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Thread: Shyness vs personal importance of the person

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    I had words here once, but I didn't feed them Khola's Avatar
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    Question Shyness vs. personal importance of the person.

    Just thinking really...

    When I first meet someone I can usually pull off a very confident, playful air, even add the odd tease here and there. I find interaction becomes more and more difficult the better I get to know them, particularly if I like them, not just in a sexual context, but in general. It is as if I panic and lose all composure when I have respect for someone new.

    If interactions with a new person make me realise that they are fun/genuine/valuable in some way important to me, particularly if they are funny and genuine, I begin to panic slightly about my impression on them and as a result tend to lose the ability to be witty and respond on the spot, sometimes even stutter slightly and go really quiet, which is actually personally really irritating, because the more I want to get close to someone, the quieter I tend to become around them, pretty much purely out of genuine concern for the impression I am giving.

    Is this possibly type related or is it just some weird thing I do? If I'm not alone in this, how in the hell does one overcome it?
    Hello, my name is Bee. Pleased to meet you .



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    Your DNA is mine. Mediator Kam's Avatar
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    I feel the same exact way. I take advantage of the fact that someone doesn't know me, then I can exact terrible vengeance upon them.
    D-SEI 9w1

    This is me and my dual being scientific together

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    Me too - exactly. Exactly.

    The joys of being an SEI?
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    On the other hand, if I don't like/respect the person much, I retain my extraverted, confident air. Meeehhhhh.
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    Your DNA is mine. Mediator Kam's Avatar
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    jem stop being emo kid

    no one cares.
    D-SEI 9w1

    This is me and my dual being scientific together

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    ^ says the promoter of iNtrYvYrt StRYfE 4 LYfe!!!!!!11!!!11
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    It's easy to control a situation when you're detached from it, basically. If you like it enough to want to participate, but aren't invested enough to truly care about the outcome, you will most likely possess control. This is a fundamental law of power which I have learned through experience, and it seems like something that is hard for people to follow, due to their seemingly inherent desire to attach to things? I don't know, but if you can maintain the balance of quasi-interest and detachment, you're golden. Anything less is desultory, anything more is a risk (sometimes worth taking). So, bee, if it's with a guy - which would be like a girl for me - I think it could be worth the risk. If you see a potential, you follow it; if it fails, heh.

    Just drank a cup of coffee. It is dunkin donuts' original blend. My typical preference is for arabica blended beans - they are the most elite and elegant. Yet this blend is so much more down-to-earth; it's something I feel like I should be drinking casually, whereas the arabica feels like something that should only be enjoyed in a high-end restaurant before you take the pale blonde you're with home and rail her. oops lol. whatever.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    It's easy to control a situation when you're detached from it, basically. If you like it enough to want to participate, but aren't invested enough to truly care about the outcome, you will most likely possess control.

    This is a fundamental law of power which I have learned through experience, and it seems like something that is hard for people to follow, due to their seemingly inherent desire to attach to things? I don't know, but if you can maintain the balance of quasi-interest and detachment, you're golden. Anything less is desultory, anything more is a risk (sometimes worth taking).
    What kind of power is that? That's just a way of protecting yourself from being hurt. Giving yourself an escape clause. No matter how hard the person tries, they can never truly win (even if they're about to) ... because you just duck out when things are getting hairy or for the heck of it, using the "Lol @ you for caring" card. Maybe you technically have control of the situation, because you can end it at your leisure ... but is there some sort of glory in that? That's just quitting. Quitting with an excuse which keeps your ego intact. Like running a race with someone, seeing they're about to pass you - so you stop and laugh at all the energy they're expending - "Haha - did you think I was really racing you? Look at you go!" So you have control over the person's energy and time I guess ... but it's just ugh. Like some sort of sleazy manipulation tactic. Since when has "not caring" become a virtue? Oh good for you - you're so high above the rest of us that everything is just kind of petty and boring for you. It takes courage to truly invest yourself in something, give it all of yourself - take a risk knowing that if you lose, you won't come out of the situation unscathed.
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    It's easy to control a situation when you're detached from it, basically. If you like it enough to want to participate, but aren't invested enough to truly care about the outcome, you will most likely possess control. This is a fundamental law of power which I have learned through experience, and it seems like something that is hard for people to follow, due to their seemingly inherent desire to attach to things? I don't know, but if you can maintain the balance of quasi-interest and detachment, you're golden. Anything less is desultory, anything more is a risk (sometimes worth taking). So, bee, if it's with a guy - which would be like a girl for me - I think it could be worth the risk. If you see a potential, you follow it; if it fails, heh.
    I agree.

    The more invested, the less control. But most of the times, especially wrt to relationships, if you're not taking a risk and giving control away, it's also probably not worth it.

    It is dunkin donuts' original blend.
    I read this as 'original bland' and I lol'd at your coffee snobbery!
    ()
    3w4-1w2-5w4 sx/sp

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem
    What kind of power is that? That's just a way of protecting yourself from being hurt. Giving yourself an escape clause. No matter how hard the person tries, they can never truly win (even if they're about to) ... because you just duck out when things are getting hairy or for the heck of it, using the "Lol @ you for caring" card. Maybe you technically have control of the situation, because you can end it at your leisure ... but is there some sort of glory in that? That's just quitting. Quitting with an excuse which keeps your ego intact. Like running a race with someone, seeing they're about to pass you - so you stop and laugh at all the energy they're expending - "Haha - did you think I was really racing you? Look at you go!" So you have control over the person's energy and time I guess ... but it's just ugh. Like some sort of sleazy manipulation tactic. Since when has "not caring" become a virtue? Oh good for you - you're so high above the rest of us that everything is just kind of petty and boring for you. It takes courage to truly invest yourself in something, give it all of yourself - take a risk knowing that if you lose, you won't come out of the situation unscathed.
    a)You just proved my point.
    b)Reread my post - I clearly stated that a significant relationship makes it worth it.
    c)Control and power are not subjective. If you control the situation, you have power. The principle I explained is a tactic to power- regardless of opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by unefille
    I agree.

    The more invested, the less control. But most of the times, especially wrt to relationships, if you're not taking a risk and giving control away, it's also probably not worth it.
    Yup.

    I read this as 'original bland' and I lol'd at your coffee snobbery!
    LOL -- I accidentally wrote it as "bland" the first time, and edited it cause I figured "blend" was the proper term.

    And <3 I knew you would appreciate my aristocratic attitude, lol.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    It's easy to control a situation when you're detached from it, basically. If you like it enough to want to participate, but aren't invested enough to truly care about the outcome, you will most likely possess control. This is a fundamental law of power which I have learned through experience, and it seems like something that is hard for people to follow, due to their seemingly inherent desire to attach to things? I don't know, but if you can maintain the balance of quasi-interest and detachment, you're golden. Anything less is desultory, anything more is a risk (sometimes worth taking). So, bee, if it's with a guy - which would be like a girl for me - I think it could be worth the risk. If you see a potential, you follow it; if it fails, heh.

    Just drank a cup of coffee. It is dunkin donuts' original blend. My typical preference is for arabica blended beans - they are the most elite and elegant. Yet this blend is so much more down-to-earth; it's something I feel like I should be drinking casually, whereas the arabica feels like something that should only be enjoyed in a high-end restaurant before you take the pale blonde you're with home and rail her. oops lol. whatever.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    What kind of power is that? That's just a way of protecting yourself from being hurt. Giving yourself an escape clause. No matter how hard the person tries, they can never truly win (even if they're about to) ... because you just duck out when things are getting hairy or for the heck of it, using the "Lol @ you for caring" card. Maybe you technically have control of the situation, because you can end it at your leisure ... but is there some sort of glory in that? That's just quitting. Quitting with an excuse which keeps your ego intact. Like running a race with someone, seeing they're about to pass you - so you stop and laugh at all the energy they're expending - "Haha - did you think I was really racing you? Look at you go!" So you have control over the person's energy and time I guess ... but it's just ugh. Like some sort of sleazy manipulation tactic. Since when has "not caring" become a virtue? Oh good for you - you're so high above the rest of us that everything is just kind of petty and boring for you. It takes courage to truly invest yourself in something, give it all of yourself - take a risk knowing that if you lose, you won't come out of the situation unscathed.
    eh? i thought he was just saying that it's easier to pull off that "confident & playful air" when you're detached from that person, not close yet.
    but harder when you're more attached to that person. something like that.

    anyway, don't relate to this thread. i don't behave that way with people i meet for the first time.
    probably an isfp thing? though i don't see all isfps that way.
    INTp
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mea
    eh? i thought he was just saying that it's easier to pull off that "confident & playful air" when you're detached from that person, not close yet.
    but harder when you're more attached to that person. something like that.
    Yeah, I was just referring to bee's specific example, with an allusion to a more general principle. Jem just got all offset that one of her moral beliefs was crossed or something. Dunno. Don't care.
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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    c)Control and power are not subjective. If you control the situation, you have power. The principle I explained is a tactic to power- regardless of opinion.
    the lowest, most pathetic form of power possible IMO
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    I had words here once, but I didn't feed them Khola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    On the other hand, if I don't like/respect the person much, I retain my extraverted, confident air. Meeehhhhh.
    Yes! This is what I'm talking about! I'm exactly the same, lol.
    Hello, my name is Bee. Pleased to meet you .



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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    ^ says the promoter of iNtrYvYrt StRYfE 4 LYfe!!!!!!11!!!11
    Playa got pwned!
    Hello, my name is Bee. Pleased to meet you .



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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem
    the lowest, most pathetic form of power possible IMO
    lol, make sure you say that to the person who has power over you. I'm sure they'll care a lot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mea View Post
    anyway, don't relate to this thread. i don't behave that way with people i meet for the first time.
    Same, fwiw.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Really depends how I behave with people I don't know. Usually, I'm superficially friendly, even cool to strangers.

    Of course, when I feel comfortable and reasonably close to someone, I can joke with them on familiar terms. There's a kind of light wry banter that I can do with people I know well, whether or not I'm emotionally invested.

    However, when there is actual attachment to someone on my part, I tend to read their reactions very closely and mirror them. So, if they behave somewhat distant with me, I pick up that cue and it alters my ability to feel comfortable with them. I might then become awkwardly quiet or concerned. Still friendly, but in subdued mode. If I'm actually romantically attracted to someone, I'm almost always alert and overthinking my behavior when I'm near them.

    Very difficult to just "be" when someone makes my VIP List.
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    Whenever I talk to a stranger, I immediately tongue-kiss her/him, wether they're female or male.
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    On the other hand, if I don't like/respect the person much, I retain my extraverted, confident air. Meeehhhhh.

    Me too...it's not a good combination as that tends to attract and give off the wrong impression to people i have no interest in. I've always been like that. No idea on how to get over it...if you find the answer, let me know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aka-kitsune View Post
    Really depends how I behave with people I don't know. Usually, I'm superficially friendly, even cool to strangers.

    Of course, when I feel comfortable and reasonably close to someone, I can joke with them on familiar terms. There's a kind of light wry banter that I can do with people I know well, whether or not I'm emotionally invested.

    However, when there is actual attachment to someone on my part, I tend to read their reactions very closely and mirror them. So, if they behave somewhat distant with me, I pick up that cue and it alters my ability to feel comfortable with them. I might then become awkwardly quiet or concerned. Still friendly, but in subdued mode. If I'm actually romantically attracted to someone, I'm almost always alert and overthinking my behavior when I'm near them.

    Very difficult to just "be" when someone makes my VIP List.
    yes, what she said.

    and if you want to talk about coffee snobbery, how's this one: we roast our own beans at home.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron
    and if you want to talk about coffee snobbery, how's this one: we roast our own beans at home.
    Impressive.


    @Jessica: sweet avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    and if you want to talk about coffee snobbery, how's this one: we roast our own beans at home.

    Can I come over for coffee??

    (And here I thought myself snobbish for grinding my own beans.)
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    Quote Originally Posted by aka-kitsune View Post

    Can I come over for coffee??

    (And here I thought myself snobbish for grinding my own beans.)
    come on over!
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem
    Mm - yeah, personally I don't think of homosexuality as natural or normal ... but why is that an issue? Gah - just do what you want to do - to hell with other people's perceptions. I don't understand the focus on trying to standardise homosexuality. Why do you need mass acceptance or approval for doing something if you feel it's the right thing for you? Just seems to point to insecurity on the person's part IMO.
    So, you value autonomy in beliefs, not having a uniform way of thinking among people, and people generally minding their own business and letting others be?

    Quote Originally Posted by YOU
    What kind of power is that? That's just a way of protecting yourself from being hurt. Giving yourself an escape clause. No matter how hard the person tries, they can never truly win (even if they're about to) ... because you just duck out when things are getting hairy or for the heck of it, using the "Lol @ you for caring" card. Maybe you technically have control of the situation, because you can end it at your leisure ... but is there some sort of glory in that? That's just quitting. Quitting with an excuse which keeps your ego intact. Like running a race with someone, seeing they're about to pass you - so you stop and laugh at all the energy they're expending - "Haha - did you think I was really racing you? Look at you go!" So you have control over the person's energy and time I guess ... but it's just ugh. Like some sort of sleazy manipulation tactic. Since when has "not caring" become a virtue? Oh good for you - you're so high above the rest of us that everything is just kind of petty and boring for you. It takes courage to truly invest yourself in something, give it all of yourself - take a risk knowing that if you lose, you won't come out of the situation unscathed.
    So much for not imposing one's belief one someone else who merely states an observation. I was just referencing an idea, but you, for some reason, felt the need to (again) treat it as an argument and attempt to refute me. Do I unsettle you?

    Are you so set on being an individual that you forget to not impose it on other people? (by doing so you nullify the idea of being individually unique; you externalize it). Can you accept that there are principles out there which exist regardless of context, and that you can't always break something down in order to make it seem more specific, or to heighten the uniqueness of your own experience?

    What is your motive here? Got a vendetta against me after I vowed extermination of the duck watchers? hmm. I would say...

    Gah - just do what you want to do - to hell with other people's perceptions.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    Quote Originally Posted by bee View Post
    Just thinking really...

    When I first meet someone I can usually pull off a very confident, playful air, even add the odd tease here and there. I find interaction becomes more and more difficult the better I get to know them, particularly if I like them, not just in a sexual context, but in general. It is as if I panic and lose all composure when I have respect for someone new.
    I've noticed that some people seem to slip up when interacting with me. And generally I tend to think that either they're clumsy, nervous, or they like me.

    When I meet new people, that seem significant I personally often hold back - I seem kind of "quiet", and I can probably come across as kind of shy.

    That said sometimes I approach people and say that I'm "shy", and try to "increase" interactions from *their* shyness level.

    If interactions with a new person make me realise that they are fun/genuine/valuable in some way important to me, particularly if they are funny and genuine, I begin to panic slightly about my impression on them and as a result tend to lose the ability to be witty and respond on the spot, sometimes even stutter slightly and go really quiet, which is
    That sounds annoying. *poke*

    actually personally really irritating, because the more I want to get close to someone, the quieter I tend to become around them, pretty much purely out of genuine concern for the impression I am giving.
    I get more problems with people who are "rushed" when they interact with me.

    Is this possibly type related or is it just some weird thing I do? If I'm not alone in this, how in the hell does one overcome it?
    Throw yourself at them?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bee View Post
    Just thinking really...

    When I first meet someone I can usually pull off a very confident, playful air, even add the odd tease here and there. I find interaction becomes more and more difficult the better I get to know them, particularly if I like them, not just in a sexual context, but in general. It is as if I panic and lose all composure when I have respect for someone new.

    If interactions with a new person make me realise that they are fun/genuine/valuable in some way important to me, particularly if they are funny and genuine, I begin to panic slightly about my impression on them and as a result tend to lose the ability to be witty and respond on the spot, sometimes even stutter slightly and go really quiet, which is actually personally really irritating, because the more I want to get close to someone, the quieter I tend to become around them, pretty much purely out of genuine concern for the impression I am giving.

    Is this possibly type related or is it just some weird thing I do? If I'm not alone in this, how in the hell does one overcome it?
    Yeah, I'm always ridiculously friendly and outgoing when I first meet people just because I feel like that's what's expected of me. Buut... that's where I differ from you other SEIs, I guess, because I don't keep up the extroversion witty crap unless I like the person or want them to like me more or something. If I don't like them, I don't really care how witty they think I am so I act ...whatever.
    Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own freshness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop off like autumn leaves.
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    Quote Originally Posted by aka-kitsune View Post
    Really depends how I behave with people I don't know. Usually, I'm superficially friendly, even cool to strangers.

    Of course, when I feel comfortable and reasonably close to someone, I can joke with them on familiar terms. There's a kind of light wry banter that I can do with people I know well, whether or not I'm emotionally invested.
    So that doesn't really mean anything.

    However, when there is actual attachment to someone on my part, I tend to read their reactions very closely and mirror them. So, if they behave somewhat distant with me, I pick up that cue and it alters my ability to feel comfortable with them. I might then become awkwardly quiet or concerned. Still friendly, but in subdued mode. If I'm actually romantically attracted to someone, I'm almost always alert and overthinking my behavior when I'm near them.
    Hmm, I wonder if that's what this girl that acts weird around me is doing. I somehow had this "idea" to be more distant with them. As we're not "close" and I had this "wonderful" idea that if you're not close to someone you should be "distant" with them. And if they want to get close then they can get close. Because that's what people normally do.

    So I kind of notice her, she notices me more intensely. I'm kind of standoffish. Her intensity rises. She does some kind of "doubt" thing I find myself a bit closer. And I'm thinking to myself weren't I meant to be keeping my distance. And then I'm thinking to myself that maybe it doesn't matter. And interaction finishes.

    That was this morning. Then later during today I was remembering interaction. And it's like there seemed to be quite a lot of awkward tension. And she seemed to want to "resolve" the problem. And I kind of created it. And afterwards I was wondering about the effect of my actions on her.

    Which in retrospect is very strange. Because I *often* keep my distance with people. I often let people struggle etc. And yet with her. It's like there was quite a hump to go over to actually continue - and even then it's like HOW THE HELL DID SHE SNEAK IN that kind of doubt thing. That actually got me to get a little closer.

    I mean I *know* that people sometimes use "doubt" to try and manipulate me. Like be certain be certain be certain *DOUBT* and then suddenly like a moth to a flame I can respond.

    Very difficult to just "be" when someone makes my VIP List.
    Same actually. The way to tell that I like someone is that I interact with everyone but them ...

    Although I tend to go into "first and last" mode ... like if multiple people are around, I'll interact with them first, or last. First if I can at the time, otherwise last...

    Luckily I tend to like people who can deal with being "last" knowing that I'll still interact with them, even if I interact with everyone else first. Although there's a few people who kind of "give up", who I kind of like .. but not enough to want to break my flow.

  29. #29
    I've been waiting for you Satan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calenwen View Post
    Yeah, I'm always ridiculously friendly and outgoing when I first meet people just because I feel like that's what's expected of me. Buut... that's where I differ from you other SEIs, I guess, because I don't keep up the extroversion witty crap unless I like the person or want them to like me more or something. If I don't like them, I don't really care how witty they think I am so I act ...whatever.
    Hmm, I find some people act this way when I first meet them, and I don't like it.

    At one stage I decided there were three types of people.

    Those who interact readily, show themselves from the start. Those who hide readily, hide themselves from the start. And those who are in between.

    I think I'm in between. But I tend to like girls that hide. And I find it hard to respect girls that interact readily.

  30. #30
    ~~rubicon~~ Rubicon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    So, you value autonomy in beliefs, not having a uniform way of thinking among people, and people generally minding their own business and letting others be?



    So much for not imposing one's belief one someone else who merely states an observation. I was just referencing an idea, but you, for some reason, felt the need to (again) treat it as an argument and attempt to refute me. Do I unsettle you?

    Are you so set on being an individual that you forget to not impose it on other people? (by doing so you nullify the idea of being individually unique; you externalize it). Can you accept that there are principles out there which exist regardless of context, and that you can't always break something down in order to make it seem more specific, or to heighten the uniqueness of your own experience?

    What is your motive here? Got a vendetta against me after I vowed extermination of the duck watchers? hmm. I would say...
    What can I say? I was in a bad mood. :-p Yeah, you're right - my rant kinda contradicted my general life philosophy ... but at the same, everyone has different issues that annoy them, so sometimes I just feel like getting something off my chest - doesn't mean I'm trying to force the person to change or anything. I'm aware that I can come off as a pretty contradictory person sometimes ... because I do what I feel is right in the moment. I say what I think in the moment. So that first quote of mine was what I felt within the context of that argument, my rant at you was what I wanted to say in the context of this thread.

    Really, Nick - you hardly bother me. I like arguing for the heck of it sometimes. I generally see arguments in terms of issues, not people.
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

  31. #31
    I've been waiting for you Satan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    What can I say? I was in a bad mood. :-p Yeah, you're right - my rant kinda contradicted my general life philosophy ... but at the same, everyone has different issues that annoy them, so sometimes I just feel like getting something off my chest - doesn't mean I'm trying to force the person to change or anything. I'm aware that I can come off as a pretty contradictory person sometimes ... because I do what I feel is right in the moment. I say what I think in the moment. So that first quote of mine was what I felt within the context of that argument, my rant at you was what I wanted to say in the context of this thread.

    Really, Nick - you hardly bother me. I like arguing for the heck of it sometimes. I generally see arguments in terms of issues, not people.
    That seems pretty detached Jem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio View Post
    That seems pretty detached Jem.
    I'm feeling detached atm. Nick has lost his power over me. Muhahahaha!!
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    I had words here once, but I didn't feed them Khola's Avatar
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    Shoop da whoop!
    Hello, my name is Bee. Pleased to meet you .



  34. #34
    I've been waiting for you Satan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem View Post
    I'm feeling detached atm. Nick has lost his power over me. Muhahahaha!!
    He has power over me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio
    He has power over me.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

  36. #36
    I've been waiting for you Satan's Avatar
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    Jem, maybe he doesn't care about you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio View Post
    Jem, maybe he doesn't care about you.
    Maybe cows can learn to salsa.
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio View Post
    Jem, maybe he doesn't care about you.
    Yeah, just from what I've read of his it seems like he's pretty immoral.
    Suomea

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suomea
    Yeah, just from what I've read of his it seems like he's pretty immoral.
    Are you speaking in regards to this thread or in general?
    4w3-5w6-8w7

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jem
    What can I say? I was in a bad mood. :-p Yeah, you're right - my rant kinda contradicted my general life philosophy ... but at the same, everyone has different issues that annoy them, so sometimes I just feel like getting something off my chest - doesn't mean I'm trying to force the person to change or anything. I'm aware that I can come off as a pretty contradictory person sometimes ... because I do what I feel is right in the moment. I say what I think in the moment. So that first quote of mine was what I felt within the context of that argument, my rant at you was what I wanted to say in the context of this thread.

    Really, Nick - you hardly bother me. I like arguing for the heck of it sometimes. I generally see arguments in terms of issues, not people.
    So, why did you just provide an explanation to me? Sure, being in a bad mood makes one more likely to act irrationally, but whatever. If that was in fact the reason, then you shouldn't have provided a justification. Why defend yourself? You're the big proponent of individuality and being able to think what you want without caring what others think or having them impose upon you. Yet upon my pointing out a contradiction, you responded; you did care what someone else thought. I would think that someone who actually implemented the philosophy you preach would have shrugged off my criticism with a soft "whatever" and moved on. But you just gave some other reasoning about the present context, and then conveyed some trait about how you act in the present.

    Which is similar to what you said in the duck-watching argument - how it's better to listen to your feelings as they occur and analyze them so as to act upon them.

    So, let's be walking contradictions, and then contradict the fact that we are such by providing an explanation for how much of a contradiction we are.

    And by doing so, we'll come right back to where we started! Two negatives is zero, right?

    So, there's the beautiful circular reasoning of such a position.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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