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Thread: Introverted Intuition

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    Default Introverted Intuition

    Could someone explain to me the nature of Ni? This has to be the most elusive function for me. I'm not really sure what it amounts to.

    Jason

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    It's not about time, foresight, being a prophet or having a feeling of impending doom.

    It's about seeing the essence of things, making intangible connections within fields, tracking underlying activity and patterns, formulating abstract images to summarize the gestalt of ideas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    It's not about time, foresight, being a prophet or having a feeling of impending doom.
    All these things are related to Ni, even if a bit exaggerated.

    It's about seeing the essence of things, making intangible connections within fields, tracking underlying activity and patterns, formulating abstract images to summarize the gestalt of ideas.
    Seeing the essence of things is really Ne (qualities that persist over time rather than evolve), but the rest is all good stuff. "tracking underlying activity and patterns" is a good example of how an Ni ego person might describe it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    It's not about time, foresight, being a prophet or having a feeling of impending doom.

    It's about seeing the essence of things, making intangible connections within fields, tracking underlying activity and patterns, formulating abstract images to summarize the gestalt of ideas.
    +1. Sounds right!

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    All these things are related to Ni, even if a bit exaggerated.



    Seeing the essence of things is really Ne (qualities that persist over time rather than evolve), but the rest is all good stuff. "tracking underlying activity and patterns" is a good example of how an Ni ego person might describe it.
    i agree.

    i think the original description is likely to be recognizable to all intuitives.

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    It's not about time, foresight, being a prophet or having a feeling of impending doom.

    It's about seeing the essence of things, making intangible connections within fields, tracking underlying activity and patterns, formulating abstract images to summarize the gestalt of ideas.
    according to your definition, those are all things i do naturally, including the first things.

    i believe there are different kinds of essences. one an Ne version, one an Ni version. so, semantics can get in the way of understanding.... Ni is an INNER essence, while Ne is an OVERALL essence. sound right?

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    again, people, let's stop focusing on stupid reifications like calling a psychic function "time" or "foresight". It's about what the function does. wtf do you think? all Ni people sit around at home making predictions about the future, waiting for some Se person to come in and save the day with their magnificent willpower? Give me a break. Move past the stereotypes or don't bother responding lol.

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    Additionally, Ne does not see the essence like Ni does. It can formulate a perceptive picture of something, sure; but it is always based off of data that is outside of the subject (hence objects)...Ni people have an inherent "seeing" about them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    again, people, let's stop focusing on stupid reifications like calling a psychic function "time" or "foresight". It's about what the function does. wtf do you think? all Ni people sit around at home making predictions about the future, waiting for some Se person to come in and save the day with their magnificent willpower? Give me a break. Move past the stereotypes or don't bother responding lol.
    i don't see what you are so upset about actually.

    the inner essence of time and predictions and such that i "see" as my inner knowing tells ME WHAT TO TAKE ACTION on. i don't wait for someone else to come along with Se. i use my own will to do what my Ni knows and tells me to do. MY inner knowing is MY inner knowing to take action on. another's is theirs to take action on or not.

    maybe this is the Ni/Se combo working together is in a different way than an Ni dom or even ego?

    off to dr for son, talk later. love

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    Quote Originally Posted by dbmmama
    according to your definition, those are all things i do naturally, including the first things.

    i believe there are different kinds of essences. one an Ne version, one an Ni version. so, semantics can get in the way of understanding.... Ni is an INNER essence, while Ne is an OVERALL essence. sound right?
    whether you do those things or not is irrelevant; they do not in any way describe what Ni is.

    I generally agree with your second statement.

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    whether you do those things or not is irrelevant; they do not in any way describe what Ni is.

    I generally agree with your second statement.
    ok, gotcha.

    here is my definition of Ni, from wherever it is coming from in me, my type:

    the inner essence, current, flow, timelessness, spacelessness, where everything exists and nothing exists. it runs in and through everything physical as well as beyond the outer reaches of our imagination, which to me is not imagination at all. that "place" is just as real as my fingers on this keyboard, if not more real. that is why i never thought i had an imagination. what some others perceive as such is a main aspect of reality to me.

    one thing about me is that i have felt compelled to bring awareness of that "place" into my physical reality, to manifest FROM it.

    my "imagination" (Ni) tells me what to take action on (Se) in an expressive way, using my emotions (Fe) and when i stop the flow to analyze it (Ti) i get sidetracked from my "purpose." which happens/has happened too often. i am happiest in the listening and expressing and doing state.

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    @strrring:
    Take these Ni aspect definitions and accept them as truth.

    Ni = the ordering of events in either objective (universal) or relative time.

    +Ni = relative time, such as the following of a set of instructions, or personal experience of an event. Also, the arrangement of energies into an organized process, such as the arrangement of sound into music.

    -Ni = objective time which is shared by everyone and is independent of the subject. The history of time and space.

    The "intangible" aspect of Ni isn't Ni proper, but is its relationship to Ne. Every moment consists of the actualization of Ne potential.

    EDIT: check that, I just remembered that Ni role and vulnerable are both abstract, therefore Ni superego types may consider it intangible. Actually, Ni leading types probably pay much much more attention to the relationship between Ni and Ne than does myself as an LII.
    Last edited by tcaudilllg; 05-30-2008 at 08:13 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dbmmama
    the inner essence, current, flow, timelessness, spacelessness, where everything exists and nothing exists. it runs in and through everything physical as well as beyond the outer reaches of our imagination, which to me is not imagination at all. that "place" is just as real as my fingers on this keyboard, if not more real. that is why i never thought i had an imagination. what some others perceive as such is a main aspect of reality to me.
    It is accurate in a general sense, but it sounds more like a meditative state - which I know all of you "classical" socionics enthusiasts love to believe Ni is lol - than an actual mode of information processing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    I don't think that the description that I posted (which is "classical" socionics), has anything to do with being in a meditative state.
    Meditation may have something to do with concentrating on how a given function influences its dual. Any meditators around?

    I admit to not really concentrating on how Ti shapes Fe. It's a general scientific principle not to concentrate on how knowledge may be applied for purposes of ethics, although admittedly that's probably an excuse made in defense of T reluctance to understand how it affects F.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    I don't think that the description that I posted (which is "classical" socionics), has anything to do with being in a meditative state.
    i feel the same as you glamourama. my awareness and being is not a meditative state. it is...it is...and information is processing in the ISness....for me, it is a constant awareness, i don't have to meditate to be "in it." i am it

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    Beneath the surface, not immediately apparent, or abstract connections between events.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    Seeing the essence of things is really Ne (qualities that persist over time rather than evolve), but the rest is all good stuff. "tracking underlying activity and patterns" is a good example of how an Ni ego person might describe it.
    yes, I was going to ask whether that was Ni or Ne.

    Quote Originally Posted by dbmmama View Post
    i believe there are different kinds of essences. one an Ne version, one an Ni version. so, semantics can get in the way of understanding.... Ni is an INNER essence, while Ne is an OVERALL essence. sound right?
    I don't think I understand - what's the difference between inner essence and overall essence?

    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    Additionally, Ne does not see the essence like Ni does. It can formulate a perceptive picture of something, sure; but it is always based off of data that is outside of the subject (hence objects)...Ni people have an inherent "seeing" about them.
    you said "the essence of things" - doesn't that suggest objects rather than fields?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    Beneath the surface, not immediately apparent, or abstract connections between events.
    So "events" (as opposed to things?) is where the "dynamics" part comes into it?

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    btw, the only reason that Ni was ever connected to "time" is because for individuals with Ni in their ego block there is often a focus on the past or the future.

    The "underlying" connections in events I spoke of occur in the present as well though, so it's not good to focus on "time" in one's definition or personal understanding of Ni.
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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothere View Post
    So "events" (as opposed to things?) is where the "dynamics" part comes into it?
    Static: state
    Dynamic: activity

    "Events" is just the term I used to describe that activity.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    btw, the only reason that Ni was ever connected to "time" is because for individuals with Ni in their ego block there is often a focus on the past or the future.

    The "underlying" connections in events I spoke of occur in the present as well though, so it's not good to focus on "time" in one's definition or personal understanding of Ni.
    ah well i thought it was because time is a good example of a dynamic medium for events to take place, for the kinds of connections Ni makes, like logic is a good example of the kinds of connections that Ti makes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothere View Post
    I don't think I understand - what's the difference between inner essence and overall essence?



    you said "the essence of things" - doesn't that suggest objects rather than fields?
    this is how it makes sense to me. the Ni field is a metaphysical realm that goes beyond, in, through, over, under, out of, all encompassing, it is BEYOND. it has nothing to do with the physical world in and of itself. that is why it is Inner essence.

    where Ne is overall essence because it takes into account connections with other things or what have you.

    a person's inner essence is their soul and beyond......the field beyond, including imagination, flow, rhythm, stuff that is beyond words even.

    a person's overall essence is the "thing" that is a combination of potential "things" coming together to make a whole of a person, an overall "theme" of a person, including personality type, upbringing, psychological makeup, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothere
    you said "the essence of things" - doesn't that suggest objects rather than fields?
    lol, another case of misconstrued semantics...

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    lol, another case of misconstrued semantics...
    yeah you can also control those with your words. i feel the need to point out its not other people's fault that they dont know what you mean

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    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    lol, another case of misconstrued semantics...
    please explain what you meant then, because what you said about Ne not being able to perceive the essence of things in the same way as Ni was very vague and did not clarify anything for me at all:

    "but it is always based off of data that is outside of the subject (hence objects)..." - isn't this what it should be based off?

    "Ni people have an inherent "seeing" about them." - what does that mean?

    @Ms. Kensington - if Ni was connected to time in that way (time is a dynamic medium for events to take place), then couldn't Si also be connected to time in the same way, as it is also concerned with the dynamics of fields?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothere View Post
    please explain what you meant then, because what you said about Ne not being able to perceive the essence of things in the same way as Ni was very vague and did not clarify anything for me at all:

    "but it is always based off of data that is outside of the subject (hence objects)..." - isn't this what it should be based off?

    "Ni people have an inherent "seeing" about them." - what does that mean?

    @Ms. Kensington - if Ni was connected to time in that way (time is a dynamic medium for events to take place), then couldn't Si also be connected to time in the same way, as it is also concerned with the dynamics of fields?
    "Things" didn't mean objects in his sentence. It more meant everything/anything/situations/whatever.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    "Things" didn't mean objects in his sentence. It more meant everything/anything/situations/whatever.
    in that case it still includes objects, and my question still holds as to how Ni sees the essence of "things" differently to Ne

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    Ne sees the things, Ni sees the connections between the stuff that the things are doing.

    It's actually a lot easier to compare Si to Ni and Se to Ne than it is to compare Ne to Ni, because they're a lot less similar.
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    I don't think I understand - what's the difference between inner essence and overall essence?
    i think the overall essence is herbal.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunshine Lively View Post
    i think the overall essence is herbal.
    calgon, take me away!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dbmmama View Post
    calgon, take me away!
    hehehhe

    ILE

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    Something I associate with Ni that's perhaps more tangible is movement and anticipation (=seeing potential in movement). I'm constantly aware of how people move about, their mannerisms, their pace,... It doesn't really take any conscious effort. I often don't pay much attention to it at all, don't judge people on it, don't categorise, don't rationalise it. I think this is part of the reason why I sometimes have difficulty putting things into words, i.e. my brain just seems to register experiences of motion, not some rationalisation of it. I know/remember the feel, but often lack the words to express it. Knowing a person, I can anticipate how he'll react in a certain situation, but it takes me quite a bit longer to tell you what kind of a person he is for instance.

    When randomly walking around I can usually tell where we are, but my explanation for it will sound something like, well, we went so and so and so (hands waving), and, oh, we also went there, so actually we are now here probably, see?

    Another example is that I seem to keep track of where people are. Whatever I'm doing you can ask me where someone is in the house and I can often make quite an accurate guess, because I heard someone swiftly racing up the stairs and he's the only one doing that so he must be in his room.

    I can tell when someone or something is suddenly acting different or in a way I haven't seen before, even some subtle details like eye movement or fingers or whatever. If something's off here, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

    Something else entirely is that I have a habit of unscrewing pens to see how the mechanism works. There's probably some Ti in this and I think taking things apart is usually associated with Ti, but I'm not really focused on the parts themselves and how they fit together. I'm more focused on what happens when you press the button. What rotates and how. Where exactly do two parts hit each other to cause a click etc.

    It can be more abstract too. When writing software, but even more so when debugging code, I seem to understand a computer program in terms of motion and behaviour and I can find the cause of chaotic/buggy behaviour rather quickly. I'm much better at this than at conceiving some design or structure for a new program.

    I also noticed I seem to measure distance in terms of time it would take at a certain speed.

    Hmmm, ok, that's it for now. I'll add more when I think of it. I think most of this is Ni, but perhaps more Ni-Fe-Ti. If not, I got my type wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mm View Post
    Something I associate with Ni that's perhaps more tangible is movement and anticipation (=seeing potential in movement). I'm constantly aware of how people move about, their mannerisms, their pace,... It doesn't really take any conscious effort. I often don't pay much attention to it at all, don't judge people on it, don't categorise, don't rationalise it. I think this is part of the reason why I sometimes have difficulty putting things into words, i.e. my brain just seems to register experiences of motion, not some rationalisation of it. I know/remember the feel, but often lack the words to express it. Knowing a person, I can anticipate how he'll react in a certain situation, but it takes me quite a bit longer to tell you what kind of a person he is for instance.

    When randomly walking around I can usually tell where we are, but my explanation for it will sound something like, well, we went so and so and so (hands waving), and, oh, we also went there, so actually we are now here probably, see?

    Another example is that I seem to keep track of where people are. Whatever I'm doing you can ask me where someone is in the house and I can often make quite an accurate guess, because I heard someone swiftly racing up the stairs and he's the only one doing that so he must be in his room.

    I can tell when someone or something is suddenly acting different or in a way I haven't seen before, even some subtle details like eye movement or fingers or whatever. If something's off here, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

    Something else entirely is that I have a habit of unscrewing pens to see how the mechanism works. There's probably some Ti in this and I think taking things apart is usually associated with Ti, but I'm not really focused on the parts themselves and how they fit together. I'm more focused on what happens when you press the button. What rotates and how. Where exactly do two parts hit each other to cause a click etc.

    It can be more abstract too. When writing software, but even more so when debugging code, I seem to understand a computer program in terms of motion and behaviour and I can find the cause of chaotic/buggy behaviour rather quickly. I'm much better at this than at conceiving some design or structure for a new program.

    I also noticed I seem to measure distance in terms of time it would take at a certain speed.

    Hmmm, ok, that's it for now. I'll add more when I think of it. I think most of this is Ni, but perhaps more Ni-Fe-Ti. If not, I got my type wrong.
    excellent, excellent! sorry, i don't if that is Ni-Fe-Ti either but it is sure what is going on with me too! yes, it IS SO HARD to put words to! thank you!

    your sig doesn't mention your type, what do you think it is?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mm View Post
    Something I associate with Ni that's perhaps more tangible is movement and anticipation (=seeing potential in movement). I'm constantly aware of how people move about, their mannerisms, their pace,... It doesn't really take any conscious effort. I often don't pay much attention to it at all, don't judge people on it, don't categorise, don't rationalise it. I think this is part of the reason why I sometimes have difficulty putting things into words, i.e. my brain just seems to register experiences of motion, not some rationalisation of it. I know/remember the feel, but often lack the words to express it. Knowing a person, I can anticipate how he'll react in a certain situation, but it takes me quite a bit longer to tell you what kind of a person he is for instance.

    When randomly walking around I can usually tell where we are, but my explanation for it will sound something like, well, we went so and so and so (hands waving), and, oh, we also went there, so actually we are now here probably, see?

    I can tell when someone or something is suddenly acting different or in a way I haven't seen before, even some subtle details like eye movement or fingers or whatever. If something's off here, it sticks out like a sore thumb.
    These are the parts that I identify with from your post (second and third quoted paragraph more strongly). The other parts, not at all. But I'm not sure about my type either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mm View Post
    Something I associate with Ni that's perhaps more tangible is movement and anticipation (=seeing potential in movement). I'm constantly aware of how people move about, their mannerisms, their pace,... It doesn't really take any conscious effort. I often don't pay much attention to it at all, don't judge people on it, don't categorise, don't rationalise it. I think this is part of the reason why I sometimes have difficulty putting things into words, i.e. my brain just seems to register experiences of motion, not some rationalisation of it. I know/remember the feel, but often lack the words to express it. Knowing a person, I can anticipate how he'll react in a certain situation, but it takes me quite a bit longer to tell you what kind of a person he is for instance.

    When randomly walking around I can usually tell where we are, but my explanation for it will sound something like, well, we went so and so and so (hands waving), and, oh, we also went there, so actually we are now here probably, see?

    Another example is that I seem to keep track of where people are. Whatever I'm doing you can ask me where someone is in the house and I can often make quite an accurate guess, because I heard someone swiftly racing up the stairs and he's the only one doing that so he must be in his room.

    I can tell when someone or something is suddenly acting different or in a way I haven't seen before, even some subtle details like eye movement or fingers or whatever. If something's off here, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

    Something else entirely is that I have a habit of unscrewing pens to see how the mechanism works. There's probably some Ti in this and I think taking things apart is usually associated with Ti, but I'm not really focused on the parts themselves and how they fit together. I'm more focused on what happens when you press the button. What rotates and how. Where exactly do two parts hit each other to cause a click etc.

    It can be more abstract too. When writing software, but even more so when debugging code, I seem to understand a computer program in terms of motion and behaviour and I can find the cause of chaotic/buggy behaviour rather quickly. I'm much better at this than at conceiving some design or structure for a new program.

    I also noticed I seem to measure distance in terms of time it would take at a certain speed.

    Hmmm, ok, that's it for now. I'll add more when I think of it. I think most of this is Ni, but perhaps more Ni-Fe-Ti. If not, I got my type wrong.
    This sounds more like Si.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    This sounds more like Si.
    Definitely.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    This sounds more like Si.
    I agree, everything but the last three paragraphs was in the Si territory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    This sounds more like Si.
    interesting, interesting, i was thinking the same thing myself and wondering..............my *idea* of Ni in myself could be Si afterall? hmmmmmmm

    so, what is the last half of mm's post about then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Ni is about connections.
    Well what about the people who say it's something else, too?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dbmmama View Post
    interesting, interesting, i was thinking the same thing myself and wondering..............my *idea* of Ni in myself could be Si afterall? hmmmmmmm
    I think you should really consider ESE. A lot of what you've said about Ni sounds more like Ne + Si.

    so, what is the last half of mm's post about then?
    Well, there is the part about Ti (with some Te too, actually), but the rest sounds like Si to me.

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