Roman Abramovich (Роман Абрамович)

[Ezra]

Here's his wiki.

"Roman Arkadyevich Abramovich (born 24 October 1966) is a Russian businessman, an investor, and a politician.
According to Forbes, Abramovich's net worth in 2015 was US$ 7.8 billion, making him the 12th richest person in Russia, and the 137th richest person in the world.
Abramovich first worked as a street-trader and then as a mechanic at a local factory. At the peak of perestroika, Abramovich sold imported rubber ducks from his Moscow apartment. In 1988, as perestroika opened up opportunities for privatization in the Soviet Union, Abramovich got a chance to legitimize his old business. He and his wife Olga set up a company making dolls.
Within a few years his wealth spread from oil conglomerates to pig farms and he also started investing in other businesses. Abramovich set up and liquidated at least 20 companies during the early 1990s, in sectors as diverse as tyre retreading and bodyguard recruitment. From 1992 to 1995, Abramovich founded five companies that conducted resale, produced consumer goods, and acted as intermediaries, eventually specializing in the trading of oil and oil products."

I find his story fascinating, and you can see from where he got his drive to get him where he is.

Here are the only bits of footage of him I can find.



I can already see an argument for LIE. Unstructured, but I can see it.

[FDG]

i think him an his ex-wife are both good examples of gamma rational-perceptive subtypes. their divorce i think was a typical gamma proceeding to a falter typical of a perceptive subtype in that quadra.

contrast the personal life, VI, education, and means of work with Bill Gates (rational subtype.)

MM yes I agree completely.

[Ezra]

contrast the personal life, VI, education, and means of work with Bill Gates (rational subtype.)

I don't get your aim here. Are you asking us to contrast so that we can see the differences between the two men, or are you trying to tell us that they are similar?

[Ezra]

others i think can be explained by subtype. in the case of Abramovich and Gates -- i think many of the differences between the men illustrate the the differences between the typical subtypes quite well.

I'd be inclined to agree with you there. Although I'm also inclined to put Abramovich as the logical subtype, and Gates as the Ni subtype. If you have an argument for otherwise, I'd love to hear it. But my basic reasons for typing Gates as Ni over Te subtype is because of the way he "leads" Microsoft, and likes to refer to his "vision". We don't really get this with Abramovich. He doesn't give a shit about Chelsea or about football; he just cares about how much money he rakes in. He attends the matches for his social image; it's the way he guarentees not losing his position. It's mere gut instinct, but I wouldn't put Abramovich down as the kind of guy to talk about "vision"; I think he's like Expat. He's less interested in where "his" club is going, and more interested in making money. This really is down to a "the feeling I get" case, so don't attack me too hard.

[FDG]

I'd be inclined to agree with you there. Although I'm also inclined to put Abramovich as the logical subtype, and Gates as the Ni subtype. If you have an argument for otherwise, I'd love to hear it. But my basic reasons for typing Gates as Ni over Te subtype is because of the way he "leads" Microsoft, and likes to refer to his "vision". We don't really get this with Abramovich. He doesn't give a shit about Chelsea or about football; he just cares about how much money he rakes in. He attends the matches for his social image; it's the way he guarentees not losing his position. It's mere gut instinct, but I wouldn't put Abramovich down as the kind of guy to talk about "vision"; I think he's like Expat. He's less interested in where "his" club is going, and more interested in making money. This really is down to a "the feeling I get" case, so don't attack me too hard.

No, I disagree completely. Abramovich caring more about money and image than gates = a point TOWARDS him being Ni subtype given that a Ni subtype would also have a more Se-centered and Fe centered lifestyle in comparison to Bill Gates.

IFMD: What does seedy mean?

[FDG]

"making money" could just as easily be putting one's strong Te preference to use and satisfying Fi goals such as humanitarianism -- for their own sake -- which may come to mind more often with Gamma values combined with Delta values. I wouldn't say any of the subtypes are more or less concerned with making money -- perhaps just by different means and for different ends. Bill Gates is clearly concerned with making money, too.

@FDG -- more likely to make a "personal life faltering" like Mr. Abramovich

Don't do the devils' advocate too much only in order to contradict people or you'll end up contradicting yourself

[Ezra]

That is an interesting point actually, but if you Google some earlier videos of Bill Gates -- I at least notice that Fe comes very awkward to him. Even in more recent videos -- Gates still after years seems much more at home with divulging facts and figures about Microsoft. I suspect that putting on a more qualitative vision for Microsoft for the press -- this is largely compelled by competitors' overwhelming emphasis on communicating to the public their vision. (case in point: apple.) in other words, you might say Gates is unusually forced to use his role function. less Microsoft lose marketshare because it is an imposing giant without a face.

I assume you're talking about the vision that you see in EIEs. Well, I see this vision not as Fe blocked with Ni, but as Ni. The Fe offers inspiration. Gates doesn't inspire; he divulges facts with a few good words on the new computer Microsoft is developing. That is fundamentally his style. So, if he has Fe role, but still manages to have vision (regardless of his ability to communicate said vision), it must be related to a different function. In this case, it's Ni.

No, I disagree completely. Abramovich caring more about money and image than gates = a point TOWARDS him being Ni subtype given that a Ni subtype would also have a more Se-centered and Fe centered lifestyle in comparison to Bill Gates.

I don't understand why Abramovich's being a Ni subtype would mean he is any more Se- or Fe-centred than a Te subtype.

What does seedy mean?

It means disreputable or run-down. One would probably call a red-light district seedy. Hookers, pimps and dealers (save barons, obviously) normally inhabit seedy areas of towns and cities.

I wouldn't say any of the subtypes are more or less concerned with making money -- perhaps just by different means and for different ends.

I'd be inclined to agree. Subtype theory is taken too far when one subtype desires something which is characteristic of the type itself more than the other subtype.

Bill Gates is clearly concerned with making money, too.

So is Abramavich in my opinion.

[FDG]

I don't understand why Abramovich's being a Ni subtype would mean he is any more Se- or Fe-centred than a Te subtype.

???

Ni-sub ENTj more similar to ENFj Te-subt ENTj more similar to ESTj of course

Ni-Se as being the peak of resolute

[Ezra]

???

Ni-sub ENTj more similar to ENFj Te-subt ENTj more similar to ESTj of course

Ni-Se as being the peak of resolute

FDG and I are talking about subtypes constructed by rotating around the quadra ring. Anyone can talk about any subtype construction they want -- but if yours is different, then it's unsurprising if we cannot reach consensus on celebrity subtypes.

Err, right, okay, well, I don't abide by that theory of subtypes.

[Minde]

Err, right, okay, well, I don't abide by that theory of subtypes.

Why not? And what then do you abide by?

[Ezra]

Why not? And what then do you abide by?

I've gone off subtypes. niffweed helped me. Basically, my reasons are here, under Socionics Opinions & Beliefs.

And FTR, I always thought this quadra ring theory was absolutely ridiculous and pointlessly abstract.

[FDG]

And FTR, I always thought this quadra ring theory was absolutely ridiculous and pointlessly abstract.

Then you understand absolutely nothing about socionics and should stop talking about it so much.

[Ezra]

Then you understand absolutely nothing about socionics and should stop talking about it so much.

Fuck, Fabio. I thought you were smarter than this.

[Ezra]

Classic.

[FDG]

i very-tentatively think Darya Zhukova could be ISTj-Se, but i'm mostly basing this off a vague resemblance to Catharine Zeta-Jones and the fact that Catharine Zeta-Jones also doesn't mind pairing with some peak-Se POLR guy (ENFj-Ni Michael Douglas) who is almost a generation her senior. (Douglas is older than his father-in-law lol)

Oh, ENFj-Ni for Michael Douglas? Wasn't he typed as ESTp by Russians? (not that I generally agree with Russians, really, I'm just throwing this here). Catharine Zeta Jones is extremely hot anyway.

Darya Zhukova, I cannot VI her, damn.

[implied]

http://www.thefashionspot.com/forums...a-56226-4.html

[FDG]

she is quite above average. but she also reminds me of what i mean and what i don't mean when i say i hate fast women. zeta jones is not superficially extravagant. a gamma SF is probably faster at spending money, but that is not the issue.

in conversations i think the Fe-seeking is obvious. where by that i mean, beta ST women seem as though they chiefly want to be entertained. and i am not a piece of meat damnit.

MMmmh yeh, I really just meant that I like her naked, how fast she orgasms is another thing...