical images. Like to use their knowledge to advise and edify, but only in a narrow social circle; prefer to maintain an air of modesty and subtlety. Dresses simply, adhering to classical style, often conservatively; not prone to notable gesticulating while conversing. Speech is emotional yet restrained, their voice is often instructive. Often has a disproportionate figure, especially if prone to corpulence; meanwhile gait may be plain, clumsy and/or classy (though restrained).



    LSE - ESTj - Director

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Attempts to combine the entire cycle of production in their hands. A good worker, does not tolerate incompetence, is well educated in their area of competence. Very operational, sometimes wear themselves out with work. Consider that only thus can they require the same from others. Can be sharp in judgments. Usually formulates tasks very clearly. In the sphere of production attains the responsibility for a product, love to admire what they have made, and emphasize the advantage of their goods. Works well under the conditions of a stable market - in transportation, in the army. Clothing is conservative; for them, the main things are cleanliness, order and functionality.

    Creative subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype is characterized by a differentiation between their internal stability and working capacity. Internally unstable, they are likewise extremely vigorous and cannot relax without business affairs as they do not like wasting time in vain. Interested in new technologies within the professional sphere and able to adapt these to serve their needs. Possess a sense of humor. Their speech is abrupt and emotional; their smile is somewhat tense. Pulls together distance in dialogue through hospitable, friendly gestures – embraces and light touches. Briskly conducts conversation and/or jokes. An aesthete with a taste for gourmet, they love original dishes and beautiful, expensive objects of quality. Are able to relieve pressures by sitting at a table with friends but rarely allow themselves the rest to themselves that they need. Have a tendency to corpulence, their movements are gusty, sharp, quick and impulsive; often embody a restless demeanor.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype is efficient, correct, dry in dialogue, has a strict appearance and is unapproachable. They’re serious and restrained, not inclined to jokes. Usually laconic, but when angry, are difficult to calm down. Are direct in their behaviour and conversation, their sharpness in judgment often leads to ethical dilemmas. Prone also to other extreme measures of emotional expression: i.e. they will keep silent in order to avoid dialogue and compile insults for use at a later time. Uncompromising and stubborn. Sometimes try to gain the interlocutor’s intimacy through heart-felt intonations in voice, Often a mistrustful hypochondriac; they do not enjoy speaking of feelings. Prefer to remain engaged in something useful until it is completed. Are constantly strained(intense) and it is difficult for them to relax; are subject to unexpected fits of anger.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Feels at home in the intermediate fields of production – in trade or management. Is less inquisitive than the logical subtype; Is very sociable, emotional, gregarious. Frequently hospitable; loves comfort and cosiness, and likes to spend leisure time in nature. Easily manages the responsibilities of a technical director or manager.



    SLI - ISTp - Craftsman

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Outwardly businesslike, a little severe, cold and unapproachable. A realist and skeptic, distrustful of novelty, of those who advance [ideas of declarative character?]. Will always avoid useless matters, due to pragmatic nature. Very dynamic and technologically effective, Can extract the maximum of benefit even from tools. Their production is always foremost and will stand up to any competition on the market. Clothing is restrained, conservative, and they prefer a sporty, technological style.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Aesthete, disposed to obtaining pleasant sensations. Is considerably more gregarious than the initial subtype. More optimistic, but less operational. Sybaritic epicure. Gravitates towards the humanitarian disciplines - skill, linguistics, history. Dresses with taste, chooses clothes that emphasize their good looks, selects clothes according to colour.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype prefers to maintain a distance. Are very independent and proud; act for their own convenience. In conversation may become ironic but can also become affable and interested if shown sympathy/respect from the interlocutor. When they become aware of having had offended someone they show regret, soften themselves and apologize calmly. Behind their external inaccessibility lies vulnerability; are impatient and mobile, love constant changes and new impression, are active, efficient and careful. Disdain discomfort in all situations and are therefore prone to correct/repair/adapt everything for the sake of convenience. Reliable and punctual, are exacting towards themselves and others; they behave with cold advantage but still may become emotional. Their behaviour is unpredictable and characterized by unexpected transitions from cold contemplation to active action. Gestures are impulsive, resolute. Gait: fast, measured.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The sensory subtype is modest and non-demonstrative, constrained and polite, obstinate and uncompromising in regards to upholding their interests. Give concrete, logical reasons, rather than far-fetched ones, when explaining themselves. From time to time become thoughtful and isolate themselves from friends in order to plunge into their problems. Restrained in dialogue, they are laconic but at times try forcing a smile if they feel that there is intensity in the conversation. Dress with taste, like original, but modest, items of quality; watch over their health and figure: an aesthete. Enjoy manual labor, they are careful, laborious, patient and persistent; if in business will tirelessly improve production – material or intellectual – though sometimes they require a change of employment. Gestures tend to be graceful and lazy, smooth and thus confident in exact movements. Gait appears a little bit weakened and elastic; do not like feeling rushed but, at the same time, are not sluggish; may seem a little bit haughty.
    Last edited by CheGuevara; 11-13-2009 at 06:15 PM.
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    You switched dominant and harmonizing for ESIs.
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    It seems like that. But that wouldn't follow the pattern

    Nevertheless, I will switch D-ESI and H-ESI.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CheGuevara View Post
    Nevertheless, I will switch D-ESI and H-ESI.
    Revert. It can't be true. The sensory subtype cannot be the dominant one.

    ESI is the type I know least people of. So I'm not sure about it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CheGuevara View Post
    Revert. It can't be true. The sensory subtype cannot be the dominant one.

    ESI is the type I know least people of. So I'm not sure about it.
    Well, the description doesn't sound harmonizing at all. Btw, you might think about the fact that creative sensing is not the same as base sensing, etc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    It's actually N and H that were switched for them imo.
    This is a harmonizing subtype:

    Subtle, sensitive nature, is a good judge of character and a reliable friend, is capable of compromise. In their softness and ease of contact he sometimes resembles IS(F)Ps. This subtype is more frequently better at putting ideas into practice than at organizing things: since others are included, their opinions are important to him. Very good with small children; sensitive, thoughtful and attentive. Can also manifest applied skill and cultural activity. Outward appearance is modest; rarely follows fashion and prefers a freer style.
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    If you could work out a functional basis for DHCN you could write your own subtype descriptions instead of piecing together these, which were never meant to be DHCN.
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    Some of this makes no sense at all. The Creative subtype of INTp has so far always been associated with a stengthening of the Te function. Am I suddenly to believe the Ne is strengthened in this type instead?

    Also, Gulenko allowed for subtype combinations that were conflicting in club, whereas this model apearently doesn't. Where is the Fe subtype INTj, for example?

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    I don't believe it's correct to apply functions directly to these subtypes. An "Ne INTp" wouldn't exist in the 4 subtype model. Rather, it's more correct to say an "NeSe INTp" or just "C INTp" in shorthand.

    The reason is that we're not really working with functions. We're working with reinin dichotomies. A C INTp has strengthend EXTROVERT, IRRATIONAL and STATIC dichotomies.

    This is equivalent to saying that a C INTp has strengthened object statics. It's not really the Ne or Se functions that are strengthened, just the "object statics" aspect. The full definition of either function isn't being used, which includes all 15 reinin dichotomies.

    In the +/- model, for example:
    +Ne = Extroverted, Intuitive, Logical, Irrational, Static, Yielding, Democratic, Tactical, Constructivist, Carefree, Merry, Judicious, Positivist, Process, Asking.


    It's the only way (that I can think of) to make sense of the claim that BOTH Se & Ne are strengthened at the same time.

    If you wanted to strengthen only one of the functions (in order to write Ne INTp as opposed to Se INTp) you'd need to add the next scale: INTERNAL/EXTERNAL == INTUITIVE/SENSING (for irrational subtypes)... or PRIMARY/SECONDARY as Gulenko calls it. Then we'd have an 8 subtype model. The INTp has strengthened "internal object statics" or "external object statics," depending on the choice.


    Sorry for sounding anal, but it seems like an important distinction.
    Last edited by xerx; 11-14-2009 at 04:53 PM. Reason: corrected typo; added content
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    Also why is this in articles?

    /N mode
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazedratXII
    If you could work out a functional basis for DHCN you could write your own subtype descriptions instead of piecing together these, which were never meant to be DHCN.
    Krig had this idea and I think the descriptions are a good approximation. ESI still confuses me...

    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat
    Some of this makes no sense at all. The Creative subtype of INTp has so far always been associated with a stengthening of the Te function. Am I suddenly to believe the Ne is strengthened in this type instead?
    What you mean is the the "producing subtype" with a strenthened "creative function". The "creative subtype" in the DCNH system has strengthened and .

    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat
    Also, Gulenko allowed for subtype combinations that were conflicting in club, whereas this model apearently doesn't. Where is the Fe subtype INTj, for example?
    Strengthened and mean Dominant Subtype. Fe-INTj is a name in a system with 8 subtypes.

    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat
    I don't believe it's correct to apply functions directly to these subtypes. An "Ne INTp" wouldn't exist in the 4 subtype model. Rather, it's more correct to say an "NeSe INTp" or just "C INTp" in shorthand.
    That is true. I had the intention to write "Creative Subtype: " but it's not allowed to use so many symbols in a post.
    So I just used the symbol for the strenghened Ego or Id function.

    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat
    If my logic is right, then an intuitive way to look at it is to ignore the functions and just focus on sub-temperament.
    Nevertheless, I'm a rather introverted and perceiving INTj so my seems to be stronger than usual.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana View Post
    Okay, yes, that makes sense, but something else seems off then, because switching the H up to D, doesn't work great either.
    I think I can explain this paradoxical ESI description now.

    People normally try to limit the use of the ignoring fuction. Let's look at some ignoring-function-subtypes:

    Harmonizing ILE: not as shy as other -subtypes
    Dominant LII: not as dominant as other -subtypes
    Normalizing ESE: not as quiet as other -subtypes
    Creative SEI: not as aggressive as other -subtypes

    So Dominant ESIs are not as dominant as other -subtypes.



    People often use the demonstrative function as a kind of game or in an unconventional way. Let's look at some demonstrative-function-subtypes:

    Dominant ILE: "unpredictable and full of contrast"
    Harmonizing LII: "Not always absolute in statements, but obstinate and uncompromising in their actions"
    Creative EIE: "extravagant and unpredictable"
    Normalizing IEI: "Creating original contrasts, they can unexpectedly prick and then just as quickly embrace/kiss."

    So Harmonizing ESIs are also full of contrast: "Despite being internally wounded and emotional they try to appear as the strong, cool and self-assured person."

    Conclusion: The ESI descriptions sound paradoxical because the "Harmonizing ESI" seems to be more dominant than the dominant one. Nevertheless, I think the descriptions are not wrong. As is the ESI's ignoring function Dominant ESIs are not very dominant. As is the ESI's demonstrative function the Harmonizing ESI is full of contrast. Maybe the descriptions are not perfectly accurate and therefore a bit confusing...
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    You're wrong. That description can't be of an harmonizing ESI. You're creating ad-hoc rules to make everything fit. Why don't you just switch the descriptions? You'll look less like a fool. "Uncompromising in decisions" is the complete opposite of an harmonizing subtype.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    You're wrong. That description can't be of an harmonizing ESI. You're creating ad-hoc rules to make everything fit. Why don't you just switch the descriptions? You'll look less like a fool. "Uncompromising in decisions" is the complete opposite of an harmonizing subtype.
    The demonstrative-function-subtypes are often paradoxical. You can read that in the DCNH thread Krig started, too.

    H-LIIs are paradoxical.
    H-LSIs are paradoxical.
    H-ESIs are paradoxical.

    It's just because or is their demonstrative function so they use it as a game or in an unconventional way!

    The term "harmonizing subtype" does not in every case indicate a harmonizing person. "Harmonizing subtype" just means stronger and . It does not necessarily mean they use it in a peaceful way.
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    Being paradoxical just makes the whole theory much less credible. It would be better to match the description with the adjective, rather than trying to build a weird system to make everything fit toghether. Moreover, that type of ESI has simply much stronger , not stronger introverted function. You might look into the extrernal-well defined properties of functions, I think that subtypes that emphasize external and well-defined functions ( and ) tend to be dominant, for example. That would explain why you can't assimilate an ESI-Se to a LII-Ne or a SLE-Se to a IEE-Ne.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    You're wrong. That description can't be of an harmonizing ESI. You're creating ad-hoc rules to make everything fit. Why don't you just switch the descriptions? You'll look less like a fool. "Uncompromising in decisions" is the complete opposite of an harmonizing subtype.
    depends on what is being harmonized.
    he really can't switch descriptions as there is little to no basis for these actually being DHCN descriptions other than this [apparent] pattern.
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    Yeah, this is going further than I believe the evidence warrants. I thought the Gulenko/Meged/Ovcharov descriptions matching up somewhat with the DCNH descriptions was an interesting co-incidence that might hypothetically be able to shed some light on things, but clearly they weren't written with DCNH in mind, so it's best not to take them too dogmatically.

    I think it would be more profitable to start trying to come up with our own descriptions of the subtypes, based on the theory and the evidence, as I started in the other thread.
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    BTW, to whoever moved this thread, shouldn't it be in "Alternative Socionics Theories", not "Alternative Personality Typologies"? It is, after all, still based on Socionics.
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    I've always wondered if I'm really Te subtype, which would make me normalizing or dominant, according to this. I'm kind of in between them all, so I have problems identifying. But a lot of Meged's Te subtype goes with me well, and I've been known to get into Ti things of my own fairly easily, and depend upon common sense in many endeavors.

    I don't know if this project is fair, because I've always liked Meged's descriptions better anyway. Out of Meged's I think I identify the most with:

    Te-INTp > Ni-INTp >>> Ne-INTj

    and the other Meged ones I don't. However I know many days when I'm less positive I'm thinking Ni-INTp works best. So I'm leaving it out in the open for now. I know I'm definitely INTp, and not INTj. Been there done that is hard to say, but it's surprisingly true in this little sample. I can see reasons for people thinking of me as INTj though, they are common types. Se-PoLR is very impossible though.
    Last edited by 717495; 11-16-2009 at 12:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by polikujm View Post
    I've always wondered if I'm really Te subtype, which would make me normalizing or dominant, according to this. However I know many days when I'm less positive I'm thinking Ni-INTp works best. So I'm leaving it out in the open for now.
    I think it is very easy to distinguish between Te-INTp and Ni-INTp:

    Te-INTps are hardworking, firm and not inclined to reverie whereas Ni-INTps are lazy, dreamy and sensitive.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Being paradoxical just makes the whole theory much less credible. It would be better to match the description with the adjective, rather than trying to build a weird system to make everything fit toghether.
    The question is: Do the DCNH-types exist? I know they do because I can see them. So it is a good system and paradoxical types are not the system's fault. If you don't like the adjectives we could speak of Ni-LIIs instead of H-LIIs for example.

    The name "Critic" doesn't fit to every INTp because Ni-INTps don't like to criticize others openly.
    The name "Robespierre" doesn't fit to every INTj because logical INTjs are in no way revolutionaries.
    So it's not very surprising that not all "harmonizing" subtypes are really harmonizing!
    Last edited by CheGuevara; 11-27-2009 at 05:18 PM.
    Ni-INTj --- Harmonizing Analyst --- -
    DCNH rox

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    JohnDo's Avatar
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    I just wanted to mention that I still think theses descriptions are very useful - until there are some original DCNH descriptions...

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDo View Post
    I just wanted to mention that I still think theses descriptions are very useful - until there are some original DCNH descriptions...
    I think these ones are more useful, personally.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    ILE - ENTp 1981slater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CheGuevara View Post

    ILE - ENTp - Seeker

    Dominant subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype tries to project the impression of a serious person. Can be sharp and, from time to time, even inconsiderate. They are self-assured and speak quickly, usually with a categorical tone. Are unduly categorical in their judgments and tend to impose their opinion on others. Sometimes appears energetic and self-confident; are impatient and cannot always wait for a speaker to finish before interrupting. Often take great new interests and try to find these a practical embodiment; will actively and vigorously defend their interests but after they flare up and offend someone they will consciously make note and try to correct their position. Very ambitious and prone to take offense to mere trifles, however, after a while will again return to an affable and benevolent state. Behaviors are unpredictable and full of contrast. Appear tenacious, gait and gestures seem confident but are poorly coordinated. Pose without restraint, capable of quickly closing a distance, may embrace or kiss the interlocutor.
    What if this one is the creative subtype?

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) They differ in their excellent sense of novelty. They frequently become the originator of many inventions and discoveries. Unsurpassed generator of ideas. In their suggestions they is very daring. However, they easily drop a project if they are bored with it and they then feel drawn to a new, more captivating project. Capable of working well in business. Dynamic, talks rapidly, with many gestures. Frequently of stocky built, courageous appearance, whiskers (if a man). Great significance is attached to external appearance.
    And I think this profile fits better the dominant.
    ILE "Searcher"
    Socionics: ENTp
    DCNH: Dominant --> perhaps Normalizing
    Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
    MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
    Astrological sign: Aquarius

    To learn, read. To know, write. To master, teach.

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    Crispy's Avatar
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    The first one is a logical subtype, so it only makes sense as Dominant, or Normalizing in DCNH. If I understand correctly the provisionals were set up in a predictable pattern, unless it's been changed since then.
    ILI (FINAL ANSWER)

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    It seems silly that there is this system of subtypes, and there are only provisional (not to mention unoriginal) descriptions for them. If people are serious about this, then they should work on that. Put it in their own words, provide their own research, etc.. I'm not necessarily casting doubt on it. I just think that if one is able to invest in it seriously then they should also be able to write about it seriously. Splitting existing descriptions into seperate sentences is in poor form.

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    Quote Originally Posted by straytk View Post
    Splitting existing descriptions into seperate sentences is in poor form.
    Yes, I agree. I don't even understand how someone could think of this as a solution for the non existing DCNH descritptions. No offense, but that just doesn't make sense. The Meged/Ovcharov and Gulenko texts both describe the same, it's like asking two different people what their opinion on the same question is. Just because you get four small descriptions doesn't make it DCNH.
    „Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
    – Arthur Schopenhauer

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    Landlord of the Dog and Duck Subteigh's Avatar
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    spent time reading these before realising they aren't "official".

    I thought maybe out of the EII ones that I'm: H>N or D>C...
    but they all basically say the same thing and/or strongly describe key aspects of my personality (the only way of ruling one out was, for example, by dismissing those with statements that absolutely do not reflect me. In such cases, it makes me wonder whether they are overstated (given undue prominence etc.) and also whether circumstances unique to each individual should be accounted for or not.
    EII-Ne
    5w4 or 1w9 Sp/So

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    Poster Nutbag The Exception's Avatar
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    LII - INTj - Analyst

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Concrete and regulated, an organizer in science, does not entrust too [outlandish?] ideas. Scholars, but only in their own narrow area of competence. Their behaviour is dry, restrained; they can be authoritarian. Does not love discussions and frictions in a group; operates from a distant psychological distance. Strict adherent of reasonable systems. Clothing is strict.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Analyst; a good scientist and conceptualist. Their primary attention is given to global issues. A generator of ideas. Achievements with potential are more important to them than the result of the current moment. Soft, correct and careful in his social contacts. Outwardly frequently very slim, gives more attention to external appearance and health than Logical subtype.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentina Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The logical subtype is usually quiet, serious and constrained, are often uncompromising, even categorical, in their judgments. When they are not interested by the theme of a conversation they remain silent and severe, however, this cold demeanor is difficult to sustain. If the interlocutor behaves disdainfully they can be put in their place. Able to clearly and laconically, without superfluous emotions, express their ideas; does not enjoy long discussions. Spend lots of time in reflection: analyzing and comparing various phenomena, figures and facts. Give the impression of a strong-willed person. Lips are densely compressed, speech precise, abrupt, but their voices are not deep with varying intonations. Facial expression makes them seem as if they’ve recently awoke from sleep; internal emotions are reflected in unexpected and impulsive movements of muscles.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentina Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype appears a bit uncertain, and even soft, in dialogue. Not always absolute in statements, but obstinate and uncompromising in their actions. May keep silent, refrain from discussion, but their opinion will not change. Their latent emotions become visible during moments of extreme nervous pressure within intonations of their voice and impulsive gestures. In conversation are constrained, pay close attention to the interlocutor in order to give advice and to impress with their knowledge and conclusions; in such cases their serious demeanor is softened and goodwill penetrates their voice. Gait is quiet, synchronous, movements, on the contrary, are a little slow and nervous.. Pose appears restrained, gestures are avaricious and constrained, occasionally are unconsciously impulsive and badly coordinated.


    I'm probably H>C>N>>D going by those descriptions. I know they're not *official* DCNH descriptions though. But it is consistent with my own self-assessment on how I relate to the subtypes.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by CheGuevara View Post
    Beta Quadra

    IEI - INFp - Romantic

    Dominant subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Flatters and is charming and communicable. If they see negative emotions in the people around them, they will try to arrange things so that people will calm down. They will mobilize well in dangerous situations. Loves to be in the centre of attention and dramatize proceedings, possesses a sense of humour. They easily manipulate by intonation and voice; can work successfully as a journalist --- They easily succeed in enticing the person they talk to. Outwardly they can appear extravagant; frequently takes a bohemian and bright form.

    Creative subtype:
    (Victor Gulenko) Facial expression is typically interrogative, and they seem calm, dreamy, and contemplative. Their line of behaviour is frequently passive. Romantic spirits. They live in the world of illusions, and they attempt to avoid negative emotions. They can be optimistic. They shrink away from conflict situations and support compromises. They are restrained in their clothing, elegant and refined. They can fulfill the functions of an abstract thinker, work in psychology and psychotherapy.

    Normalizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype provides the impression of a soft, charming and emotional person. Usually look inspired and optimistic. Possess a fine sense of humor allowing them to list their problems and failures while smiling. Are ironic, crafty, unpredictably and inconsistent in behaviour and conversation. Creating original contrasts, they can unexpectedly prick and then just as quickly embrace/kiss. Artistic and charming; are eloquent in dialogue, occasionally portraying shades of familiarity and impudence. They’re generally affable, kind and careful. Easily draw attention and thereby attract people; talent towards persuasion: states requests in such a manner that it is difficult to refuse them. Movements are graceful as is their gait. Speech is emotional, rich with shades, sometimes melodious.

    Harmonizing subtype:
    (Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype appears as a quiet, tactful, languid and diffident individual. They seem torn off from reality, inert and poorly adapted to life. However, such impressions are erroneous, for they possess a fine intuition, which aids them in establishing useful connections and obtaining support from influential people. Seem externally serene but sentimentally are disposed to experience moodiness and bouts of melancholy. While their voice at times seems monotonous they often induce a light surprise, even full interest, from the interlocutor. Outwardly are pensive, slightly strained/intense.. Prone to emanate sadness masked in sardonic irony. Speech is measured, smooth and intimately heart-felt. On their face they almost constantly exude a polite half-smile that easily wins people’s trust. Gestures are modest, shy. Gait is ponderous, elegant.
    Out of the above descriptions, I'm thinking maybe Normalizing for myself (maybe, maybe) - but I strongly agree with the bolded of Subteigh's statement. I've never been able to come to a conclusion concerning DCNH or eve Ni/Fe for myself, but have typically thought that I'm a balanced subtype.

    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    spent time reading these before realising they aren't "official".

    I thought maybe out of the EII ones that I'm: H>N or D>C...
    but they all basically say the same thing and/or strongly describe key aspects of my personality (the only way of ruling one out was, for example, by dismissing those with statements that absolutely do not reflect me. In such cases, it makes me wonder whether they are overstated (given undue prominence etc.) and also whether circumstances unique to each individual should be accounted for or not.

  37. #37
    Shaebette's Avatar
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    Won't 4w3 EIIs be of the Creative subtype mainly because of the need to express themselves?

    C-EII-INFj 4w3 Sx/sp 479

  38. #38
    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaebette View Post
    Won't 4w3 EIIs be of the Creative subtype mainly because of the need to express themselves?
    Anybody can have a need to express themselves. The DCNH types are a real thing. You have to learn what it is by long term observations and not translate it into something else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    Anybody can have a need to express themselves. The DCNH types are a real thing. You have to learn what it is by long term observations and not translate it into something else.
    So I'm curious about the Creative subtype EIIs. Ne+Se+Fe are accentuated. How does that work when EIIs are Se PolR?

    C-EII-INFj 4w3 Sx/sp 479

  40. #40
    Melodies of a Martian~
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    Why are the descriptions stolen?




    They were not supposed to be DCNH descriptions by their authors!



    Oh.



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