Sororities/Fraternities

[ScarlettLux]

?

This is a personally relevant thread to me... just went to a sorority recruitment type thing last night and umm... boy, oh boy, was it ever... odd. And like the movies.

So what types of girls/guys are most likely to join sororities/frats? I think the obvious answer is Fe/Ti valuers... Alpha/Beta. I do NOT see Gammas/Deltas AT ALL appreciating the atmosphere of the typical frat/sorority... especially yesterday's. It was an overload of

And then we visited a frat that had a ton of engineers in it, who seemed to respond to very well... LSI/LII/SLE imo.

Anyone else been in a frat/sorority and have stories to share?

I'm still iffy on the whole thing but I do want to join one.

[Gilly]

I was in a frat It was fucking insane. My frat was about 50/50 Alphas and Betas, but it was probably the exception; I would say fraternities in general have an Aristocratic bent.

[tereg]

I would never be caught dead in a frat.

[Creepy-Diana]

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[Slacker]

The sorority my mom and grandmother were in wanted me to join because I was a "double legacy" or something? I don't remember. Anyway, NO WAY. My mom said she hated being in it and only did it because my grandma wanted her to.

[Gilly]

My school doesn't have frats or sororities so I don't have much choice in the matter. Otherwise, I highly doubt I'd actually join a sorority because they're just not my thing.

I would never be caught dead in a frat.

That's what I thought too.

And no you may not chalk it up to me being socially extroverted , because I'm really not, and neither were most of the guys in my frat for that matter...it was more like a commune, really.

[tereg]

In case I wasn't clear, I have a tremendous amount of disdain for frats.

[Gilly]

All I'm saying is, don't judge them all because they're called "frats." They're not all the same.

[Creepy-Diana]

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[olduser]

my friend was once being recruited by a fraternity:
'oh yeah our frat is great, you should really join, you'll make so many friends.'
'hmm.'
'come on, it's a great life style.'
'wait.'
'what?'
'i don't want to join the frat- but how much do i have to pay you, just you, to be my friend?'

[redbaron]

I wasn't in one cause my college didn't have them. But I had a fair bit of disdain for them. Of course at the time, my two best friends were ESIs so that could have affected my outlook. I think the only way I might have considered joining one is if an SEE or SLE had dragged me into it.

[Cyrano]

In case I wasn't clear, I have a tremendous amount of disdain for frats.

They always struck me as clubs designed to keep people out.

[Gilly]

Not socially extroverted, just groupey. That's what I meant by "mass social" it's the band-together sort of mentality. Not good for the individualistic and independent sorts.

I think you're confusing mob mentality with wanting to have a tight group of close friends. I'm both highly individualistic and independent, and your suggesting otherwise is pretty much evidence that you have nothing but stereotype-based notions of the entire concept of a fraternity, just like most people who show disdain for it (as well as probably some lingering passive-aggression directed at me ). When it comes to having a social circle, I like to be part of a small, tight-knit group of friends. I have nothing but contempt for the idea of belonging to some big formal social clique, engaging in group social dynamics, etc, and it sounds like you can't really draw the line between those two things.

[Creepy-Diana]

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[marooned]

I decided not to when I found out how much time was devoted to sorority-specific things.

That's my big objection to them for me, personally. I don't want to have to participate in activities if I don't want to and would rather spend my time some other way... and I think I'd find a lot of the activities so excrutiating that I would walk out of the sorority after one or two of them, so might as well not join in the first place..

The one good thing about them I think is that they have some requirements for GPA, and because of that I have general respect for them I think.

Anyway, I only tried to go to a frat party once, which didn't actually become a party because after buying all the alcohol the frat members had proceeded to drink so much of it that no one was capable of finishing the work needed to organize the party and there were bags and bags and piles and piles of beer cans and empty alcohol bottles everywhere in the main room. I really didn't regret going there because that was really amusing.

Oh, and I do think that Fe is really dominant in those sorts of environments.

[Gilly]

Yeah, whatever. I'm going off of my experience with fraternities and sororities. You can have a tight group of close friends without having to be obligated to partake in various activities with them on a regular basis, pay dues, or live together.

You're obviously missing the point and, as usual, are obviously not going to change your mind. Fortunately for you I'm not in the mood to pick a fight over it. Have a nice day.

[Creepy-male]

You're obviously missing the point and, as usual, are obviously not going to change your mind. Fortunately for you I'm not in the mood to pick a fight over it. Have a nice day.

[Gilly]

If this were my modus operandi, I might agree.

[Creepy-male]

If this were my modus operandi, I might agree.

[Gilly]

...No, actually I was serious.

[Creepy-male]

...No, actually I was serious.

I'm sure you were.

However, giving vague and cryptic answers is a way of exerting control through doubt. I believe it's a popular tactic within the media.

Anyway, the end point is that you're reading into Gul as playing mindgames with you. Instead, I'm just on a high and having fun accusing you of being an ILE for your conflict with a Fi type.

[Gilly]

How was my message in any way vague or cryptic?

[Creepy-male]

How was my message in any way vague or cryptic?

You'll understand when you're older.

Naw, just kidding.

"If this were my modus operandi, I might agree." <- what did you think I was commenting on? What "Modus Operandi"?

[Gilly]

I thought you were talking about how I handled the conflict; usually I'm inclined to express my anger and frustration at closed-mindedness, whereas here I avoided it.

In any case, I'm done with you.

[Creepy-male]

I thought you were talking about how I handled the conflict; usually I'm inclined to express my anger and frustration at closed-mindedness, whereas here I avoided it.

No, avoiding expressing those would be simply not to communicate. You still expressed your anger and frustration, just in a "I'm telling you they're not there" way.

How much more before Gilly snaps?

EDIT

In any case, I'm done with you.

Oh, okay.

[Creepy-Diana]

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[olduser]

hahaha. i always get the impression that girls in sororities are kind of -dumb-. and the guys in frats are sort of clowns. i'm sure there's a lot of diversity, but i'm equally sure that the number of gay jokes is virtually uncountable, and that all those girls in sisterhoods text while they drive. anyway, what would i know, those equations are little complex for me.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

To be honest, the thought of fraternity life really appeals to me. There is the natural homoerotcism, which I'd obviously enjoy, and I'd actually be turned on by their pranks instead of humiliated, but I'm afraid it's kind of just a 'gay porn fantasy' and in reality I probably would get bored and wouldn't like it. So I'm kind of torn. I don't really tell anybody IRL this, because they don't understand these urges I have and write me off as just another computer geek. And yes that is *basically* what I am, but there are still all these sides of myself, that I'd like to explore....but I hate, having to choose one side of the other, and well my computer geek friends would let be myself more than preppy frat boys, wouldn't they? They are so pretty, guys like that deserve only to be fisted.

But then it's like, my true friends would of course want me to be 'myself' whatever that entails but I just don't know, I feel like Cordelia having to choose between the Cordettes and Scoobs; or in my case- the more deeper, genuine friends and the hot jock that's better in bed but treats you like shit. *sigh*

[Gilly]

Every sorority or fraternity I knew of had stipulations on how involved the members had to be. Of course the atmosphere of every one was different, and each drew different sorts of people, blah, blah, blah, but they all still had requirements that had to be met.

Every one of the ones that I talked to at the college I attended required members to be involved in a minimum number of activities, and the time involved in meeting these obligations was to me, excessive. People who like that sort of thing, I'm sure wouldn't have a problem with it. But, people who like to do their own things with their time, won't like it.

Voluntarily spending lots of time with your friends is one thing. Being obligated to do so is something entirely different. Burdening yourself with social obligations is not for everyone. Independent sorts of people will have an especially hard time willingly roping themselves in to something like that.

I think you need to step further out of the box and decline to judge that which you have not experienced directly. I'm telling you, from direct experience, that not all fraternities are like the ones you have seen.

[Gilly]

No, avoiding expressing those would be simply not to communicate. You still expressed your anger and frustration, just in a "I'm telling you they're not there" way.

I announced their existence; I didn't express them.

How much more before Gilly snaps?

You could never snap me, gul

[JRiddy]

To be honest, the thought of fraternity life really appeals to me. There is the natural homoerotcism, which I'd obviously enjoy, and I'd actually be turned on by their pranks instead of humiliated, but I'm afraid it's kind of just a 'gay porn fantasy' and in reality I probably would get bored and wouldn't like it. So I'm kind of torn. I don't really tell anybody IRL this, because they don't understand these urges I have and write me off as just another computer geek. And yes that is *basically* what I am, but there are still all these sides of myself, that I'd like to explore....but I hate, having to choose one side of the other, and well my computer geek friends would let be myself more than preppy frat boys, wouldn't they? They are so pretty, guys like that deserve only to be fisted.

But then it's like, my true friends would of course want me to be 'myself' whatever that entails but I just don't know, I feel like Cordelia having to choose between the Cordettes and Scoobs; or in my case- the more deeper, genuine friends and the hot jock that's better in bed but treats you like shit. *sigh*

Is is safe to say that your fraternity fantasy is analogous to the common straight male fantasy about being in a sorority house while they are having pillow fights in lingerie? I mean, that's something that seems like it would be awesome when it's just a fantasy and you don't have to worry about all the complications, but you kinda know that in reality it would suck.

[JRiddy]

In reference to the original question, I don't think there's anything inherently type-related about greek organizations in general. It wouldn't surprise me if specific houses had higher concentrations of a certain quadra or some kinda group of people. But this doesn't mean that the very idea of a greek organization is specific to certain socionic values. I was actually in a fraternity for a while, albeit a pretty small one, and we had roughly equal representation from each quadra. Of course, we ended up splitting up largely on quadra lines. It's a long story with a lot of annoying bro-drama, and I don't care to recount the whole thing now.

If anything, these organizations are a primarily cultural institution, so if you're not part of that culture, they probably won't appeal to you.

[jewels]

I remember thinking the sorority houses were pretty, with flowers and stuff, but I drove by during rush and saw a group of thin girls, ignoring one fat girl, who was off to the side alone, and no one was going to risk talking to her. And then I decided never to join. That's just mean. I don't like cliques.

Is it possible for Deltas to join greek life?? I see it as quite Beta.

[strrrng]

There were a bunch of girls who wanted me to join their sorority when I went to college. I liked all of them, and it probably would have been fun. I decided not to when I found out how much time was devoted to sorority-specific things. I like to fill my time how I want, and didn't like the time-investment aspect. I'm sure it's great for the mass social people. Not so great for the independent.

Not socially extroverted, just groupey. That's what I meant by "mass social" it's the band-together sort of mentality. Not good for the individualistic and independent sorts.

Sounds more like you just categorized it a certain way after refraining from joining. Is there anything else besides your compensatory strong-woman complex that served as a legitimate basis for making such a judgment? Or are you simply above such kinds of justifications?

Yeah, whatever. I'm going off of my experience with fraternities and sororities. You can have a tight group of close friends without having to be obligated to partake in various activities with them on a regular basis, pay dues, or live together.

What experience? The superficial assessment you made based on an outside perspective of something you were averse to?

And did you ever consider that some fraternities/sororities just might function as a "tight group of close friends" who partake in mutually-enjoyable activities, without any feelings of obligation?

[xerx]

The only frat I'd ever consider joining is this one.

[Creepy-Diana]

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[strrrng]

The experience of living in a fraternity (during the summer when school was out) and talking to the guys in it. The experience of marrying someone in a fraternity, and obviously dating him beforehand while he was living there. The experience of having several of my friends join sororities and talking to them and experiencing the amount of time they had for non-sorority activities compared to what they had before they joined. Talking to many different people in different fraternities and sororities before, during, after "Rush Week" knowing them personally, knowing what sort of schedules they had compared to the non-greeks. Seriously considering joining a sorority and weighing the pros and cons beforehand with as much information as I could get.

Yeah, list them off. The point lies in the way you express your opinions, and the complete blind spot you demonstrate towards accepting anything that marginally escapes the position you speak from.

Ftr, knowing and talking to people in sororities, does not in any way suggest that you actually made legitimate judgments on the nature of them. The fact that you've whittled things down to some banal dichotomy about independent and groupie people, betrays your position clearly.

Being Gilly's little helper pet is pathetic strrrng. If you have something to contribute, such as your own experience or some such, do it. But trying to cut me down for my opinion based on my own experience is laughable. ScarlettLux asked for opinions on joining a sorority. I gave mine, based on a whole lot more information and perspective than you have. So butt out. Gilly has a different opinion based on his experience. I can tell you what I've seen and what I've concluded. Anyone else can do the same. So you and Gilly can shove this "close-minded and judgemental" crap up your asses, since you're the only ones who are being so.

Pass it off however you want. Nobody was attempting to undermine your experience; the issue lied in the fact that your opinion was close-minded and judgmental, despite the purported understanding you possess.

[Logos]

Are Sororities/Fraternities type related? Yes and no. It is type related in that it is likely that statistically there will be a higher concentration of some types over others who end up joining. But at the same time, I do not think we can make a direct causal relationship that states "these types join sororities/fraternities" without first examining the motivations for why particular types join or choose not to join sororities/fraternities. Because you will and do find all types in these organizations.

[Gilly]

We're closed minded because we refuse to let you blunder on with this opinion that all frats are the same because you're unwilling to acknowledge anything outside your personal experience.

Fucking BRILLIANT, Diana. Makes me want to attack you with a rubber stamp that says, "DON'T CRITICIZE MY VIEWPOINTS, I'M SLOW."

[Creepy-Diana]

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