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Thread: Test: Are MBTI descriptions recognizable?

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    Default Test: Are MBTI descriptions recognizable?

    MBTI uses a different approach to defining types as Socionics does, yet it would be useful to know if the descriptions can be recognized by Socionists or are simply too different.

    Therefore I've copied 1 description out of an MBTI book to test what type of person the people on this forum recognize in it. Elaborate if you like.

    --------------------------------------------------

    These types are the consummate project managers. Regardless of the nature of the task to be accomplished or whether they do it as part of their job or for fun, these types are talented at realistically sizing up a situation, setting goals, determining abailable resources, and organizing and supervising the personnel to make sure the job gets done correctly, always in the most efficient manner.

    Logical and analytical, these types are natural leaders and quick decision makers. Their serious no-nonsense approach to life inspires confidence and trust from the people they work and live with. Respected for their objectivity and fairness, these types live by a code that includes working hard and behaving honorably and ethically. They are seldom accused of playing favorites or acting capriciously.

    Thoroughly committed to the organizations they belong to, they are wiling to take on difficult assignments and make the tough decisions for the good of the organization.

    They may inadvertently act insensitively at times. But when they do, it is because they are not very tuned in to the emotional side of people, and, consequently, they may not consider how people feel about an issue particularly relevant to the decisionmaking process.

    Although they are often outgoing and friendly, these types are highly competitive, have a strong need to be in control and are also strong willed and very verbal. Therefore, by the sheer power of their personality, they may easily intimidate less assertive people.

    Often drawn to work environments that are highly structured, these types are most comfortable when everyone knows the ground rules, and where there are established operating procedures and clear expectations. They are loyal team players who are more interested in maintaining than challenging the status quo. They respect authority and expect others to do the same. Practical and realistic these types consider it important to be accurate with facts and to pay close attention to details. These types are particularly good at maintaining existing systems and using resources wisely.

    Traditional and often conservative, these types have little interest in or enthusiasm for experimental creative or new approaches. Instead they prefer to stick with familiar and tested ways of doing things. Nor do they adapt well or easily to change. As a result, they can be forceful and effective opponents constantly challenging the necessity of change. They are rarely convinced by anything other than hard facts and logical reasoning.

    Because they are so focused on the present, they may fail to appreciate how current actions may affect the future. And they are not particularly good at anticipating future needs or forecasting future trends.

    Because they tend to make quick decisions, they sometimes rush to judgement before they have carefully and thoroughly considered all their options. And once they have made up their minds, they are difficult to convince otherwise. When they slow down and take the extra time to listen patiently to suggestions, they may find the added perspecive helps them make better choices for themselves and others.
    Last edited by Jarno; 10-15-2008 at 12:47 AM.

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    MBTI ESTJ

    socionics closest to LSI, but not really anything

    next

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    I would say that they are somewhat, but not completely. Personally, I think that's worse than if they were completely unrecognizable because then people wouldn't use them. Some types seem to match up better than others, and I think extraverted descriptions generally match up better than introverted, but still not completely. They're enough alike to be confusing, and enough different to be pretty worthless, IMO.

    Now I will wait for Phaedrus to find this thread.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
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    Jarno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker Mom View Post
    I would say that they are somewhat, but not completely. Personally, I think that's worse than if they were completely unrecognizable because then people wouldn't use them. Some types seem to match up better than others, and I think extraverted descriptions generally match up better than introverted, but still not completely. They're enough alike to be confusing, and enough different to be pretty worthless, IMO.
    That is your general opinion. The question is how well THIS description fits a type.

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    Creepy-Cyclops

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    This is a description of ESTj's I have known.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    That is your general opinion. The question is how well THIS description fits a type.
    It sounds something like a Beta ST, something like a Delta ST, but not just like any of them.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    I should say to be fair that the MBTI ENFP descriptions do fit me pretty well.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

  8. #8
    Creepy-Cyclops

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    Thought I would add, that MBTI and Keirsey ISTP fit me also.

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    Yeah that obviously is ESTJ.

    I honestly don't see what is so bad about MBTI as opposed to Socionics. I do prefer Socionics though, but essentially they both are theories about categorizing personality types. There is one thing that I find interesting in MBTI that I haven't seen in Socionics theories, which is the supposed progression of functional development with each type. For example, I remember that for INFJ the theory is that you develop the "T" function at one stage in your life marked by certain "T" interests, such as being more interested in matters of logic. Later you really get into developing "S", etc. Then duality is marked by two people who develop their functions starting from different end points. I thought this was interesting, but I couldn't determine a conclusion as to how accurate this really is.

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    Sounds ISTj for the most parts.
    INTp
    sx/sp

  11. #11
    Creepy-Cyclops

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    MBTI uses a different approach to defining types as Socionics does, yet it would be useful to know if the descriptions can be recognized by Socionists or are simply too different.

    Therefore I've copied 1 description out of an MBTI book to test what type of person the people on this forum recognize in it. Elaborate if you like.

    --------------------------------------------------

    These types are the consummate project managers. Regardless of the nature of the task to be accomplished or whether they do it as part of their job or for fun, these types are talented at realistically sizing up a situation, setting goals, determining abailable resources, and organizing and supervising the personnel to make sure the job gets done correctly, always in the most efficient manner.

    Logical and analytical, these types are natural leaders and quick decision makers. Their serious no-nonsense approach to life inspires confidence and trust from the people they work and live with. Respected for their objectivity and fairness, these types live by a code that includes working hard and behaving honorably and ethically. They are seldom accused of playing favorites or acting capriciously.

    Thoroughly committed to the organizations they belong to, they are wiling to take on difficult assignments and make the tough decisions for the good of the organization.

    They may inadvertently act insensitively at times. But when they do, it is because they are not very tuned in to the emotional side of people, and, consequently, they may not consider how people feel about an issue particularly relevant to the decisionmaking process.

    Although they are often outgoing and friendly, these types are highly competitive, have a strong need to be in control and are also strong willed and very verbal. Therefore, by the sheer power of their personality, they may easily intimidate less assertive people.

    Often drawn to work environments that are highly structured, these types are most comfortable when everyone knows the ground rules, and where there are established operating procedures and clear expectations. They are loyal team players who are more interested in maintaining than challenging the status quo. They respect authority and expect others to do the same. Practical and realistic these types consider it important to be accurate with facts and to pay close attention to details. These types are particularly good at maintaining existing systems and using resources wisely.

    Traditional and often conservative, these types have little interest in or enthusiasm for experimental creative or new approaches. Instead they prefer to stick with familiar and tested ways of doing things. Nor do they adapt well or easily to change. As a result, they can be forceful and effective opponents constantly challenging the necessity of change. They are rarely convinced by anything other than hard facts and logical reasoning.

    Because they are so focused on the present, they may fail to appreciate how current actions may affect the future. And they are not particularly good at anticipating future needs or forecasting future trends.

    Because they tend to make quick decisions, they sometimes rush to judgement before they have carefully and thoroughly considered all their options. And once they have made up their minds, they are difficult to convince otherwise. When they slow down and take the extra time to listen patiently to suggestions, they may find the added perspecive helps them make better choices for themselves and others.
    I think it's strange how people see LSI in this description. What we are seeing is an extravert and a thinker - a dominant Te with repressed N. And the behaviours of an ESTj as we meet them and work with them IRL.

    To see LSI here isn't recognising socionic extravert or seeing the difference in thinking styles, or perhaps also a lack of experience in dealing with the types IRL.

    I wonder if those who see introverted thinking in this person could elaborate why?

    I can only think at the moment that this could be related to why we see some strange typings pop up, like Smilingeyes being an LSI, among other occasional typings.

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    i see Se.. beta ST basically
    INTp
    sx/sp

  13. #13
    Creepy-Cyclops

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mea View Post
    i see Se.. beta ST basically
    How so? Don't you see the dominant Te style of thinking?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mimosa Pudica View Post
    I tried to find my description, but got completely lost, as they talk about introverted feeling as the dominant function of INFPs? Am I INFJ in MBTI? I'd like someone to explain...?
    I can explain this perfectly.

    First of all, MBTI has simply made an error in the order of their functions for introverts. Therefor MBTI functions are of no use, they just confuse things.

    Secondly, people have struggled with this confusion, and came up with the idea to just switch the J and P when converting types to socionics or back. That was a wrong way of solving things and added some more confusion. Fortunately the J/P switch has become a dying myth.

    Thirdly, MBTI descriptions on the internet suck. If you are interested, just buy a book. one of the best descriptions, like the one in this tread, are from 'speedreading people'.

    You are an INFP in MBTI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post

    To see LSI here isn't recognising socionic extravert or seeing the difference in thinking styles, or perhaps also a lack of experience in dealing with the types IRL.
    You are right on. It is because they use descriptions as a reference for a type, instead of people in real life.

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    I have HUGE problems with this description, if this is indeed the entire thing ) Here's why. The type is described almost entirely within the context of work, and, to be more specific, in the role of a leader or manager. Unless this is specifically a typology of leaders, it is a terrible way to present personality descriptions.
    It is easier for the eye of a camel to pass through a rich man than for a needle to enter the kingdom of heaven.

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    (whoops, repeated my post)
    It is easier for the eye of a camel to pass through a rich man than for a needle to enter the kingdom of heaven.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    I have HUGE problems with this description, if this is indeed the entire thing ) Here's why. The type is described almost entirely within the context of work, and, to be more specific, in the role of a leader or manager. Unless this is specifically a typology of leaders, it is a terrible way to present personality descriptions.
    It's from the section called 'verify your type'. I've just read the other types and they all seem to focus a lot on work environment. Although it's not the typical personality profile, I would think the type is pretty easy to recognize.

    In my book is also another section called 'How to spot an type' with some observable characteristics. Somewhat more in the style of a Socionics profile. I'll post one of those next week.

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    double post...

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