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    jessica129's Avatar
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    Default Here I go again

    Okay, I fully understand how unbelievably annoying it is when someone constantly questions their type (I know I complain about it all the time) but I need clarification on something.

    Why is SLE/Beta being thrown around when it comes to my type? What about me points to this? What about me doesn't point to this? I'm having a very rough time deciding between E/I and Mimosa's thread didn't very well help matters...it only confused me more. I've never been 100% convinced of any type other than SLI and I guess i'm getting more willing to possibly look at others...even if they're not accurate, I was wondering what types seem to be the most clear for me? The only things I am absolutely positive about are **TP.

    What are some obvious differences between SLI/SLE/ILI. Please, I'm not joking, don't go abstract and shape-ish on me when i ask this because i won't read it. I'm asking for real life examples, not how such and such function cancels out such and such function blah blah blah. I'm asking how the differences play out when it comes to interacting with others and the environment, their thought processes, their relationships, their appearance, their mannerisms. NOT SHAPES AND FUNCTIONS. What are some things that separate an ESTP from an ISTP?

    Is INTP possible? Don't worry Delta, I'm not leaving yet. This is just out of curiosity.

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    This [1] [2] type of conduct separates Fi PoLR people and non Fi PoLR people. Where you would be the Fi PoLR person. Another example of that type of conduct is on the show two and a half men by the lead character. IMO that is.

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    So that points to ISTP? Yes, I'm really that clueless.

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    I've lately been considering other types too, but not because some random schmucks that don't know me and/or socionics have spoken, but because of my neverending curiosity and openness to new ideas as well as my desire to improve my overall socionics knowledge. And while I'll probably never put a lock on my self-typing no matter how extraordinary my theoretical knowledge will (potentially) become, SLI is what best feels at home right now, what has always felt best in the past and what will most likely feel the best in the future.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Jessica, don't get too caught up in the E/I dichotomy; just focus on your functional usage mainly.

    fwiw you VI more like ISTp IMO.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    jessica129's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    I've lately been considering other types too, but not because some random schmucks that don't know me and/or socionics have spoken, but because of my neverending curiosity and openness to new ideas as well as my desire to improve my overall socionics knowledge. And while I'll probably never put a lock on my self-typing no matter how extraordinary my theoretical knowledge will (potentially) become, SLI is what best feels at home right now, what has always felt best in the past and what will most likely feel the best in the future.
    Yeah, same here. But for me, there's always been something that has been a bit off when it comes to SLI for me. I can't put my finger on it, but it just feels a bit...off. Dunno. I mean, it makes the most sense but there's that little bit that doesn't. If you could mix SLE/SLI/ILI together I think it'd work perfectly.

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    By the way, what comes to mind is that the types I've been considering for myself happen to be pretty much the opposite of what has randomly been suggested by some folks here. I say you should learn, explore and connect things by yourself and don't listen to others much.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    ~~rubicon~~ Rubicon's Avatar
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    What you gotta do ... is take some , cross it with and voila - do you like what you see? Say yes. It's that simple. To get to your base, this depends on whether you see as representing eggs or coasters. Eggs - your ego block is ridden, Coasters - you're nuts ... and probably an person. Next - what do you see in this? Just a black square? No - look closer. Can you not see a $ in there? If not, you're ego. And if you don't get what I'm talking about, you're .

    Np.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    What you gotta do ... is take some , cross it with and voila - do you like what you see? Say yes. It's that simple. To get to your base, this depends on whether you see as representing eggs or coasters. Eggs - your ego block is ridden, Coasters - you're nuts ... and probably an person. Next - what do you see in this? Just a black square? No - look closer. Can you not see a $ in there? If not, you're ego. And if you don't get what I'm talking about, you're .

    Np.


    <3
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    What you gotta do ... is take some , cross it with and voila - do you like what you see? Say yes. It's that simple. To get to your base, this depends on whether you see as representing eggs or coasters. Eggs - your ego block is ridden, Coasters - you're nuts ... and probably an person. Next - what do you see in this? Just a black square? No - look closer. Can you not see a $ in there? If not, you're ego. And if you don't get what I'm talking about, you're .

    Np.
    best socionics explanation evar.

    I'm SiFe now.
    ILE - Ti.

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    I'm gonna say ESTp b/c I want you to be my dual... Your posts make my day sometimes, so, yeah...

    Sense of humor =

    Maybe someone else could get into how it's Beta or Delta... I'll try to get back to you with some practical examples of ESTp/ISTp/INTp after I get back from class.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JuJu View Post
    I'm gonna say ESTp b/c I want you to be my dual... Your posts make my day sometimes, so, yeah...

    Sense of humor =

    Maybe someone else could get into how it's Beta or Delta... I'll try to get back to you with some practical examples of ESTp/ISTp/INTp after I get back from class.
    Haha, thanks JuJu, I thoroughly enjoy your posts also

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    Quote Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
    So that points to ISTP? Yes, I'm really that clueless.
    Fi POLR = EXTp

    It's loads of fun.
    ILE - Ti.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
    What are some obvious differences between SLI/SLE/ILI.
    Here some stereotypes, although these people actually exist among my friends:

    Male SLE: The main party man, the one that gets the party going. REALLY OUTGOING, talks, touches and makes fun of nearly everyone that passes by. Usually constantly making jokes. TALKS his way out of every situation. Always boasting about their loan / money / swimming pool. I've never got bored around these guys.

    Female SLE: Some curse a lot. Have a big mouth, very high self confidence in social situations. never shy. Likes to sing. Usually smoke and drink a lot, not limited to weekends.

    Male SLI: Not the main party man, way more on the background. Likes danger and things that give adrenaline. Always has some experience with mechanics, tuning their motorcycle etc. Si subtypes read your face when you are talking to them. Really ackward.
    Si subtypes can be extremely cool and in control of their body.

    Female SLI: Friendly and inviting. usually seem always on the watch that nothing bad can happen around them or to them. like dancing, not singing. They like silent places, e.g. the woods or whatever. Always because of the quietness. Also like crisis situations (especially Si subtypes). Te subtypes are very well suited for intellectual discussions, probably the reason because of your ILI consideration? Si types like to listen to intellectual stuff. Si subtypes read your face when you are talking to them. Really ackward and makes me feel uncomfortable.

    Male ILI: analyst, not mechanical. glances with eyes. few eyecontact.

    Female ILI: Ni subtypes sometimes art lovers. paintings etc.


    Questions?

    ...
    Last edited by Jarno; 10-08-2008 at 11:54 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Here some stereotypes for extra clarity:

    Male SLE: The main party man, the one that gets the party going. REALLY OUTGOING, talks, touches and makes fun of nearly everyone that passes by. Usually constantly making jokes. TALKS his way out of every situation. Always boasting about their loan / money / swimming pool.

    Female SLE: Some curse a lot. Have a big mouth, is never afraid or shy. Likes to sing. Usually smoke and drink a lot, not limited to weekends.

    Male SLI: Not the main party man, way more on the background. Likes danger and things that give adrenaline. Always has some experience with mechanics, tuning their motorcycle etc. Si subtypes read your face when you are talking to them. Really ackward.
    Si subtypes can be extremely cool and in control of their body.

    Female SLI: Friendly and inviting. usually seem always on the watch that nothing bad can happen around them or to them. like dancing, not singing. They like silent places, e.g. the woods or whatever. Always because of the quietness. Also like crisis situations (especially Si subtypes). Te subtypes are very well suited for intellectual discussions, probably the reason because of your ILI consideration? Si types like to listen to intellectual stuff. Si subtypes read your face when you are talking to them. Really ackward and makes me feel uncomfortable.

    Male ILI: analyst, not mechanical. glances with eyes. few eyecontact.

    Female ILI: Ni subtypes sometimes art lovers. paintings etc.


    Questions?

    ...
    haha...ahh. Definetly not SLE based on that. Eek. Those sorts scare me and turn me off a lot. I'm not like that and hope someone never views me like that.

    The SLI one fits a lot. Many ILI descriptions fit also. I think if I had to narrow it down to two types it'd be SLI/ILI with SLI the most probable. I find it very telling to base your type on interactions with others. SLI works. I just don't understand why people keep saying I belong in beta--there never really was a clear reason as to why they said that.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Here some stereotypes, although these people actually exist among my friends:

    Male SLE: The main party man, the one that gets the party going. REALLY OUTGOING, talks, touches and makes fun of nearly everyone that passes by. Usually constantly making jokes. TALKS his way out of every situation. Always boasting about their loan / money / swimming pool. I've never got bored around these guys.

    Female SLE: Some curse a lot. Have a big mouth, very high self confidence in social situations. never shy. Likes to sing. Usually smoke and drink a lot, not limited to weekends.

    Male SLI: Not the main party man, way more on the background. Likes danger and things that give adrenaline. Always has some experience with mechanics, tuning their motorcycle etc. Si subtypes read your face when you are talking to them. Really ackward.
    Si subtypes can be extremely cool and in control of their body.

    Female SLI: Friendly and inviting. usually seem always on the watch that nothing bad can happen around them or to them. like dancing, not singing. They like silent places, e.g. the woods or whatever. Always because of the quietness. Also like crisis situations (especially Si subtypes). Te subtypes are very well suited for intellectual discussions, probably the reason because of your ILI consideration? Si types like to listen to intellectual stuff. Si subtypes read your face when you are talking to them. Really ackward and makes me feel uncomfortable.

    Male ILI: analyst, not mechanical. glances with eyes. few eyecontact.

    Female ILI: Ni subtypes sometimes art lovers. paintings etc.


    Questions?

    ...
    This is a horrible way to go about typing someone.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    SLE's don't have anxiety disorders

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    LSIs do though
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    In fact, probably a lot more than SLIs.


    ...
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    noooo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    This is a horrible way to go about typing someone.
    That shows poor judgement.

    These description are based on existing people, and the differences get pretty clear.

    Where are your descriptions by the way? '-)
    Last edited by Jarno; 10-09-2008 at 06:33 AM.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    That shows poor judgement.

    These description are based on existing people, and the differences get pretty clear.

    Where are your descriptions by the way? '-)
    No, YOU show poor judgment because (a) you believe that people can be easily described and categorized based on simplistic behavioral groupings, which they cant, and (b) you think your personal experience encapsulates enough observation to accurately form these groupings, which it doesn't, and therefore you can't. Unlike you, I don't presume to have a broad enough scope of human nature to put people into simplistic behavioral categories, despite probably having vastly more varied experience with people and numerous more acquaintances and friends. Why? Because I am absolutely 100&#37; positive that it isn't that simple.

    The reason typology is hard is precisely because it's not this easy. If it was, would we sit around having insanely abstract theoretical discussions about information metabolism? No. Occam's Razor dictates that, if your method worked, then it would have been developed long ago by people who first chose to observe and categorize people by over-generalized external behavioral traits, as per the humors, and behavior studies never would have bothered to give rise to a theory as nuanced and confusing as Socionics. However, this kind of over-simplification is trite and fruitless, which is why theories like Socionics have been developed to facilitate discourse on deeper motivations and information processing.

    Have a nice day.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    No, YOU show poor judgment because (a) you believe that people can be easily described and categorized based on simplistic behavioral groupings, which they cant, and (b) you think your personal experience encapsulates enough observation to accurately form these groupings, which it doesn't, and therefore you can't. Unlike you, I don't presume to have a broad enough scope of human nature to put people into simplistic behavioral categories, despite probably having vastly more varied experience with people and numerous more acquaintances and friends. Why? Because I am absolutely 100&#37; positive that it isn't that simple.
    My goodness. This makes me think of something: "Do not be so humble; you are not that great" [Golda Meir].

    The reason typology is hard is precisely because it's not this easy.
    Or, in other words, "The reason typology is hard is precisely because it is hard." That's a non-argument, followed by a lot of rambling that implies you said something in the first place.


    I thought Jarno's descriptions were very accurate; they match both my real-world observations of people and much of socionics theory. You dismiss her observations as simplistic and stereotype-based, but socionics [as well as many other things in life] are dependent on observation of such patterns in order to work at all. It's true that we shouldn't let them get out of hand, as there are always exceptions, but to dismiss these patterns as invalid would be silly and counterproductive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    No, YOU show poor judgment because (a) you believe that people can be easily described and categorized based on simplistic behavioral groupings, which they cant, and (b) you think your personal experience encapsulates enough observation to accurately form these groupings, which it doesn't, and therefore you can't. Unlike you, I don't presume to have a broad enough scope of human nature to put people into simplistic behavioral categories, despite probably having vastly more varied experience with people and numerous more acquaintances and friends. Why? Because I am absolutely 100&#37; positive that it isn't that simple.

    The reason typology is hard is precisely because it's not this easy. If it was, would we sit around having insanely abstract theoretical discussions about information metabolism? No. Occam's Razor dictates that, if your method worked, then it would have been developed long ago by people who first chose to observe and categorize people by over-generalized external behavioral traits, as per the humors, and behavior studies never would have bothered to give rise to a theory as nuanced and confusing as Socionics. However, this kind of over-simplification is trite and fruitless, which is why theories like Socionics have been developed to facilitate discourse on deeper motivations and information processing.

    Have a nice day.
    Jessica deliberately asked for simple descriptions.

    BTW It's not that typing is that hard, rather those insanely abstract theoretical discussions make typing harder then necessary. I also agree with songofsappho's explanation.

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