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Thread: Differences between EII-INFj and SLI-ISTp

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    Default Differences between EII-INFj and SLI-ISTp

    Has someone ever had difficulty identifying between EII and SLI types ? In what ways are they similar and/or different ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ali View Post
    Has someone ever had difficulty identifying between EII and SLI types ? In what ways are they similar and/or different ?
    They are both very different... Though, I can see how it might be confusing for someone to distinguish between the two in certain situations, like in some type of moral discussion, or conversations involving general comfort, health, etc. But again, they are still significantly different.

    SLI usually have a pluralistic sense of the "good" or the "bad," often not taking the individual into account in the moral philosophy they may have. I believe there are certain levels, or stages, in the simultaneous development of Ne and Fi. If my understanding of this is correct, I would say that there is a direct relationship between the development of these two functions and the further realization of the importance of the individual as a moral philosophy. If you were to compare an SLI and EII at the same developmental stage of their lives, you would see a difference in this area. For example, if you are talking about war, you might get an opinion by an SLI involving the massive destruction of the "bad" people, without seeing it relevant that there might be innocent people among them, which is something that might be more readily observed by an EII. Another example would be in terms of universalizing personal inclinations. I would say that SLI do this significantly more than EIIs, in assuming something common sense they are feeling or thinking about is shared by everyone else, or that it is the universal "truth." It's the openminded factor that is different between the two types.

    I would say the most noticeable difference however is in the temperament, even though they may show signs from both, but never for an extended period. On a personal note, I can definitely see myself being more structured mentally than SLIs (nothing to do with intelligence though). I even have a few clear "cannons" that apply to anyone whom I would consider close, which when violated bother me to no end. One of them is punctuality, in that if you tell me something is going to happen at a certain time, you have to follow through, THE END. Someone leaving me hanging is a big deal to me. I have yet to meet an SLI that places as much importance to this as I do, more towards other areas which I can't think of now.

    Well, I hope this helps somewhat.

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    Thankyou - I think those are good pointers. I also like what slacker mom pointed out on another thread.

    Si, which causes SLIs to have a relaxed pace and not like to be pushed, is a strong and valued function in SLIs and a weak but valued function in EIIs. So for SLIs it comes naturally, but in EIIs it isn't something they can easily attain themselves. But both value that.

    Also, from what I've seen, EIIs don't seem to mind making decisions for others if the issue is important to them. I don't think other people's issues are of much importance to SLI's in most cases. EIIs have strong Fi and Ne, which makes them sometimes see what would be good decisions for others, but SLIs aren't strong in those areas.
    My friend is clearly an EII. It was in the area of of relationships which had me confused. I've read a lot of descriptions of how an SLI would behave in a relationship, from the hot-cold/pushing-pulling, keeping at a distance, needing time and space when everything is going okay, to not verbal expressing feelings with ease, being clueless to someone else's hints as well as closing down (or going cold?) on instances. My friend has displayed all these in his relationships. Particularly the one with an ENFP sort of spot on the description of an ISTP/ENFP duality (or the difficulties faced in them !).
    (note, could this have to do with temprament change in nf nf relationships according to keirsey theory - http://look.net/success/NF )

    My question is, are all these typical of EII behavior in relationships (or possibly in the cases where the inter-type relationship is of large-psychological distance)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ali View Post
    I've read a lot of descriptions of how an SLI would behave in a relationship, from the hot-cold/pushing-pulling, keeping at a distance, needing time and space when everything is going okay, to not verbal expressing feelings with ease, being clueless to someone else's hints as well as closing down (or going cold?) on instances.
    Why do we do this? It drives me and everyone around me crazy and I can't rationalize why I do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
    Why do we do this? It drives me and everyone around me crazy and I can't rationalize why I do it.
    I can't speak for ISTps but i think it comes down to the ISTp feeling emotional secure around the other person. My brother does this to almost everyone but not to me (when he's not in a "mood" that is - then he's just plain mean to EVERYONE )
    n00bIEE

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ali View Post
    Thankyou - I think those are good pointers. I also like what slacker mom pointed out on another thread.



    My friend is clearly an EII. It was in the area of of relationships which had me confused. I've read a lot of descriptions of how an SLI would behave in a relationship, from the hot-cold/pushing-pulling, keeping at a distance, needing time and space when everything is going okay, to not verbal expressing feelings with ease, being clueless to someone else's hints as well as closing down (or going cold?) on instances. My friend has displayed all these in his relationships. Particularly the one with an ENFP sort of spot on the description of an ISTP/ENFP duality (or the difficulties faced in them !).
    (note, could this have to do with temprament change in nf nf relationships according to keirsey theory - http://look.net/success/NF )

    My question is, are all these typical of EII behavior in relationships (or possibly in the cases where the inter-type relationship is of large-psychological distance)
    Emotional overload is a factor that can cause that want for distance, and I don't consider it a bad thing. I actually see it as a good thing, because you might be getting overwhelmed of the amount of good things happening and you want to look at it from a distance almost, or simply take things a little slower. Interactions with people have a considerable affect on my conscience, and when things get closer it can be too much to handle without losing some kind of identity or personality almost.

    I think the problem actually in situations where someone maintains a distance is not knowing or understanding the reason(s) for it. Considering that it can lead someone to believe in not so nice things about why I'm doing it, I would see it as the other person having the right to ask or comment about it and expect a truthful answer. For some people they might find it hard to believe that keeping a distance is not a bad thing, which I guess might be the issue with SLIs in those cases. Maybe they don't even expect people to believe they have a good reason for it, because they might not even believe it themselves if someone did it to them (might be cheating or other activities). Things like this become an issue when there isn't enough faith or trust, which I see it as incredibly hard to gain nowadays, even might seem naive. I see it as incredibly difficult for people to be able to reach high levels of trust now, considering how it's always juicier and more intertaining (even cooler somehow) to be entertained on tv/movies with stories of promiscuity, deception, and "eat your cake and still have it," and morality supposedly making people dull and boring. This is just my perception.

    Yeah, and based on that link I'm definitely NF.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sereno View Post
    SLI usually have a pluralistic sense (...) and the further realization of the importance of the individual as a moral philosophy. (...) you might get an opinion by an SLI involving the massive destruction of the "bad" people, without seeing it relevant that there might be innocent people among them (...) universalizing personal inclinations. I would say that SLI do this significantly more than EIIs, in assuming something common sense they are feeling or thinking about is shared by everyone else, or that it is the universal "truth."
    @Sereno:

    That's Ti. Socionics is sometimes misleading, because thoughts can only be produced by the introverted functions; it's a basic concept of the Jungian theory. Fi and Ti are both logical functions and the difference can be understood using the set theory. Fi is about handling subsets and Ti about handling supersets.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    @Sereno:

    That's Ti. Socionics is sometimes misleading, because thoughts can only be produced by the introverted functions; it's a basic concept of the Jungian theory. Fi and Ti are both logical functions and the difference can be understood using the set theory. Fi is about handling subsets and Ti about handling supersets.
    I wouldn't know much about that though, but what I mentioned at least is a perception of mine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sereno View Post
    SLI usually have a pluralistic sense of the "good" or the "bad," often not taking the individual into account in the moral philosophy they may have.
    I don't think they really have a sense of good and bad like that, they would probably want a better situation and would do anything that effectively got to that situation (including ignoring some of the moral implications of getting).

    I think they would be perfectly capable of supporting seriously dangerous people with money etc. just so they wouldn't cause more trouble.

    It's all about the direct end effect, with the possibility of ignoring the other stuff (i.e. people).

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    @Sereno:

    That's Ti. Socionics is sometimes misleading, because thoughts can only be produced by the introverted functions; it's a basic concept of the Jungian theory. Fi and Ti are both logical functions and the difference can be understood using the set theory. Fi is about handling subsets and Ti about handling supersets.
    could you explain this? I'm familiar with set theory but am struggling to make the connection

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    @Sereno:

    That's Ti. Socionics is sometimes misleading, because thoughts can only be produced by the introverted functions; it's a basic concept of the Jungian theory. Fi and Ti are both logical functions and the difference can be understood using the set theory. Fi is about handling subsets and Ti about handling supersets.
    @ mikemex

    That's Ti.
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    Quote Originally Posted by leckysupport View Post
    I don't think they really have a sense of good and bad like that, they would probably want a better situation and would do anything that effectively got to that situation (including ignoring some of the moral implications of getting).

    I think they would be perfectly capable of supporting seriously dangerous people with money etc. just so they wouldn't cause more trouble.

    It's all about the direct end effect, with the possibility of ignoring the other stuff (i.e. people).
    The last sentence you wrote is what I meant, ignoring the people factor sometimes, which I assume EIIs don't do as often.

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