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Thread: Punitiveness

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    Jesus is the cruel sausage consentingadult's Avatar
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    Default Punitiveness

    For those who seek understanding:
    PUNITIVENESS

    Typical Representations of the Schema

    These patients believe that people -including themselves- should be harshly punished for their mistakes. They present as moralistic and intolerant, and find it extremely difficult to forgive mistakes in other people or in themselves. They believe that, rather than forgiveness, people who make mistakes deserve punishment. No excuses are permitted. Patients with this schema display an unwillingness to consider extenuating circumstances. They do not allow for human imperfection, and they have difficulty feeling any empathy whatsoever for a person who does something they view as bad or wrong. These patients lack the quality of mercy.

    The best way to detect this schema is by the punitive, blaming tone of voice these patient use when someone has made a mistake... The origin of this punitive tone of voice is almost always a blaming parent who spoke in the same tone of voice.... Like the Red Queen in Lewis Carroll's Alice in Wonderland, shouting "Off with his head!"

    (Source: Schema Therapy, A Practitioner's Guide, Jeffrey E. Young et.al, Pages 267-268)
    Since this speaks for itself, I will not enter into further discussion of this topic. Do with it whatever you please.
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    passive aggressive thread dodge.
    "human weakness" is a pretty wording which lightly implies a passive mistake.
    what was being discussed on the previous thread was the real, and active tendency you have to be an arrogant, elitist snob
    INTp

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    It is a real kick in the teeth to know that people get paid to write these descriptions.

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    Could you please create more threads where you police everyone's mental health? We all want to be the way you want us to be! Don't stop now!

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    Like how many times have you posted that?
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    Like how many times have you posted that?
    Many times. Sometimes it's to provide an example of Gamma Se. Sometimes it's to tell people more or less to stop being a little bitch.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    Many times. Sometimes it's to provide an example of Gamma Se. Sometimes it's to tell people more or less to stop being a little bitch.
    Yeah... it's so full of Punitiveness.

    (Punitiveness my ass, you'll post it even in a marshmallows thread)
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    For those who seek understanding:
    PUNITIVENESS

    Typical Representations of the Schema

    These patients believe that people -including themselves- should be harshly punished for their mistakes. They present as moralistic and intolerant, and find it extremely difficult to forgive mistakes in other people or in themselves. They believe that, rather than forgiveness, people who make mistakes deserve punishment. No excuses are permitted. Patients with this schema display an unwillingness to consider extenuating circumstances. They do not allow for human imperfection, and they have difficulty feeling any empathy whatsoever for a person who does something they view as bad or wrong. These patients lack the quality of mercy.

    The best way to detect this schema is by the punitive, blaming tone of voice these patient use when someone has made a mistake... The origin of this punitive tone of voice is almost always a blaming parent who spoke in the same tone of voice.... Like the Red Queen in Lewis Carroll's Alice in Wonderland, shouting "Off with his head!"

    (Source: Schema Therapy, A Practitioner's Guide, Jeffrey E. Young et.al, Pages 267-268)
    Since this speaks for itself, I will not enter into further discussion of this topic. Do with it whatever you please.
    This is called an average-to-unhealthy One in the Enneagram.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    This is called an average-to-unhealthy One in the Enneagram.
    I don't know anything about Eneagram, but I'm sure all pseudo- and protoscientific models of personality contain elements of phenomena that are also described in mainstream psychology.
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    Yeah... it's so full of Punitiveness.

    (Punitiveness my ass, you'll post it even in a marshmallows thread)
    It's not punitive at all. It's supposed to be encouraging. There are many situations in which I'd like to encourage people to believe in their own personal power and to take responsibility for their lives. It's supposed to be motivating and inspiring. I could never do that anywhere near as well as an SEE could though, so I leave it to Rocky.
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    Quote Originally Posted by discojoe View Post

    That's not a creepy elephant, but a cute one. Only a misanthropic individual would perceive this cutie as creepy.
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Misanthropy is a general dislike, distrust, or hatred of the human species or a disposition to dislike and/or distrust other people.
    That's a distrust of people, not elephants.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    That's a distrust of people, not elephants.
    Have you ever heard of fables? Where is your imagination? At last discojoe seems to have some...
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    So then you do recognize that it was a joke?
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    So then you do recognize that it was a joke?
    I'll post an mp3 the next time, so you can tell by the tone of my voice
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    lol okay
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    It's not punitive at all. It's supposed to be encouraging. There are many situations in which I'd like to encourage people to believe in their own personal power and to take responsibility for their lives. It's supposed to be motivating and inspiring. I could never do that anywhere near as well as an SEE could though, so I leave it to Rocky.
    Stallone is a great guy. I think, despite popular belief, there is a chance that he's an SLI.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Sure... I'd give it a 1% chance.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    Sure... I'd give it a 1% chance.
    .0083% is better. maybe .0084%.

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    Rocky is a great (if not exaggerated) example of a male SEE, and I think Stalone is playing himself in the Rocky movies.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    Sure... I'd give it a 1% chance.


    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    .0083% is better. maybe .0084%.
    Suck cock.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    Rocky is a great (if not exaggerated) example of a male SEE, and I think Stalone is playing himself in the Rocky movies.
    Possibly. But I also think he plays SLI characters in some movies, like in "Cop Land" and some other films were Delta values are prominent. I do think SEE is most likely for him and I wouldn't doubt Te/Fi, but I would keep SLI as an alternative. At least until I find some spare time to do a research.
    Last edited by Park; 09-02-2008 at 02:55 AM.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    Possibly. But I also think he plays SLI characters in some movies, like in "Cop Land" and some other films were Delta values are prominent. I do think SEE is most likely for him and I wouldn't doubt Te/Fi, but I would keep SLI as an alternative. At least until I find some spare time to do a research.
    Aaah, but the difference is that he's "just an actor" in Cop Land, while Rocky Balboa is Stallone's own creation, and imo very obviously as an alter ego.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Aaah, but the difference is that he's "just an actor" in Cop Land, while Rocky Balboa is Stallone's own creation, and imo very obviously as an alter ego.
    Well he's "just an actor" in many Delta movies and appearances then.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    ...
    Last edited by Suomea; 09-28-2008 at 02:21 AM.
    Suomea

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    Vastly overrated.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian Bale View Post
    Vastly overrated.
    What, or who, is vastly overrated? (Punitiveness? Stallone? Rocky Balboa? niffweed?) Be more specific if you want to be understood.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    What, or who, is vastly overrated? (Punitiveness? Stallone? Rocky Balboa? niffweed?) Be more specific if you want to be understood.
    two of the four

    RE: Stallone as SLI or SEE... In Stallone's movies, (particularly the Rocky movies, inc. Rocky Balboa,) the most striking Socionics feature for me is Fi... E.g. the scene in Rocky Balboa where Rocky is speaking in front of the boxing commission about his right to fight regardless of his age... After the commission rejects his application for a license, Rocky gives an impassioned speech that ends with the line, "do the right thing." If someone studying Socionics wants to see Fi manifested, they ought to watch that scene...

    While watching R. Balboa with smccosker, he said to me exactly what Winterpark just wrote, i.e. "I believe that Stallone is SLI." I disagreed w/ him, but i understood why he'd said it... In that movie Stallone seems to waver between two character archetypes, one that could be described as SEE (e.g. his new relationship/scenes at his restaurant/with his son,) and the other as SLI, (getting a dog w/his gf's son/at his dead wife's grave.) There's more Rocky as SEE than Rocky as SLI in Rocky Balboa, but both archetypes are there.

    The overall meaning of R. Balboa, i.e. how to age 'with heart'--is Fi--and given that Stallone wrote the script, (as someone said, Rocky is his alter ego to an extent,) Fi creative seems like a good bet.

    Regardless, I can understand why WP would make the comment.
    Last edited by JuJu; 09-03-2008 at 06:21 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    What, or who, is vastly overrated? (Punitiveness? Stallone? Rocky Balboa? niffweed?) Be more specific if you want to be understood.
    I don't think he wants to be understood, he wants to be unique
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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