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Thread: Let's Try This Again

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Default Let's Try This Again...

    Me: I need stability in my life, and I wish to know what is going on when, but I demand the right/ability to be flexible myself. You all don't want to see my room; in 20 years, I have never developed the self-discipline to keep the darned thing clean. I hate household chores. I hate being told what to do; I would rather be advised, with the final decision left to me. I hate having to assert my authority if I don't have complete control. I'm not usually assertive, and my efficiency, *isn't*; however, I have a tendency to do something my way if I feel it is more efficient (disregarding what someone else would want). My motivation is low (unless it's what I want to do), and to make hard decisions to do something, I may call in someone else to "give me a boost", ie get their opinion to back me up and cement my resolve. I don't tend to pay attention to what's going on around me, and my spatial skills are pretty bad; I tend to hold a hand out as I round a corner so I can feel where it is rather than possibly bump into it. I hate having my intelligence insulted. I prefer one-on-one communication, but a small group's fine in some circumstances. I can cook well, but sometimes I miscalculate and do something wrong. I enjoy categorization to some degree, and I love understanding people. I like passionate people, but I dislike people who come on too strong (emotionally or otherwise). I operate out of my values; I've really had to strain to conform to my parents' after years of passive rebellion, and I still hate it. I have a fast walk. I spend a lot of time in my head, and I love fantasy. I hate confrontation, but I have no problem griping about someone to someone else, nor did I have a problem in adolescence when someone complained to me about someone else. I only take issue with name-calling behind someone's back. I sometimes hold grudges, depending on the offense. I don't plan if I don't have to, and I don't manage time well. I spend a lot of time stuck in the past or worrying about the future. And this is all totally random, I know. I'm not organizing it. I've never been much for conflict, but only recently have I really begun considering other people's feelings. I used to just say whatever without thinking about that what I said could hurt them.

    I TILT easily. Ever seen those pinball machines shut down when rattled? My brain has a tendency to do that when it hits overload; it's like it tries to take the information in and make it fit together, but it can't keep up. It's bad enough that I have friends who will do it to me on purpose, for the fun of it. Also, my morals are somewhere in-between conviction and an ability to see the consequences. If I don't foresee consequences, I do it. Or I refuse to think about the consequences and do it, but I'm capable of thinking about them. Get bitten in the butt that way. I have become mediator-ish, able to consider different sides of an issue, but I've been informed (by my parents) that I wasn't always that way. My organizational skills are present, and I use them to make life easier; this encompasses my e-mail and my files. My physical surroundings tend to be abysmal. My financial skills aren't (existent). I have a frustrating belief not in the goodness of humanity by any means, but in the goodness of people around me (ie they wouldn't lie to me, cheat me, etc). That's cost me, and I've become more cynical over the years. And I'm not totally resistant to being told what to do, by any means. If someone needs me to do something, fine. I can be obliging, and I don't always mind helping. I just don't appreciate others telling me how to live my life. I dislike others having power (ie strong influence) over me, but I don't mind having it over them. If someone's afraid of me (healthily so), that's fine and actually quite amusing. I'm competitive, and I refuse to compete with someone if I'm concerned that I'll lose.

    Me as a kid: I've toned myself down a lot since childhood, because people disapproved of me; I was openly rebellious, good with at least some details, impulsive (more so than now), and good at making friends in random places (grocery store, etc). I also spent time making up stories (I was writing character profiles before age 10) and playing make-believe with my toys. Tact was not my strong point. I was also emotionally expressive, and I was a screamer/squealer.

    Interaction with others:

    Little brother: Don't know his type. He tries to be emotionally manipulative; I dig my heels in and continue to tell him no. He tries to be persistent; I tell him no. He attempts to tell me what to do; I react badly. He's a nice kid, I'm sure; we just have issues. I like him when he's calm.

    Little sister: ISFj. Wonderful kid, IMO. She cooks, she makes stuff...and I'm happy to let her. She's also very giving, and she's pretty compliant. I tease her mercilessly, especially when she's mad (in which case, she's funny) or sad (generally also funny), but I also make sure she knows I love her (I'd hate for her to think otherwise). I try to lift her spirits when she's down, be it through jokes or simple explanation. I think she worries too much.

    Mother: *not sure anymore* She criticizes my lack of motivation/assertiveness, as well as my lack of planning (or sticking to my plans, definitely). She tells me I need to be more responsible, too, and she dislikes my laziness (I hate chores and avoid them when possible, but I also tend to forget about them). We can definitely have fun together. She also pops off to get a reaction from me (because she knows she will).

    Father: Probably ESTj. *grinds teeth* When I was a child, he would show me how to do something faster (or that I could do something faster). Left me with a feeling of incompetence (not on purpose, I know). Still, I think we got along better before I hit adolescence. As an adolescent, he discounted my opinions and attempted to shove his down my throat. Yes, I'm still dealing with resentment from that. He also lectured...I hear that tone in his voice now and, I tune out. Intellectually, we get along fine, unless we get into a heated discussion. I'll tell him off in a heartbeat (which I would with Mom, save the above). He's very analytical and very focused on efficiency. He's also the "how can we take this experience and learn from it?" type. Also, when I explain socionics to him, he asks me, "Where is the practical application?" Intellectually, we get along; we tell each other about cool things we found. However, we're both very stubborn, and I'll go at his throat (metaphorically) over an issue. We seem to have Te/Ti and Te/Fe conflict.

    I had an I_Tp friend last summer who kept me pulled together and took care of the cooking (we were in college). I let him, but sometimes it got kind of annoying (such as when he would prepare my instant oatmeal or offer to help me with something). I'm not helpless. We were quite opposite and complemented each other well. However, he was a lying, charming, manipulative pain in the behind, and I got burned.

    I had an I_T_ friend in high school; I thought we had a lot in common, but apparently, we were quite opposite. I have a memory of closeness. However, the details are fuzzy (that was between Fall '02 and the middle of Spring '04). I was the dominant one, and I was the happier/more energetic one, and a few times, I ran F interference (a couple of times, he asked to me to just in case he felt like pounding someone (he was in a bad mood at the time). He apparently saw me as someone to protect/keep an eye on, though I never knew that until he said something about it. We did a lot of verbal sparring, and there were many jokes about our non-existent relationship. His Si was bad, in my opinion, and he seemed Se-seeking; I think he was INTp, but he may have been ISTj. We fought twice, might have had other little disagreements (can't remember).

    Edited for some details.
    Last edited by Cuddly McFluffles; 09-11-2008 at 12:47 AM.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    your description sounds relatively IEE. and your mother sounds like an Se type.

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    Snomunegot munenori2's Avatar
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    Based on sheer post length, I could go with IEE.
    Moonlight will fall
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    I'd say IEE as well.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    your description sounds relatively IEE. and your mother sounds like an Se type.
    *shrugs* She identifies best with ESFj. She thinks I'm lazy and unmotivated (which I am), and I think she's irrational and berating. Whenever she explodes, I head for my room. Recently, we had a big falling out (partly due to her very much misunderstanding something I said). She thinks I'm bad at life skills (which I am); I think she's immature when it comes to her emotions and sometimes in taking responsibility for her own actions (as opposed to blaming others). Usually, I drive her to distraction, and then she berates me; in return, I act like her explosion doesn't have the slightest effect on me. Of course, heaven forbid I lash out at her. I did once over the phone, and she suddenly talks about how she's going to get off the phone, because she doesn't need this from me. We've been arguing at least since I was 9, and I mean yelling. She'd walk off afterward and apologize to my baby sister for *my* being bad.

    Temperamentwise, we have an EJ-IP dynamic going.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    i still think she sounds like an Se type from your description. how did she come to ESE?

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    I agree, Ryene Astraelis is IEE.

    My impression of your mom is SEI.

    Your dad could be LSE rather than LIE (and it would make more sense if your mom is SEI).
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    I don't feel like I'm Ti PoLR, really. I don't dislike structure in the informational sense; organizing such things makes access easier. A rigid schedule I don't like; being subject to total authority I don't like. I like wiggle room, and I like being able to put my own twist on the instructions I'm given if I so choose.

    My mother was undecided between ISFj and ESFj. She took the STA, and the only thing it could conclusively tell her was that she's an extrovert. She's not ISFp; I went through the strong functions on Filatova's profile, and she said it didn't fit.

    My stepdad identifies pretty well with ENTj, Expat. I can print out ESTj and see what happens. But Si PoLR sounded about right.
    Last edited by Cuddly McFluffles; 08-19-2008 at 02:02 AM.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Austraelis
    Temperament wise we have an EJ-IP thing going
    Interesting. You are actually saying you can see the IP temperament in yourself, yet people are saying that you are EP (with no explanation) and that your mum is not EJ but IP (again, with no explanation) ?

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    Umm. I think you're more likely INFp than ENFp.
    At least you seem more Ip>Ep IMO.
    Your mom, the description is pretty short, but I'd go with ESFj for her too.
    I think ESTj fits your dad better though.


    I have a frustrating belief not in the goodness of humanity by any means, but in the goodness of people around me (ie they wouldn't lie to me, cheat me, etc). That's cost me, and I've become more cynical over the years.
    possibly weak Fi?

    I've never been much for conflict, but only recently have I really begun considering other people's feelings. I used to just say whatever without thinking about that what I said could hurt them.
    sounds like weak, possibly unvalued Fe?

    I was also emotionally expressive, and I was a screamer/squealer.
    umm. emotionally expressive? how?

    I think the first paragraph shows you're intuitive.
    INTp
    sx/sp

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    Quote Originally Posted by munenori2 View Post
    Based on sheer post length, I could go with IEE.
    LOL... man, you make me laugh hard.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    I don't feel like I'm Ti PoLR, really. I don't dislike structure in the informational sense; organizing such things makes access easier. A rigid schedule I don't like; being subject to total authority I don't like. I like wiggle room, and I like being able to put my own twist on the instructions I'm given if I so choose.
    Which is a good description of Te-valuing and low Ti, maybe Ti PoLR.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    My mother was undecided between ISFj and ESFj. She took the STA, and the only thing it could conclusively tell her was that she's an extrovert. She's not ISFp; I went through the strong functions on Filatova's profile, and she said it didn't fit.

    My stepdad identifies pretty well with ENTj, Expat. I can print out ESTj and see what happens. But Si PoLR sounded about right.
    Honestly, I think your descriptions of what they actually are like and how you interact with them and how they interact with each other are more useful than how they relate to descriptions, or test results.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Snomunegot munenori2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterpark View Post
    LOL... man, you make me laugh hard.
    Yeah, I was raised by a pack of wild comedians.
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    Quote Originally Posted by munenori2 View Post
    Yeah, I was raised by a pack of wild comedians.
    that is one of the funniest things i have read in a long time.
    EII; E6(w5)

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mea View Post
    Umm. I think you're more likely INFp than ENFp.
    At least you seem more Ip>Ep IMO.
    Your mom, the description is pretty short, but I'd go with ESFj for her too.
    I think ESTj fits your dad better though.



    possibly weak Fi?


    sounds like weak, possibly unvalued Fe?


    umm. emotionally expressive? how?

    I think the first paragraph shows you're intuitive.
    I identified most with IP. Then I second-guessed myself. I'll have to check out the ESTj thing.

    Fi: I usually give people the benefit of the doubt. However, when my trust is broken, I'm much faster to believe ill about the person.

    Fe: Hm. I thought being concerned with others' feelings was Fi.

    Emotions: I squealed when I laughed. I was pretty energetic. And I was prone to screaming here and there when angry. I also liked playing jokes on my friends, so I was a teasing sort. To this day, I'm good at voice pitching - I'll take it to a certain volume for different purposes, like if i'm getting onto my brother and want my mother to hear me and get onto him, too. Or if I want someone within earshot to hear me.

    I have a bad habit of taking people's words at face value, so I tend to take people too seriously. On the other hand, I tend to joke a lot, make snarky comments, etc.

    Haha....yeah, I'm definitely intuitive.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    So far, my dad thinks ESTj sounds better than ENTj; but he has yet to compare the two.

    One another notem specifically the INFp one...I'm not so sure could be my Dual-seeking function; I hate being told what to do, and if you want me to really like you (provided you're not a jerk, which disqualifies you anyway), all you have to do is feed me. Seriously.

    I have some command of Ti, which shows up here and there; but according to RSV3, this could be due to a high Ne-subtype. I still come out IP, which is odd, given the rest of it.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
    Interesting. You are actually saying you can see the IP temperament in yourself, yet people are saying that you are EP (with no explanation) and that your mum is not EJ but IP (again, with no explanation) ?
    Well, then let them explain. I'm up for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Which is a good description of Te-valuing and low Ti, maybe Ti PoLR.



    Honestly, I think your descriptions of what they actually are like and how you interact with them and how they interact with each other are more useful than how they relate to descriptions, or test results.
    As I mentioned, my dad and I have Te/Ti conflict; I'll be talking theory, and he'll ask me to give him real-life examples. I do if I can. But if I am Delta, why would I be more OK with Ti than he is?

    I'd love to get some Delta and Beta opinions, to see which I sound more like.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    I don't see INFp, or even IP, and not Beta either really.

    I agree with those that point towards IEE.
    INFp

    If your sea chart does not match reality, go with reality (Old mariner saying)



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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    Me: I need stability in my life, and I wish to know what is going on when, but I demand the right/ability to be flexible myself. You all don't want to see my room; in 20 years, I have never developed the self-discipline to keep the darned thing clean. I hate household chores. I hate being told what to do; I would rather be advised, with the final decision left to me. I hate having to assert my authority if I don't have complete control. I'm not usually assertive, and my efficiency, *isn't*; however, I have a tendency to do something my way if I feel it is more efficient (disregarding what someone else would want). My motivation is low (unless it's what I want to do), and to make hard decisions to do something, I may call in someone else to "give me a boost", ie get their opinion to back me up and cement my resolve. I don't tend to pay attention to what's going on around me, and my spatial skills are pretty bad; I tend to hold a hand out as I round a corner so I can feel where it is rather than possibly bump into it. I hate having my intelligence insulted. I prefer one-on-one communication, but a small group's fine in some circumstances. I can cook well, but sometimes I miscalculate and do something wrong. I enjoy categorization to some degree, and I love understanding people. I like passionate people, but I dislike people who come on too strong (emotionally or otherwise). I operate out of my values; I've really had to strain to conform to my parents' after years of passive rebellion, and I still hate it. I have a fast walk. I spend a lot of time in my head, and I love fantasy. I hate confrontation, but I have no problem griping about someone to someone else, nor did I have a problem in adolescence when someone complained to me about someone else. I only take issue with name-calling behind someone's back. I sometimes hold grudges, depending on the offense. I don't plan if I don't have to, and I don't manage time well. I spend a lot of time stuck in the past or worrying about the future. And this is all totally random, I know. I'm not organizing it. I've never been much for conflict, but only recently have I really begun considering other people's feelings. I used to just say whatever without thinking about that what I said could hurt them.

    I TILT easily. Ever seen those pinball machines shut down when rattled? My brain has a tendency to do that when it hits overload; it's like it tries to take the information in and make it fit together, but it can't keep up. It's bad enough that I have friends who will do it to me on purpose, for the fun of it. Also, my morals are somewhere in-between conviction and an ability to see the consequences. If I don't foresee consequences, I do it. Or I refuse to think about the consequences and do it, but I'm capable of thinking about them. Get bitten in the butt that way. I have become mediator-ish, able to consider different sides of an issue, but I've been informed (by my parents) that I wasn't always that way. My organizational skills are present, and I use them to make life easier; this encompasses my e-mail and my files. My physical surroundings tend to be abysmal. My financial skills aren't (existent). I have a frustrating belief not in the goodness of humanity by any means, but in the goodness of people around me (ie they wouldn't lie to me, cheat me, etc). That's cost me, and I've become more cynical over the years. And I'm not totally resistant to being told what to do, by any means. If someone needs me to do something, fine. I can be obliging, and I don't always mind helping. I just don't appreciate others telling me how to live my life. I dislike others having power (ie strong influence) over me, but I don't mind having it over them. If someone's afraid of me (healthily so), that's fine and actually quite amusing. I'm competitive, and I refuse to compete with someone if I'm concerned that I'll lose.

    Me as a kid: I've toned myself down a lot since childhood, because people disapproved of me; I was openly rebellious, good with at least some details, impulsive (more so than now), and good at making friends in random places (grocery store, etc). I also spent time making up stories (I was writing character profiles before age 10) and playing make-believe with my toys. Tact was not my strong point.
    Whoa, are you me..? Am I posting things in my sleep under a different name..? WTF

    From the way you wrote stories/character profiles before the age of 10 to the way you interact with your ESFj Mom--from your competitiveness to your impulsiveness to the tendency of your physical surroundings to be abysmal...

    ENFp for you... Now, be aware Niffweed may suggest Alpha SF, but I wouldn't put much stock in it, as he has a tendency to... Oh, look at that, even Niffweed thinks ENFp... Whoa.

    Consensus is pretty rare around here... But I'll wager (something?) you're Delta.

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JuJu View Post
    Whoa, are you me..? Am I posting things in my sleep under a different name..? WTF

    From the way you wrote stories/character profiles before the age of 10 to the way you interact with your ESFj Mom--from your competitiveness to your impulsiveness to the tendency of your physical surroundings to be abysmal...

    ENFp for you... Now, be aware Niffweed may suggest Alpha SF, but I wouldn't put much stock in it, as he has a tendency to... Oh, look at that, even Niffweed thinks ENFp... Whoa.

    Consensus is pretty rare around here... But I'll wager (something?) you're Delta.
    Haha. Do you know, my best friend is ENFp. We amazed each other back when we met; we were so much like each other it was scary! <3 her.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    As I mentioned, my dad and I have Te/Ti conflict; I'll be talking theory, and he'll ask me to give him real-life examples. I do if I can. But if I am Delta, why would I be more OK with Ti than he is?
    It's difficult to know without witnessing the actual dialogue, but one possibility is that he asks for examples precisely because he thinks that the way you are explaining the theory is not very good Ti. As in "that makes no sense to me, perhaps you could give me some examples so I see what you mean"? That is, it's a sign of him spotting the weak Ti in you.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    It's difficult to know without witnessing the actual dialogue, but one possibility is that he asks for examples precisely because he thinks that the way you are explaining the theory is not very good Ti. As in "that makes no sense to me, perhaps you could give me some examples so I see what you mean"? That is, it's a sign of him spotting the weak Ti in you.
    Ah. Interesting. So you're saying that my inability to easily relate real life to theory is a sign of weak Ti.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    Ah. Interesting. So you're saying that my inability to easily relate real life to theory is a sign of weak Ti.
    More or less. I'm suggesting that maybe what he's spotting is an inconsistent theory, so he prefers to get the "raw data" rather than the theory as you explain it.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Jesus is the cruel sausage consentingadult's Avatar
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    well, with the discussion of Tereg's type behind us, I'm no longer sure if my view of IEEs matches that of classical socionics, but what you (Ryene) are describing most certainly is IEE according to my definitions.
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    More or less. I'm suggesting that maybe what he's spotting is an inconsistent theory, so he prefers to get the "raw data" rather than the theory as you explain it.
    I think it's more of him wanting to know what all the fancy terms mean in English, as it were. And how they relate to him. He's really big on practicality. He asks me how I'm going to make this where people can relate to it in the future and be able to grasp it (I'm a Psych major).
    Johari/Nohari

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    what you (Ryene) are describing most certainly is IEE according to my definitions.
    CA, you are on track with your views about IEEs

    And you're right--Ryene is as IEE as they come... I'll say it again, for those think that I'm, what, ESFj now--I feel like this post very accurately sums up the situations of many IEEs, myself included.

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    Creepy-Cyclops

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    Ryene is a tricky one, I still don't think INFp is out of the question for her

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    well, with the discussion of Tereg's type behind us, I'm no longer sure if my view of IEEs matches that of classical socionics, but what you (Ryene) are describing most certainly is IEE according to my definitions.
    The description she gave is very true to how I see IEE as well, fwiw.
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    Scratch EXTp.

    I just had a long post written up.....and now it's gone. I don't have the energy to do all that explaining again. Anyway, here's me in conflict.

    First situation: guy who likes me and is younger than I am gets offended over an insult to his manhood and (somewhat dramatically) ignores me.

    Two things to say:

    First, I will apologize for yesterday. I didn’t realize you were so sensitive about such things, and I was used to people who weren’t, so I can admit that I made an honest mistake, and I won’t do it again unless you really tick me off.

    Second, grow up. I walk up and you make a show of ignoring me. You’re in high school, not middle school. And furthermore, I was ignorant in that matter. Cut some leeway. It would have been perfectly fine if you had explained what was wrong instead of pulling the crap you did. The many guys I hung out with last year tossed the insult (and worse) around regularly, as did I, and my own was meant in good humor, not to truly tick you off. Realize that, and quit being so immature about this. You won’t talk to me in person, yet you’ll do it online. Make up your mind about this. If it was a discussion of what happened, and it was the only civil way to come about a solution, that would be one thing. But casual conversation, acting like it hadn’t happened? I won’t do it. Heather had told me to apologize profusely if I saw you on last night, but I don’t lie down like that. I will warn you now, boy: I will make my amends once, and you can do with them what you like. If you still choose to be immature, I can tell you where to shove them, even, but if you pull this 7th grade crap with me again, be sure I will lay into you. I won’t put up with it, and if it comes to it, I would rather leave than do so. You can ask Laurie and Danielle if you don’t believe me. I don’t mind having you as a friend, but not if you can’t act your age. If you’re ticked off at me for this, then so be it. I really don’t care. I happen to expect a little more from people, and I’m not afraid to let most know if they’re sorely missing the mark. If it comes to separation, it’ll be little problem to me. I’m used to it by now, and you and I aren’t especially close. Well, you have my position. The rest is your choice.
    Last edited by Cuddly McFluffles; 09-05-2008 at 12:29 AM.
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    Default And Part 2

    2nd situation: Making a looong story very short, i got mad and told off a group of girls. My reply to a couple of the replies I got. More specifics if you ask. Please ignore the italics symbols and such. BTW, these emails are to different people, but about the same situation.

    Girl #1:

    When I first read this e-mail, I thought, well now I can tell Ashley what I have thought about her, but then it occurred to me that I never had anything against you, and to my knowledge, have never made it appear that I did, to you or anyone else. However, now I do. Who the hell do you think you are, trying to act like you know me? I \i never\i0 treat people in ways that are any less than they deserve. No, I have never talked about you, at least not in any way meaner than: "I was talking to Ashley and she said...." As almost anyone can tell you, yes, I do have a best friend (Alycia, remember?), but I have never tried to imitate her. Ask Rachel, or anyone else who has met her, and you'll find out how totally different she and I have always been, which is the way I like things with her. And get your "disloyal, petty" people straight: I'm not immature enough to assume anything from the phrase "I like you."\par

    \i

    Danielle told me you didn't, and I did, for the most part, believe it. I just have learned not to take anything for granted, and I wasn't foolish enough to assume that I'd be free of it forever. People are people, period. As for the friend thing, I said I was told such, and it was from a believable source. So I was wrong about that. Or maybe I wasn't. If I was, I will apologize. And I was joking when I said the last thing you're complaining about. I'm mature, but being around certain people has left my mind in the gutter. I just wanted to make sure that was covered. I don't pretend to know you; I know better. That's why I didn't even attempt to rip apart every aspect of your life. I know what I see, and that is it.\i0 \par

    Oh, and as for me growing out of it? Well, Miss Thing, you're not the only person who has made mistakes in the past. Yes, I hung out with a group of people who actually WERE petty backstabbers who would turn on you at a moment's notice, and I can tell the difference now. Yes, the so-called clique have had our share of problems, but we've \i worked through them\i0 , in a lot mature of a manner than you are handling things now. And speaking of turning on you, what do you call what you're doing RIGHT NOW???\par

    \i I never said I hadn't, and I never will. I didn't mean that part in any way but friendly and helpful. I do believe you're a good person (albeit with a few kinks that need to be worked out), and I won't say otherwise. I turn on people only when it feels that they have turned on either me or a best friend, when they have done something to merit it. As for them not being that way, I'm sorry you may not see that, but you're also one who saw nothing offensive in Becca's letter. You speak of me not knowing you and therefore having no right to criticize you. Pot's rather black, wouldn't you say? If you knew \i0 me\i , you might actually understand why I'm doing this, and why I would again at the drop of a hat. \i0 \par

    Back to an earlier subject, what would make you assume that I would make Megan into my so-called best friend? Or is it just because you were trying to find something that you could criticize in all of us? \par


    \i I don't dig. I simply say. Again, this is what I heard. So I'm going on hearsay. That was a mistake, and I will be mature and \i0 apologize\i . I just happen to believe credible sources that aren't afraid to tell me the truth. I had something to criticize in you anyway. I didn't need to make things up, and that's not the way I am. And again I say, don't accuse me of such without knowing. I don't want to hear it. I realized my mistake and apologized. Be mature and at least back out of that arena. It's not a pretty place to be. \i0\par

    Finally, I would like to remind you that I have nothing whatsoever against Laurie, in fact she is one of the nicest people I have ever known, and I am not exactly eager to cause bad blood between myself and Danielle. I may whine and bitch about her, but I still consider her to be one of my friends, even if she hates my guts. Personally, I think that everyone is blowing this whole damn car thing out of proportion. If she gets it, cool, if she doesn't, too bad. LEAVE IT THE HELL ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!\par

    \i *sighs* You certainly don't make a point of getting yours across. Why didn't you just \i0 say\i that in the first place and let her know that instead of making it seem like you're on their side? She \i0 needs\i supportive friends right now! I have told her similar things myself, except I support her decision. As for your constant bitching, with only that to go by, you certainly seem just the same as them. What do you expect someone like me to think when that's all you do? You talk about her with the rest of them, and about everything! You have an interesting way of caring about her. Yeah, so maybe I seem uptight about all of this. I know what it's like to have so-called friends constantly talk trash about me behind my back, and I won't tolerate it now. I think people deserve better than that, and I don't want to see them hurt like I was. \i0 That\i is why I'm now in this thing. I will \i0 not\i stay out of it when one of my best friends is being hurt. My only guess would be to present your case and apologize after she's cooled down. Maybe she'll be willing to work things out. Or maybe not, if she's like I am. It seems like you were one to complain about her, but my memory is my memory. \par

    Two things I would like to address before I go. First, regardless of what I think of you and what you think of me, if Robinson lays a hand on you, I will still go after his sorry ass. And if something happens to Sara, I am willing to put this aside at least long enough to help. I hope you are as well. I may be a bitch when I'm pissed, but I still retain a sense of honor when it comes to things like this, and that won't change. As for Compet, I'm not going to let this disturb it, and while I generally don't do this, I \i0 expect\i you are mature enough to do the same. Amazingly enough, that's the first time I've put faith in someone in matters like this in a while. No, I don't expect you to feel flattered or anything similar. See you Monday. \i0\par


    Girl #2:

    who the hell are you to talk about something you dont understand? ok i wrote something to danielle that really didnt make any sense but you know what, i was mad. but that doesnt give YOU the right to butt into what our group is fighting about and start saying things like you have. and who the hell are you? i dont know anyone named "ariana". and for your information danielle is being stupid and the fact that you "support" her when so many people, mind you people who also dont know her are thinking that she is stupid for wanting this stupid avalanche, are trying to tell her its not for real and that something is very wrong about the fact that a guy who has an avalanche, which is a new car and he probably hasnt finished paying it off, wants to work something out with danielle whenever she gets a job. heres a news flash for you- HE IS SCAMMING HER AND SHE IS SO SET ON THIS, THAT SHE DOESNT WANT TO LISTEN TO EVEN PARENTS WHO ARE LIKE 20 YEARS OLDER THAN HER AND KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT!(mind you more parents than just one) and you know what in the beginning of all of this we were nice about it, than she started being a bitch about everything and we decided that its not worth talking to her about it. and the fact that she said that our group would fall apart "because she wasnt there" is just a bunch of dog shirt. now that you know the facts that are going on you can just butt out and leave us alone. goodbye and NEVER email me again.\par

    Never e-mail you again? You think I'm going to slink off with my tail between my legs just because some immature sophmore tried to bitch me out? Think again, honey.\par

    I don't \i understand\i0 . \i Don't\i0 make me laugh. No, wait. Too late. Oh, I \i know\i0 the facts. Better than you think. Who do I think I am? Someone who actually cares about her and isn't afraid to say something when she's being hurt. I have \i plenty\i0 of right to do such, more than you do to bitch at her about it. Why? I actually am concerned about and supportive of her. Do these people who don't know her have the whole story? I know of at least one case where the person changed her mind when she heard the truth. As for bringing others into this, I know an eighteen-year-old with a \i very\i0 solid head on his shoulders who agrees with her (want more? I can get them). And I agree with what he asked: It's not your car. Why the hell do you care? If she won't listen, she won't listen. Who's more hardheaded, the one who won't listen, or the one ignores the first's unwillingness? If it doesn't work out, then she's a better person for it, and she will learn from it. About the story: save your breath. I have no use for hot air anyway. So because you were mad, you're allowed to make no sense. I was pissed, which doesn't happen often, and I was still clear on what my problem was. I presented my case instead of immature shit. Her not being there won't make it fall apart, and I doubt she said such. More than likely you assumed it. I \i agree\i0 that something like that is doomed to fail. Butt out. Lean a little closer, will you, that way it gets through your thick head? \i Like hell\i0 . I'll be in this as long as I need to be. You can't figure out who I am? Heh... \i sucks to be you.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Sorry for the triple post.

    I should add that as a kid, I was loud, bouncing-off-the-wall energetic, bossy, and openly challenging. And prone to screaming. In adolescence, I loved picking on people - not in a way of being mean so much as amusing myself. I also like being in a position of power (not responsibility) over some people - like guys. Fun when they're afraid of me.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    Ryene, honestly, whatever type you are, I am... We're so similar, it's blown at least half my mind...

    What did you decide? INFp or ENFp?

    (My Mom is chillin here and she believes, after having read the type/subtype descriptions, that I'm Fe-INFp.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by JuJu View Post
    Ryene, honestly, whatever type you are, I am... We're so similar, it's blown at least half my mind...

    What did you decide? INFp or ENFp?

    (My Mom is chillin here and she believes, after having read the type/subtype descriptions, that I'm Fe-INFp.)
    Actually, I'm looking at ES_p now.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wittmont View Post
    I don't see INFp, or even IP, and not Beta either really.

    I agree with those that point towards IEE.
    Seconded. With caveat that both IEE and IEI are cluttery types.
    (It's more an N-first thing.)
    socio: INFp - IEI
    ennea: 4w5 sp/sx

    **********

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Twain
    Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we'.

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    Creepy-Cyclops

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    Always shown Se valueing in my interactions, used to think INFp, money now on ESTp - ESFp

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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    Someone please explain the discrepancies between IEE and EIE, because throughout a lot of that I was thinking there were many EIE tendencies there. So what is it about EIEs that RA doesn't do? Or about IEEs that RA does?
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    Scratch EXTp.

    I just had a long post written up.....and now it's gone. I don't have the energy to do all that explaining again. Anyway, here's me in conflict.

    First situation: guy who likes me and is younger than I am gets offended over an insult to his manhood and (somewhat dramatically) ignores me.
    I know this isn't about me although I feel like putting things in perspective.

    Two things to say:

    First, I will apologize for yesterday. I didn’t realize you were so sensitive about such things, and I was used to people who weren’t, so I can admit that I made an honest mistake, and I won’t do it again unless you really tick me off.
    You apologise, yet you're still really pissed off

    Second, grow up. I walk up and you make a show of ignoring me. You’re in high school, not middle school. And furthermore, I was ignorant in that matter. Cut some leeway. It would have been perfectly fine if you had explained what was wrong instead of pulling the crap you did. The many guys I hung out with last year tossed the insult (and worse) around regularly, as did I, and my own was meant in good humor, not to truly tick you off. Realize that, and quit being so immature about this. You won’t talk


    You're the one that's pissed off.

    to me in person, yet you’ll do it online. Make up your mind about this. If it was a discussion of what happened, and it was the only civil way to come about a solution, that would be one thing. But casual conversation, acting like it hadn’t happened? I won’t do it. Heather had told me to apologize profusely if I saw you on last night, but I don’t lie down like that. I will warn you now, boy: I will make my amends once, and you can do with them what you like. If you still choose to be immature, I can tell you where to shove them, even, but if
    Woah.

    you pull this 7th grade crap with me again, be sure I will lay into you. I won’t put up with it, and if it comes to it, I would rather leave than do so. You can ask Laurie and Danielle if you don’t believe me. I don’t mind having you as a friend, but not if you can’t act your age. If you’re ticked off at me for this, then so be it. I really don’t care. I happen to expect a little more from people, and I’m not afraid to let most know if they’re sorely missing the mark. If it comes to separation, it’ll be little problem to me. I’m used to it by now, and you and I aren’t especially close. Well, you have my position. The rest is your choice.
    Have you ever considered councelling?

    I dont' know about you, but I've had people suddenly lash out at me, with huge long complaining vents.

    I haven't really done anything wrong. But they just want to throw all their problems at me. And then they tell me that it's not really about me. And, it's like, I've already noticed that.

    It used to happen to me when people seemed to lose control of situations, and then want to suddenly decide that I was the one that had tipped them off balance. I was the guilty one. The one that had caused thier bad reaction.

    No, it's you that's done it. And yes, you're look like you're out of control. And no, I'm not going to rebut.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio View Post
    I know this isn't about me although I feel like putting things in perspective.



    You apologise, yet you're still really pissed off



    You're the one that's pissed off.



    Woah.



    Have you ever considered councelling?

    I dont' know about you, but I've had people suddenly lash out at me, with huge long complaining vents.

    I haven't really done anything wrong. But they just want to throw all their problems at me. And then they tell me that it's not really about me. And, it's like, I've already noticed that.

    It used to happen to me when people seemed to lose control of situations, and then want to suddenly decide that I was the one that had tipped them off balance. I was the guilty one. The one that had caused thier bad reaction.

    No, it's you that's done it. And yes, you're look like you're out of control. And no, I'm not going to rebut.
    *shrugs* I don't see any point in rebutting this myself. It was 5 1/2 years ago.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    Someone please explain the discrepancies between IEE and EIE, because throughout a lot of that I was thinking there were many EIE tendencies there. So what is it about EIEs that RA doesn't do? Or about IEEs that RA does?
    Some things about EIE really fit me. And some things absolutely don't.
    Johari/Nohari

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