S/N split

[discojoe]

Does Socionics officially "allow" this sort of balance? My Ne and Se are both very strong, and it seems like I favor both equally when considering new ideas, or making decisions. I kind of try to balance possibility with practicality, and use Ti to analyze the information, while Se and Ne are used to see the information.

Does this work?

[Gilly]

I've noticed that my Si is fairly strong (possibly a result of playing sports), but it's not quite as imminent as your Se sounds. And it never, ever presides over Ne when it comes to making decisions/considering options.

This rings a bell less in terms of S/N for me, and more in terms of T/F. I feel like I balance them when I make decisions: I take into account what the most logical thing to do is (i.e., what makes the most sense), but I also weigh how it will affect other people; I almost never make a decision without using both, and when I do, it's using only T, simply because I know that some situations are better off kept impersonal.

I'd say my functions, in order of strength, go something like this:

[discojoe]

Having strong Ti may have allowed me to detach enough to see the benefits of N and S without any great discomfort.

[Gilly]

That makes sense. I think having strong Ti is also what prevents you from seeing my Ti, because (perhaps) you feel the need to make yourself the meterstick by which you measure others.

[discojoe]

That makes sense. I think having strong Ti is also what prevents you from seeing my Ti, because (perhaps) you feel the need to make yourself the meterstick by which you measure others.

Most definitely.

[Gilly]

Actually, I want to change that.



Now that I think about it, I can't really recall any instance in which I've consciously used or .

[Raver]

I'd say my functions, in order of strength, go something like this:

That contradicts everything in socionics and MBTI.

I'm not saying your wrong, but people like you is what makes me skeptical of the ordering and how it works. It's a lot more complicated then it appears in my opinion.

That order seems ENTP to me anyways, your introverted feeling is your 6th function making it almost impossible to be ENFP. It looks like your an ENTP that developed your introverted sensing.

[discojoe]

Actually, I want to change that.



Now that I think about it, I can't really recall any instance in which I've consciously used or .

My consciously strong functions appear to be:



These functions feel weaker most of the time, although does tend to pop out when I am feeling happy.



Also, Se is very empowering. When I get into Se mode I feel like I am rational, realistic, and able to actually achieve what I want. It's also good for sex.

[discojoe]

Okay, I now officially have NO IDEA (kinda) what type I am.

Everything that fits me in bold, and I am being very anal about this, not picking any old thing that sounds remotely like me. These are things I actually exhibit most of the time:

ESTps generally have either slim figures or firm and solid figures. Slim ESTps have slow and phlegmatic movements, giving the impression of calmness and self-confidence. Females often have a fragile appearance. Solid ESTps have free and flexible movements. When standing in one place they tend to wriggle rhythmically as if they have a slight electric current running through them.

Their eyebrows are often asymmetrical. When ESTps want to show their dissatisfaction they frown as if they are angry. Older ESTps often become puffy and swollen around the eyes. They also have a tendency to squint. Their noses are usually quite wide at the base and their jaws are also large and square. They may have thick, immobile lips, making their speech somewhat garbled.

ESTps rarely wear eye-catching clothes. They try to maintain a neutral style of clothes, steering away from fashion. Females prefer not to wear very bright or colourful clothing. Males have an inclination to official styles of clothing such as suits etc. ESTps generally prefer to remain in the shadows.

When in conversation, ESTps always show self-restraint and tact. They generally interact in an open and friendly manner, always showing positive emotions. They do not like to openly express their opinions. During interaction ESTps always try to show that they are paying full attention and that they understand their interlocutor very well. One of the ways they do this is by asking many questions concerning personal problems or opinions. They do this with masterful tact and delicacy, therefore gaining other peoples trust very quickly.

ESTps have a very characteristic way of behaving when in conversation. They can pause for long periods of time before replying to questions or statements. This can give the impression that they are assimilating the received information. In situations such as these they usually squint. ESTps are never afraid to show others that they did not understand or do not know something and therefore never hesitate ask people to repeat or to specify what they said. ESTps enjoy showing their understanding and like to explain things to others. They always do this slowly and methodically giving simple, practical examples. They also prefer to have the last word in conversations, concluding the dialogue themselves.

When in confrontation, ESTps quickly focus on their opponents weaknesses, usually destroying them with one perfectly placed phrase. If this opportunity does not manifest itself, they have the skills to provoke the reaction they desire. ESTps are very slow to anger. And when they do become angered it is very difficult for them to calm down. They like games that require quick thinking and tactics and often win these games as they have great skill misleading and provoking their opponents into making bad moves.

ESTps have cast-iron self-control and nearly always achieve their goals. If required they can step on anyone or anything often ignoring ethics completely if the situation calls for it. If a project becomes too big and difficult for them to control by themselves, they will delegate the less important parts of the project, giving others complete independence to make their own decisions. ESTps do not care much how people achieve results. They give others complete independence to choose their own method of working, as they consider the end result to be more important.

ESTps are very tactically minded and know how to adapt to changing situations very quickly. They know how to arrange people according to their abilities and usefulness. They prefer to adopt an informal and unofficial leadership. They also do not like doing their own dirty work. ESTps are hard working and extremely persevering people. The more obstacles they meet the more obvious these qualities become. They do not react well to unchallenging situations. They truly come alive in the face of adversity. ESTps are inclined to give ultimatums.

Lol.

ENTps normally have a long, slim figure. Other parts of the body are also stretched, especially the legs and fingers. They often have rounded shoulders. Sometimes ENTps have a characteristic inwardly sloping chin. Because of their particular physical structure their clothes always seem to fit pretty badly, often slipping down and hanging off them in an unflattering manner. Their buttons also seem to have a habit of falling off.

ENTps usually have a distant, far away look in their eyes and it often seems as though they are paying little attention to what is going on. During conversation ENTps like to play with objects, like a pen for example, often accidentally breaking it. They may gesticulate when passionately telling a story.

ENTps do not know how to keep the right psychological distance with people. This becomes especially noticeable during long term interaction. One day they can be friendly and the next day they can be completely opposite. They often behave unceremoniously and can rudely butt in on others conversations. ENTps can also find it difficult to evaluate how others feel about them and therefore can make mistakes when choosing friends.

ENTps like to explore everything and are usually completely unaware of how others react to this. They often propose ideas that although have great potential are completely impractical at the time. As usual, they soon forget about that idea and generate a new one, which has no less potential and originality but has no logical connection with the previous. ENTps pay little or no respect to their past achievements. They hardly ever admit when they are at fault. Even if they apologise formally they usually continue to behave the same as before.

ENTps are interested in and talk about everything that is new and unusual even if it is not in their main field of knowledge. It is as if they are magnetised by all brand new theories and are fascinated by all phenomena that can not be explained with logic or reason, for example: ESP, telekinesis and UFO's. They cannot logically explain their ideas as they are always intuitive and vague. Most people cannot fully comprehend their concepts, they simply believe or do not believe.

The main peculiarity of ENTps behaviour is an incredible absent-mindedness. They usually leave items where they used them and have a tendency to constantly lose smaller objects. ENTps work place and personal belongings are often kept in disarray. They invariably forget what they have already done and what they need to do. However, they are quick and shrewd in day to day matters, taking advantage of every opportunity that arises. Because of this others may consider them to be crafty or shifty.

The other main peculiarity of ENTps behaviour is the ability to mobilise in extreme conditions. If somebody puts pressure on them they immediately counterattack, often with more than equal force. They also like to give people advice on how to extricate themselves from difficult entanglements, often proposing the most radical solutions. If ENTps are not interested in a particular job, they try to leave it until the last moment. Then in very short period of time they can complete all awaiting jobs, but of course the quality suffers.

One more peculiarity is the element of chaos and destruction that ENTps bring to every field of their activity. This is especially noticeable in well established institutions where strong discipline is commonplace. However, they implement this chaotic element creatively, generating reform from the destruction. Because of this quality ENTps often become leaders.

Wtf. I mean, I'm *pretty sure* I"m ENTp, but these correlations are annoying. For some reason I feel like I want closure here, but perhaps the feeling is misplaced. I mean, at the end of the day, I'm just me.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Creepy-aurora_faerie]

Okay, I now officially have NO IDEA (kinda) what type I am.

Everything that fits me in bold, and I am being very anal about this, not picking any old thing that sounds remotely like me. These are things I actually exhibit most of the time:

ESTps generally have either slim figures or firm and solid figures. Slim ESTps have slow and phlegmatic movements, giving the impression of calmness and self-confidence. Females often have a fragile appearance. Solid ESTps have free and flexible movements. When standing in one place they tend to wriggle rhythmically as if they have a slight electric current running through them.

Their eyebrows are often asymmetrical. When ESTps want to show their dissatisfaction they frown as if they are angry. Older ESTps often become puffy and swollen around the eyes. They also have a tendency to squint. Their noses are usually quite wide at the base and their jaws are also large and square. They may have thick, immobile lips, making their speech somewhat garbled.

ESTps rarely wear eye-catching clothes. They try to maintain a neutral style of clothes, steering away from fashion. Females prefer not to wear very bright or colourful clothing. Males have an inclination to official styles of clothing such as suits etc. ESTps generally prefer to remain in the shadows.

When in conversation, ESTps always show self-restraint and tact. They generally interact in an open and friendly manner, always showing positive emotions. They do not like to openly express their opinions. During interaction ESTps always try to show that they are paying full attention and that they understand their interlocutor very well. One of the ways they do this is by asking many questions concerning personal problems or opinions. They do this with masterful tact and delicacy, therefore gaining other peoples trust very quickly.

ESTps have a very characteristic way of behaving when in conversation. They can pause for long periods of time before replying to questions or statements. This can give the impression that they are assimilating the received information. In situations such as these they usually squint. ESTps are never afraid to show others that they did not understand or do not know something and therefore never hesitate ask people to repeat or to specify what they said. ESTps enjoy showing their understanding and like to explain things to others. They always do this slowly and methodically giving simple, practical examples. They also prefer to have the last word in conversations, concluding the dialogue themselves.

When in confrontation, ESTps quickly focus on their opponents weaknesses, usually destroying them with one perfectly placed phrase. If this opportunity does not manifest itself, they have the skills to provoke the reaction they desire. ESTps are very slow to anger. And when they do become angered it is very difficult for them to calm down. They like games that require quick thinking and tactics and often win these games as they have great skill misleading and provoking their opponents into making bad moves.

ESTps have cast-iron self-control and nearly always achieve their goals. If required they can step on anyone or anything often ignoring ethics completely if the situation calls for it. If a project becomes too big and difficult for them to control by themselves, they will delegate the less important parts of the project, giving others complete independence to make their own decisions. ESTps do not care much how people achieve results. They give others complete independence to choose their own method of working, as they consider the end result to be more important.

ESTps are very tactically minded and know how to adapt to changing situations very quickly. They know how to arrange people according to their abilities and usefulness. They prefer to adopt an informal and unofficial leadership. They also do not like doing their own dirty work. ESTps are hard working and extremely persevering people. The more obstacles they meet the more obvious these qualities become. They do not react well to unchallenging situations. They truly come alive in the face of adversity. ESTps are inclined to give ultimatums.

Lol.

ENTps normally have a long, slim figure. Other parts of the body are also stretched, especially the legs and fingers. They often have rounded shoulders. Sometimes ENTps have a characteristic inwardly sloping chin. Because of their particular physical structure their clothes always seem to fit pretty badly, often slipping down and hanging off them in an unflattering manner. Their buttons also seem to have a habit of falling off.

ENTps usually have a distant, far away look in their eyes and it often seems as though they are paying little attention to what is going on. During conversation ENTps like to play with objects, like a pen for example, often accidentally breaking it. They may gesticulate when passionately telling a story.

ENTps do not know how to keep the right psychological distance with people. This becomes especially noticeable during long term interaction. One day they can be friendly and the next day they can be completely opposite. They often behave unceremoniously and can rudely butt in on others conversations. ENTps can also find it difficult to evaluate how others feel about them and therefore can make mistakes when choosing friends.

ENTps like to explore everything and are usually completely unaware of how others react to this. They often propose ideas that although have great potential are completely impractical at the time. As usual, they soon forget about that idea and generate a new one, which has no less potential and originality but has no logical connection with the previous. ENTps pay little or no respect to their past achievements. They hardly ever admit when they are at fault. Even if they apologise formally they usually continue to behave the same as before.

ENTps are interested in and talk about everything that is new and unusual even if it is not in their main field of knowledge. It is as if they are magnetised by all brand new theories and are fascinated by all phenomena that can not be explained with logic or reason, for example: ESP, telekinesis and UFO's. They cannot logically explain their ideas as they are always intuitive and vague. Most people cannot fully comprehend their concepts, they simply believe or do not believe.

The main peculiarity of ENTps behaviour is an incredible absent-mindedness. They usually leave items where they used them and have a tendency to constantly lose smaller objects. ENTps work place and personal belongings are often kept in disarray. They invariably forget what they have already done and what they need to do. However, they are quick and shrewd in day to day matters, taking advantage of every opportunity that arises. Because of this others may consider them to be crafty or shifty.

The other main peculiarity of ENTps behaviour is the ability to mobilise in extreme conditions. If somebody puts pressure on them they immediately counterattack, often with more than equal force. They also like to give people advice on how to extricate themselves from difficult entanglements, often proposing the most radical solutions. If ENTps are not interested in a particular job, they try to leave it until the last moment. Then in very short period of time they can complete all awaiting jobs, but of course the quality suffers.

One more peculiarity is the element of chaos and destruction that ENTps bring to every field of their activity. This is especially noticeable in well established institutions where strong discipline is commonplace. However, they implement this chaotic element creatively, generating reform from the destruction. Because of this quality ENTps often become leaders.

Wtf. I mean, I'm *pretty sure* I"m ENTp, but these correlations are annoying. For some reason I feel like I want closure here, but perhaps the feeling is misplaced. I mean, at the end of the day, I'm just me.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Creepy-]

You're in trouble if you're an ESTp, discojoe, after the crap you gave Rocky about being a Sensor

Ditto Herzy about strength/order of functions.

This is how I perceive the order of strongest functions to be:

- maybe with the and swapped around depending on my mood etc.

But it's probably more like this because I perceive some functions as "weak" because I don't use them consciously (and can't use them consciously), also I think I'm over-confident in so in reality it's probably more like:



However, in terms of most consciously realised it follows model A pretty much to the letter:

[Creepy-]

Actually, I want to change that.



Now that I think about it, I can't really recall any instance in which I've consciously used or .

Also, Se is very empowering. When I get into Se mode I feel like I am rational, realistic, and able to actually achieve what I want. It's also good for sex.

Do you have repeating cycles of rising and falling Se tha form synusoid-alike pattern?

That's what happens to me, the sensation is exactly the one you describe.

[FDG]

The person above it's me.

[Joy]

honey you're very much ENTp

[FDG]

I know I have some ENTp traits, but the ENTj description fits me perfectly.

[Joy]

that was @ discojoe

[FDG]

ahahahha, sorry.

[Creepy-heathiep]

honey you're very much ENTp

yay yay, you are very much a 3-4 paragraph stereotype. awesome! you win! you win!

[Gilly]

Do you have repeating cycles of rising and falling Se tha form synusoid-alike pattern?

This person is definitely a ******.

[Gilly]

honey you're very much ENTp

I'm with Joy on this one. You'd be more even-tempered if you were an ESTp, like Heath.

[discojoe]

Whatever. I feel like I am growing out of Socionics. I don't really care anymore.

[Joy]

how very ENTp

[discojoe]

honey you're very much ENTp

I'm with Joy on this one. You'd be more even-tempered if you were an ESTp, like Heath.

You are such an idiot.

[discojoe]

how very ENTp

Yeah, lol.

[Creepy-aurora_faerie]

I dunno. You seem to fit the ESTp descriptions I've read but you don't seem very similar to my dad.

???

[Creepy-heathiep]

discojoe you are nuts. completely mindblowing, completely indecphirable.

[Gilly]

honey you're very much ENTp

I'm with Joy on this one. You'd be more even-tempered if you were an ESTp, like Heath.

You are such an idiot.

...right.

[Creepy-Jimbean.]

I'm the same way. The ESTp description fits me the best, and I also think it has something to do with Ti. Its like I can stratigize with Ne and go on the attact with Se. my behavoir is more like an ENTj or ESTp than anything else. I still think I'm an ENTp though.

[Joy]

I am more like ENFp and ENTj than anything else, but am definitely an ENTp.

[Gilly]

No you're not.

[Joy]

then what am I?

[Gilly]

You're an ESFj. Dur.

[Joy]

If you can convince me I'm an ESFj, I'll shave my head and join the military and eat nothing but pickles and black licorice for the rest of my life.

[Angel von Himmel]

I think it would be more likely that joy would be an ENFj than ESFj ...

[Gilly]

Actually, I can see Joy as a Beta.

[Joy]

if I'm an ENFj why do they scare me so much?

[Gilly]

Delete por favor. Double post.

[Gilly]

Because you're so much like them. Plus you're not as self-righteous: you're an intuitive subtype.

[Joy]

no, they really scare me. there is an actual physical response in me when they get all ... it's quite traumatizing... soooo embarassing

they make me uncomfortable... and it's quite obvious that I get along best with alphas