My Case for EIE-Ni cp6w7

[Gilly]

Yes this is a repeated topic of discussion. Yes I probably should have figured this bullshit out by now. No, I don't care, so please keep snide remarks to yourself or I will likely do my best to rip you a new one.



Starters

I am definitely intuitive beyond any fragment of doubt that I can see. I seem to most to appear extraverted (although I'm still not entirely sure what that means coming from most people). I obviously value Fe.

My closest friend is an EIE-Fe, my longest standing friend is an IEI-Ni, and most, if not all, of my closest friends are Betas, and are consistently guaged by my parents as "bad influences" (little do they know I'M the worst influence, lmao) or "too risky" (despite the fact that I am by far the riskiest personality in each and every circle I enter, teehee).



Details

What most people notice about me on webcam is Fe. I can discuss intellectual matters, but they are almost always interspersed with random commentary or attempts to lighten the mood. I also tend to put on "shows" when nothing else is going on.

I tend to take things to the extreme, which seems to be a Beta tendency.

I have identified with Ezra from day one of his being here, and I think he is almost definitely SLE -Ti, especially after having had more experience as of late with two people of this type at my work.

I have serious problems with detailed administrative bullshit; it just makes me feel anxious. From the time I was little, the thing that overwhelmed me the most about growing up was the idea of paying bills and taxes.

I take a very systematic Ti approach to Si matters: I enjoy cooking, but I have most of my meals planned out and delegated ahead of time, or at least have simple food groups worked out when I shop so that I know I will have one of each for every meal. I take reasonable care of my health, but for example with dental matters, I have to ensure that I brush AND floss AND use mouthwash every day or else I fall into a bad pattern that I usually don't bother climbing out of until I have some kind of revelation that I am doing poorly or I have some serious consequence.

My mother and I are very similar in temperament in the LITERAL sense (non-socionics related) and tend to have what I think of as territorial conflicts: we try to do the same things different ways.
My father and I have very similar ideals, but extremely different personalities and preferences and.



My Idols/Role Models:

My Dad - EII most likely
My Paternal Grandmother - most likely IEI
My Maternal Grandfather - ESFx
My Maternal Grandmother - most likely SLE-Ti
Marilyn Manson - probably EIE cp6w7
Anthony Keidas - probably IEI
Robin Williams - ESE, Fe subtype
Eminem - probably IEI cp6w7
Bob Marley - probably EIE or IEI
George Bush - he's just the man, duh



Characters I identify with and/or admire:

Narcissus from Narcissus and Goldmund - 6w7, probably EIE
Don Juan - definitely EIE
Ged from the Earthsea Trilogy - probably EIE or LIE, seems 6w7
Han Solo - probably SLE or SEE, definitely 7
Howl from Howl's Moving Castle - definitely Beta NF, IMO
V from V for Vendetta - probably EIE (ESI is total and complete bullshit)
George Jung as portrayed in Blow - probably EIE
The Mad Hatter - probably Beta NF
Will Hunting - probably ILE, LIE, or SLE, seems like a cp6
Max from Pi - 5w4, probably ILI?


People who Tend to Piss Me Off With Prolonged Interaction

My brother-in-law - ESE-Si
My Dad - EII-Fi
My Mom - LSE-Si
thehotelambush - LII-Ne (right?)



People With Whom I have Positive Interactions or Impressions That I Deem To Be In Part Related to Type

Ezra - SLE-Ti IMO
discojoe - Beta or Gamma Rational type, IMO
Tanehem - ILI-Te
Maria - IMO Gamma SF, LSI, or ILI (confession: my foundation for SLI was subjectively geared towards my thoughts on my own type and our interactions...kindof like these typings of her, so whatever, think what you like)
Jessica - IMO LSI-Se ("I like big muscles and gambling and getting smashed" - Se+Fe or WHAT?)
Allie - ILE or SLE Ti subtype, IMO
strrrng/Nick - IEI-Ni
krae - IEI-Ni



Personal Enneagram Shit

I have a deep need for approval that I feel has not been provided by the male figures in my life; I am only recently coming to terms with how deep this runs. I think my laid-back attitude and desire for comfort can mostly be chalked up to 6 growth to 9. I exhibit obvious traits of 6 disintegration to 3. I have some traits of 7 disintegration to 1 and growth to 5 that are all Ti related.



Notes

I will add more to this. I am tired of debating this over and over again and I want to make a case so strong that every time I have doubts I can come back and reassure myself that I am in the right place. I'm sick of worrying about this bullshit while I'm working and trying to relax and enjoy some other activity because it's causing me a fuckload of anxiety and I need to have it resolved.

FUCK SOCIONICS I WANT TO GET THIS OVER WITH

It is internally stressed, frequent doubts and fluctuations are experienced, because of what it is sufficiently variable in its solutions.

[Joy]

George Bush?

[Gilly]

Joke?

[Joy]

Joke.

[Gilly]

I think there's also something to be said for the fact that I have considered every Beta type at some point or another, the only real exception being LSI (although, admittedly, it has crossed my mind), while on the Alpha side of things, ILE is the only type I could coherently entertain.

[Gilly]

lmfao

[Kim]

So if it's not Ne, why do you and I get along? And how come we have misinterpreted out positive interaction as based on Ne for so long?

I don't buy it.

[Ms. Kensington]

yes i think the clearest thing about you to me, even if i havent chatted with you in a while, is a preference for Fe. I think more than a few times it appears to be something you take for granted, and don't really back up logically when in arguments with Te/Fi types.

Other than that I considered you ENTp, but you always VI'ed differently to me. Very pretty, you.

[Gilly]

1. I am strong in Ne
2. We are both decent people
3. My family values Ne highly so I guess I have probably "learned to be Ne" in some ways, as it would seem to be the Delta value that is most accessible to me.

[Gilly]

Why thank you.

[ScarlettLux]

=[ I am saddened that I am not on Gilly's list of forum members with whom he has had good interaction/vibes with/from.

You are now my identical!

[implied]

i'm really considering EIE for you.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Kim]

You know, I was just thinking that yours and my interactions were kind of similar to mine and Kristiina's - where we were at each other's throats and butting heads for awhile, pretty vicious, but are now fine (at least I think we are, lol). It's like with both of you we had to get all of that over with first in order to deal with and understand each other better.

That's interesting. My interaction with Gilly could not be more different than that with Kristiina...

[UDP]

i'm really considering EIE for you.

I can see it somewhat. But is he rational?

I still get more of an alpha vibe from him. I don't see beta elitism that I easily get from ENFjs. Gilly seems more carefree and fun-loving.


But I am not sure. He is clearly Fe valuing, yes.

[Nexus]

The Mad Hatter - probably Beta NF

How would you type Alice, the Queen of Hearts, the Caterpillar, the Dodo Bird, the Chesire Cat, the Doormouse, the March Hare, the White Rabbit, the Doorknob, etc?

"But I don't like to go among mad people..."

[Gilly]

You know, I was just thinking that yours and my interactions were kind of similar to mine and Kristiina's - where we were at each other's throats and butting heads for awhile, pretty vicious, but are now fine (at least I think we are, lol). It's like with both of you we had to get all of that over with first in order to deal with and understand each other better.

I'm over it I guess we did have to just "get it out," but hell, learn from the past, right?

I'm the same way with my mother, actually; if we don't have a good all-out-get-out shouting match once in a while, things start feeling off

[Gilly]

I can see it somewhat. But is he rational?

I still get more of an alpha vibe from him. I don't see beta elitism that I easily get from ENFjs. Gilly seems more carefree and fun-loving.


But I am not sure. He is clearly Fe valuing, yes.

Eh, I don't have any super-elitist tendencies but I certainly have in the past, especially on intellectual issues and somewhat with my druggy circles.

[Gilly]

I can see it somewhat. But is he rational?

I still get more of an alpha vibe from him. I don't see beta elitism that I easily get from ENFjs. Gilly seems more carefree and fun-loving.


But I am not sure. He is clearly Fe valuing, yes.

Yeah, rationality is the only thing about EIE I can't see in myself, but you know what, I don't really care at this point Enough has been said about Fe dominants that contradicts "rationality" that I think I'm comfortable taking the j (lowercase as it is). Besides, I'm most likely Ni subtype, which could explain it.

How would you type Alice, the Queen of Hearts, the Caterpillar, the Dodo Bird, the Chesire Cat, the Doormouse, the March Hare, the White Rabbit, the Doorknob, etc?

"But I don't like to go among mad people..."

I have no idea, honestly, but the role of the Hatter certainly seems to be that of an EIE: his eccentric behavior, his "holding court" with his little ritual (the tea party), wearing outrageous clothing, asking nonsensical riddles, etc. And he left the tag on his hat; if that's not Si PoLR then I don't know what is

Maybe he Hare could be IEI? I dunno, in our analogy my SEI friend was the Hare, an SEE girl was Alice, and I believe an LII guy was the caterpillar.

I dunno, look for yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Hatter

[Expat]

Yeah, rationality is the only thing about EIE I can't see in myself, but you know what, I don't really care at this point Enough has been said about Fe dominants that contradicts "rationality" that I think I'm comfortable taking the j (lowercase as it is). Besides, I'm most likely Ni subtype, which could explain it.

Actually, this is something that I think may need a major re-think generally. I have seen people who are to me very obvious EIEs looking too much at the "irrationality" thing and being encouraged at doing so by others, so we have Beta NFs being typed as ENFp.

[Gilly]

Indeed. I'd say about half of the EIEs I know would certainly test as irrational given any set of relevant questions, even looking at things like Rick's website's definitions of rat/irrat.

[Expat]

Also, speaking as the only (?) person who met you: I was never skeptical of your arguments for Beta generally; what I was skeptical about was SLE in particular. I always saw EIE as a plausible type.

[Gilly]

You remain the only forum member to have met me, and were rightly skeptical of SLE as a plausible type for me

A question for a fellow person with a family of the opposing quadra: did your parents usually dislike or distrust your friends?

[Expat]

A question for a fellow person with a family of the opposing quadra: did your parents usually dislike or distrust your friends?

That's difficult for me to say, since my parents never had much contact with my friends. Which is, of course, significant. Usually I never really felt the need, or the desire, to bring friends into contact with my parents.

[strrrng]

Gilly, Gilly, what are you thinking?? I can see where you're coming from with the whole charisma stuff and whatnot, but it just doesn't seem like a strong enough case. What I'm wondering is how you think your main focus is on Ni when you couldn't understand the descriptions Ashton and I were giving of it on stickam. I find it very hard to believe that an Ni-ENFj would Ti the shit out of the descriptions we gave in the manner that you did. Instead of getting a dynamic feel for what we were saying, you took a systems perspective, and generally crystallized each concept presented to fit it into a framework. And you don't have the sense of control to be EJ - you're too fun lol.

Personal Enneagram Shit

I have a deep need for approval that I feel has not been provided by the male figures in my life; I am only recently coming to terms with how deep this runs. I think my laid-back attitude and desire for comfort can mostly be chalked up to 6 growth to 9. I exhibit obvious traits of 6 disintegration to 3. I have some traits of 7 disintegration to 1 and growth to 5 that are all Ti related.

This is correct.

[Gilly]

Actually my so-called "charisma" is one of the things that goes against EIE, in my mind. I'm fairly formal with people I don't know and soforth; the only people who get the explosive, silly, charming me are people who have gotten to know me at least somewhat.

Your descriptions were contrived bullshit to the max, and sounded more like Ne than anything. Ashton is known here for his outlandish interpretation of Ni as some kind of "universal intuition, gut instinct, blah blah blah." You're free to not think of me as an Ni type; your buttbuddy certainly doesn't. I actually have a very clear understanding of what Ni is, both in terms of the IM definition and how it manifests; a reclusive lunatic and a clueless prepubescent boy aren't about to shake it.

And why wouldn't an EIE use Ti when dealing with intellectual matters? I certainly have no experience that points to the contrary, and I don't see the theory disagreeing either.

This is correct.

Oh, wow, I wasn't aware that you were in a position to say so. Thanks for the "validation," jackass.

[strrrng]

No one said an ENFj wouldn't use Ti. I said they wouldn't use it as much as you. Also, you're childish insults only proved how much of a counter-phobic six you really are ("so" as well), as the littlest thing seems to shake up your whole sense of reality. So stop bullshitting and make a post when you're more than 50% certain of your type.

And why wouldn't an EIE use Ti when dealing with intellectual matters? I certainly have no experience that points to the contrary, and I don't see the theory disagreeing either.

funny guy lol

[Gilly]

Let's everyone give Nick a great big round of applause for falling right in line with my prediction!

Now if you'll kindly shut the fuck up and take your flaming disguised as critical input elsewhere, the rest of the world can go on existing in relative non-disgrace. You clearly have no purpose here other than to boost your own flimsy self-esteem by pointing out the insecurities that I'm actually being CANDID about, so take your emotional baggage elsewhere you parasitic scum.

[strrrng]

Let's everyone give Nick a great big round of applause for falling right in line with my prediction!

Now if you'll kindly shut the fuck up and take your flaming disguised as critical input elsewhere, the rest of the world can go on existing in relative non-disgrace. You clearly have no purpose here other than to boost your own flimsy self-esteem by pointing out the insecurities that I'm actually being CANDID about, so take your emotional baggage elsewhere you parasitic scum.

Translation: Gilly propagating his external image (his only sense of self) by claiming to have made a prediction about my behavior, which I coincidentally accorded with.

And don't talk about flimsy self-esteem

[Gilly]

I've already admitted to mine. But I guess by continuing to post here you're doing the same.

*high five*

[Kim]

What I'm wondering is how you think your main focus is on Ni when you couldn't understand the descriptions Ashton and I were giving of it on stickam. I find it very hard to believe that an Ni-ENFj would Ti the shit out of the descriptions we gave in the manner that you did. Instead of getting a dynamic feel for what we were saying, you took a systems perspective, and generally crystallized each concept presented to fit it into a framework.

Perhaps Ashton and others have forced people to do this because of the repeated propagation that "only Ni people can understand the magical nature of Ni." Ni-valuing types who do not buy into Ni as the function that gives a selected few insights into realities that will always be inaccessible to others would seem inclined to deconstruct that argument and therefore take a Ti approach.

Originally Posted by Gilly
I can't see a valuing type actively pursuing leadership roles the way I do. Whenever I'm in a small group of my peers, I'm always inclined to take the lead and "direct traffic," as I say: I like telling people what to do and seeing it done. I'm not really big on forcing stuff on people unless it's for a very specific reason, because I hate bullies in general and loathe seeing myself as one (even though it's a role I'm compensatorily tempted to lapse into sometimes), but if it has to happen, hey, it has to happen, and when there's a reason for it, I like making it happen.

I don't see why Ne-types wouldn't actively pursue leadership roles. If nothing else, Ne-types don't want to have people in charge who cannot see alternatives, so they jump in and take over themselves (at least I do). The motivation might be different than a beta motivation though.

Edited to add: Gilly, my interaction with you is so different than my interaction with Kristiina that I have a hard time seeing you as the same type.

[strrrng]

I've already admitted to mine. But I guess by continuing to post here you're doing the same.

*high five*

A simple interpretation at best.

Did I ever claim to be completely secure? No. My response was basically pointing out what you were doing. If you want to debate insecurities, this thread is not the proper place.

[Gilly]

Do you have any idea what the word "grace" means, Nick?

[Gilly]

Kristiina and I are very different people and come from very different backgrounds. I don't imagine she grew up with Deltas. Is it really a difference that you can't imagine these things blurring in some way?

[Kim]

Kristiina and I are very different people and come from very different backgrounds. I don't imagine she grew up with Deltas. Is it really a difference that you can't imagine these things blurring in some way?

I honestly can't. I would be curious to hear what you think you both have in common.

[strrrng]

Do you have any idea what the word "grace" means, Nick?

grace = me shadow boxing (?)

[ScarlettLux]

I feel very different from Kriistina too.

[implied]

why do you think you need an ISTj dual? other than obviously needing to be slapped into reality or whatever as auvi has mentioned.

[UDP]

why do you think you need an ISTj dual? other than obviously needing to be slapped into reality or whatever as auvi has mentioned.

When he was naked on cam that one time, he was slapping his own ass with a rigor that could possibly explain Se HA.......

However, I'd have to see more to know for sure.
The matter is whether or not it was done in a playful, alpha nature.
(Yes, I am a booty-smack connoisseur)

[implied]

quoted for archival purposes

lol