Could EIEs/ENFjs be insensitive and upset others without realizing it?

[Joy]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Joy]

Interesting.

[Satan]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

I find it ironic, that you of all people would talk about others insensitiveness.

[Joy]

I find it ironic, that you of all people would talk about others insensitiveness.

I was actually wondering if this could be an indication of Te dominance > Fe dominance, which is why I started this topic.

[Satan]

I was actually wondering if this could be an indication of Te dominance > Fe dominance, which is why I started this topic.

I know that I can "upset" people without really realising it myself.

Although usually I'd say that I "didn't care". Like the situation is more important to me than the individual.

It's like if someone's a fucking drop kick. Why should I give a shit if they want to have a little cry about something? And if I can't get through to them - I may as well ignore them.

And then someone else can "help" them come to terms with .. blah blah blah.

Although I'm not EIE.

I think anyone can act like that though. I read something soemtime time about "in an arguement do you consider the others feelings". And I don't think that everyone "considers other peoples feelings" in the heat of an arguement.

[FDG]

Usually they know what they're trying to do when they try to upset somebody.

[machintruc]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

-+0 EIE's, maybe... Like ****** or Zhirinovsky.

[Expat]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

Actually I do. I have seen it happening that they go into a sort of emotional explosion, where they are more letting out their own emotions rather than trying to achieve anything with it, and only then do they realize they have caused a lasting offense/upset on the other person. They may be puzzled as to why the other person is still upset, but they do realize it and may regret it, or at least be saddened.

However, I wouldn't say that they "tend" to do it; I have seen it happening on occasion.

[Satan]

Actually I do. I have seen it happening that they go into a sort of emotional explosion, where they are more letting out their own emotions rather than trying to achieve anything with it, and only then do they realize they have caused a lasting offense/upset on the other person. They may be puzzled as to why the other person is still upset, but they do realize it and may regret it, or at least be saddened.

However, I wouldn't say that they "tend" to do it; I have seen it happening on occasion.

Oh, I've seen people do that.

I can kind of enjoy it (from some people) I think.

But then I used to go around saying "I like to see people cry" without thinking of the ramifications of interpretation.

I'm not going to try and push people to cry on purpose. If they happen to that's okay though.

[Ezra]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

Yeah. ******.

[Joy]

Do you guys really think that ****** thought that his message and agenda would be instantly and happily accepted by everyone in the world and everything would be sunshine and roses?

[Park]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

Yes. I do. And they want to pretend that nothing happened afterwards. They tend to act as "what's the big deal" when I remind them what they did. Like as if loosing control over yourself (and your emotions) is something normal and ordinary. And they tend to be oblivious to the fact that they have a strong potential of seriously hurting someone's feelings by doing that.

[Kristiina]

when I get angry at someone, I prefer being mean with them for a little while, even if I lose control emotionally and say mean things. I have plenty of experience with holding back and being shy friendly and later being very angry at them for something else. So I gladly snap and them when I'm angry and i want them to know it and if I'm not angry later then I'll act very friendly to show that I don't have a problem with them later. And no apologizing! If I think it was the right and justified reaction, then I see no reason for apologizing. If I exaggerate something and say something I don't mean and they remember it later, then I take it back and apologize.

I don't really worry about hurting people. If they piss me off and I snap at them and they feel hurt and unable to forgive me or whatever, then the relationship just wasn't meant to be.

I don't offend people too often though. And if I do, I think it's their fault anyway.

[Joy]

tangent, but: is this a manifestation of Fi as the 7th function maybe?

Possibly, and I think there's an aspect of Ni to it as well (in that ESE's would be less likely to hold this sentiment than EIE's).

[Park]

when I get angry at someone, I prefer being mean with them for a little while, even if I lose control emotionally and say mean things. I have plenty of experience with holding back and being shy friendly and later being very angry at them for something else. So I gladly snap and them when I'm angry and i want them to know it and if I'm not angry later then I'll act very friendly to show that I don't have a problem with them later. And no apologizing! If I think it was the right and justified reaction, then I see no reason for apologizing. If I exaggerate something and say something I don't mean and they remember it later, then I take it back and apologize.

I don't really worry about hurting people. If they piss me off and I snap at them and they feel hurt and unable to forgive me or whatever, then the relationship just wasn't meant to be.

I don't offend people too often though. And if I do, I think it's their fault anyway.

I am amazed at how someone can actually be like this. You sound like someone with no real feelings at all.

[Park]

dude whatever

your sentiment is consistent with what kris said here about conflict with SLIs btw.

I actually relate better to #1 in that post, but whatever... I don't understand how someone could experience and display strong emotions as a "passing phase". That's just sick. Or how some people can change their feelings about things 100 times a day...

[Park]

And I fucking hate that bleeping avatar of Kristiina's. (Sorry for acting like an ENFj here, it's just a passing phase, no offense to Kris intended.)

[Kristiina]

tangent, but: is this a manifestation of Fi as the 7th function maybe?

perhaps it's too much stress on with a pinch of Ti-dual seeking. "What's the point in having a relationship with someone when your natural reactions immidiately make the relationship go sour?". I believe that if you have to supress your natural reactions too much it's just not worth it.

[Kristiina]

I actually relate better to #1 in that post, but whatever... I don't understand how someone could experience and display strong emotions as a "passing phase". That's just sick. Or how some people can change their feelings about things 100 times a day...

that's the thing - I change my opinion quite rarely. just my emotion can be stronger or weaker depending on the circumstances. SLIs sometimes taunt me to see if I really have to same opinion that I used to have. "I thought you hated that actor! Why are you watching this?" and I relive the entire emotion "I do hate him, I thought I'd give him another chance... But yes, he's the same as always! Ah, annoying guy!". SLIs often remind me of emotions that I talked about a while ago.

[Park]

And well, if they're not Fe-valuing they probably wouldn't value the reason anyway.

<3 U just for that smiley.

[lefty]

Does anyone know any EIE's who tend to offend/upset people without realizing it (until after they're upset, that is)?

People are intimidated by us and we're nice people, too, so peole try to undercut our power, but really we're primarily ethical and that's why whe have the place we do in the scheme of things.

[Angel Alliterator]

I can be very friendly and nice with people, sometimes even modestly so....

HOWEVER when I am on the attack (especially if I feel secure with them) I will let them have it. And when I mean "let them have it" I mean it. I become detach and want to hurt them emotionally with words and lose my usual cool nature.

Sometimes I regret going over the top and sometimes I feel like it was well justified.

Sometimes I get too fiery for my own good, but I will not let others undermine and try to control me.

[idealistichick]

when I get angry at someone, I prefer being mean with them for a little while, even if I lose control emotionally and say mean things. I have plenty of experience with holding back and being shy friendly and later being very angry at them for something else. So I gladly snap and them when I'm angry and i want them to know it and if I'm not angry later then I'll act very friendly to show that I don't have a problem with them later. And no apologizing! If I think it was the right and justified reaction, then I see no reason for apologizing. If I exaggerate something and say something I don't mean and they remember it later, then I take it back and apologize.

I don't really worry about hurting people. If they piss me off and I snap at them and they feel hurt and unable to forgive me or whatever, then the relationship just wasn't meant to be.

I don't offend people too often though. And if I do, I think it's their fault anyway.

I'm the exact same way. If I took it to far then I'll apologize. If I feel like its not my fault I won't apologize. Instead I'll complain to my friends and explain it over and over again why its the other person's fault. The only way I'll offend someone is when they attack me first. I'll do something to piss them off back.

[Kristiina]

I'm the exact same way. If I took it to far then I'll apologize. If I feel like its not my fault I won't apologize. Instead I'll complain to my friends and explain it over and over again why its the other person's fault. The only way I'll offend someone is when they attack me first. I'll do something to piss them off back.

haha, yes, I do the same - I complain and explain to my friends. "And then he said ... and then I said... and later he thought I was being mean, but I wasn't! I wasn't being mean at all! And if he interpreted it this way, then it's his problem". Mostly I explain it to a third person when I think that this one person didn't understand me even after the fight. When I dated an SLI a while back, I kept replaying the fights to my IEI sister all the time. If I get everything settled then I don't replay the fight later.

[Kristiina]

Well it would be "sick" if it was just random, or there was no reason for the change. I notice those with weak ethics having a harder time observing the catalyst and the transitional process, a harder time empathizing with why their emotions are changing so they incorrectly assume it's for no good reason. And well, if they're not Fe-valuing they probably wouldn't value the reason anyway.

+1.
It's never random. Sometimes when I get snappy for no apparent reason then I actually tell my ILI, "I'm in a very snappy mood, but I don't know why.". This way he can at least take it into account even though there's no apparent cause. Sometimes I don't notice it though and he will tell me, "you're acting snappy. " and I'm like, "No I'm not. I'm not I'm not I'm not... well maybe a little...".

Sometimes I don't want to overwhelm him with too much negativism and I'll tell him there's nothing wrong even though I'm just in a very bad mood and everything seems to suck. He does pick up on that though, so there isn't much point in hiding it.

[redbaron]

One of my best friends from college is EIE. She'd go off on a tangent about this or that and I'd be standing there with an amused grin on my face while the other person would get this wide-eyed expression due to the intensity of her emotions and the explosiveness with which she expresses them. Her attitude was very much the same as Kriistina's. Kind of a this-is-how-I-am, take-me-or-leave-me sort of thing. She ended up marrying an IEI, very gentle accepting guy. Anyway, she can definitely "let people have it" if she sees an injustice or something that she thinks needs to change. "sensitive" is not a word I'd use to describe her. lol Yet she's a breath of fresh air in many ways.

[Kristiina]

One of my best friends from college is EIE. She'd go off on a tangent about this or that and I'd be standing there with an amused grin on my face while the other person would get this wide-eyed expression due to the intensity of her emotions and the explosiveness with which she expresses them. Her attitude was very much the same as Kriistina's. Kind of a this-is-how-I-am, take-me-or-leave-me sort of thing. She ended up marrying an IEI, very gentle accepting guy. Anyway, she can definitely "let people have it" if she sees an injustice or something that she thinks needs to change. "sensitive" is not a word I'd use to describe her. lol Yet she's a breath of fresh air in many ways.

mhh, but would you call her "insensitive"?

[redbaron]

mhh, but would you call her "insensitive"?

At times, yes. But usually not. She's also mellowed a little bit over the years. (we're in our 30s) When she gets going she can really let loose and the truth she feels she's saying always comes first even if that means insensitivity towards the emotions of others. She would admit this and say that if it hurts someone's feelings then too bad, it's probably something they needed to hear and that's more important than tip-toeing around or stating something in a way that would be less likely to offend. I kind of like that though. I know she'll be honest with me. I do think certain people remove themselves from her presence because they're intimidated. She knows this and I think it amuses her to some degree but she also accepts it and knows that she's just too much for some people to handle.

[Kristiina]

At times, yes. But usually not. She's also mellowed a little bit over the years. (we're in our 30s) When she gets going she can really let loose and the truth she feels she's saying always comes first even if that means insensitivity towards the emotions of others. She would admit this and say that if it hurts someone's feelings then too bad, it's probably something they needed to hear and that's more important than tip-toeing around or stating something in a way that would be less likely to offend. I kind of like that though. I know she'll be honest with me. I do think certain people remove themselves from her presence because they're intimidated. She knows this and I think it amuses her to some degree but she also accepts it and knows that she's just too much for some people to handle.

haha, I can relate to your description of her quite a bit. People don't remove themselves from my presence, because I don't let anyone know my personality unless I think they can handle it. And if I don't think so, then I don't even hang out with them. I have got less mellow over the years and the differences between "the social me" and "the real me" are decreasing. In a few years, I might end up scaring people away right after meeting them. YAY!!!!

[redbaron]

haha, I can relate to your description of her quite a bit. People don't remove themselves from my presence, because I don't let anyone know my personality unless I think they can handle it. And if I don't think so, then I don't even hang out with them. I have got less mellow over the years and the differences between "the social me" and "the real me" are decreasing. In a few years, I might end up scaring people away right after meeting them. YAY!!!!

You sound like a lot of fun actually... yeah, be yourself!

[FDG]

I am amazed at how someone can actually be like this. You sound like someone with no real feelings at all.

In fact, that's what I think too when I read those posts.

[FDG]

It seems natural in a way to me. The way I see it is your moods change and shift over the course of the day. You might feel sad, then happy, then surprised, then shocked, then angry, then depressed, then hopeful, then happy, then content... blah, blah, blah...

Well, you can. I generally don't, my mood is stable.

[marooned]

Well, you can. I generally don't, my mood is stable.

that makes sense. Some people are more moody than others.

[ScarlettLux]

Well, you can. I generally don't, my mood is stable.

Good for you?

[FDG]

Good for you?

Well, I didn't mean to say it's better or worse. Certainly some people can find moodier people more exciting for example! I wanted to say that it's not a perspective that "everybody can understand".

[Ms. Kensington]

Well, you can. I generally don't, my mood is stable.

now this sounds like a T or a Te perspective on mood.

[lefty]

Yes. I do. And they want to pretend that nothing happened afterwards. They tend to act as "what's the big deal" when I remind them what they did. Like as if loosing control over yourself (and your emotions) is something normal and ordinary. And they tend to be oblivious to the fact that they have a strong potential of seriously hurting someone's feelings by doing that.

you know...we're real sorry we dont compartmentalize all our emotions for the sake of the 9-5 and live "lives of quiet desperation," as thoreau described, but we're just not built that way.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Uh. Why would they give a shit? In this society nobody views that type as a threat anyway. They are mocked/laughed at/emasculated ... nobody pictures a mafia of a bunch of ENFj or INFp males. ((Unless they were making fun of something)) I don't believe in underestimating anybody, just this annoying human trait I have, but I think the reason they don't give a shit about how other people feel is that, 9 times out of 10 people don't give a shit about them.

[Khamelion]

EIE or not, I do that. upset people off-handedly. especially EIE's hahah