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Thread: "Political" typings: when someone on the forum pisses you off

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    Default "Political" typings: when someone on the forum pisses you off

    The most most childish behavior on this forum is "political typing."

    These typings are disingenuous, made out of spite, and the16types equivalent of the shit kids say during elementary school recesses.

    On this forum, political typings occur when one forum member--acting out of anger, annoyance, or other impure motive--"types" another person erroneously in attempt to make said person look bad, stupid, etc... (It is never done to make another person look good, smart, etc.)

    Here's an example of one that very recently occurred (re: me--I didn't have time to go looking for other examples...)
    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...tml#post532748

    In this case, as in most cases, the poster simply wants to create a controversy... The poster is probably bored, insecure, and angry... And unfortunately, nothing good comes out of political typing threads, (usually just a bunch of insults.)

    ---

    One can tell the difference between a "political" typing and a genuine typing suggestion by the tone of the post, evidence offered, (questions about whomever is being typed?,) and also by the poster's history of political typings/history of interaction with whomever is being typed. (For example, some ppl who have been offended by Niffweed tend to erroneously type him INTj... In actuality, he's one of the most clear examples of INTp on this planet... Ppl type him this way often to attempt to put him down... However, the joke is on them, not Niffweed.)

    ---
    Another personal example... immediately after I wrote a criticism of Steve's interpretation of Socionics/Socionix, he changed how he typed me--from INFp to ENFp... He did this for reasons known only to him, although I think most ppl here can put 2+2 together.

    This does not happen only to me--ppl push "political typings" all the time on this forum... These typings cause many ppl here to 'spin their wheels' as re: learning Socionics, (especially more susceptible ppl. Before I learned SOcionics, I was one of these.)

    This post is a call to end political typings... ONly by being honest with ourselves--and to others, about our own personalities and others', will we progress in learning Socionics. Until then, we'll just spin our wheels

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    expired Lotus's Avatar
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    lol
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    ***el X Mercenary Nebuchadnezzar's Avatar
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    I know what you mean JuJu. I just hate stupid, unsubstantial political bullshit like this.

    "His feeling that this world is not his Fatherland, and that it does not represent his proper condition, so to speak—his feeling that, basically, he 'comes from afar'—will remain a fundamental element which will not give rise to mystical escapism and spiritual weakness, but rather will enable him to minimise, to relativise, to refer to higher concepts of measure and limit, all that can seem important and definitive to others, starting with death itself, and will confer on him calm force and breadth of vision." — Julius Evola

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeAnte View Post
    I know what you mean JuJu. I just hate stupid, unsubstantial political bullshit like this.
    lol

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    I say Fidel Castro and Hitler are the same type as Juju

    ILE "Searcher"
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    personally, i don't see why juju's history and attitude leave him remotely in a position to berate others on this subject.

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    let's stick on topic.

    re: deante... I believe that typing to be correct... I have not made a political typing in at least a year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    personally, i don't see why juju's history leaves him remotely in a position to berate others on this subject.
    i'd just rather fix the problem than contribute to it anymore

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    Fucking Christ.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Quote Originally Posted by JuJu View Post
    i'd just rather fix the problem than contribute to it anymore
    You just did.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    As soon as someone disagrees with someone, it's so often the case to jump on to 'you are/are not such and such a type' which is almost like ad hominem without the insult.

    In real life, if I disagree with someone, if I said, 'it's cause you're not delta', people would laugh their ass off at me. Things can be worked out or discussed without such ad hominem antics, you see such productive solutions in actual other examples all the time, people who actually are capable of working together (whether they have to or just as they are, they achieve it without getting so personal, which re-typing someone just scratches the surface of).

    It's a poor way to argue, but, sometimes it's true, often it's not, but it almost never leads to productive debate.

    Socionics forums typically suck anyway, perhaps sadly. Often if I want what I or is generally seen as an informative internet discussion, I use other forums.

    Maybe peoples types shouldn't be questioned unless they want it to, which is probably something that couldn't work here. Hmm.

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    ***el X Mercenary Nebuchadnezzar's Avatar
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    JuJu is blatantly Ne-ENFp ppl!

    Ne-ENFp Filmmaker and screenwriter, David Goyer.




    Ne-ENFp assclown, JuJu.


    Simultaneously play both videos and observe identical expressions, gestures, Ep temperment, etc. Goyer is slightly calmer than JuJu, but they are basically the same type.

    Also, see my excellent post on JuJu and ENFps.

    "His feeling that this world is not his Fatherland, and that it does not represent his proper condition, so to speak—his feeling that, basically, he 'comes from afar'—will remain a fundamental element which will not give rise to mystical escapism and spiritual weakness, but rather will enable him to minimise, to relativise, to refer to higher concepts of measure and limit, all that can seem important and definitive to others, starting with death itself, and will confer on him calm force and breadth of vision." — Julius Evola

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    ILE - ENTp 1981slater's Avatar
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    ***el X Mercenary Nebuchadnezzar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carla View Post
    Lol, Gully called it battle typing.
    lol



    Let's hope it sticks!

    "His feeling that this world is not his Fatherland, and that it does not represent his proper condition, so to speak—his feeling that, basically, he 'comes from afar'—will remain a fundamental element which will not give rise to mystical escapism and spiritual weakness, but rather will enable him to minimise, to relativise, to refer to higher concepts of measure and limit, all that can seem important and definitive to others, starting with death itself, and will confer on him calm force and breadth of vision." — Julius Evola

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    Quote Originally Posted by JuJu View Post
    The most most childish behavior on this forum is "political typing."
    Though I absolutely agree with you, this is clearly an 'it takes one to know one' phenomenon. So though you have made a very keen observation about people, it was done in part because it is also something peculiar of you.

    But I am not discrediting you or insulting you. I am just relating this situation that you are in to situations I have been in.

    EDIT: self-observation and accepting our defects is the first step toward changing ourselves into better people.
    Last edited by Waddlesworth; 06-18-2009 at 10:21 PM.

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    I support this thread. It's good that this phenomenon gets extra attention.

    Publicly doubting someones selftyping is a cheap way of undermining their credibility.

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    i'll tear down the sky Mattie's Avatar
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    I can't really comment on whether or not typings or what-not are "political," but there are obvious lines in the sand between members. I would like this to stop as well, at least, kept private so the forum could be more proactive. But, in my opinion, you go about trying to solve this the incorrect way JuJu. I understand you have good intentions, but to me, you embody "The path to Hell is paved with good intentions." on this forum. You're not going to sway anyone with a "I'm the right one here, and these are the wrong things over there." Your attitude can come off very pompous, and people see that instead of what you actually want to accomplish. I think you should try a different approach if you really are concerned with what's going on, there should be a focus on cooperation and open discussion, not focused on who's right and wrong. People are going to be wrong and make mistakes, but we should be progressive and just stay positive. If there are actually people who just mean to do harm, they'll eventually get bored and moved on when no one reacts to them. Those who are genuinely interested in discussing Socionics and being part of a community will stay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by look.to.the.sky View Post
    I can't really comment on whether or not typings or what-not are "political," but there are obvious lines in the sand between members. I would like this to stop as well, at least, kept private so the forum could be more proactive. But, in my opinion, you go about trying to solve this the incorrect way JuJu. I understand you have good intentions, but to me, you embody "The path to Hell is paved with good intentions." on this forum. You're not going to sway anyone with a "I'm the right one here, and these are the wrong things over there." Your attitude can come off very pompous, and people see that instead of what you actually want to accomplish. I think you should try a different approach if you really are concerned with what's going on, there should be a focus on cooperation and open discussion, not focused on who's right and wrong. People are going to be wrong and make mistakes, but we should be progressive and just stay positive. If there are actually people who just mean to do harm, they'll eventually get bored and moved on when no one reacts to them. Those who are genuinely interested in discussing Socionics and being part of a community will stay.
    +1000

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    Brill pretty much beat you to it with one of his signatures.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Why only these people. Where are all the people on this list who think I'm LII?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gulanzon View Post
    Brill pretty much beat you to it with one of his signatures.
    Which one?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ifmd95 View Post
    just remember that these sort of typing would erode your own credibility when someone who knows what they're talking about sorts through the mess.
    That's precisely what I'm speaking about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    it's "only these people" because the typings listed on that page are the typings of those who have put up public lists of their typings of community members.
    That is quite fine. I seem to trust JuJu more than the others listed on his many accounts, as I'm sure those who know me could just as well write a list containing false typings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mimosa Pudica View Post
    OOoooo.... That sound exciting
    Marry me.


    @look.to.the.sky: very well said.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aldous Huxley
    The propagandist's purpose is to make one set of people forget that certain other sets of people are human.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Quote Originally Posted by tuturututu View Post
    Which one?
    The one about "Battle Typing".

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    Quote Originally Posted by JuJu View Post
    Another personal example... immediately after I wrote a criticism of Steve's interpretation of Socionics/Socionix, he changed how he typed me--from INFp to ENFp... He did this for reasons known only to him, although I think most ppl here can put 2+2 together.
    I had not spoken to you for a long time, until the last few weeks when you jumped in threads I was involved with and attempted to undermine my credibility. During this process, I got to see more and more how you went about doing your thing and what kinds of leverage you sought to use, and it reminded me exactly of the stuff you did a long time ago when you typed yourself ENFp, something I had characterized as Fi/Fe differences.

    I began to see the pattern more and more; particularly how your way of attacking and stirring up shit in threads contrasted to that of the Beta NFs I know, and I couldn't in good conscience keep you as INFp. I actually spent over 2 hours during the course of a few days comparing you to videos of ENFjs, INFps and ENFps, trying to consider every way you could possibly be each, and it became clear that Beta NFs Fe and Ni are just inverse to what you do and run contrary to the way you convey information and relate in discussions.

    I never confirmed the INFp typing, I sort of just went with it because strrrng had suggested it in the fall, and I took his word for it since you guys had gotten to know each other more, not bothering to do too much scrutinizing examination myself. Also I had certain Beta stereotypes I loosely accepted in my head that you fit, but I realized that those aren't Beta things at all, that instead they are Enneagram 3 things.

    Taking a step back recently and observing how you talk more closely in light of all the time I've seen you post of the forum, as well as re-examining your videos, prompted the change.

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    While we're on the topic of politics: JuJu strategy 101

    (copied from my response in the other thread)

    Your pattern:

    Step 1: Say something condemnatory/ad hominem and potentially thread-derailing

    Step 2: Wait for people to respond to the remark with their own jest

    Step 3: Jump back in and pretend that you had no involvement in the atmosphere of the thread, now trying to sell some noble teacher image while other people are responding negatively to things you initially started. You attempt to capitalize on this apparent contrast between people's antipathic responses toward your initial comments, and your new pretend didactic motives. Why? I don't know yet. Why don't you tell me. You're persistent and must still believe it's not transparent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    Marry me
    Too late for that...
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    I don't think Joy likes this thread.

    Binary or dichotomous systems, although regulated by a principle, are among the most artificial arrangements that have ever been invented. -- William Swainson, A Treatise on the Geography and Classification of Animals (1835)

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    from toronto with love ScarlettLux's Avatar
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    I'm done with this. I think most people can see through your bs Juju, so my last rant in Sirena's thread will be the end of it. Though it could become quite entertaining and fun to continue on with this 'battle' hehe.

    Eh, maybe when I have more energy.


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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux View Post
    Though it could become quite entertaining and fun to continue on with this 'battle' hehe.

    Eh, maybe when I have more energy.
    *raises hand in guilt* You know, as annoying as it's been trying to correct the propaganda, there has been something strategically entertaining about it. That, in addition to giving me practice at trying to pinpoint stuff with words. I guess it's impossible to keep my ego 100% out of this

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    from toronto with love ScarlettLux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    *raises hand in guilt* You know, as annoying as it's been trying to correct the propaganda, there has been something strategically entertaining about it. That, in addition to giving me practice at trying to pinpoint stuff with words. I guess it's impossible to keep my ego 100% out of this
    LOL of course it's fun! You gotta make light of it at the end of the day


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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux View Post
    LOL of course it's fun! You gotta make light of it at the end of the day
    You mean, after burying the bodies?
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux View Post
    LOL of course it's fun! You gotta make light of it at the end of the day


    Idk, call me out if I'm stereotyping, but I feel like you, and Nick (and even myself but whatever Fe I put out is more implicit in the structure I lay out) are riding the Fe wave of the evolving dynamic in these exchanges, whereas Sirena and JuJu are more or less offering their "assessment" of the specific people, not in terms of what those people are "doing" right now or evaluating their actions, but evaluating them in what i'll approximate to, "their character". It's like JuJu and Sirena are seeing people within a personalized relating context like "this is how the person has to be based on my evaluation of them". Whereas you and Nick are like "this is what's going on with you, this is what you're doing...now stop!" Yours is a dynamic causal "reaction" lets say, whereas Sirena and JuJu always feel to me like they're "evaluating" people the way I would evaluate some sort of logical paradigm or Ti equivalent, looking to maintain an inherent static consistency.

    This "reacting" vs "evaluating" is the crux of the difference in how I experience Beta vs Delta NFs.

    The same could be said more of less of Alpha SFs vs Gamma SFs.

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    i'll tear down the sky Mattie's Avatar
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    I guess this might say something about type differences, but I don't know how you guys find this enjoyable at all. Looking at these posts almost make me wince.

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    Quote Originally Posted by look.to.the.sky View Post
    I guess this might say something about type differences, but I don't know how you guys find this enjoyable at all. Looking at these posts almost make me wince.
    It's not "enjoyable" per-se. It's weird that way. For me at least, it started because I was annoyed at JuJu misrepresenting my point of view, and annoyed at his constant evasion of my replies. I actually tried to be reasonable and make socinoics based arguments because I wanted to hear how the observations I presented collide with his point of view, but that never happened.

    Then I got over that initial thing and it turned into this sort of game where it's like "how can I corner him this time?". It's like cat and mouse, me trying to make it so he can't slip any lie/contradiction through.

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    i'll tear down the sky Mattie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    It's not "enjoyable" per-se. It's weird that way. For me at least, it started because I was annoyed at JuJu misrepresenting my point of view, and annoyed at his constant evasion of my replies. I actually tried to be reasonable and make socinoics based arguments because I wanted to hear how the observations I presented collide with his point of view, but that never happened.

    Then I got over that initial thing and it turned into this sort of game where it's like "how can I corner him this time?". It's like cat and mouse, me trying to make it so he can't slip any lie/contradiction through.
    Sure, but at the expense of everyone else? It just seems like a really lame flash back to high school really. I mean, if everyone else finds this humorous/no big deal, I guess I have no room to talk, but I can't be the only one tired seeing more of these types of arguments/bickering/gang-ups/whatever more than intelligent conversation, no matter who "started it." Or is that kinda what needs to happen...? I don't know, doesn't feel right to me.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by look.to.the.sky View Post
    Sure, but at the expense of everyone else? It just seems like a really lame flash back to high school really. I mean, if everyone else finds this humorous/no big deal, I guess I have no room to talk, but I can't be the only one tired seeing more of these types of arguments/bickering/gang-ups/whatever more than intelligent conversation, no matter who "started it." Or is that kinda what needs to happen...? I don't know, doesn't feel right to me.
    welcome to the16types.info

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    Quote Originally Posted by look.to.the.sky View Post
    Sure, but at the expense of everyone else? It just seems like a really lame flash back to high school really. I mean, if everyone else finds this humorous/no big deal, I guess I have no room to talk, but I can't be the only one tired seeing more of these types of arguments/bickering/gang-ups/whatever more than intelligent conversation, no matter who "started it." Or is that kinda what needs to happen...? I don't know, doesn't feel right to me.
    I understand. I guess there's a little high school left somewhere in there.

    I'm still extremely open to an actual socionics debate with JuJu or anyone that disagrees with me. I have presented numerous typings and reasoning/observations for those typings that have not been addressed. Instead they've been personally slandered. But I'm still more than open to discussing actual socionics if the ad hominem detour can be bypassed.

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    i'll tear down the sky Mattie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat View Post
    welcome to the16types.info
    I should have seen something like this coming

    I can easily see how his rhetoric can be frustrating to you, as well as I feel like I can see where JuJu is coming from, but I don't agree with how it's handled. Whatever my opinion's worth is up to you I guess, but I think it's time to just stop with all this BS. Like, this JuJu + whomever and the same crew who argue with him are spanning on three different threads at ONCE. It's like all of you are jumping back and forth between the same multiple threads saying basically the same thing and nothing is really changing. I'm sorry, I don't mean to talk down to you, I don't want to villain-ize either of you.

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