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Thread: Nobel Peace Prize 2009

  1. #1
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    Default Nobel Peace Prize 2009

    I'm surprised there isn't a thread on this.

    What do you guys think of Obama being awarded the Nobel Peace Prize? Apparently it's "for his extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between peoples." I'm very interested to hear people's perspectives on this....

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    in his first year as president? People can go years before their work is recognized, it's way too soon for him.
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    I am an Obama supporter, but I think it's kind of silly to give him the Nobel Peace Prize simply for not being George W. Bush. A lot of people aren't George W. Bush.
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    Maybe it is a little early for him to get the Peace Prize, but is it really so easy to think of someone who has had a greater statement of intent and at such a high level as Obama? It's true that there will be people who have got their hands dirtier so to speak in the quest for peace and over a longer period of time, but the things he has done and said so far have been quite bold.

    The award people were asked why he was given the award, and part of the reason was to aide his stated aims...so yes, it does sound like Obama's been awarded for something he hasn't done yet.

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    I think that, especially considering he was nominated less than two weeks into his presidency, it is a bit too soon. If I were Obama I think I would ask that someone else receive it instead - maybe a posthumous award for Ghandi, even - and then hope to maybe go up for it again in a few years when/if he manages to accomplish those things.

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    I consider Gandhi to have been a rather vile person.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    I consider Gandhi to have been a rather vile person.
    Well whatever lol... I wasn't campaigning for Gandhi; his name just came to mind.

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    China has a larger military force I think...but I don't think that's particularly relevant - armies can fight wars which are 'morally justified' and which need to be fought.

    ...but then...Winston Churchill got his Nobel Prize in Literature for his History of the Second World War (as well as for his speeches) rather than for how he actually fought it...i.e. although he fought for peace, maybe the Nobel Prize people don't consider that an acceptable way of bringing about peace!

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    I thought the award was about accomplishments. He hasn't had a chance to do much at this point.
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    This is propaganda, just like when Al Gore won it years ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    This is propaganda, just like when Al Gore won it years ago.
    How is it propaganda? It could backfire spectacularly.

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    Other famous people to have won the Nobel Peace Prize:
    Henry Kissinger ...
    Mother Teresa - only helped those as a means to convert them to Christianity
    Yasser Arafat - terrorist\freedom-fighter
    Nelson Mandela - was the head of a militia

    The United Nations Peace-Keeping Forces have also won the Nobel Peace Prize.

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    Also Mikhail Gorbachev - for apparently helping to bring the Cold War to an end...although there is evidence to suppose that his motive wasn't peace, but indifference or miscalculation. I suspect many of these people are probably suspect!
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    I think it's important to note this:

    Nominations for the Prize may be made by a broad array of qualified individuals, including former recipients, members of national assemblies and congresses, university professors (in certain disciplines), international judges, and special advisors to the Prize Committee. In 2009, a record 205 nominations were received.[5] The Committee keeps the nominations secret and asks that nominators do the same. Over time many individuals have become known as "Nobel Peace Prize Nominees", but this designation has no official standing.[6] Nominations from 1901 to 1955, however, have been released in a database.[7] When the past nominations were released it was discovered that Adolf Hitler was nominated in 1939 by Erik Brandt, a member of the Swedish Parliament. Brandt retracted the nomination after a few days.[8] Other infamous nominees included Joseph Stalin and Benito Mussolini. However, since nomination requires only support from one qualified person (e.g., a history professor), these unusual nominations do not represent the opinions of the Nobel committee itself.[citation needed]

    Unlike the other Nobel Prizes, which recognize completed scientific or literary accomplishment, the Nobel Peace Prize may be awarded to persons or organizations that are in the process of resolving a conflict or creating peace. As some such processes have failed to create lasting peace, some Peace Prizes appear questionable in hindsight. For example, the awards given to Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Shimon Peres, Yitzhak Rabin, Yasser Arafat, Lê Ðức Thọ, and Henry Kissinger were particularly controversial and criticized; the Kissinger-Thọ award prompted two dissenting Committee members to resign.[9]
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    That's interesting.

    Well, maybe it will inspire him.

    I see on Facebook that my mom is very pleased that he won the award. It seems premature to me, but I guess that's the way it goes.
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    The erroneous publication in 1888 of a premature obituary of Nobel by a French newspaper, condemning him for his invention of dynamite, is said to have brought about his decision to leave a better legacy after his death.[2] The obituary stated Le marchand de la mort est mort ("The merchant of death is dead") and went on to say, "Dr. Alfred Nobel, who became rich by finding ways to kill more people faster than ever before, died yesterday.

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    Que ridicule.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoapOfSapphire View Post
    I'm surprised there isn't a thread on this
    So am I, I haven't turned on the TV all year. Without the images of Obama's face and the small recordings of his talking I have no idea what he's been doing (well except for a few things that I do know but anyway, they don't count).

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    Actually,

    Quote Originally Posted by yahoo news
    Many observers were shocked by the unexpected choice so early in the Obama presidency, which began less than two weeks before the Feb. 1 nomination deadline and has yet to yield concrete achievements in peacemaking.
    Some around the world objected to the choice of Obama, who still oversees wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and has launched deadly counter-terror strikes in Pakistan and Somalia.
    Obama said he was working to end the war in Iraq and "to confront a ruthless adversary that directly threatens the American people and our allies" in Afghanistan.
    Members of the Norwegian Nobel Committee said their choice could be seen as an early vote of confidence in Obama intended to build global support for his policies. They lauded the change in global mood wrought by Obama's calls for peace and cooperation, and praised his pledges to reduce the world stock of nuclear arms, ease American conflicts with Muslim nations and strengthen the U.S. role in combating climate change.
    I rather disagree with these things if this is the case. I don't think the Nobel Peace Prize should be awarded in anticipation of what someone might do or as a way to promote that person's actions or policies with a vote of confidence of "this person shows great promise". It's supposed to be awarded for something the person actually did do... like if their work created "peace" by say, stopping a war, or uniting enemies thereby possibly preventing a war, or if their humanitarian acts across the globe made great progress in improving international relations, etc. Which, in this article, I've noticed there are usually some pretty specific reasons for it being awarded (assuming my skimming skills have not failed me in that determination). And plus if the cut off date was Feb 1, then it's completely ridiculous... he just started. Is he being awarded for his excellence in getting started in a new job and dealing with paperwork? (I think if they were considering awarding him, they should have waited until later and had more of a reason... I mean by that they would actually have something they could say he did... it would be more thorough...)

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    This is like awarding valedictorian to whatever student has the best attitude at the start of the school year.

    If he had any class, he'd turn it down because, ya know, he hasn't actually done anything yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Actually,

    I rather disagree with these things if this is the case. I don't think the Nobel Peace Prize should be awarded in anticipation of what someone might do or as a way to promote that person's actions or policies with a vote of confidence of "this person shows great promise". It's supposed to be awarded for something the person actually did do... like if their work created "peace" by say, stopping a war, or uniting enemies thereby possibly preventing a war, or if their humanitarian acts across the globe made great progress in improving international relations, etc. Which, in this article, I've noticed there are usually some pretty specific reasons for it being awarded (assuming my skimming skills have not failed me in that determination). And plus if the cut off date was Feb 1, then it's completely ridiculous... he just started. Is he being awarded for his excellence in getting started in a new job and dealing with paperwork? (I think if they were considering awarding him, they should have waited until later and had more of a reason... I mean by that they would actually have something they could say he did... it would be more thorough...)
    Ah, but just because the cut off date for nomination was February 1st doesn't necessarily mean that only events before then should be taken into account. Also, I would count reading speeches and making diplomatic relationships as doing something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    Ah, but just because the cut off date for nomination was February 1st doesn't necessarily mean that only events before then should be taken into account. Also, I would count reading speeches and making diplomatic relationships as doing something.
    Speeches are not doing something: They're talking about doing something.
    Making diplomatic relationships isn't doing something unless they get results. What results has Obama got? More support in Afghanistan? Russia to stop aiding Iran's weapons programs? Nope, nadda, nothing.

    This just in from New York:

    Wall Street firms announced today that, in honor of President Obama's Nobel Peace Prize, they were changing their bonus practices. No longer will annual bonuses be based on income generated during a twelve month period. Instead, annual bonuses will be awarded every 8-1/2 months. Further, instead of being based on actual results, bonuses up to three times actual salary will be eaerned if the employee has demonstrated the prospect of bringing in future income. "This is change we can believe in", the banks' employees said. "If it's good enough for the Nobel Committee, it's good enough for us".

    Senator Claire McCaskill (D-Mo) who introduced The Cap Executive Officer Pay Act of 2009 (S.360), which would limit the annual compensation for executives at companies receiving TARP funding to the salary received by the President of the United States, currently $400,000 per year, said she planned to withdraw her bill and reintroduce it at some time in the future when the Nobel Committee stops giving President Obama awards. She could not predict when that would be, noting that, unlike the Constitution, there is no limit on the number of times the Nobel Committee could vote for President Obama.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drommel View Post
    Speeches are not doing something: They're talking about doing something.
    Making diplomatic relationships isn't doing something unless they get results. What results has Obama got? More support in Afghanistan? Russia to stop aiding Iran's weapons programs? Nope, nadda, nothing.
    'Speaking' and 'Talking' are both verbs - that means they are "doing" words. Promoting peace is a worthy criterion for getting a peace prize.

    As for getting more support in Afghanistan or getting Russia to stop aiding Iran's weapons programs (which I didn't realise they supported)...you must learn to appreciate that the World is a big, complicated place and that things are not always black-and-white. The US didn't help Russia fight in Afghanistan in the 70s and 80s for example...in fact the US actively hindered the Russians. Although the US and Russia have different leaders and different policies now, there is only a limited amount that each country can do and they don't actually always agree on policy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drommel View Post
    This just in from New York:

    Wall Street firms announced today that, in honor of President Obama's Nobel Peace Prize, they were changing their bonus practices. No longer will annual bonuses be based on income generated during a twelve month period. Instead, annual bonuses will be awarded every 8-1/2 months. Further, instead of being based on actual results, bonuses up to three times actual salary will be eaerned if the employee has demonstrated the prospect of bringing in future income. "This is change we can believe in", the banks' employees said. "If it's good enough for the Nobel Committee, it's good enough for us".

    Senator Claire McCaskill (D-Mo) who introduced The Cap Executive Officer Pay Act of 2009 (S.360), which would limit the annual compensation for executives at companies receiving TARP funding to the salary received by the President of the United States, currently $400,000 per year, said she planned to withdraw her bill and reintroduce it at some time in the future when the Nobel Committee stops giving President Obama awards. She could not predict when that would be, noting that, unlike the Constitution, there is no limit on the number of times the Nobel Committee could vote for President Obama.
    erm...they're entitled to do whatever they like, as long as it's within the law.

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    I don't really know what he's done to deserve it. Seems kind of weird.

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    that said, think how badly America has been seen , suth that it 10 months into the new president's regime he's awarded the nobel peace prize.

    lol..... : /

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    'Speaking' and 'Talking' are both verbs - that means they are "doing" words. Promoting peace is a worthy criterion for getting a peace prize.

    As for getting more support in Afghanistan or getting Russia to stop aiding Iran's weapons programs (which I didn't realise they supported)...you must learn to appreciate that the World is a big, complicated place and that things are not always black-and-white. The US didn't help Russia fight in Afghanistan in the 70s and 80s for example...in fact the US actively hindered the Russians. Although the US and Russia have different leaders and different policies now, there is only a limited amount that each country can do and they don't actually always agree on policy.
    The Nobel Peace Prize was suppose to be awarded to people who have enhanced world peace. What has Obama done to enhance world peace? I mean, beside saying that peace is a good thing, like a Miss America contestant.

    The U.S., nor it's president, weren't awarded a peace prize for anything related to Russia's engagement in Afghanistan. Today, however, Obama has been awarded a peace prize despite not dealing the challenges facing peace.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    erm...they're entitled to do whatever they like, as long as it's within the law.
    That was a joke, moron.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drommel View Post
    The Nobel Peace Prize was suppose to be awarded to people who have enhanced world peace. What has Obama done to enhance world peace? I mean, beside saying that peace is a good thing, like a Miss America contestant.

    The U.S., nor it's president, weren't awarded a peace prize for anything related to Russia's engagement in Afghanistan. Today, however, Obama has been awarded a peace prize despite not dealing the challenges facing peace.
    He has reached out to the Muslim world, Iran in particular, he has shown a willingness to speak to North Korea, he has decided not to build a missile defence system in Poland and the Czech Republic and attempted to improve relations with Russia and not sung "Bomb Bomb Iran".

    Quote Originally Posted by Drommel View Post
    That was a joke, moron.
    ...and what exactly is your point?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fear of sleep View Post
    in his first year as president? People can go years before their work is recognized, it's way too soon for him.
    agree.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    he should refuse it.
    The saddest ESFj

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    Peace and diplomacy is really about not doing things... like not bombing the shit out of people or killing them and instead talking it over a cup of tea and some biscuits.

    Peaceful people are remember for things like... not murdering 6 million Jews, not forcing apartheid or slavery amongst other things.

    Peace is often about talking and convincing people not to do much of anything, you know just chill with the fam, shag the wifey, give piggy back rides to your kid amongst other things.

    As a President and a diplomat, the key to establishing peace is dialog where people can negotiate over how not to go all medieval on each other. Now the negotiation can result in absolutely nothing at all, but at least you didn't cut somebody's head off on tv.

    The thing about peace, is people don't really know what it is, until they start really feeling what it is like not to be peaceful... most of the punk ass kids here never really deal with violence on any appreciable level or the consequences of a 500kg bomb dropped in the street.

    I don't know if Obama deserves the award, but if the Nobel committee sees fit to give it to him, I don't see much point arguing with them. I think his commitment to peace is genuine and he's opening dialog with others that need to be opened. I think any criticism of Obama is pretty stupid on this matter, it's entirely outside his control. There is a political agenda to this criticism and a lot of resentment from the GOP and other right-wing interests. People like Drommel are no more interested in peace then any other of these douche bag fascists, really all they are interested in is their self-interest and how they can profit from this world, the detriment of others be damned. We should be careful not to buy into these people and their arguments, they are not on the side of peace or justice, normally only profit and greed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hkkmr View Post
    Peace and diplomacy is really about not doing things... like not bombing the shit out of people or killing them and instead talking it over a cup of tea and some biscuits.

    Peaceful people are remember for things like... not murdering 6 million Jews, not forcing apartheid or slavery amongst other things.

    Peace is often about talking and convincing people not to do much of anything, you know just chill with the fam, shag the wifey, give piggy back rides to your kid amongst other things.

    As a President and a diplomat, the key to establishing peace is dialog where people can negotiate over how not to go all medieval on each other. Now the negotiation can result in absolutely nothing at all, but at least you didn't cut somebody's head off on tv.

    The thing about peace, is people don't really know what it is, until they start really feeling what it is like not to be peaceful... most of the punk ass kids here never really deal with violence on any appreciable level or the consequences of a 500kg bomb dropped in the street.

    I don't know if Obama deserves the award, but if the Nobel committee sees fit to give it to him, I don't see much point arguing with them. I think his commitment to peace is genuine and he's opening dialog with others that need to be opened. I think any criticism of Obama is pretty stupid on this matter, it's entirely outside his control. There is a political agenda to this criticism and a lot of resentment from the GOP and other right-wing interests. People like Drommel are no more interested in peace then any other of these douche bag fascists, really all they are interested in is their self-interest and how they can profit from this world, the detriment of others be damned. We should be careful not to buy into these people and their arguments, they are not on the side of peace or justice, normally only profit and greed.
    I agree 100%
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drommel View Post
    Speeches are not doing something: They're talking about doing something.
    Making diplomatic relationships isn't doing something unless they get results. What results has Obama got? More support in Afghanistan? Russia to stop aiding Iran's weapons programs? Nope, nadda, nothing.

    This just in from New York:

    Wall Street firms announced today that, in honor of President Obama's Nobel Peace Prize, they were changing their bonus practices. No longer will annual bonuses be based on income generated during a twelve month period. Instead, annual bonuses will be awarded every 8-1/2 months. Further, instead of being based on actual results, bonuses up to three times actual salary will be eaerned if the employee has demonstrated the prospect of bringing in future income. "This is change we can believe in", the banks' employees said. "If it's good enough for the Nobel Committee, it's good enough for us".

    Senator Claire McCaskill (D-Mo) who introduced The Cap Executive Officer Pay Act of 2009 (S.360), which would limit the annual compensation for executives at companies receiving TARP funding to the salary received by the President of the United States, currently $400,000 per year, said she planned to withdraw her bill and reintroduce it at some time in the future when the Nobel Committee stops giving President Obama awards. She could not predict when that would be, noting that, unlike the Constitution, there is no limit on the number of times the Nobel Committee could vote for President Obama.
    Since the beginning of the year...the relationship between goldman sachs and the govt has never been cozier. No one on wall street has been punished. Goldman is more powerful than ever before. The markets have become a reflection of the fed and the big banks playing with themselves rather than the psychology of market participants. The federal reserve has become the first trillion dollar hedge fund in the history of the world and cash advances the nations credit card aka the us treasury under geithner five billion a day to give to goldman and other brokerage houses to play with...five times the rate of spending in iraq and seven times the rate of spending in afghanastan. Long-term capital management was three billion when it went down in 1998...that's cash advancing 1.7 LTCMs a day to give to the big banks. Five billion dollars is a whole week's worth of inflows from the entire nation collectively on a good week. It's a joke seeing "five micriphones" Geither sell the recovery "plan" every day like an amway salesman....throwing five billion a day at the markets and hoping something sticks. Although he inherited the problem he had a chance to fix things but instead continued the ways of his predecessor...albeit a more "double-down" approach...either way no financial reforms.

    To goldman sachs and the big banks...we love you!!

    Sincerely..."the worst is over" Obama, Timmie "Green shoots, jam it baby!" Geithner, and Ben "slum dog trillionaire" Bernanke.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by hkkmr View Post
    Peace and diplomacy is really about not doing things... like not bombing the shit out of people or killing them and instead talking it over a cup of tea and some biscuits.

    Peaceful people are remember for things like... not murdering 6 million Jews, not forcing apartheid or slavery amongst other things.

    Peace is often about talking and convincing people not to do much of anything, you know just chill with the fam, shag the wifey, give piggy back rides to your kid amongst other things.

    As a President and a diplomat, the key to establishing peace is dialog where people can negotiate over how not to go all medieval on each other. Now the negotiation can result in absolutely nothing at all, but at least you didn't cut somebody's head off on tv.

    The thing about peace, is people don't really know what it is, until they start really feeling what it is like not to be peaceful... most of the punk ass kids here never really deal with violence on any appreciable level or the consequences of a 500kg bomb dropped in the street.

    I don't know if Obama deserves the award, but if the Nobel committee sees fit to give it to him, I don't see much point arguing with them. I think his commitment to peace is genuine and he's opening dialog with others that need to be opened. I think any criticism of Obama is pretty stupid on this matter, it's entirely outside his control. There is a political agenda to this criticism and a lot of resentment from the GOP and other right-wing interests. People like Drommel are no more interested in peace then any other of these douche bag fascists, really all they are interested in is their self-interest and how they can profit from this world, the detriment of others be damned. We should be careful not to buy into these people and their arguments, they are not on the side of peace or justice, normally only profit and greed.
    I like this post.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by hkkmr View Post
    Peace and diplomacy is really about not doing things... like not bombing the shit out of people or killing them and instead talking it over a cup of tea and some biscuits.

    Peaceful people are remember for things like... not murdering 6 million Jews, not forcing apartheid or slavery amongst other things.

    Peace is often about talking and convincing people not to do much of anything, you know just chill with the fam, shag the wifey, give piggy back rides to your kid amongst other things.

    As a President and a diplomat, the key to establishing peace is dialog where people can negotiate over how not to go all medieval on each other. Now the negotiation can result in absolutely nothing at all, but at least you didn't cut somebody's head off on tv.

    The thing about peace, is people don't really know what it is, until they start really feeling what it is like not to be peaceful... most of the punk ass kids here never really deal with violence on any appreciable level or the consequences of a 500kg bomb dropped in the street.

    I don't know if Obama deserves the award, but if the Nobel committee sees fit to give it to him, I don't see much point arguing with them. I think his commitment to peace is genuine and he's opening dialog with others that need to be opened. I think any criticism of Obama is pretty stupid on this matter, it's entirely outside his control. There is a political agenda to this criticism and a lot of resentment from the GOP and other right-wing interests. People like Drommel are no more interested in peace then any other of these douche bag fascists, really all they are interested in is their self-interest and how they can profit from this world, the detriment of others be damned. We should be careful not to buy into these people and their arguments, they are not on the side of peace or justice, normally only profit and greed.
    Nice, I agree.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  38. #38
    Slippery when wet Simon Ssmall's Avatar
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    Well Gorbachev got one of those also, so I've seen worse. Either way Nobel peace prize I've never considered it as something to be of real value although some great people/organisations got it.

    "The awards given to Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Shimon Peres, Yitzhak Rabin, Yasser Arafat, Lê Ðức Thọ and Henry Kissinger were particularly controversial and much-debated. The Kissinger-Thọ award prompted two dissenting Committee members to resign.[13] Most recently, awarding the prize to President Barack Obama early in his presidential term has generated debate about the timing of the award in relation to the recipient's actual achievements, particularly in light of President Obama being office for less than two weeks before the February 1 nomination deadline.[14] [15][16][17], although it is not known who nominated him, when, or why, and although nomination and award are entirely separate processes."

    "Another criticism of the peace-prize are the notable omissions, namely the failure to award individuals with widely recognized contributions to peace. The list includes Mahatma Gandhi, Corazon Aquino, Pope John XXIII, Pope John Paul II, Dorothy Day, César Chávez, John Lennon, Oscar Romero, Jose Figueres Ferrer, Steve Biko, Raphael Lemkin, Abdul Sattar Edhi and Irena Sendler.[citation needed]

    In particular, the omission of the Indian leader Gandhi has been widely discussed, including in public statements by various members of the Nobel Committee.[18][19] The Committee has confirmed that Gandhi was nominated in 1937, 1938, 1939, 1947 and, finally, a few days before he was murdered in January 1948.[20] The omission has been publicly regretted by later members of the Nobel Committee.[18] In 1948, the year of Gandhi's death, the Nobel Committee declined to award a prize on the ground that "there was no suitable living candidate" that year. Later, when the Dalai Lama was awarded the Peace Prize in 1989, the chairman of the committee said that this was "in part a tribute to the memory of Mahatma Gandhi".[21]"
    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

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  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    He has reached out to the Muslim world, Iran in particular, he has shown a willingness to speak to North Korea, he has decided not to build a missile defence system in Poland and the Czech Republic and attempted to improve relations with Russia and not sung "Bomb Bomb Iran".
    Obama hasn't reached out to the Muslim world. Yes, he's speechified about the Muslim world, but policy remains the same with no advancements in relations. The U.S. still isn't talking to Iran, Iran is still after nukes, and Isreal is still after Iran.

    During the Bush administration, the U.S. held multilateral talks with North Korea. Under the Obama administration, these talks have disolved. North Korea has since kicked out nuclear inspectors, resumed its nuclear program, and tested several weapons.

    The U.S. is still building a missile defense system, it's simply changed. A site in the Ukraine instead of Czech and Poland along with sea-based systems.

    You seem to be unable to differentiate between rederick and results. Or, worse still, seem to think rederick alone is worthy of recognition.

    I'm not sure why you're arguing that the prize was awarded for something Obama has actually acommplished. Both Obama and the Nobel committee acknowledged it wasn't.

    ...and what exactly is your point?
    That you can't tell the difference between reality and fiction.

  40. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drommel View Post
    Obama hasn't reached out to the Muslim world. Yes, he's speechified about the Muslim world, but policy remains the same with no advancements in relations. The U.S. still isn't talking to Iran, Iran is still after nukes, and Isreal is still after Iran.

    During the Bush administration, the U.S. held multilateral talks with North Korea. Under the Obama administration, these talks have disolved. North Korea has since kicked out nuclear inspectors, resumed its nuclear program, and tested several weapons.

    The U.S. is still building a missile defense system, it's simply changed. A site in the Ukraine instead of Czech and Poland along with sea-based systems.

    You seem to be unable to differentiate between rederick and results. Or, worse still, seem to think rederick alone is worthy of recognition.

    I'm not sure why you're arguing that the prize was awarded for something Obama has actually acommplished. Both Obama and the Nobel committee acknowledged it wasn't.



    That you can't tell the difference between reality and fiction.

    Thank you for saying this for me.

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