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Thread: Greta Garbo

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    machintruc's Avatar
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    Default Greta Garbo



    Despite what most socionists think, I don't think she's LSE.

    She's LIE.

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    I have no idea what other socionists said (btw any links?), but I type her based on her personality - not VI - as SLI. Both LSE and LIE are reaaaly unlikely, she quit a successful career just to waste the time. She was strong and manly indeed, though her initiatives involving others can rather be qualified as caprices than plans, or constructive pursuits. She was not attracted by success and was doing only what she liked, in an uncompromising, cynical and independent manner. She is known for being relatively lonely and alienated from people, no apparent interest in variety and opportunities.

    Quotes:
    "Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening."
    "Being a movie star, and this applies to all of them, means being looked at from every possible direction. You are never left at peace, you're just fair game."
    "I don't want to be a silly temptress. I cannot see any sense in getting dressed up and doing nothing but tempting men in pictures."
    "I want to be alone."
    "If only those who dream about Hollywood knew how difficult it all is."
    "If you are blessed, you are blessed, whether you are married or single."
    "Life would be so wonderful if we only knew what to do with it."
    "My talents fall within definite limitations. I am not as versatile an actress as some think."
    "The story of my life is about back entrances, side doors, secret elevators and other ways of getting in and out of places so that people won't bother me."
    "There are some who want to get married and others who don't. I have never had an impulse to go to the altar. I am a difficult person to lead."
    "There is no one who would have me - I can't cook."
    "There seems to be a law that governs all our actions so I never make plans."
    "Your joys and sorrows. You can never tell them. You cheapen the inside of yourself if you do tell them."
    Shock intuition, diamond logic.
     

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    I have no idea what other socionists said (btw any links?), but I type her based on her personality - not VI - as SLI. Both LSE and LIE are reaaaly unlikely, she quit a successful career just to waste the time. She was strong and manly indeed, though her initiatives involving others can rather be qualified as caprices than plans, or constructive pursuits. She was not attracted by success and was doing only what she liked, in an uncompromising, cynical and independent manner. She is known for being relatively lonely and alienated from people, no apparent interest in variety and opportunities.

    Quotes:
    Her behavior was not mannish or masculine. It was independent. The concept of a function or a trait like independence--which has no tie to how someone urinates--being tied to sex is unfounded.
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    Her behavior was not mannish or masculine. It was independent. The concept of a function or a trait like independence--which has no tie to how someone urinates--being tied to sex is unfounded.
    I did not say she was masculine because of her independence, I read/watched these things in her biographies, I did not made them up. She liked to be boyish and wanted to wear trousers, she was taking over men in kissing scenes, etc.

    Youtube: Greta Garbo Documentary - PART 07 - from min 05:20
    ---

    And masculinity is not only the way one pees, AFAIK.
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    I'm inclined to agree with SLI. Maybe even a reclusive SLE.. her cynicism isn't that different from Brando, if we accept him as SLE. He spent the latter half of his life getting fat on an island, and lost interest in the worth of film.

    edit: lol.. ignore what i said about SLE btw.
    Last edited by stray; 06-08-2011 at 03:20 AM.

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    .
    Last edited by golden; 06-09-2011 at 09:17 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden View Post
    'strapping young boy'
    Whatever it is, it's incredibly hot...and still female to me.

    I like women like her in general. Maybe it's some superego thing. /shrug

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    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    I HATE typing from black and white photos.

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stray View Post
    Whatever it is, it's incredibly hot...and still female to me.

    I like women like her in general. Maybe it's some superego thing. /shrug
    I had a SLI gf - still my longest relationship so far. I can't say she was too masculine, in fact that was not noticeable, though she had some peculiarities which are to be found mainly among men. She liked to drink me and anyone she could under the table, could hang out with anyone, anywhere, enjoyed to do things I was cautious about in order to taunt me or prove they're no biggie, she was most of the time dispassionate, skeptical, hard to impress. She had a compassionate side too, she could not leave a lost kitten or a fallen drunkard behind.

    Btw, after we broke up I once drinked her under the table, haha! Either it happened I was in an unusual good shape that night or she was a bad influence to me while we were together. In fact I'm looking forward to try that again with her...
    ---

    Edit: I had a SLI classmate in the highschool. That one was really a boy, she had a manly stance and look. We were Calling her "Zenga" because of her haircut (like the Italian goalkeeper) . She's not a lesbian, she's married now and everything else.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    I HATE typing from black and white photos.
    Oh, so the color of the neck is equally important as the shape.

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    Aushra said LSE.

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    edited because I don't know what I'm talking about hurp durp.

    Something EJ, ENFj comes to mind but I need to see good candid videos of her.

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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Looked a few clips, and I'm still thinking something like Ni-ENFj. Reminds me of Golden in a way. Someone prove me wrong, please.

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    She's obviously an introvert, idiots. What do you mean, EIE?

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neverthesame View Post
    She's obviously an introvert, idiots. What do you mean, EIE?
    Having that in my book you're an Extrovert (IEE) typing yourself an Introvert, allow me to dispute that you're in the position to question. Social extroversion has nothing to do with Socionics Extroversion.
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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by neverthesame View Post
    She's obviously an introvert, idiots. What do you mean, EIE?
    Having that in my book you're an Extrovert (IEE) typing yourself an Introvert, allow me to dispute that you're in the position to question. Social extroversion has nothing to do with Socionics Extroversion.
    Where in his post did he even imply that's what he was referring to?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Where in his post did he even imply that's what he was referring to?
    Where in my post do I imply I deduced that from her post? I have had discussions with her some time ago on this subject.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Looked a few clips, and I'm still thinking something like Ni-ENFj. Reminds me of Golden in a way. Someone prove me wrong, please.
    Whu .... ?

    You know, when people watch old films, they often tell me that such-and-so female star reminds them of me--a wide range of women from Bette Davis to Ginger Rodgers to Carole Lombard to Katharine Hepburn, and, well, I'm not much like most of those women personality-wise. But there may be something about me that on the surface is "oldtime film actress" in general.

    I've seen most of Garbo's films and read bios of her. Wow, I really don't think she and I are much alike, Galen! IRL she was highly reclusive. This isn't just about social intro- and extraversion; her whole way of dealing with people seems really weird and ... inhumane to me.

    Her face is not very mobile, and she's stoic and "heavy." She's got a kind of bluntness about her, and it doesn't seem like something she can turn off. I'm doubting she's even an ethical type. Also, her eyes, there's something about them I don't identify with--like they're kind of watery to me and I can't read them. Overall, I find her hard to read.

    But ... thanks, lol. (Can I have Marlene Dietrich instead?)
    Last edited by golden; 06-17-2011 at 07:19 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    I HATE typing from black and white photos.
    Maritsa is, ib, referring to the BLOWN OUT or shitty quality of b&w photos.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    I did not say she was masculine because of her independence,
    ok. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    I read/watched these things in her biographies,
    what things? That she tried to be a man? How does one 'try' to be a man? You said it wasn't about independence (see above). So...what, then? It's not about ingesting hormones (biological directions to the body to 'be male'), so I'm assuming clothes or manner, then?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    I did not made them up. She liked to be boyish
    how does one 'like to be boyish?' what? what did she do?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    and wanted to wear trousers,
    Jesus wore a skirt.

    still sexy in his dress: http://www.imdb.com/media/rm2714863872/tt0896529



    cheongsam
    thobe
    kaftan
    kimono
    cassock
    foustanella
    gho
    sarong, pareo, and lavalava
    dhoti and lungi
    mundu
    kilts

    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    she was taking over men in kissing scenes, etc.
    Yes, that's called Pseudo-Aggressor ILI/LIE or Aggressor LSI/SLE or Pseudo-Victim ESI/SEE behavior, and while it may not be your particular cup o' sex to have a woman show her ardor like that, lots of guys find that is hot and sexy.


    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    And masculinity is not only the way one pees, AFAIK.
    You're right, males carry sperm as their gametes. :/ Was that what she was doing?
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    2 EVIL I golden's Avatar
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    Nanashi, Garbo apparently wanted people to see her as masculine, and liked to see herself as masculine, and I don't think anyone here is saying that's a bad thing ... ? Or am I missing something?

    I deleted one of my posts up there because I deleted dozens of my posts, lol. But anyway, I remember reading this about her, and looked it up again. She referred to herself in masculine terms and she knowingly adopted a somewhat masculine image.

    I don't think Bolt/Ineffable is putting Garbo down as unfeminine. She herself rejected things she saw as feminine and probably fettering. She seems to have enjoyed her masculinity. Some other actresses from film's golden age seem to have done this too, and I mentioned a couple of them, Marlene Dietrich and Katharine Hepburn. And further complicating all this is whether in today's terms any of all of these women would have called themselves lesbians, which to me is a different category (sexuality) than gender role. If we put them on the lesbian continuum, at any rate, they would not be at the "nope, not at all lesbian" end.

    I'm tempted to get into some long, overthunk thing about flappers and boyishness, how "masculinity" in a woman of independent means probably was perceived differently in the first half of the 20th century (at least pre-WWII) than it would be today, how recent decades' backlash against feminism has made referring to a woman adopting masculine traits cause kneejerk responses ... but I'll skip it, lol.

    What I DON'T see is how this is type-related, really. I can't take that for granted in the least. I mean, if Garbo reminds me of anyone, it would be more along the lines of Jodie Foster, another intelligent, private, masterful actress who happens to have had a tomboy image and, in today's view of things, identifies as a lesbian. Doesn't mean they have the same Socionics type, or, if they do, that it's truly related to type.

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    I personally think I answered you, nanashi. I'm not interesting in arguing against that hysterical feminist mumb-jumbo. I'm not gonna waste my time to explain to you the psychological differences between men and women, especially because this was not even my initial point (I don't think that's type-related, but reveals details in the context and the big picture). The differences are not easily quantifiable - thing that you know very well unless you lived on Mars - and the psychological dimorphism is too complex to put in few sentences, even in species with an obvious psychological gender difference, that even a child can tell.

    Don't tell me that the difference in behavior of males in most animals (deers, lions, sheep, cickens, gorillas and so on) is nurtured, is there some sort of universal conspiracy dictating them to be more cocky? Did someone ordered every people in prehistory that men should fight wars and hunt while women do whatever women do? No, this is our nature, perhaps the differences will fade with time, but I'm sure your pseudo-intellectual rubbish has no power in changing reality, it is at most a propaganda to make a convention. I can say fine, women are psychologically perfectly identical to men, and remove the arguments regarding this matter from my analysis on GG, does this change anything? If each of us thinks like you do, all we obtain is yet another utopian era in human history, like communism, which will come to an end sooner or later. We are not ourselves, but submit to a ridiculous ideology that claims that men and women are the same. Good luck in your political career and being a man.
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    2 EVIL I golden's Avatar
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    Lol, Ineffable. This thread sounds so very screechy, preachy, and pissy on both sides.

    Come on, people, it's the Great Garbo. She rocked!

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by werlkjlakjeraoiaeswroiaer View Post
    Lol, Ineffable. This thread sounds so very screechy, preachy, and pissy on both sides.
    I'm done with it .

    And btw I agree with what you wrote, both in this post and the other you deleted IIRC, typing-relevant or not. My discussion with nanashi does not involve GG, but nanashi denies the existence of masculinity entirely. It was enough to use "masculine" as a criterion for her to snap on me, regardless of the topic. This is ridiculous and it is based on her neurosis regarding her interactions with males IRL, finding most of them abusive asses (she wrote about it with several ocasions). I hate being dictated what's real by these insecure feminists simply because that's not true, even if I were a female I'd have objected .
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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by werlkjlakjeraoiaeswroiaer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Looked a few clips, and I'm still thinking something like Ni-ENFj. Reminds me of Golden in a way. Someone prove me wrong, please.
    Whu .... ?

    You know, when people watch old films, they often tell me that such-and-so female star reminds them of me--a wide range of women from Bette Davis to Ginger Rodgers to Carole Lombard to Katharine Hepburn, and, well, I'm not much like most of those women personality-wise. But there may be something about me that on the surface is "oldtime film actress" in general.

    I've seen most of Garbo's films and read bios of her. Wow, I really don't think she and I are much alike, Galen! IRL she was highly reclusive. This isn't just about social intro- and extraversion; her whole way of dealing with people seems really weird and ... inhumane to me.

    Her face is not very mobile, and she's stoic and "heavy." She's got a kind of bluntness about her, and it doesn't seem like something she can turn off. I'm doubting she's even an ethical type. Also, her eyes, there's something about them I don't identify with--like they're kind of watery to me and I can't read them. Overall, I find her hard to read.

    But ... thanks, lol. (Can I have Marlene Dietrich instead?)
    Thank you for this, lol. I know it seemed off, but I couldn't really think of anything else for her. Possibly ESTj or something.

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    silke's Avatar
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    I'm beginning to think EII-Fi for her, especially how she's described as highly private and self-involved sometimes to the point of being mean and callous, intense and passionate though though not interpersonally warm, occasionally having disregard for rules and social convention, and considering quotes like this "Your joys and sorrows. You can never tell them. You cheapen the inside of yourself if you do tell them." - this sounds a lot like inert Fi.





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    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    EII



    This is a better VI pic where she looks like me

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    take a second of me sarinana's Avatar
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    The founder of socionics typed her as LSE. End of discussion. I like the sound of her name.
    Sincerely Yours,

    Beyond the clouds. Beyond the sun.

    The Rebel without a cause.

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    Marshmallow Foru-m chriscorey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarinana View Post
    The founder of socionics typed her as LSE. End of discussion. I like the sound of her name.
    I like your avatar.
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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    take a second of me sarinana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chriscorey View Post
    I like your avatar.
    Gypsy is not a location. Thanks.
    Sincerely Yours,

    Beyond the clouds. Beyond the sun.

    The Rebel without a cause.

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    Marshmallow Foru-m chriscorey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarinana View Post
    Gypsy is not a location. Thanks.
    *snuggles you*
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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