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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Default I lose.

    Yep.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    what? is this related to your new LIE typing? and why are you now LIE?
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    Creepy-Diana

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    .

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    TeNi White LIE is back, I see. Since when?
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Because I was always LIE.

    The basic lowdown on my confusion is as follows:

    1.In certain cases (mine is quite prevalent here) Te is a bigger hardass about logic, etc. than Ti. I thought I had to be Ti because I am constantly reverting everything to logic, which doesn't have to be the case at all (and isn't, at all).

    2.I do have Ni. I always have. Read some of my creative writing and you'll flip a shit if you have problems with Ni.

    So I screwed the pooch thoroughly on this one.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    In a hilarious onslaught of irony, I may die of laughter.

    A TeNi LIE after all.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    <something> Wynch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom View Post
    Because I was always LIE.

    The basic lowdown on my confusion is as follows:

    1.In certain cases (mine is quite prevalent here) Te is a bigger hardass about logic, etc. than Ti. I thought I had to be Ti because I am constantly reverting everything to logic, which doesn't have to be the case at all (and isn't, at all).


    2.I do have Ni. I always have. Read some of my creative writing and you'll flip a shit if you have problems with Ni.

    So I screwed the pooch thoroughly on this one.
    Um, what?
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    Very busy with work. Only kind of around.

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    From Jung's Psychological Types on Extroverted Thinking:

    "This type will, by definition, be a man whose constant endeavor-in so far, of course, as he is a pure type-is to make all his activities dependent on intellectual conclusions, which in the last resort are always oriented by objective data, whether these be external facts or generally accepted ideas."
    Jung, with his obvious Te polr, goes on and on about how horrible Te is; I fit his hate quite well, unfortunately.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom View Post

    2.I do have Ni. I always have. Read some of my creative writing and you'll flip a shit if you have problems with Ni.
    you know, most physiological responses can probably be explained through socionics. I recently made a joke and my ESE friend totally Ne-spasmed on me. Go figure!
    EII; E6(w5)

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Hey: you hated it, remember? You Si-agenda, you.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom View Post
    From Jung's Psychological Types on Extroverted Thinking:
    "This type will, by definition, be a man whose constant endeavor-in so far, of course, as he is a pure type-is to make all his activities dependent on intellectual conclusions, which in the last resort are always oriented by objective data, whether these be external facts or generally accepted ideas."
    Jung, with his obvious Te polr, goes on and on about how horrible Te is; I fit his hate quite well, unfortunately.
    How does that quote show that Jung went on and on about how horrible Te is?

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    excuse me. i think we all agree that jung was a flaming ILI.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    when i read psychological types way back when (and i am not willing to look at it again right now and i don't know when i will feel like it), i thought the Te description sounded rather like socionics Ti in some places... i don't think Jung's Te is socionics Te (some of it fits; but some of it doesn't at all). as for Jung's type, i have no idea, though i wouldn't be surprised if he was leading.

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Oh he's Ni IEI alright.

    And yes, his Te is socionics Te; Fi drives Te into a bit of a frothing frenzy over whatsoever it deems as "truth".

    External Object Dynamics = externally focussed implementation of rules garnered from it's dualizing type, Fi.

    In my case, those rules from Fi that I have are external and logical. Te always works through a "logical" process, but what exactly, it implements is subjective, and driven by personal internal field preference; in my case, actual logic.

    Put more simply, I've grown up with such a heady amount of Ti from Jakey-puddles that my Fi IS (for the most part) Ti.
    Last edited by Tom; 04-12-2009 at 02:09 AM.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    How does that quote show that Jung went on and on about how horrible Te is?
    That particular quote doesn't; it only begins the pages-long section of hate.

    Edit: In fact, If you wanted a great example of Te polr, Jung goes into all the problems he sees with it right there.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    is this real or a joke? (serious question)
    ahahahahaha.
    glam, i love you.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom View Post

    Put more simply, I've grown up with such a heady amount of Ti from Jakey-puddles that my Fi IS (for the most part) Ti.
    Haha, nice. For some reason I feel like I relate to Ti a lot. I'm not sure why....
    Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own freshness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop off like autumn leaves.
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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Tom, you have no clue what you are talking about. Go de-Ashtonize your views on Socionics by reading Rick's website and then come back.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    yes. uh, Tom, seriously, how can you and Jake possibly be quasis?
    i think Supervision is, otoh, very likely.
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Oh Gilly...

    Anyway this doesn't have diddles to do with Model X. Te leading is Te leading either way. Read Jung. Think about what the external dynamics of objects really means. Get over yourselves and Rick's site.

    Also, Quasi makes plenty of sense. People are always telling us we're similar, asking if we're brothers, etc.; we can see our vast differences, but the "layman" usually can't, for one reason or another.

    It also puts me into the correct club, if you think that not-so-pertinent stuff is worth anything.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Oh:

    Yes glam, I am serious.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    interesting that Tom would dislike Rick and Rick's site so much. Wonder why.....
    if only we could devise a system of interaction that allows us to expain why 2 people, who barely know each other, immediately have problems with information communication.
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    interesting that Tom would dislike Rick and Rick's site so much. Wonder why.....
    if only we could devise a system of interaction that allows us to expain why 2 people, who barely know each other, immediately have problems with information communication.
    you are saying he is an LSI? I have a lot of problem with rick's site as well, not that it isn't knowledgeable but it is written in a way I find it confusing and not in depth to explain the core things
    (D)IEE~FI-(C)SLE~Ni E-5w4(Sp/Sx)/7w8(So/Sp)/9w1(sp/sx)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    1)
    A girl who I want to date, asks me: well first tell me how tall you are?
    My reply: well I will answer that, if you first tell me how much you weigh!

    2)
    A girl I was dating said she was oh so great at sex etc, but she didn't do blowjobs.
    My reply: Oh I'm really romantic etc, I just will never take you out to dinner.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    interesting that Tom would dislike Rick and Rick's site so much. Wonder why.....
    if only we could devise a system of interaction that allows us to expain why 2 people, who barely know each other, immediately have problems with information communication.
    So far almost everyone has had a problem with his information communication. Maybe Glam is Delta too, since she seems to have the most problems with him. Anyway, the fact that they barely know each other and disagree doesn't mean they're conflictors, it just means that Tom thinks Rick's site is mostly bullshit (which isn't-type related).
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    I've basically read every little scrap of information on Rick's site/blog.

    twas interesting, then I moved on. Same with wikisocion.

    I gave Tom the idea that he might be ENTj

    I brought it up to him that he seemed more 8w7 than 8w9

    He vehemently refuses to sit in Delta

    So I said, fine. You are Te Ej. Maybe your Ni ENTj?

    And I guess he did his own research into the matter.

    Personally I think hes Si ESTj.

    But hes not fucking Ti so please every stfu. Many of you are annoying little Rick/Niffweed/Expat fanboys and it makes me want to drink turpentine and shit lazer beams.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom View Post
    Because I was always LIE.

    The basic lowdown on my confusion is as follows:

    1.In certain cases (mine is quite prevalent here) Te is a bigger hardass about logic, etc. than Ti. I thought I had to be Ti because I am constantly reverting everything to logic, which doesn't have to be the case at all (and isn't, at all).

    2.I do have Ni. I always have. Read some of my creative writing and you'll flip a shit if you have problems with Ni.

    So I screwed the pooch thoroughly on this one.
    Shit man, you're just like me a few years ago.

    You are so Se ego.

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    ESTj Tom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    interesting that Tom would dislike Rick and Rick's site so much. Wonder why.....
    if only we could devise a system of interaction that allows us to expain why 2 people, who barely know each other, immediately have problems with information communication.
    I have no problems with Rick, nor do I like/dislike him particularly; I just think the information he presents is incorrect.

    My main function is definitely Te.
    I use Ni in my writing and in my thought process.
    Se/Ni + ExTj = ENTj
    I may be Ni LIE, which would basically put Se in my "ego", but I'm going with Te at present, because I seem to operate almost solely in that aspect, and I can see a very discernible archetypical trend in Ni LIEs.

    Jung is certainly Te polr, and his writing style suggests a Ni base. He also VIs perfectly as Ni IEI. Niff can blow it out his ass.
    Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Tom, don't give me this "Te is Te" crap. Te in Jung is a vaguely defined observational phenomenon that is pretty much just Jung's impression of some of his patients. Augusta's Te is a well-defined category that, while it owes its origins in terms of its label to Jung, is really just a mental tool used to observe a particular thinking strategy. This "Te is Te" crap is bullshit, because neither of them have any concrete basis in reality; these are simply projections, mental methods of categorization, that are in no way rooted in physical phenomena except in terms of the external results used to measure the internal processes that they claim to deduce. We can measure the external results, find correlations, whatever you want, but there is no "Te." "Te" is in your mind, and that is all.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    The Ignoring function is easily mistaken for the PoLR... in Model T terms, it's the shutoff to the base. Not something you want to sped a lot of time with...

    The PoLR is painful, but in its own right, not because of anything it does to the base. I think the PoLR is more easily perceived as an attack, whereas the Ignoring is more easily perceived as idiocy (because when you try it yourself, it hinders your thinking)... the PoLR will be criticized as "evil" whereas the Ignoring will be criticized as "useless."



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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Tom, you have no clue what you are talking about. Go de-Ashtonize your views on Socionics by reading Rick's website and then come back.
    Gilly, you legend.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom View Post
    My main function is definitely Te.
    I use Ni in my writing and in my thought process.
    Se/Ni + ExTj = ENTj
    I may be Ni LIE, which would basically put Se in my "ego", but I'm going with Te at present, because I seem to operate almost solely in that aspect, and I can see a very discernible archetypical trend in Ni LIEs.
    Can't you see that means shit? All you're doing is stating something - no evidence, no back up, nothing! You're convincing no one.

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    yeah, so most of you guys are pretty fucking pretentious.

    Must be that time of the month.
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    I'm not sure but I think Te EJ makes sense for Tom. From what he's shown, he's pretty much Expat/Smilex's identical.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion View Post
    yeah, so most of you guys are pretty fucking pretentious.

    Must be that time of the month.
    ????
    fuck off.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    ????
    fuck off.

    HAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAAHAHAHA

    Seeing that next to your avatar...its priceless.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Ashton's a little rough, and his overbearing fatherness and distant motherness is a conflicting opposite to what most people on here have, but I've always enjoyed his views on socionics and found nothing wrong with them, whatsoever.

    Oh. I did disagree with him about a few things before. Non-socioncs related. And *one* socionics thing I disagreed with him about. But I usually agree with what he's saying, despite being supervised by him. Both he and Allie have socionics pretty much down imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BulletsAndDoves View Post
    Ashton's a little rough, and his overbearing fatherness and distant motherness is a conflicting opposite to what most people on here have, but I've always enjoyed his views on socionics and found nothing wrong with them, whatsoever.

    Oh. I did disagree with him about a few things before. Non-socioncs related. And *one* socionics thing I disagreed with him about. But I usually agree with what he's saying, despite being supervised by him. Both he and Allie have socionics pretty much down imo.
    Please tell me you're joking.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    I wish I was.

    I like you Gilly but I also have no problem with Ashton. Unless he personally fucks me over somehow, but that hasn't happened yet.

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    I just think he's obviously an idiot.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by BulletsAndDoves View Post
    I wish I was.

    I like you Gilly but I also have no problem with Ashton. Unless he personally fucks me over somehow, but that hasn't happened yet.
    i thought you'd like that...
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    Quote Originally Posted by BulletsAndDoves View Post
    Unless he personally fucks me over somehow, but that hasn't happened yet.

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