"Feeling" of a function

[Ms. Kensington]

I apologize if there was a thread already on this subject.

I am wondering if people could describe how using their lead or second function feels like.

im not sure if this is a useful idea yet. How a function feels refers mostly to the feeling of using a particular function, but when trying this excersize myself i am feeling only how it mightmake me feel.

When I feel i am using Ti, I feel as if i am seeing out of my eyes, or focusing a bit more internally. If I see something that is inconsistent, I feel uneasy or uncomfortable a little bit inside my being. When I am using Ne, I feel that I am having fun. I feel overwhelmed at times too. This is if someone asks me to create something out of thin air.

[tereg]

When I use Ne, it feels like reading a roadmap. I see a point on the map that represents me or a stage I find myself in or some random current thought. And I see all the roads that lead into the point and go forth from it. But I only see a contained area of roads around the point. I can't tell where the roads go nor where they originated. Each road is a potential of interesting thoughts or ideas or learning something new, being informed of some curiosity, or whatever.

When I use Fi, it's like ... it's kind of like this



where I'm in the center of the ball. These bonds or electricity arms are constantly on me, constantly shifting and moving around me, fading in and out. It's constantly assessing the realm around me.

When someone comes up and touches the ball with their finger, the electricity arm is more pronounced, it's not as scattered, it goes straight to the source of interference. The other bonds are still going on around me, but my attention is on the finger on the ball. The finger is free to move around, but I will know that and my bond will follow it. But I'm constantly aware of my direct bond with the finger touching the ball as long as it's there. When the finger goes away, the other bonds become similar and blend in with each other.

[tereg]

For clarification, here's what each piece of what I described represents in the Fi part.

I am the tip of the rod in the center of the ball. The rod is where all of the bolts emanate from/go towards. The glass ball represents the extent of my current atmosphere or realm. The bolts that emanate from the rod to the ball represents some sort of connection I feel with my space or atmosphere.

The touching represents some notable object or action or emotion that I detect that I shift my attention to. It simultaneously reminds me of my relationship with that point (how I might appear to that point, as one example). When the event or object moves away, I'm back to assessing what's around me.

[Ms. Kensington]

that's cool tereg. Reminds me of a journalist that interviewed Angelina Jolie a few years back, and he said trying to transcribe her was like trying to unzip fog.. but more so, your lightning ball description reminded me when the interviewer said they could see her feelers coming up.

[jessica129]

Si-self conscious.

[tcaudilllg]

-Ti is, if anything, regret. It is regret for the cruelty of natural necessity. Cold, impartial. This is the way it is, so accept it, deal with it. Anything else is stupid and foolish. Denial.

+Ne is various considerations of how things may be. You are not certain which of these they may be, but you do know that some things definitely are, and for that matter, could not be anything else. There is also the added matter of "well if this is such, then what would it mean for everything else?" There is the question of whether you can find a connoting principle in the haystack, as it were. If you can't, then you know that the situation is not true and the consideration false.

[Creepy-]

I assume it's because I am Si-base that I am pretty much always in the moment. I don't really daydream, and except times like driving a familiar path, my mind doesn't really wonder from the here/now. Also, I am nearly always aware of my body as well [physical position, appetites, muscle soreness, etc.].

Ni often feels like moving in a lot of fog, and suddenly I sense something somewhere in that fog - I feel I have made a discovery, but I have a hard time understanding how I found it, and it's not always easy to pin it down, as everything moves all the time. I just know it's there, and must try and land it. When I do, it's rather frustrating trying to explain to others how I know. It becomes a rather foggy explanation.... (and yes, the conclusions are often very good and it takes others ages to reach them.)

The fog feeling is the usual way I feel Ni. However, if I consciously LOOK for a connection/and understanding of something, I will collect pieces of information, and sooner or later I'll find the key piece of the puzzle that makes the whole picture clear. I feel I can see and hear the pieces fall, turn and click into place inside my head, and then I'll know the solution. I just love that clicking feeling.
(maybe this is partly Ti? Not sure?)

Using Fe feels like becoming warmer and warmer and warmer until I feel I have a visible aura around me...

I think I would like to experience being Ni-base, at least for a day; this sounds like fun. That said, I cannot relate to it at all, haha. You Ni characters must have a very different life experience than Si people.

[tcaudilllg]

I assume it's because I am Si-base that I am pretty much always in the moment. I don't really daydream, and except times like driving a familiar path, my mind doesn't really wonder from the here/now. Also, I am nearly always aware of my body as well [physical position, appetites, muscle soreness, etc.].




I think I would like to experience being Ni-base, at least for a day; this sounds like fun. That said, I cannot relate to it at all, haha. You Ni characters must have a very different life experience than Si people.

That has noting to do with Ni; it's a description of initial differentiation which conservatives tend to avoid.

[Creepy-]

That has noting to do with Ni; it's a description of initial differentiation which conservatives tend to avoid.

This amuses me. Did you really write this just to roundabout insult me because you didn't like something I said in an unrelated thread? This seems like quite a waste of your valuable time and energy. Anyway, I was talking about Si, not Ni. Now please go away, TC.


Back on topic:

Do you have more descriptive words for Si? How it "feels" to use? I think I mixed up Si and Ni a lot before changing types. A lot of the feelings I thought of as Si are in fact Ni. Weird I guess, or maybe Si and Ni somehow feel the same in some ways??

I guess I would say that I am unsure of how exactly to answer this; I don't think of myself as "using" Si; it's just there. Si, for me, means being aware of myself at all times, and aware of the way things affect me/my senses.

I guess it would help if I gave examples, to make my answer more concrete:

E.g. 1: Tonight a friend came over to hang out. I went upstairs to find something while he popped a DVD in, and when I came back he pushed "play." As soon as the first commercial came on, I knew that something was off, so I grabbed the remote and began to reset the speaker settings for the surround sound. Turns out he had changed the bass settings by about two bars [whatever that means] while I was upstairs. He's never done that before and I had no idea he had, but I could just tell the difference immediately. I don't know if that is a good illustration or not, but I hope it'll serve as an example of Si in action, registering a very subtle change in sound instantaneously and without trying to, and knowing exactly what needed to be changed in order to make it sound "right" again [a very subjective judgement, of course].

E.g. 2: I do a lot of baking this time of year, but I never stick to a recipe; I modify recipes as I go, replacing and adding ingredients as I see fit. I can just tell the effect of adding a spice or oil to a recipe, and I am very rarely “wrong” in the sense that things pretty much always end up being delicious [I guess that sounds arrogant, but hopefully it won’t be taken that way]. I guess I use Si in this case to anticipate, almost as if I can taste it before I’ve done it, the way ingredients will affect the taste/texture of the finished product.

Eh, I don’t know if this answers your question or gives you an idea of what it “feels like” to use Si... like I said, if you have specific questions, that would help....

[jughead]

I do the both the si and Ni stuff, but the Si related things I do pretty much without thinking at all, there is usually not much thought but I can give extended thought to it. I do the exact same thing with speakers and such but it's only with certain things I care about and pay attention to.

For example my room is currently a wreck, I could straighten and perfect it but it would be a waste of my time at this moment. But when the speakers are slightly out of place or the sound isn't just right I usually quickly know and like a feedback loop quickly try and correct it by coming closer to the value with each tweak. The same withcooking,cleaning.
People have mentioned how meticulous I can be with some things, like speakers and such, and how my hearing and taste are so sensitive and I notice things they don't but I give little overall thought to these things unless they are part of a Ni solution.
Using si continuosly and meticulously requires me to be relaxed, but I'll overdo it and get bored or fall asleep, or the contrary become EJ like and stress and overwork quickly.
With Ni i have to focus my mind more, it is indeed a "slow" function, and there is some sensory loss, but you don't really notice that. However you will when people touch you because its can feel very wrong and it jolts you out of that mental state; conscious thought is interrupted.
It's very hard to use my Ni to do complicated and or repetitive tasks, this is where i think the "meaning" that is in so many IEI/Ni descriptions comes in. Pushing the rock up the hill for eternity only to have it roll back. This shit becomes the most boring and mentally draining thing ever ...Your walking into a minefield/asteroid field if your concentrated with Ni on complicated physical procedures. (Te polr?) What Si/Te is for!?
Using Ni on this stuff is basically pointless it's like planning out every little action but you can't go to far into the future to defeat the pattern. You will see endless patterns of work, rest, exhaustion, cycles of everything in life. Have at it Estj!

I've always though that having a dominant function allows you to focus and climb into it, see all the nuances the multiple dimensionality that has been mentioned and of course the time aspect witch is the most important if ones is to focus on that thing(because focusing takes time itself). The golden rule of socionics supposedly points to a 60/40 rule of the ego block/super ego but I doubt I actually follow it too well. Anyone care to explain this more?

Fe...its easiest to grasp this by just looking at others facial expressions and reacting to that; you recieve a broad range of feelings happy, sad, etc and how this effects you and those around you. If I see angry body language I can feel its effect on those around me and in myself, it's tension, how its affecting them. Being overly emotional either way is a bad thing for me and anyone to be rational, it can totally through me around into circles of madness; but most often it's used to subltly manipulate or influence peoples thought processes. That's why i try and keep the general flow to the point where i barely have to pay attention to them, just as they come along. But with the Ni you can easily guess their motivations based on past experiences. The dominant Ni may keep you from commenting until the pattern is clear, but you could still be wrong or slightly correct and then you adjust as you say this by their words and body language to come closer to accuracy.
This was wordy and this stuff seems overly simplified but it could just be that way;it is late at night.

[MysticSonic]

For me Ti feels like taking a thought about the world, any sort of thought, and looking at it through various sorts of angles. It almost feels as if I'm rotating the idea and trying to fully grasp and comprehend it, look at all aspects of it, and when comparing it to another idea, it's as if I attempt to look down towards the other idea, look back at the central idea, and sort of feel out what's in between them, while all the while trying to put squeeze these feelings and thoughts into words both so I can understand them more concretely and so I can communicate them. It also feels like I have to separate the idea, push it apart, pull it into little pieces and examine the sub-aspects of it, to look at the tiny details and see if they fit together too, or if I'm ignoring a certain part of the idea simply because I'm looking at the whole thing without considering the little pieces from which it's made. I also begin to feel slightly disconnected from what is here and lose sight of things around me. If there's a thing in the environment that my thoughts are focused upon, I will more focused on the thoughts of that thing than the thing itself, more focused on my processing of the idea of the thing than how the the thing makes me feel and what my perceptions of it are.

That is, of course, when I'm focused using Ti. When I'm lost or done tearing an idea apart my mind floats and travels via Ne into a sort of amorphous state where I feel one thing, feel another, and almost try to put them together after noting a sense of compatibility between the two things. If I'm thinking about a friend whom has traits x, it might spontaneously occur to me that my other friend also has trait x, and that the second friend has a different trait which might seem to imply the previous friend has that trait as well. The noting of similarities is not random or without cause, however, and it is usually done through the means of an underlying concept that would cause the implication. The feeling of doing such things though feels rather exploratory, and feels often without purpose. I'll explore something without knowing why I'm exploring it, but know for certain that I should because something is there, without a doubt. Something significant lies in that corner of my mind and can tell me something about something else---that one aspect of my friend can definitely explain a perplexing trait in my other friend.

[Khola aka Bee]

Do you have more descriptive words for Si? How it "feels" to use? I think I mixed up Si and Ni a lot before changing types. A lot of the feelings I thought of as Si are in fact Ni. Weird I guess, or maybe Si and Ni somehow feel the same in some ways??

Wait.... you thought you were Si once too?

[Gilly]

This thread gets my stamp for the most useless and misleading topic ever.

[iAnnAu]

For me Ti feels like ... If there's a thing in the environment that my thoughts are focused upon, I will more focused on the thoughts of that thing than the thing itself, more focused on my processing of the idea of the thing than how the the thing makes me feel and what my perceptions of it are.

This is interesting. During various meetups, I've had both Elro and hkkmr mention when I go off on Te spews. It's like I have all these pieces of data in my head, swirling in random formation. They get called to the fore of my consciousness by association, so that in one minute I could be talking about how the robber baron era led to the government mandating negotiations with labor unions, and the next minute I could be chiming in with names of my favorite visual artists. The only connection between the two is formed by the conversation at hand, but it doesn't feel contradictory - or useless - to jump around like that. For some reason, even though I don't seem to have much structure to all the STUFF in my brain, I can recall most things with ease, as if it's easier for me to ride the zig-zags of random association than to lock things into a more categorized, hierarchical, etc. form.
The last time I was told I was going off in a Te storm, I asked what Ti was, in contrast, and the response was along the lines of "Te is bits of data, Ti is the structure that the bits fit into." The person who offered that seemed unsure if that was an adequate way to describe it, but what you say above adds some depth to that assessment.
For just about every other function, I'm still in the dark. Even Si. And I don't even consider my idea of Te to be all that conclusive ...

[tcaudilllg]

This thread gets my stamp for the most useless and misleading topic ever.

They're getting worse. Fast.

[tcaudilllg]

This may be the WORST THREAD EVER. I'm trying desperately to see some value in this... but all I see are a bunch of intellectual lightweights exchanging opinions as though they were gospel. The natural order ain't being respected around here, it seems.

[tereg]

wtf, this thread is about conjecture, it's not as though this is some set in stone theory we're spouting or preaching here.

Take it down a notch, damn.

[tereg]

This may be the WORST THREAD EVER. I'm trying desperately to see some value in this... but all I see are a bunch of intellectual lightweights exchanging opinions as though they were gospel. The natural order ain't being respected around here, it seems.

The way that I perceived this thread was to find some analogous way to describe one's personal use of ego functions. That's it. I found it to be an exercise to find a way to visualize (intuitively speaking) certain functions.

This isn't gospel.

[tereg]

And also to assert that this thread, THIS THREAD is the worst thread of them all is absurd.

I think I can name a few threads that exist that are worse by content standards than this thread.

[tcaudilllg]

Content standards don't matter... it's the idiocy growth index (IDI) which is cause for concern. I mean really now, we're approaching Mein Kampf on the absurdity scale here. (you post excluded).

[dbmmama]

The way that I perceived this thread was to find some analogous way to describe one's personal use of ego functions. That's it. I found it to be an exercise to find a way to visualize (intuitively speaking) certain functions.

This isn't gospel.

i couldnt agree more.

[Khola aka Bee]

Content standards don't matter... it's the idiocy growth index (IDI) which is cause for concern. I mean really now, we're approaching Mein Kampf on the absurdity scale here. (you post excluded).

I'm getting really sick of your shit. It isn't even cute anymore. Don't like, don't participate, nobody gets hurt.

[Gilly]

wtf, this thread is about conjecture, it's not as though this is some set in stone theory we're spouting or preaching here.

Take it down a notch, damn.

It's just stupid and pointless and grossly misleading. Functions don't have "feelings" because they are not concrete cognitive processes; they are simply external interpretations of the world as information. If you wanted to talk about how a dopamine rush felt, that would be fine, and probably pretty fucking cool. But talking about what Ne or Ni "feels like" is analogous to discussing what it feels like for a shirt to be red. On top of it being totally pointless and unfounded, it gives people who don't have a solid understanding of the ACTUAL nature of the functions a completely skewed idea of what a function might be.

If this is your idea of a creative outlet, you need to learn to draw or write or sing or something.

[tcaudilllg]

I'm getting really sick of your shit. It isn't even cute anymore. Don't like, don't participate, nobody gets hurt.

Same here, I'm gettin' sick of yours.

[tereg]

It's just stupid and pointless and grossly misleading. Functions don't have "feelings" because they are not concrete cognitive processes; they are simply external interpretations of the world as information. If you wanted to talk about how a dopamine rush felt, that would be fine, and probably pretty fucking cool. But talking about what Ne or Ni "feels like" is analogous to discussing what it feels like for a shirt to be red. On top of it being totally pointless and unfounded, it gives people who don't have a solid understanding of the ACTUAL nature of the functions a completely skewed idea of what a function might be.

If this is your idea of a creative outlet, you need to learn to draw or write or sing or something.

While functions don't have "feelings" as you're describing them, how else are you going to describe external interpretations of the world?

Isn't that the main premise of the original question? If you put the word "feeling" aside for a moment and... you know, maybe I misinterpreted the original intent of the question, it's possible... but if the question was rephrased "Describe what using your ego functions resemble", how is that not analogous to describing concrete facets of reality as perceived by an individual? Is that not what analogies and metaphors are for? To intuitively be able to describe these facets of reality by some communicative means to be able to paint a picture of what the process is like?

[dbmmama]

While functions don't have "feelings" as you're describing them, how else are you going to describe external interpretations of the world?

Isn't that the main premise of the original question? If you put the word "feeling" aside for a moment and... you know, maybe I misinterpreted the original intent of the question, it's possible... but if the question was rephrased "Describe what using your ego functions resemble", how is that not analogous to describing concrete facets of reality as perceived by an individual? Is that not what analogies and metaphors are for? To intuitively be able to describe these facets of reality by some communicative means to be able to paint a picture of what the process is like?

yes!! i had a "feeling" the word "feeling" was going to get misconstrued when this was first posted. changing it to "sensing" would be more appropriate to everyone maybe. like "how do you sense your functions?" i personally have always used the word feeling for when i sense something and that has confused some things for me.

[tcaudilllg]

"Experience" is the word your looking for: how do you experience your use of the functions?

[dbmmama]

"Experience" is the word your looking for: how do you experience your use of the functions?

yeah, that's it. but everyone's experience is going to be unique so, whatever word is used will still be individual to them. i like "feeling" personally.

[tcaudilllg]

yeah, that's it. but everyone's experience is going to be unique so, whatever word is used will still be individual to them. i like "feeling" personally.

Well I would disagree... but granted I cannot prove it. Yet even if one man's green is another man's red (though I'm thinking this is probably intrinsically false as a notion), our experiences, when described with words, can be explained and communicated in such manner as to seem familiar.

Actually I think it was Kepinsky who argued that red was DEFINITELY red and green was DEFINITELY green, with no deviation.

[MysticSonic]

It's just stupid and pointless and grossly misleading. Functions don't have "feelings" because they are not concrete cognitive processes; they are simply external interpretations of the world as information.

What do you mean?

[Ms. Kensington]

well, im not asking functions what they feel like. I'm asking a person to tell me what they feel like when they are doing what they are doing. I'm not making any objective claims about the nature of a function or a process I am looking at the effects they have on a person's experience. Perhaps the terminology is not correct. A function here referring to taking in those information aspects signified by a black triangle or a white square. Maybe "function" is not the word for the process of taking information in, but I thought that was a basic assumption that someone who is ENTp does have cognitive processes that are more connected with Ne aspects than an ISFj's cognitive processes. Not everyone does the same taking in of information the same way, but they do all have experiences.

In my opinion asking someone what seeing a red shirt is experienced like, is more analagous to the thread than asking someone what does it feel like for a shirt to be red. Maybe I need more explanation.

[dbmmama]

Well I would disagree... but granted I cannot prove it. Yet even if one man's green is another man's red (though I'm thinking this is probably intrinsically false as a notion), our experiences, when described with words, can be explained and communicated in such manner as to seem familiar.

Actually I think it was Kepinsky who argued that red was DEFINITELY red and green was DEFINITELY green, with no deviation.

red may be red and green may be green but not to those who are colorblind. their perception makes their reality, even if "scientifically" the colors are the colors they are...

i know i see colors in the sky that others do not. they see blue and i can see the hues that change values as well as shades as well as the tints that comes from the sun, etc....i also see shapes in clouds when another (my hubby) only sees a cloud, i see a horse or smiling old lady or witch on a broomstick. and my hubby cannot see them moving in the sky and i can see the slightest movement and merging with each other to make other unique shapes. i see time passing with the sunset and another day coming to an end.

and my 5 year old sees the moon "moving" with us as we drive in the car. of course, it's not moving but without the understanding of the way of the moon and earth, she sees it moving with us. and when i see the moon, i see the shapes on it's surface, i see man walking on it the day after i was born...

i could write about this for days.

my point is that there are as many ways of "experiencing" everything as there are people and more. the uniqueness of each person is phenomally interesting and worthy of respect to me.

[Ms. Kensington]

"Experience" is the word your looking for: how do you experience your use of the functions?

hey didn't see this. would you be satisfied with that?

(this is why i don't use facebook or myspace regularly.. not good on the upkeep)

[tcaudilllg]

I wasn't referring to you, Ms. K, but to the people who transformed your query into an unintelligible speculation jaunt.

[Warlord]

Like this, on a good day:


It just feels like I'm thinking, and I do that at all the time.

The visual effect when I space out is like I still see the colors, but don't recognize the objects well. And I'm totally concentrated on what's going in my thoughts.

I can often almost see some of the thoughts in video/pictures or graphs of some sort. But don't really see them, unless I close my eyes.

My thinking draws different types of information from like huge harddisk in my head, and processess them with different kinds of methods. One example of a common method is elimination, and one other is simulation. Also I have very strong need to feed more information to my brain.

I often go through a process like:
Does it make sense.
Is it true and to what extent.
Is it important.
How can I use this information.

But it's like faster than that, sort of takes leaps ahead, without really filling in the gaps.

[Not A Communist Shill]

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