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Thread: The metaphysical and alchemical origins of socionics

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    Default The metaphysical and alchemical origins of socionics

    The origin of using shapes as information elements ...

    Look closely at the symbols ... This is from book of witchcraft titled "making magic" by Edain McCoy pages 48 and 49 ...

    Book found here:
    http://www.amazon.com/Making-Magic-W.../dp/156718670X




    The origin of using 1-2-4-16-32-64 ways of mathematically calculating the different types ...

    The Eye of Horus Fractions:



    And some thing I have been doing with socionics:



    And also here:


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    You know those triangle, square, and circle symbols have historically been used so rarely that this clearly cannot be a coincidence.
    It is easier for the eye of a camel to pass through a rich man than for a needle to enter the kingdom of heaven.

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    Wow! Other people have used circles, squares, and triangles before! Who would have thought?
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    The Chinese War Strategems are a nice touch.
    Moonlight will fall
    Winter will end
    Harvest will come
    Your heart will mend

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    Also, notice how noone has used the rhombus. Or these random irregular trapezoids that I happen to like:


    I mean, how improbable is that?
    There must be a gazillion possible irregular trapezoids, 1 square, 1 circle, a gazzilion million irregular polygons, even more types of random squiggles, 1 equilateral triangle...
    and 2 different groups of people pick the OUTLIERS. either people are completely irrational or this is an aspect of divine intervention. discuss.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    The rhombus is the symbol of all that is unholy and the darkness that lurks at the pit of each person's soul. It must neither be seen nor spoken...

    For real, don't do it or it will be pretty bad for you.
    Moonlight will fall
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    Harvest will come
    Your heart will mend

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    McNew, call me silly, but I really think you may want to look into the idea that between the two languages:
    circle /= circle
    square /= square
    .... and so on

    I think it's possible that there's actually a permutation on it. Like:
    socionics circle = creepy square
    socionics triangle = creepy circle.

    I mean it's very likely that God just wanted to fool people and wanted a prophet (if you get my hint <nudge>) to decipher his code.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    Also, have you collaborated with tcaudilllg on this? I think you should. Just an idea.
    And let me tell you, I know potential when I see it.
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Also, notice how noone has used the rhombus. Or these random irregular trapezoids that I happen to like:


    I mean, how improbable is that?
    There must be a gazillion possible irregular trapezoids, 1 square, 1 circle, a gazzilion million irregular polygons, even more types of random squiggles, 1 equilateral triangle...
    and 2 different groups of people pick the OUTLIERS. either people are completely irrational or this is an aspect of divine intervention. discuss.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    McNew, call me silly, but I really think you may want to look into the idea that between the two languages:
    circle /= circle
    square /= square
    .... and so on

    I think it's possible that there's actually a permutation on it. Like:
    socionics circle = creepy square
    socionics triangle = creepy circle.

    I mean it's very likely that God just wanted to fool people and wanted a prophet (if you get my hint <nudge>) to decipher his code.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Also, have you collaborated with tcaudilllg on this? I think you should. Just an idea.
    And let me tell you, I know potential when I see it.


    Ritella, it doesn't require three posts of cringe-worthy, obvious sarcasm to get a point across.
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    Quote Originally Posted by Allie View Post
    Ritella, it doesn't require three posts of cringe-worthy, obvious sarcasm to get a point across.
    okay, i'll just post random monkeys and hope that someone takes it as code for me having an opinion.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    As a side note, and not related to topic at hand so I won't drag it out, but how on earth does anyone type McNew as INFj or ENFp? Since his return ENTp has been pretty obvious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
    As a side note, and not related to topic at hand so I won't drag it out, but how on earth does anyone type McNew as INFj or ENFp? Since his return ENTp has been pretty obvious.
    +1000

    or at the very least, not an Fi-ego.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew View Post
    The origin of using shapes as information elements ...

    Look closely at the symbols ... This is from book of witchcraft titled "making magic" by Edain McCoy pages 48 and 49 ...
    The correspondence of the symbols for the information elements doesn't correspond with the symbols of those elements. If they used them as source, why would they have changed the connection.

    But if you intrested in these kind of occultic connections. I suggest buying 777 by Aleister Crowley.
    ...the human race will disappear. Other races will appear and disappear in turn. The sky will become icy and void, pierced by the feeble light of half-dead stars. Which will also disappear. Everything will disappear. And what human beings do is just as free of sense as the free motion of elementary particles. Good, evil, morality, feelings? Pure 'Victorian fictions'.

    INTp

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    It's like reading Umberto Eco's - Foucault's Pendulum all over again.
    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

    ENFp - Fi 7w6 sp/sx
    The Ineffable IEI
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mimosa Pudica View Post
    There are no coincidences.
    If we just develop the magical elements a little, and introduce external and internal versions, we get that :
    / = external/internal air
    / = external/internal fire
    / = external/internal water
    / = external/internal earth

    Clearly, my Avatar then says NiFe (internal fire=, external water(bubble)=)

    Ritella's Avatar seems to say FiNe (the woman looks drunk, so internal water=, and sexy= external fire = )

    rmcnew's says NeTi (hot babe = external fire = , internal lune = earth = )

    I'm sure we can see similar patterns in all of your Avatars. Probably we could type you all based on this. I'm certain there are patterns here!!! We just have to look closely.

    Socionics is finally on to something BIG!!!
    Nu-uh, just look at the shape of your avatar, it's in , a.k.a. the black square, and that water bubble is clearly . which tries to limit your usage of fiery .
    Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mimosa Pudica View Post
    There are no coincidences.
    If we just develop the magical elements a little, and introduce external and internal versions, we get that :
    / = external/internal air
    / = external/internal fire
    / = external/internal water
    / = external/internal earth

    Clearly, my Avatar then says NiFe (internal fire=, external water(bubble)=)

    Ritella's Avatar seems to say FiNe (the woman looks drunk, so internal water=, and sexy= external fire = )

    rmcnew's says NeTi (hot babe = external fire = , internal lune = earth = )

    I'm sure we can see similar patterns in all of your Avatars. Probably we could type you all based on this. I'm certain there are patterns here!!! We just have to look closely.

    Socionics is finally on to something BIG!!!
    lol. my avatar looks drunk?!

    Btw, McNew, thank you for the "[this may offend some people]" warning. I daresay that was the best part of this whole thing.
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    This just in:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost of Phaedrus Past View Post
    I have studied this more than anyone in the whole world. The Circle-Square-Triangle-moon=/-/-/-/ thesis holds true.
    There you have it folks. Believe what you want. Now I know the truth.
    EII; E6(w5)

    i am flakey

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    This is actually not impossible. There is a strong association with the occult between the life and consciousness axes of the id. (which, I observe, must be the foundational nature of all)

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    The use of powers of two is based on the fact that two is the smallest integer that consistently increases when multiplied by itself repeatedly. I think Socionics could actually use a three somewhere, but it would take a special effort to bring that about.

    Any occult connection would have to be traced from the writings of Jung, not the symbols brought to the West.



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    It's dialectic: thesis-antithesis-synthesis-antisynthesis

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
    It's dialectic: thesis-antithesis-synthesis-antisynthesis
    Er... which of the fifty things we've talked about in this thread is dialectic?



    LII-Ne

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
    As a side note, and not related to topic at hand so I won't drag it out, but how on earth does anyone type McNew as INFj or ENFp? Since his return ENTp has been pretty obvious.
    You are right, but I am able to change my own personality type at will now that I understand the underlying laws behind all typings. I have also been ENTj, INTp as of late.

    And ENFj and INFp towards some other people.

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    Isn't he permanently and irrevocably ?



    LII-Ne

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    - Blair Houghton

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    You know those triangle, square, and circle symbols have historically been used so rarely that this clearly cannot be a coincidence.
    I think that anyone who has any interest in socionics apart from anything else would want to make it seem as though there was absolutely no way that origional socionics as it was early devised is nearly 100% taken from secreted alchemical information that has slipped into religions such as wicca. Perhaps it would be somewhat challenging to prove that the few orioginal founders of socionics did not really invent socionics, they simply reinterpreted something occultic and obscure, and were able to get away with some degree of plagarization, because no one really knew about the alchemical processes anymore.

    That probably does not sound pleasant, but one thing for sure is that I appreciate the fact that these things can once again be talked about without the threat of anyone being put to death. I suppose where it all came from does not matter in that regards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord View Post
    The correspondence of the symbols for the information elements doesn't correspond with the symbols of those elements. If they used them as source, why would they have changed the connection.

    But if you intrested in these kind of occultic connections. I suggest buying 777 by Aleister Crowley.
    You apparently do not understand the included diagrams, which does indeed show a connection ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hostage_Child View Post
    I thought it started with Jung's classifications of cognitive functions that fell into eight major classifications which was later tweaked by some Russian chick and then some other Russians to get something along the lines that we have now within the last century.
    Jung did not use the information elements, but much of the same came from alchemical sources. Jung blatently admits to formulating his theory from alchemy, funny thing is that most socionist from Russia and elsewhere seem prejudiced towards any connections whatsoever, even in the face of blatant obviousness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Also, have you collaborated with tcaudilllg on this? I think you should. Just an idea.
    And let me tell you, I know potential when I see it.
    Tcaudilllg is the only one who even remotely has a clue what any of this means; atleast he has been the only one to make intelligent enough observations that shows he has some understanding of the same connections I have made.

    Unfortunately everyone else seems to have ignorantly resorted to some types of sarcasm that proves nothing for or against, or has tried to make the connection not seem obvious that socionics got the information elements from alchemy, just as religions such as wicca got those signs from alchemy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
    Isn't he permanently and irrevocably ?
    No one is permanently or irrevocably anything, though people tend towards certain tendencies for whatever reason until certain things about themselves come to the conscious side. Then, they learn control over those tendencies and can change them into others.

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    McNew, are you going to attempt to force people on here to believe/follow this, or are you going to let them come to their own conclusions and make their own choices about it?
    INFj / EII / FiNe
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    "Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." - G.K. Chesterton

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew View Post
    I think that anyone who has any interest in socionics apart from anything else would want to make it seem as though there was absolutely no way that origional socionics as it was early devised is nearly 100% taken from secreted alchemical information that has slipped into religions such as wicca. Perhaps it would be somewhat challenging to prove that the few orioginal founders of socionics did not really invent socionics, they simply reinterpreted something occultic and obscure, and were able to get away with some degree of plagarization, because no one really knew about the alchemical processes anymore.

    That probably does not sound pleasant, but one thing for sure is that I appreciate the fact that these things can once again be talked about without the threat of anyone being put to death. I suppose where it all came from does not matter in that regards.
    Actually, it's interesting that you should say this, since more and more socionists have been talking openly about Aushra's ties to Theosophy and Sufism. She confided in a few close followers of her astral connection to the Great White Brotherhood. It is well possibly she originally obtained the symbols from the Gundestrup cauldron, and her teachings on duality are marvellously reminiscent of the tawhīd. Aushra saw as a sort of "aether" uniting the other elements, and she would exert the chakras with chants of "Eko! Eko! Azarak! Eko! Eko! Zomelak!"
    It is easier for the eye of a camel to pass through a rich man than for a needle to enter the kingdom of heaven.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    Actually, it's interesting that you should say this, since more and more socionists have been talking openly about Aushra's ties to Theosophy and Sufism. She confided in a few close followers of her astral connection to the Great White Brotherhood. It is well possibly she originally obtained the symbols from the Gundestrup cauldron, and her teachings on duality are marvellously reminiscent of the tawhīd. Aushra saw as a sort of "aether" uniting the other elements, and she would exert the chakras with chants of "Eko! Eko! Azarak! Eko! Eko! Zomelak!"
    ROFL !!!!!! Oh god that's funny!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    Actually, it's interesting that you should say this, since more and more socionists have been talking openly about Aushra's ties to Theosophy and Sufism. She confided in a few close followers of her astral connection to the Great White Brotherhood. It is well possibly she originally obtained the symbols from the Gundestrup cauldron, and her teachings on duality are marvellously reminiscent of the tawhīd. Aushra saw as a sort of "aether" uniting the other elements, and she would exert the chakras with chants of "Eko! Eko! Azarak! Eko! Eko! Zomelak!"
    It is quite transparent that you are now just trying to counter bullshit with bullshit, and you want to convey that there is no correlation in any of those things. I am not falling for it.

    Apparently no one is up to any serious discussion concerning this and would rather fart around and be sarcastic where it is not needed. Suit yourselves, I only keep what I think is useful and throw out the rest anyways.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    McNew, are you going to attempt to force people on here to believe/follow this, or are you going to let them come to their own conclusions and make their own choices about it?
    If people could come to their conclusions about what I have presented without being sarcastic jerks I am all for that. Of course I knew people were going to do that, which is why I made the title thread the way I did. It seems no one cares where any of this really came from.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew View Post
    If people could come to their conclusions about what I have presented without being sarcastic jerks I am all for that. Of course I knew people were going to do that, which is why I made the title thread the way I did. It seems no one cares where any of this really came from.
    That's nice, but it didn't really answer my question.
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    And here is a question for anyone else ...

    Has anyone actually tried researching the 36 chinese strategems, and while using the charts I have made compare them to type descriptions ... ?

    Has that crossed anyone's mind at all ... ?

    When you see strong correlations, it is obvious that socionics and the others are based on halving a circle and finding polarities.

    As for everything else, Good grief ...

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    I'm totally fudgin' shocked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    Actually, it's interesting that you should say this, since more and more socionists have been talking openly about Aushra's ties to Theosophy and Sufism. She confided in a few close followers of her astral connection to the Great White Brotherhood. It is well possibly she originally obtained the symbols from the Gundestrup cauldron, and her teachings on duality are marvellously reminiscent of the tawhīd. Aushra saw as a sort of "aether" uniting the other elements, and she would exert the chakras with chants of "Eko! Eko! Azarak! Eko! Eko! Zomelak!"
    I'm not sure this is a joke.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JRiddy View Post
    I'm not sure this is a joke.
    It is a joke ... he was attempting to reconvey his feeling that there was no correlation between alchemy, the information elements and the wiccan symbols, and whatever else by making up a bullshit story that seems believable, yet everything in it has no real correlation whatsoever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew View Post
    And here is a question for anyone else ...

    Has anyone actually tried researching the 36 chinese strategems, and while using the charts I have made compare them to type descriptions ... ?

    Has that crossed anyone's mind at all ... ?

    When you see strong correlations, it is obvious that socionics and the others are based on halving a circle and finding polarities.

    As for everything else, Good grief ...
    Yep, read them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    Yep, read them.
    Then can you, perhaps, say something intelligent about why or why not what I have presented is viable besides just repeating "no correlation" over and over again without saying anything else or being unnecessarily sarcastic.

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