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Thread: ENFps read! I am starting to think

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    Default ENFps read! .... I am starting to think ...

    That I am really an ENFp ...

    First of all, there is no way that I am not dominant ... all my life I have done nothing but to consider what it is other people believe and I have always tried to look at all sides of every concept.

    For example, the other day I was talking with some friends. We were talking about the ethicalities of morality or something and I may the point to look at it too diffrent ways.

    I gave an example - "say a man is drafted into the military, goes over seas, shoot people, and is given a medal. Now, another man loses his job, his family, buys a machine gun, shoots people in a mall, and goes to jail. What the hell is the diffrence between the two? Is it that one is justified and the other is not? It seems to same to me." I do not think anyone answered that, actually people sort of looked at me oddly.

    Well anyways, I had it pointed out later by someone who heard that that that was some pretty strong Ne I was expounding there ... I agree, actually.

    Also, I am beginning to doubt that I have a PoLR ... really does not bother me as much as I thought and I actually express more of it than I previously thought. It is not that much of a problem for me. In fact, I am starting to think that it may even be stronger than I realize.

    I mean, I do not usually go around flaunting feeling everywhere I go and I do not usually stop for people. But, I do often pay full attention to people just to pay attention to them when they want to talk to me, even when I do not have anything really interesting to say in return. Sometimes I do not even leave when I probably should leave, cause they are talking to me. I hate being rude and that is something I have just always done. I also like to keep people out of trouble and bad situations. I hate to see people make stupid mistakes.

    Not only that, but there are certain types of people I just totally despise.
    In fact, I have a mental shitlist of things I just do not like in this world.

    I have a feeling that the following might offend some people, but anyhow.

    Occasionally I have exceptions for the following for specific individuals who I have certain understandings with, but anyone who generally meets the following criteria is at risk of getting shitlisted by me and I will pay minimal attention to if at all.

    1. anyone who acts or even remotely looks like my father
    2. anyone who enjoys the taste of alcohol and drinks socially
    3. anyone who frequents a bar or place where alcohol is sold
    4. anyone who preys on, uses, abuses those who are weaker than them
    5. anyone who is an insecure bully and wrecks the self-esteem of others
    6. anyone who cheats on boyfriend/girlfriend
    7. anyone who sleeps around and has no ability to commit or is untrustworthy

    Well, I probably could add much more to this list, but I think I will stop there. And I am serious about the shitlisting bit "I will not talk to you at all, ever!" So, if I talk to you, you are not shitlisted ... just so you know.

    I actually am starting to think that I have a PoLR and a hidden agenda. I have always felt intelligent and other people see me as intelligent, but in some odd way I have always had problems with my own perception of intellect. Something there that just does not make me feel that I am strong in that area.

    I mean, there are times where I have failed to research facts and have looked stupid. I admit that, but I usually lug through. And I hate it when people ask "why" questions of any sort ... I think it is sort of demeaning when people try to ask me to do things by asking questions and I hate it when people ask questions about me personally. I can not help but to think "Yeah, that is none of you buisness, shut up!" but I usually do not say it and change the subject or something.

    Also, I get pissed if I think that someone thought of something obvious that I should have thought up before they did, so I often try to keep track of what other people might think and try to out-think people all the time. It is a crappy way to go, but it keeps me on the ball and no one else but me seems to understand that I get pissed when it happens, so it is better that way, I guess.

    I really did not do that well in highscool, except in subjects that interested me. I spent most of my time charming girls and hanging out with friends as opposed to studying, and when I was not doing that I would charm the female teachers and I usually got a higher mark in classes that I would have otherwised flunked because of that. I had a few 30 and 40 year old women as teachers who had obvious crushes on me, I even had one who had subbed another class and spent most of the time sitting next in the desk next to me chatting away. Do not ask ... I thought it was weird too, but anyhow.

    I did pretty much the same thing at the 4 university and colleges I have attended, except that I have been more serious with higher education and got better grades than I did in highschool. I still charm my way around, though. Probably nothing I can really help but to do ...

    I have never had a solid relationship, I spend alot of energy into charming girls and I still have not been able to form a lasting relationship of anysort. I have probably failed in that area and I am sort of dissapointed with the outcome of my attempts.

    Anyhow ... this is basically my current reasoning for being an ENFp ... I bet some of you are probably going to say something like "I knew it" or something ... well, here you go.

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    Edited for gayness.
    ENTp

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    I know, the forum he added is actually better off than I presupposed ...

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    Default Re: ENFps read! .... I am starting to think ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Transigent
    Didn't you throw a hissyfit when people said you weren't ENTp?
    Yeah, but only towards certain people ...

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    Edited for gayness.
    ENTp

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    Hmmm, I sort of noticed that as well ... it is rather weird ...

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    Anyhow ... this is basically my current reasoning for being an ENFp ... I bet some of you are probably going to say something like "I knew it" or something ... well, here you go
    uhhmmmm .....no. I dont think so. I mean its possible but I just dont feel it. Your thought proccess does not sound ENFP at all to me. I think you should stay with ENTP.

    Topaz
    The artifact which is the source of my power will not be kept on the Mountain of Despair beyond the River of Fire guarded by the Dragons of Eternity. It will be in my safe-deposit box. The same applies to the object which is my one weakness.

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    there are forums now? i posted on them?

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    Lol, look on the front page ...

    http://www.socionics.com/

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    ESTj!

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    6w5 sx
    model Φ: -+0
    sloan - rcuei

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    Edited for gayness.
    ENTp

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    *sigh*
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Contrary to popular belief, ENTps DO have morals. We just don't showcase them like the rest of the world: we believe in them deeply, which is why we don't forsake them for a more logical viewpoint.

    ENTps work as hard as the next guy, and more enthusiastically, when they're involved in something that interests them. And McNew is quite clearly interested in Socionics. Our most basic idea of stimulation (sex aside) is developing an interest in a topic/concept/model of some sort, investigating it until we feel we have sufficient understanding, then slowly dropping it and moving on to something else. That's exactly what McNew is doing with Socionics, and it's why people labeled him as a wannabe expert right off the bat: he gathered all the information he could, analyzed it, developed an interest, then started cultivating it, all in a relatively short period of time. Why? Because it's interesting. Granted, any type could do this, but ENTps are particularly prone to it. It's just what we do.

    No matter how much we profess security, ENTp's are naturally narcissists about EVERYTHING. Oldham (?) identifies the ENTp type with Compensatory Narcissism for a reason: we're insecure about any number of things, so we try to cultivate an image of vanity about them to make them seem like strong points. The truth that we're hiding with this narcissism could be anywhere in between; there isn't always a logical foundation for this kind of self-doubt. This could apply to anything, from intelligence, to looks, to social skills, etc.

    I'm doing pretty crappy in high school in comparison to what I could be doing. My grades are OK, but in reality they only reflect what I can do with absolutely minimal effort. Parents, teachers, friends, and counselors have told me my whole life that my grades could be as high as I want them to be, but when it comes down to it, I just don't care enough. It's another ENTp trademark: we like to see how far we can let ourselves slip in the effort department before we have to pick up the slack again to "get by."

    As for what you say about not researching "the facts" before you argue a point, well, that's the same thing as above, but with something additional:

    A) You don't feel like looking up the facts because you want to see if you can "get away" with using subjective logic becauce, quite frankly, you'd rather not waste the time/energy.

    B)ENTps like to argue from their own perspective based on what they already know. They feel like looking up facts to form a viewpoint is pointless because then it's just the "facts," and is wholely un-unique and, therefore, uninteresting, and has probably already been thought of.

    doesn't bother you because, in some cases, you view it as competence of some kind. When people try to relate to you, you subconsciously perceive them as predicting your behavior through some kind of model, because that's what you do to other people when giving them advice.

    As for your example about shooting people, that's the kind of logic and ENTp uses, especially if he doesn't know the details or the context of those peoples' lives. What you see in those two examples is the same basic thing happening: people dying. You think they're the same because society tries to morally justify one as being "ok," and you see a problem with that, so you say it's the same.

    Does any of this make any sense to anyone?

    If it's any comfort, McNew, almost everything you said applies to me, too.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    I think your an ENTp, you may be confused that you are an ENFp because they are so similar. I once confused myself for being an ENTp once. I think every ENFp and ENTp enters the dilemna of what they truly are at one point.

    About you shitlisting, I don't think an ENFp would shitlist someone. I for one tend to forgive people very easily even if they did something really stupid. If someone does something that I don't like, I will still appreaciate them for their strengths. However, if they do something really stupid like beat their girlfriend or boyfriend, then I will stay away from them unless they are sorry for what they did. A girl beating her boyfriend to a pulp, has that happened before? I won't be surprised if it did happen before.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    McNew may I suggest that you read your own type descriptions?

    http://socion.info

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sycophant
    McNew may I suggest that you read your own type descriptions?

    http://socion.info
    Hah ... I've done that ... it seems like the more I know, the more I question.

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    One question, are you somehow 'uncomfortable' with your current type or are you just unsure?

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    Quote Originally Posted by snegledmaca
    One question, are you somehow 'uncomfortable' with your current type or are you just unsure?
    I am not uncomfortable, just experimenting with my options again.

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    Default Re: ENFps read! .... I am starting to think ...

    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    First of all, there is no way that I am not dominant ... all my life I have done nothing but to consider what it is other people believe and I have always tried to look at all sides of every concept.
    This is actually where I disagree with you. You seem to be impling that 's sole purpose is "openmindedness", and that other functions are not. I would disagree that all types are openminded. Discojoe said the same thing; he is NOT openminded (considering other's opinions, I mean), and he admitted that.

    has a lot of other characteristics that Jung laid out in a clear, logical way. I suggest you read them over a few times. I'm not criticizing you here, but I've taken the time to try and read them more than once, and it certianly helps (a LOT). Everytime I read it it seems like I learn something new...

    I really did not do that well in highscool, except in subjects that interested me. I spent most of my time charming girls and hanging out with friends as opposed to studying, and when I was not doing that I would charm the female teachers and I usually got a higher mark in classes that I would have otherwised flunked because of that. I had a few 30 and 40 year old women as teachers who had obvious crushes on me, I even had one who had subbed another class and spent most of the time sitting next in the desk next to me chatting away. Do not ask ... I thought it was weird too, but anyhow.

    I did pretty much the same thing at the 4 university and colleges I have attended, except that I have been more serious with higher education and got better grades than I did in highschool. I still charm my way around, though. Probably nothing I can really help but to do ...
    This, however, does suggest an dominant type, and I'm not talking about what you wrote. I'm talking about the way in which it came across, in an almost arrogant, self-centered way (sorry) that Jung attributted to the extreme Exxp types. While you're writing, you seem to trancend both logical and ethical judgment in order to focus the attention on you in some way.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Youre a brave, brave soul for reading them more than once. I hate his language and "overly-wordiness" ^_^

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    I find him interesting. :/


    I find it easy to "get it" when reading his writing, and he's able to pack so much into it, I find myself stopping myself (especially on the description of the Si type) a lot to think about what he's said and realize how much it reflects reality.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Hmm, that got me to think. Maybe it is because Im older and alreadys et into a reading flow preference. I can easily read the logical and abstract but thinking about all of my books shows me that they are far more fluid and far less culturally-biased in style.

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    Default Re: ENFps read! .... I am starting to think ...

    [quote]
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    First of all, there is no way that I am not dominant ... all my life I have done nothing but to consider what it is other people believe and I have always tried to look at all sides of every concept.
    This is actually where I disagree with you. You seem to be impling that 's sole purpose is "openmindedness", and that other functions are not. I would disagree that all types are openminded. Discojoe said the same thing; he is NOT openminded (considering other's opinions, I mean), and he admitted that.
    And this is where I agree and disagree... the reason why ENTps are arrogant and closeminded is not because of , it is because of ... When it comes to the consideration of various abstract possibilities [Not to be confused with a person's individual systematic line of thought] Entps are very very open and considerate of that, but when it comes to systematic Logic ENTps are arrogant bastards.

    So, I agree with you that ENTps are arrogant, but it is not because of as it seemed you were implying [or thought I was implying?], it is because of .

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    Jung attributed it to extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement, or extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement.

    It's something that's hard to put into words, but it's a tangible quality that you can notice with some Exxp types.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Jung attributed it to extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement, or extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement.

    It's something that's hard to put into words, but it's a tangible quality that you can notice with some Exxp types.
    You are going to have to show me where he says this, but I would say that if this is the case then the "socionic model" has taken a slight deviation from Jung. Socionics theory attributes this to the interaction between the 2nd and 8th function. [Meaning that people see ENTps as arrogant bastards because they avoid using the logical solutions of others, and derive their own in ways that are intentionally diffrent from others]

    This also means according to socionic theory, Rocky, that you personally believe that ENTps are arrogant because you value using , and it is painful for you to see ENTps use their , since you can see that they totally desecrate the function in the process of using their . That is what I believe is the real issue here ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Jung attributed it to extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement, or extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement.

    It's something that's hard to put into words, but it's a tangible quality that you can notice with some Exxp types.
    I think I see what you're getting at. You're implying that he's a crosstype.

    I don't have a pic of him. Although I do get a similar vibe from Polly_G's writing. They seem to talk about similar themes. (she's an ENxP Revealer by my reckoning) I'm not going to say he's an ExxP--wait...

    Diana, do you get a sense of a "shadow" vibe from rmcnew?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Jung attributed it to extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement, or extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement.

    It's something that's hard to put into words, but it's a tangible quality that you can notice with some Exxp types.
    I think I see what you're getting at. You're implying that he's a crosstype.

    I don't have a pic of him. Although I do get a similar vibe from Polly_G's writing. They seem to talk about similar themes. (she's an ENxP Revealer by my reckoning) I'm not going to say he's an ExxP--wait...

    Diana, do you get a sense of a "shadow" vibe from rmcnew?
    Hmmm, by inferring that I am a crosstype are you implying that I am not totally acting my type or displaying chacteristics of another type?

    By shadow vibe I would assume you are saying that I am acting out of compulsion from the [using socionic specific terms] the Super-id or another unconscious part such as the Id. Atleast that is what I think you are saying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Jung attributed it to extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement, or extreme , without consideration to their Introverted Judgement.

    It's something that's hard to put into words, but it's a tangible quality that you can notice with some Exxp types.
    I think I see what you're getting at. You're implying that he's a crosstype.

    I don't have a pic of him. Although I do get a similar vibe from Polly_G's writing. They seem to talk about similar themes. (she's an ENxP Revealer by my reckoning) I'm not going to say he's an ExxP--wait...

    Diana, do you get a sense of a "shadow" vibe from rmcnew?
    Hmmm, by inferring that I am a crosstype are you implying that I am not totally acting my type or displaying chacteristics of another type?

    By shadow vibe I would assume you are saying that I am acting out of compulsion from the [using socionic specific terms] the Super-id or another unconscious part such as the Id. Atleast that is what I think you are saying.
    That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying that you're not any of the basic 16 types, if you aren't fitting any of them like a cookie cutter. I certainly do not perceive you as one of the basic 16. You said, "I'm an ENTP" and I went along with it. But I really don't think you are. You're no ENFP either. My ENFP dad would never compare combat in war to murder. Never.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg
    That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying that you're not any of the basic 16 types, if you aren't fitting any of them like a cookie cutter. I certainly do not perceive you as one of the basic 16. You said, "I'm an ENTP" and I went along with it. But I really don't think you are. You're no ENFP either. My ENFP dad would never compare combat in war to murder. Never.
    Then that just goes back to the problem of trying to shove someone into a type as opposed to finding out where a person is weak and strong, then collecting those attributes to find a type that is closest.

    So, basically what I am saying is that what I think was just implied about me in relation to my type can be implied to everyone, and that it is totally silly to ever think to assume that anyone will fit exactly into one of 16 types.

    However, I think it is true that basically everyone exhibits strength and weakness in functions in a way that places them within the borders of a type. For example, do you honestly think that someone who uses strongly is going to use strongly? Not at all, atleast not the same way. And I think it is more or so those sort of clues that lead to a persons type, not trying to make them fit into a mold. As soon as you start thinking you can fit people into molds, you are going to fail bigtime.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg
    That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying that you're not any of the basic 16 types, if you aren't fitting any of them like a cookie cutter. I certainly do not perceive you as one of the basic 16. You said, "I'm an ENTP" and I went along with it. But I really don't think you are. You're no ENFP either. My ENFP dad would never compare combat in war to murder. Never.
    Then that just goes back to the problem of trying to shove someone into a type as opposed to finding out where a person is weak and strong, then collecting those attributes to find a type that is closest.

    So, basically what I am saying is that what I think was just implied about me in relation to my type can be implied to everyone, and that it is totally silly to ever think to assume that anyone will fit exactly into one of 16 types.

    However, I think it is true that basically everyone exhibits strength and weakness in functions in a way that places them within the borders of a type. For example, do you honestly think that someone who uses strongly is going to use strongly? Not at all, atleast not the same way. And I think it is more or so those sort of clues that lead to a persons type, not trying to make them fit into a mold. As soon as you start thinking you can fit people into molds, you are going to fail bigtime.
    I'm not listening. And I hope a lot of other people aren't listening right now, too. Even if they are, they'll stop listening someday. Crosstype is a fact waiting to be proven.

    Here's the thing: do I have conflict between my Ti and Fi? Sure I do. But I never let people see it. And even if I try, something frustrates me. The mind may be a swirling, whirling chaos, but it never appears that way to anybody who isn't living it. In that context, EVERYBODY fits into a box. EVERYBODY. The question is how many types of box do you need for them all.

    Definitely more than 16. Not more than 81, though.

    I do fit nicely into that INTJ box, BTW.

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    You speak of this "crosstyping" almost as one would await the second coming of Jesus. We will all have to wait and see, apparently.

    As for me, I see better alternatives ...

  33. #33
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    Actually, I take it back ... this stuff is interesting!

    The Crosstypes
    There are 81 personality types in existence, including 16 basic types
    and 65 cross-types.


    Guides

    17) ExFJ: The Teacher

    18) ExFP: The Star

    19) ExTJ: The Enforcer

    20) ExTP: The Engineer

    21) IxFJ: The Scribe

    22) IxFP: The Romantic

    23) IxTJ: The Administrator

    24) IxTP: The Operator


    Luminaries

    25) ESFx: The Populist

    26) ESTx: The Showman

    27) ENFx: The Actor

    28) ENTx: The Organizer

    29) ISFx: The Priest

    30) ISTx: The Historian

    31) INFx: The Counselor

    32) INTx: The Relativist


    Figures

    33) xSFJ: The Facilitator

    34) xSFP: The Herald

    35) xSTP: The Promoter

    36) xSTJ: The Sergent

    37) xNFJ: The Sage

    38) xNFP: The Crusader

    39) xNTJ: The Chieftan

    40) xNTP: The Networker


    Adventurers

    41) ESxJ: The Cultist

    42) ESxP: The Explorer

    43) ENxJ: The Ringleader

    44) ENxP: The Revealer

    45) ISxJ: The Inhibitor

    46) ISxP: The Rebel

    47) INxJ: The Maverick

    48) INxP: The Escapist


    Proletarians

    49) xSFx: The Bishop

    50) xSTx: The Revolutionary

    51) xNFx: The Healer

    52) xNTx: The Commander


    Tribunes

    53) xxFJ: The Conductor

    54) xxFP: The Harmonizer

    55) xxTJ: The Director

    56) xxTP: The Planner


    Narcissists

    57) xSxJ: The Conservator

    58) xSxP: The Dictator

    59) xNxJ: The Insurgent

    60) xNxP: The Interloper


    Destinies

    61) ExFx: The Celebrity

    62) ExTx: The Aristocrat

    63) IxFx: The Strategist

    64) IxTx: The Philosopher


    Motions

    65) ExxJ: The Prosecutor

    66) ExxP: The Exhibitionist

    67) IxxP: The Illusionist

    68) IxxJ: The Instigator


    Motivators

    69) ESxx: The Craftsman

    70) ENxx: The General

    71) ISxx: The Manipulator

    72) INxx: The Seer


    Archetypes

    73) Exxx: The Diplomat

    74) Ixxx: The Mystic

    75) xSxx: The Overlord

    76) xNxx: The Nationalist

    77) xxFx: The Empath

    78) xxTx: The Logician

    79) xxxJ: The Master

    80) xxxP: The Creator

    81) xxxx: The Providentiary

  34. #34
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    It conflicts with established socionics theory, but I want to hear more about it.

    http://the16types.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2684

  35. #35

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    LMFAO!!! I said rueben mcnewb was an ENFP months ago and people flamed me for calling him out. I admit, I was a bit harsh. I'm done with the flaming and I come in peace.

    This post is just funny to me considering mcnew was insisting that he was an enTp and wouldnt even consider having a nice discussion about the possibility of being an enFp.

    and now that he thinks I left the board, he swallows his pride and admits he is probably an ENFP just like I originally said a few months ago.



  36. #36
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    Looks like my thread just went to hell ... about time.

  37. #37

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    mcnew....i just said: I come in peace. I'm not looking for any net-beef. I'm above that. I'm just saying this thread is funny because of what happened in the past. I know you have SOME sort of ability to logically reason with others, so don't be so ignorant.

    Even YOU have to admit that I was right. Heck, you should be THANKING me for helping you find your true type.

  38. #38
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    *hangs a strawdoll copy of marcus_the_maniac from a tree in effigy and burns it*

  39. #39

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    What's your problem?

    You're only making yourself look unreasonable and ignorant.

  40. #40

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