Ladies and Gentlemen, Introducing

[Lucy]

Hey Everybody, I apologise for the appalling quality I've been compressing and uploading all day and this is as close as I can get before YouTube practically implodes. Any issues or thoughts let me know. Here's my video, I tried to embed it but I get the distinct feeling that YouTube has it in for me today:

[Lucy]

Oh and incase this lead to greater enlightenment here's a little something I wrote earlier in the 'why are you're enneagram type?' thread. Maybe it'll help.

I was identified as a 2 first by Leon and then by Liam and Ezra. At first I fought it, partly because a few years ago I was a pretty unhealthy 2 and so had developed the view that all the signs of a 2 were faults in myself. Then after a conversation with Ezra, many talks with Leon and further research I came to realise that I was a 2 and it was a good thing.

I have always been motivated by love for others and feel a need to care for anyone and everyone. I have often been described as a people pleaser, I always surround myself with people and seem to collect acquaintances. This tendency to socialise widely , forming many semi-close relationships leads to me having a very changeable personality and adapt to the person I am with. Generally I am not completely myself with others but a version of myself; exaggerating selected qualities I feel the person wants from me. My social behavior can often lead to me becoming either consciously or unconsciously manipulative, moving and placing people where I want them or where I think they should be. I have to admit that I can be prone to emotional bribery or bouts of exuberance placing myself the focus of a certain person's attention. I would say, though, that I am only moderately attention-seeking but when there is some one I like or enjoy the company of I can be intensively possessive and want ever more of that company.

Relationships wise I have many friends that range from a passing hello to pretty close and over the last year I have developed a layer of myself I am willing to give away in order to form sort of close friendships, these people often regard me as one of their closest friends and indeed I feel close to them but what they know of me is pretty superficial since I am willing to give it away easily. Beyond that you have to work hard to obtain a truely close relationship, I would say these people are so endangered that you could fit us all in a small car. When I develop a very close relationship I lend completely to my old 2 ways and would give or give up anything to receive love from that person. I would "walk over broken glass" to see them. In relationships usually I find that we are pretty badly matched (all my own fault, I tend to stumble into relationships, sadly quite thoughtlessly) and I find that a mixture of me changing whilst they don't and me caring whilst they don't leads to me drifting off. However, luckily the Bear who currently keeps me company has lead me into a stable, healthy relationship, in which I am loving, passionate, caring, listening and attentive. He puts up with me despite my very changeable nature and occasionally bouts of playful aggression. He is a 7 and we balance each other nicely.

[Iconoclast IX]

You scream .

This is based off the fact that I feel nauseous from looking at your avatar and watching your video.

Just a guess, though.

EDIT: The paragraph you just added affirms my suspicions. I can state with relative certainty that you are IxFp (SEI or IEI) or ExFj (ESE or EIE). There is no chance that you belong to a Te/Fi valuing quadra. I also think Fe base is more likely than Fe creative, so then ExFj (and the bits you wrote about being "exuberant" and "manipulative" seems to be slightly more indicative of ENFj/EIE. At the same time, though, the fact that you describe yourself as one who enjoys making others feel comfortable indicates Si coupled with Fe.

For further help in determining your type:

1. Describe a few neutral traits that you yourself lack/are very weak at utilizing, yet at the same time, admire extremely.

2. Similarly describe a few neutral traits you lack/are very weak at utilizing, and at the same time, have a hard time comprehending/dislike to a noticeable degree.

[Expat]

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[JuJu]

ESFj.

Welcome.

[Park]

Ezra is slowly invading this place with his crew....

j/k

[Lucy]

Thanks for the general niceness, despite being described as nauseating. I've read about it and pretty much agree that I'm ESE.

Here's a conundrum to put out there that I've been pondering about recently. Despite me recognizing that I am ESE I've realised that I don't embrace it, purely because there's very little I actually like about the type. It's not that I'm striving to be any particular type or that all of this is a facade that I'm projecting. It's just a little like a pair of shoes that don't fit. As I said in my video I don't like asking for or accepting help, but I'm working on that. So here's a bit of an S.O.S. Where should I go with this? Because I'm bloody fed up with trying to work this out, it's taken years on hard work and I seem to have reached only a mediocre level of cohabitation with myself!

Oh, and don't take this as some, "I hate myslf, blah blah blah, plea, it's more of a I'm lost have you got a map situation.

[cracka]

Dee! Did someone kick the rock that you were sleeping under and bring you back?

Shit.

[Park]

Dee! Did someone kick the rock that you were sleeping under and bring you back?

Shit.

LOL

(+1)

[eunice]

ESFj.

You seem like a pleasant and friendly person. Welcome to 16t. =)

[Logos]

Yes.

Thanks for the general niceness, despite being described as nauseating. I've read about it and pretty much agree that I'm ESE.

Here's a conundrum to put out there that I've been pondering about recently. Despite me recognizing that I am ESE I've realised that I don't embrace it, purely because there's very little I actually like about the type. It's not that I'm striving to be any particular type or that all of this is a facade that I'm projecting. It's just a little like a pair of shoes that don't fit. As I said in my video I don't like asking for or accepting help, but I'm working on that. So here's a bit of an S.O.S. Where should I go with this? Because I'm bloody fed up with trying to work this out, it's taken years on hard work and I seem to have reached only a mediocre level of cohabitation with myself!

Oh, and don't take this as some, "I hate myslf, blah blah blah, plea, it's more of a I'm lost have you got a map situation.

Why? What is it about the ESE description that you do not like? Can you recall which descriptions you have read?

[Lucy]

Thanks guys, I've thought about it and talked about it all and I think I can iron out the creases. And Molly Ringwald- thanks.

[Logos]

Thanks guys, I've thought about it and talked about it all and I think I can iron out the creases. And Molly Ringwald- thanks.

Iron out the creases?

[Ezra]

"My counterpart Leon", hahahahaha. Classic.

I think you're an ESE, Lucy. Then again, when I first met you my head was going "Fe Fe Fe Fe Fe". Your thinking when I talked to you before and your thinking now strengthens the case for Si over what I originally thought was Ni.

For people's information, Lucy is a very amiable character, much like cracka is. I'm not saying this confirms ESE; I'm merely pointing out a common factor in two individuals I see as ESEs.

Ezra is slowly invading this place with his crew....

It's obviously because I am LSE and I am forcefully using Se which I am not good at even though it is an eighth function and thus I am comfortable with it. It is also a counterphobic reaction to... life in general? Or maybe death. Or maybe purgatory. I don't know. I am doubting and uncertain of what I need or want.

you look like molly ringwald (:

Ha! I never saw that. Very interesting.

Iron out the creases?

"Smoothen things out" is another way of putting it.

[Logos]

"Smoothen things out" is another way of putting it.

I know what the phrase means, I meant what does she need to iron out the creases.

[Mr Saturn]

yes, I'm curious about this too. she and pretty much everyone else have identified her as ESE, yet she says that she does not like the type...? I want to know why this is.

I don't think it is Lucy not seeing herself as ESE, but more that she doesn't like ESE itself.

[Logos]

And I am trying to figure out why she does not like the ESE itself.

[Mr Saturn]

And I am trying to figure out why she does not like the ESE itself.

My misinterpretation, I apologise.

[JuJu]

Lucy, I just showed this video to my Mom, who is ESFj too--and she liked it so much!!! . She really related to the description of the pancakes--at which she lol'd, and said "wow, she's so much like me"--and to being a "people-pleaser."

My Mom's getting into Socionics now, whoa... ok, peace

[Lucy]

Hey, thanks. Well as for all that ironing of the creases it was a phase, so no worries I'm running around being a jolly ESE.

[Lucy]

The other week Leon announced that he thought he was EIE, which grabbed my attention because I originally thought that was what I was. He is now sure that he's IEI. But after having another read I think I might be EIE, despite everyone seeming to put me as ESE. Perhaps I'll make a little video about it, who knows. Just wondered what you all thought, could I be EIE?

[Ms. Kensington]

I know what the phrase means, I meant what does she need to iron out the creases.

lmao

[Ezra]

The other week Leon announced that he thought he was EIE, which grabbed my attention because I originally thought that was what I was. He is now sure that he's IEI. But after having another read I think I might be EIE, despite everyone seeming to put me as ESE. Perhaps I'll make a little video about it, who knows. Just wondered what you all thought, could I be EIE?

You could be. That was my first reaction to you. I think you're almost certainly Fe leading; I'm just not so sure on quadra values.

[JuJu]

The other week Leon announced that he thought he was EIE, which grabbed my attention because I originally thought that was what I was. He is now sure that he's IEI. But after having another read I think I might be EIE, despite everyone seeming to put me as ESE. Perhaps I'll make a little video about it, who knows. Just wondered what you all thought, could I be EIE?

If you are then my Mom needs to be re-typed, lol... It is possible... If you get a chance to post another video, please do. That will help.

[Suomea]

....

[Exodus]

The other week Leon announced that he thought he was EIE, which grabbed my attention because I originally thought that was what I was. He is now sure that he's IEI. But after having another read I think I might be EIE, despite everyone seeming to put me as ESE. Perhaps I'll make a little video about it, who knows. Just wondered what you all thought, could I be EIE?

It might make some sense, but I don't think EIEs feel such a strong need to please other people and make sure everyone's having a good time. And you seem to value Ne, wanting to "try a bit of everything".

[Lucy]

I think it would explain why I feel a bit uncomfortable with ESE. I think ESE puts far too much stock in the feelings of other people, using them as the main context for decision making. I don't do this that much.

Firstly, I am an enormous planner. I consider all the possibilities of a situation and plan for them. I do consider other people in my plans but not exclusively, I tend to make a plan based on my feelings and information I've gained and then apply others. Also, when faced with a tough or important decision I try to reason it out, often not considering feelings at all. This means I get into trouble a lot for being thoughtless because people feel I haven't considered them at all in making my decision.

Secondly, I am terribly stubborn. In a lot of cases it's my way or the high way. I am very forward with my opinions and am often very defensive of them. I become aggressive when I feel the are endangered or I am being pushed or coerced in a situation that conflicts with my original ideas. This makes me quite tough to work with because, in groups I often take up the role of the leader and work my colleagues hard, and you have to be persistent if you want me to consider your views. I try to hear everyone's thoughts but usually push mine to the fore. I am also quite loud in group work situations and if there is a presentation to be given I am the noisy one at the front.

Also, I think back to a question my dad asked my recently after a news article he had just read. He asked if he had been in a drunken fight and killed or injured a man but the police didn't know it was him, would I tell the police or would I protect him knowing that if I sent him to prison the family would disown me. I said, without a second's thought, that I would tell the police. When there is a decision between my own personal ethics and someone close to me, the ethics win out. However, I would forgive him, because that's jst what I do.

So, what do you make of those apples?

[Mr Saturn]

Lucy, I would also read some descriptions of IEE. I notice some similarities.

http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Filatova_IEE

http://www.socionics.in.ua/eng/harakter/13-iee.htm

[Mr Saturn]

It's time for another video.

This one is all about Lucy.

[Exodus]

Si >>>> Se

[implied]

agree w/ thehotelambush. very Si.

[Mr Saturn]

So Si creative? ESE?

[Ezra]

I'd like to know why Si.

[Ezra]

I think it would explain why I feel a bit uncomfortable with ESE. I think ESE puts far too much stock in the feelings of other people, using them as the main context for decision making. I don't do this that much.

Firstly, I am an enormous planner. I consider all the possibilities of a situation and plan for them. I do consider other people in my plans but not exclusively, I tend to make a plan based on my feelings and information I've gained and then apply others. Also, when faced with a tough or important decision I try to reason it out, often not considering feelings at all. This means I get into trouble a lot for being thoughtless because people feel I haven't considered them at all in making my decision.

Secondly, I am terribly stubborn. In a lot of cases it's my way or the high way. I am very forward with my opinions and am often very defensive of them. I become aggressive when I feel the are endangered or I am being pushed or coerced in a situation that conflicts with my original ideas. This makes me quite tough to work with because, in groups I often take up the role of the leader and work my colleagues hard, and you have to be persistent if you want me to consider your views. I try to hear everyone's thoughts but usually push mine to the fore. I am also quite loud in group work situations and if there is a presentation to be given I am the noisy one at the front.

Also, I think back to a question my dad asked my recently after a news article he had just read. He asked if he had been in a drunken fight and killed or injured a man but the police didn't know it was him, would I tell the police or would I protect him knowing that if I sent him to prison the family would disown me. I said, without a second's thought, that I would tell the police. When there is a decision between my own personal ethics and someone close to me, the ethics win out. However, I would forgive him, because that's jst what I do.

So, what do you make of those apples?

How is this a) compatible with ESE and b) not compatible with Beta and Se?

Lucy, I would also read some descriptions of IEE. I notice some similarities.

http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Filatova_IEE

http://www.socionics.in.ua/eng/harakter/13-iee.htm

The way she's described herself she's too direct and bossy to be an IEE.

[hellothere]

what about ESTj? or is she definitely Fe-base?

[Gilly]

Hmmmm...I would almost say she sounds more EIE from this most recent description.

[Ezra]

what about ESTj?

Errr, where do you get that idea?

[hellothere]

Errr, where do you get that idea?

LSE is not so far away from ESE. If she doesn't quite relate to ESE, then EIE and LSE might be other possibilities. Also perhaps there are signs of Fi seeking? the thing about ethics, and also in the video she asked "is that wrong of me?" or "does that make me a bad person?" or something like that. but probably not related to type... what do I know.

[Mr Saturn]

I have just spoken to Lucy about IEE. I know it might not be an obvious fit but I think it might be her.

The following quotes sourced from Filatova - Wikisocion translation

Ne – For the IEE it is most important to find, to see, to comprehend the new possibility where there previously never was one. Her attention is always riveted towards the unique and unusual. She’s stimulated by new ideas and is willing to receive information from any sources.

Lucy is constantly changing ideas. She buys an organ from a market then a few days later wants to learn the saw before learning chords on my ukulele while I am away.

However, when they fail to find creative work, in which something new can always be seen, their previously indefatigable inquisitiveness severely weakens.

Lucy is constantly on the look out, through work and play, for a creative output.

After having tried 10 – 15 different specialties she may prove to be without anything, to have attained nothing in life, the entirety of her talent gone unrealized. After completing necessary preparations for a new project, if she sees something she finds more attractive, she may drop everything.

She wants to knit. Then she wants to write books for children. Then she wants to make art. Then become a cinematographer.

Financially she’s often negligent, her money interests her more so in terms of its immediate use than in terms of obtaining new experiences in life.

This is example is also very true of Lucy's financial life.

Regime, duty, regulations, accountability, all disarm her. Finds it difficult to be inscribed in any framework. Works exclusively based on her mood, is better able to focus on ‘big picture’ work than to be occupied by thorough study.

This is a tricky one. She does make plans, true. However I believe that these plans are just a formula of ideas that she wishes to happen and that will hopefully fit into the time she idealises.

The following quotes are from the female IEE description on Wikisocion

It dresses vividly and well dressed, trying to appear uncommonly, so that it immediately it is possible to note among other women. But its details not so much pompous- well dressed, as of whimsical, consisting of the strange combinations bright it is color and forms. It rarely dresses traditionally and properly as the majorities of women, consciously selecting clothing pochudneye.

I can vouch for this. If you want the proof just look at the video in which she wears a straw hat.

The important component part of the work for HUXLEY is contact. Women of this type, as a rule, are benevolently disposed with respect to the majority of colleagues, is established around themselves a good climate, they do not be fascinated by gossips and intrigues. If to someone it is bad or it is heavy, they are always ready to show moral support.

This sort of thing crops up in the description. It's a case for the care-giving ideas thought about her.

The following quotes are from the Subtypes section on IEE wikisocion.


I know we don't all like subtypes but this is for the sake of argument

Thoughtful and impulsive, optimistic and suppressed, timid and energetic, they provide various impressions. Internally inconsistent, sensitive and vulnerable, they hid their problems under a mask of carelessness. Try to be affable with everything, aspire to understand and favor everyone with a smile.

A very sociable, spirited, mobile person. The initiator of many things; however, They are characterized by great restlessness and changeability. Very creative, but scattered and undisciplined.

Outwardly, they frequently have complete rounded forms. In their clothing they can be demonstrative and bright, sometimes even loud.

They lack self-confidence and are not inclined to independently make decisions.

They bloom next to a sensual and attentive person, capable of encouraging them and freeing them from doubts.