Ambition and Alphas

[Jimbean]

How many of you would consider yourself being competitive, domineering, and business like?

[Khola aka Bee]

FAIL.

[Jimbean]

FAIL.

Who? Me or you?

[Jimbean]

I would like to add another question to this thread: Do you know an alpha that has super competitive traits?

[Jimbean]

why u asking?

Because I am trying to prove myself wrong. Lately I have been giving into the stereotype that Alphas don't like to strive to be powerful, or that they are not competent in powerful positions. I want to see if there are any others besides me (at least on this forum), that strive to become and will do whatever it takes to accomplish that dream.

[Jimbean]

well here's the thing. it really depends on ur definition of powerfull. I do want to be powerfull but...

I don't really want to be powerfull in the conventional sense or have control over other people's lives in real life. I find the notion boring and exhausting. Not only do I find it a huge expenditure of energy, but why should I bother bossing other people around... who the hell am I to tell people what to do or want to do with their lives? Besides, how do I know if I'm acting on the right information when I'm forcing my ideology down their throats.

Powerful, not as in controlling other people, but as in the "think big and kick ass" type of power or maybe better known as strong personal power.

But do I have ambition? Oh yes. I want to be able to achieve my full intellectual potential as a human being. I want to understand the world in it's full capacity and have an omniscience about the universe unparalleled in human history. I want to see what god sees and think what god thinks. Until I've achieved that, I won't ever rest. And if I don't achieve some modicum of that before I die, I'd have considered my life a failure.

But until I've deciphered the exact natural laws behind human society and the universe, I can never, ever say with any certainty that my position is correct, or that I am confident enough about my actions to justify them over those of others.

I want to reply to this, but I honestly don't know how to right now.

[Khola aka Bee]

I know an ILE that can be.

[Wynch]

I would definitely call myself competitive, but only because I like to win things. Which seems redundant, but I like winning games because of the feeling of successful completion at the end that I can never attain in normal life because I'm too busy moving onto new things. Otherwise I couldn't care less. In the business sense I'm definitely not competitive at all.

That being said, I become business-like at work because I work in a pretty serious work environment. That's out of necessity, not choice.

As for domineering, I'm not actually a domineering person, but my height and my impatience with people who are incapable can come across as such. And I guess I seem to demand attention wherever I go. But it's not like I try so much as it just happens because I'm a gregarious female with the physique of a supermodel. I kind of stick out and I can be a little intimidating if you don't know me, which I will take advantage of at places like the bank and large crowds...

[Wynch]

well here's the thing. it really depends on ur definition of powerfull. I do want to be powerfull but...

I don't really want to be powerfull in the conventional sense or have control over other people's lives in real life. I find the notion boring and exhausting. Not only do I find it a huge expenditure of energy, but why should I bother bossing other people around... who the hell am I to tell people what to do or want to do with their lives? Besides, how do I know if I'm acting on the right information when I'm forcing my ideology down their throats.

But do I have ambition? Oh yes. I want to be able to achieve my full intellectual potential as a human being. I want to understand the world in it's full capacity and have an omniscience about the universe unparalleled in human history. I want to see what god sees and think what god thinks. Until I've achieved that, I won't ever rest. And if I don't achieve some modicum of that before I die, I'd have considered my life a failure.

But until I've deciphered the exact natural laws behind human society and the universe, I can never, ever say with any certainty that my position is correct, or that I am confident enough about my actions to justify them over those of others.

Other than that, I've entertained the occasional wet dream where I've held absolute power.

And I can be very vengeful and unyielding if someone insults me. This is consistent with having Se as a role function probably. I'm also able to mobilize quickly in a debate, and if a fight, say, were to break out, I can easily be on top of the situation.

Sorry to double post, but this is exactly how I feel as well.

[cracka]

How many of you would consider yourself being competitive, domineering, and business like?

I'm very much all 3... but only business like while at work.

[Jimbean]

I'm very much all 3... but only business like while at work.

woooohoooo! Okay, now we just need a few more, form our own mafia/business, so then we can kick gammas ass

[Jimbean]

Alphas don't value Se.

No, it's being an 8

[Jimbean]

The new motto for Alpha should be Think Big and Kick Ass .

Okay, it's me and Cracka, who else?

[Jimbean]

Sorry to double post, but this is exactly how I feel as well.

awww, you folks are no fun

btw, that is a good quote of Voltaire!

[Wynch]

Thanks, I also love that quote.

I like to kick ass, but I prefer to do it in a subtle way so that I don't take any credit for it. I like knowing I've done well without any of the awkward fame and glory. I don't know what to do with compliments and the like, they throw me off balance.

[dbmmama]

Powerful, not as in controlling other people, but as in the "think big and kick ass" type of power or maybe better known as strong personal power.

i don't know my type yet, but that is my kind of "powerful." "strong personal power." not OVER other people, i like helping them strengthen themselves and then let's have fun competing for the fun of it to strengthen each other more.

what type are you Jimbean or are you still figuring it out yourself?

[normal]

Kick Big and Think Ass

[JRiddy]

I actually think of myself as pretty ambitious, in that I have set high goals for myself, and I work hard to achieve them, but definitely not in an Se kind of way. I'm ambitious in that I actively refuse to let things around me become complacent, and do what it takes to prevent stagnation. In some ways, this is in fact more about "personal strength" than "kicking ass", but I'm not afraid to kick the ass of people who stand in the way of my goals. Only I tend to be more manipulative than directly confrontational, and even when I confront someone, I usually try to put it in a place where they will be made to look foolish.

In general, my ambitions are much more exploratory than expansionistic in nature, in that I work hard to have the freedom to look into every available option. In any field that I care about, I have at tendency to go to war (metaphorically) against anyone who tries to keep my vision from being set in motion. Though I usually work with people to bring out their potential, those who adamantly refuse to change provoke me into a rage that can be cooled by nothing less than their defeat. However, I have difficulty sustaining my drive in the absence of a passion towards a fairly clear goal or vision. I have no urge to take control for control's sake, and I can often get distracted or sidetracked by other pursuits.

[Wynch]

Ah, JRiddy, you've put my feelings into words perfectly.

[Rubicon]

I definitely set high goals for myself. I think I'm ambitious in the sense that I want to fulfill my personal potential to the fullest. What the world defines as success doesn't mean that much to me. I never accept any efforts of mine to be good enough. Not in a pessimistic way though - just that there's always something that can be done better. I don't ever expect or want to 'arrive' at a place where I've achieved everything I want to. The striving is the fun and fulfilling part.

I'm definitely not a leader-type by any means, but if no one else is stepping up to the role, I'll do what's necessary. I really dislike taking charge though.

People that 'stand in my way' to success I trample on mercilessly. Hahahaha. No. These people I generally ignore until they go away , or I go about things in a roundabout way so that they confront me first. I prefer people to confront me first because it makes me angry being that I dislike being controlled. So it's easy for me to be stubborn about standing my ground when I'm being excessively and obviously pushed. I find it harder to stay firm when I'm being subtly manipulated (think ENTps/ENFps) or my emotions are appealed to.

[machintruc]

I'd say I'm business-like, but I don't have much ambition.

I'm not really "dominant", I'm pretty loud, but I'm definitely not a pushy retard.

I'm not competitive, except at social situations, where I tend to seek others' attention subconsciously. I'm trying to be the smartest, the funniest, the loudest, or the most truthful. Besides, when drinking alcoholic beverages with other people, I tend to drink more than others. But that's all.

[Rubicon]

I'd say I'm business-like, but I don't have much ambition.

I'm not really "dominant", I'm pretty loud, but I'm definitely not a pushy retard.

I'm not competitive, except at social situations, where I tend to seek others' attention subconsciously. I'm trying to be the smartest, the funniest, the loudest, or the most truthful. Besides, when drinking alcoholic beverages with other people, I tend to drink more than others. But that's all.

How is that LII??

[machintruc]

How is that LII??

I'm 0+-, remember. N+ phitypes are attention-seeking.

[Phaedrus]

How is that LII??

It is not. There is no way that machintruc can be a LII. He is deluded in that respect, there's no question about that. Machintruc is not a LII. Period.

[Jimbean]

Thanks, I also love that quote.

I like to kick ass, but I prefer to do it in a subtle way so that I don't take any credit for it. I like knowing I've done well without any of the awkward fame and glory. I don't know what to do with compliments and the like, they throw me off balance.

I am almost exactly that way. Except for certain things I like to be out in the open in doing them. Sometimes I like to take compliments, but for the most part I try not to think nothing of them.

[Jimbean]

what type are you Jimbean or are you still figuring it out yourself?

Frankly, I don't believe that matters. What matters is that I am a static logical type that is enneagram 8 with 7. I am introverted (regardless of socionics), and I value my sense of reality, reading good books, exploring the world, surrounding myself with good people, and (excuse the cornyness) the feeling of challenging myself everyday (which is why I don't spend that much time on this forum, but I like coming here because you folks are interesting )

Okay, now for the answer you want from me: I have typed myself to be ILE, but a few people on this forum that have met me typed me as (and Rick suspected) LSI, another typed me as an LSE, and another typed me as ILE. Through the forum I have heard LIE, LSE, LSI, SLE, ILE, and ILI.

[dbmmama]

Frankly, I don't believe that matters. What matters is that I am a static logical type that is enneagram 8 with 7. I am introverted (regardless of socionics), and I value my sense of reality, reading good books, exploring the world, surrounding myself with good people, and (excuse the cornyness) the feeling of challenging myself everyday (which is why I don't spend that much time on this forum, but I like coming here because you folks are interesting )

Okay, now for the answer you want from me: I have typed myself to be ILE, but a few people on this forum that have met me typed me as (and Rick suspected) LSI, another typed me as an LSE, and another typed me as ILE. Through the forum I have heard LIE, LSE, LSI, SLE, ILE, and ILI.

hell, i only want an answer if you want to give it to me. if it doesn't matter to you, it doesn't matter. i'm good with that.

btw, if you're so inclined again, what sorts of things do you do that give you the feeling of challenging yourself everyday?

[diljs]

words.

Jriddy summed up the ILE viewpoint pretty well.

Compared to EJs and ESxPs, I suck at ambition. Not a fan of the or .

I'm ambitious and demanding of myself, but externally I'm chilled out and people rarely see me hard at work. EJs whine at me to "show more initiative" and I say "stfu I'm thinking about possibilities." I then go through a few hardcore multitasking periods and finish what takes them a day to do in about an hour and a half, so I can get back to listening to Pandora and reading up on socionics.

...This is also why I'm back to being self employed and no longer working with "Type A Central".