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Thread: Burn Notice

  1. #1
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Default Burn Notice

    A pretty good show, IMO. My roommates love it and I tend to be around when it's on.

    Michael - LSI 8w7 sp/sx
    Sam - ESE 2w3 so/sx
    Fiona - EIE 7w6? sx/sp
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    jughead's Avatar
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    I like this show as well. I think it's obvious Michael Westin is rational, the actor looks like it as well. LSI makes sense. What makes you think Sam is ESE>ILE ? His physical skills, pleasure seeking, and constancy with the government? Fiona is a mystery to me, I would have thought an EP type and that's part of what keeps her and Michael apart. At the same time the stereotypical bad girl stuff where she gets bored and trigger happy often seems forced and unnatural. It's hard to distinguish the actor/acting from certain characters.

    On second thought I don't see much of a supervisory relation between Sam and Michael. At least on the surface.
    Last edited by jughead; 03-04-2009 at 08:56 AM.

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    Pretend like it's the weekend Banana Pancakes's Avatar
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    Agree on Michael LSI and Sam ESE

    Fiona...not so sure. Seems Ni with strong Se seeking, and likes expressing emotions, so Beta...but she doesn't seem EJ, so I'd lean towards INFp.
    ILE-Ti
    6w7 sx/sp (low level of confidence)

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Fiona could be lots of things, methinks. The actress seems like either EIE or LIE, and I think Fionia could be EIE, SLE, possibly IEI, or even SEE.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    What kind of socionics type would be attracted to this show?

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    My roommate is probably LSI and he loves it; he has a particular fascination with the way Michael explains things.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  7. #7
    I'm back, assholes! Herzy's Avatar
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    I have a SLE friend who likes this show a lot.
    , Se-sub
    8w8-3w8-7w8 sx/sx

  8. #8
    Bananas are good. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Michael: ESI-Se, 3w2 sp/so
    Fiona: SLE-Se, 8w7 sx/sp
    Sam: ESE-Si, 7w6 sp/sx
    Maddie- SEI-Si, 6w7 sx/sp
    What do these signs mean—, , etc.? Why cannot socionists use symbols Ne, Ni etc. as in MBTI? Just because they have somewhat different meaning. Socionics and MBTI, each in its own way, have slightly modified the original Jung's description of his 8 psychological types. For this reason, (Ne) is not exactly the same as Ne in MBTI.

    Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function (extraverted sensing) is first and foremost associated with control and expansion of personal space (which sometimes can manifest in excessive aagression, but often also manifests in a capability of managing lots of people and things).

    For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.

    -Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    I've been getting into this show again lately. Just finished the second-last episode of the first season. My thoughts:

    Michael: LIE. His voice over bits are pure Te ("this is how you do this", "here's the best way to do that"), and his role on the show is the long-term strategist (Ni > Si). He's unusually physical for an Intuitive type, but if you'll notice, most of his combat style is Te-based -- learned techniques emphasizing skill over force. The intertype relations also fit, as I'll describe more below.

    [Edit: Oh, hey, I just realized, he lives in a warehouse with no furniture, and doesn't care. Total Si-PoLR.]

    Fiona: SEE. She's impulsive, aggressive, kind of scary. Her role in the first season is someone who is pursuing a relationship with Michael in a pushy, forceful way; Se + Fi. Being extraverts in an Activity relationship, they tend to wear each other out and exasperate each other at times, but otherwise have a close, comfortable relationship.

    Sam: I think Bruce Campbell is probably ILE (though I could be wrong), but this character actually feels like he might be more IEE. He's a smooth ladies' man, who charms beautiful rich women into giving him cars, money, etc. This sounds more like an ethical type. He also has a habit of offering the occasional bit of relationship advice, unasked. Unlike the other characters, he takes the time to enjoy the sensual Si pleasures of life -- food, comfort, etc. However, he rarely provides this for himself, instead mooching off of others, pointing towards valued but weak Si. So I think IEE fits. This would make him Michael's Benefactor, which makes sense -- Michael relies on him for help, especially for his large network of relationships (Creative Fi), but Sam asks for Michael's Te help only infrequently. Sam would also have a Business relationship with Fiona. I'll have to pay more attention in subsequent episodes to see if this bears out.

    Michael's Mom: Haven't figured her out yet. I only started analyzing the characters socionically a few episodes ago, so I'm going to have to wait for a mom-heavy episode to try to figure her out. Some ethical type though. Possibly Se-valuing.

    [Edit: Just finished another episode. My working theory on the mom is some kind of unhealthy EIE. Very emotional, in a characteristically melodramatic Beta NF way. She Benefits SEE Fiona, which is a closer relationship than LIE Michael's Business relationship with her, which is reflected especially in the early episodes. Alternatively, she could be an unhealthy IEI, which would make her Semi-Duality with Fiona, and Michael's Supervisee. Hmm. That might make more sense, actually. I shall have to ponder further.]

    I just finished watching the episode with Lucy Lawless, who of course is SLE. I think Michael as her Benefactor makes sense -- her character had long admired him, been a "fan" in her words, and may have had some romantic feelings, but despite a bit of attraction, Michael didn't really find her quite as interesting (certainly not as interesting as Fiona). The similarities and contrasts between SLE Lawless and SEE Fiona was interesting; it helped solidify my typing of Fiona as SEE rather than my second option, which was SLE.
    Last edited by Krig the Viking; 05-14-2011 at 12:04 PM.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Michael: LIE-Ni 8w7 sp/sx
    Fiona: SEE-Se 7w6 sx/sp
    Sam: EIE-Fe 2w3 sx/so
    Michael's Mom: ESE-Si 2w1 sp/so
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  11. #11
    The Looks stanprollyright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krig the Viking View Post
    I've been getting into this show again lately. Just finished the second-last episode of the first season. My thoughts:

    Michael: LIE. His voice over bits are pure Te ("this is how you do this", "here's the best way to do that"), and his role on the show is the long-term strategist (Ni > Si). He's unusually physical for an Intuitive type, but if you'll notice, most of his combat style is Te-based -- learned techniques emphasizing skill over force. The intertype relations also fit, as I'll describe more below.

    [Edit: Oh, hey, I just realized, he lives in a warehouse with no furniture, and doesn't care. Total Si-PoLR.]

    Fiona: SEE. She's impulsive, aggressive, kind of scary. Her role in the first season is someone who is pursuing a relationship with Michael in a pushy, forceful way; Se + Fi. Being extraverts in an Activity relationship, they tend to wear each other out and exasperate each other at times, but otherwise have a close, comfortable relationship.
    I agree with these. No strong opinion on Mom. Sam is some ethical type, seems Fi>Fe.
    Stan is not my real name.

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    Having watched through to the middle of the third season, I think I was wrong about Sam Axe. I think I was right about the Creative Fi (he's a charmer/ladies' man, who has an extensive network of buddies and contacts), but he seems too grounded in the "now" to be IEE, and too at ease with using physical force. He displays little interest in pursuing new ideas and abstract concepts. And having become more familiar with the character, he actually seems more similar to an SEE guy I know. Furthermore, the somewhat tenuous evidence I thought I saw for a Benefit relationship with Michael (who I am strongly confident at this point is C-LIE) hasn't really been borne out. Their relationship is pretty close and conflict-free, so Activity doesn't seem out of the question. I'll have to keep monitoring this to see if I'm right, but it feels like a better fit than IEE.

    I'm also starting to wonder if I've mis-estimated Bruce Campbell. I'm familiar with the "legend" of Bruce Campbell, the pop-culture icon, but I haven't really sat down and watched interviews and tried to get a sense of Bruce Campbell, the human being. The image of him I had in my head was ILE, but the real person may not be. I'm kind of wondering if he might be an SEI or something. Some SF. Dunno. More research is warranted.

    I'm less certain than I was of Fiona's type. Something doesn't feel right with my current typing of her, though I'm not sure what it is. I don't know what else she'd be, either. I must be missing something.

    Madeline I still think seems Beta NF, and I'm leaning toward EIE. Barry the money launderer might be IEI, possibly?... I'm not sure. He and Madeline seem to get along with each other better than they do with the others.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    squark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krig the Viking View Post
    [Edit: Oh, hey, I just realized, he lives in a warehouse with no furniture, and doesn't care. Total Si-PoLR.]
    I haven't seen the show, just noticed this. I once lived in an apartment with no furniture. I slept in a sleeping bag on the floor and ate sitting on the kitchen countertop. I didn't care, and would easily do it again, or live in a warehouse. So, not just Si-polr

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    I haven't seen the show, just noticed this. I once lived in an apartment with no furniture. I slept in a sleeping bag on the floor and ate sitting on the kitchen countertop. I didn't care, and would easily do it again, or live in a warehouse. So, not just Si-polr
    Well, certainly unvalued Si, anyway. LSI, with Demonstrative Si, would be capable of creating comfortable living conditions, whether or not he chooses to do so. LIE, with Vulnerable Si, is too preoccupied with long-term strategy and the big picture to really be aware of things like physical health and comfort. I've noticed that occasionally other characters will criticize Westen's lack of attention to Si (living in an empty warehouse, eating mostly yogurt), and he gets a bit self-conscious and quickly changes the subject to what he considers more pressing matters.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    I haven't seen the show, just noticed this. I once lived in an apartment with no furniture. I slept in a sleeping bag on the floor and ate sitting on the kitchen countertop. I didn't care, and would easily do it again, or live in a warehouse. So, not just Si-polr
    Hell yeah yo, bare bones to the death. I fucking love Betas
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  16. #16
    boom boom boom blackburry's Avatar
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    Ive always thought Michael was SLI-Te... he reminds me of a few SLI guys I know...or atleast the actor does. and I live to the bare minimum as well...just how I like it. The stuff I do have is nice, but just not lots of cuz clutter annoys me.

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackburry View Post
    Ive always thought Michael was SLI-Te... he reminds me of a few SLI guys I know...or atleast the actor does. and I live to the bare minimum as well...just how I like it. The stuff I do have is nice, but just not lots of cuz clutter annoys me.
    He's way too focused on strategy and long-term planning, IMHO. He's always thinking ahead and strategizing, while SLIs tend to focus on what can be done right now. It's true that he's pretty physical, but his physical actions are all motivated by Te rather than Si. He doesn't seem to take pleasure in Si activities at all, and he never expresses an opinion on physical sensations and how things feel physically; he's focused on taking practical actions for long-term effect (Te + Ni).
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Actor is easily SLI (and a god awful actor). Character is LIE.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  19. #19
    squark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Hell yeah yo, bare bones to the death. I fucking love Betas

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    Contrarian Traditionalist Krig the Viking's Avatar
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    I'm partway through Season 4 now. Some further thoughts...

    I'm pretty confident now that Sam is SEE. However, it seems pretty clear that he and Fiona do not have an Identical relationship. I strongly considered SLE for Fiona for a while, but it just didn't fit. She seems too relationship-oriented and Fi-valuing; part of her role on the show is as Michael's moral compass. She lacks the devil-may-care attitude SLEs tend to have on some level of their psyches.

    My current theory on Fiona is that she's ESI. She's more impulsive and trigger-happy than I normally picture ESIs, but everything else seems to fit. She relentlessly focuses on relationships and Fi matters, serving as a counter-balance to Michael's dry and objectively practical Te. She's closer to Michael than Sam, and if Sam is an Activity relationship with Michael, there's only one relationship closer than that (Duality). I postulate that she might be a C-ESI, explaining her higher levels of extraversion and impulsivity, as well as her difficulty creating a stable relationship with Michael (two Creatives are like two people on a road trip who both want to choose where they're going).

    Also, I'm liking more and more my earlier theory that Madeline is IEI. For all her strong emotionality and outbursts, she doesn't actually strike me as an extravert, and certainly not an EJ. She rarely takes the initiative in doing things or making changes, tending instead to respond to whatever the people around her are doing. She doesn't seem like she has many friends, an unusual situation for a Base-Fe type. Furthermore, the intertype relationships make more sense with IEI. She would be Sam's Semi-Duality, and Fiona's Beneficiary, both closer relationships than her Supervisee relationship with Michael.

    The new guy in Season 4, Jesse, strikes me as an LSE. Like Michael in a lot of ways (Kindred), but not very good at long-term strategy (Ni). That makes him Semi-Duality with Fiona, which makes sense given the subtle romantic tension between the two. It makes him Sam's Beneficiary, which I have no evidence for or against. And it makes him Madeline's Conflictor, which seems more apparent as the season progresses -- he really doesn't know how to handle her.

    Anyway, that's my current thoughts. I'm quite enjoying the show. I feel like I'm getting a better understanding of Gamma Quadra -- as an Alpha, my real-life experiences with that quadra are somewhat limited. A common theme I've noticed with Gammas is the importance of having a large number of personal contacts that you can call on, as well as the importance of favours and personal obligations. "I owe you a favour" seems to be a very important phrase among Gammas, whereas Alphas tend to prefer a "Let's all just help each other out of the goodness of our hearts" approach. It's interesting.
    Quaero Veritas.

  21. #21
    Moderator Reficulris's Avatar
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    Default Burn Notice (characters, not actors)

    61530_010_122_536lo.jpg

    Micheal Westen (something with a weak Fi)

    Fiona Glenanne (SLE?)

    Sam Axe (hilarious)

    Madeline Westen (something with a strong Fi)

    Type away! I'm interested in what you think these guys/galls are

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