Is Ezra Gamma?

[Joy]

vote please

[UDP]

This is entirely pointless. It simply doesn't matter what you think, or what you vote is. This isn't American Idol.

[Mediator Kam]

This is entirely pointless. It simply doesn't matter what you think, or what you vote is. This isn't American Idol.

^true^

Anyway, he bothers me a lot, some I have a feeling he's ENTj, assuming I am ISFp.

[Ezra]

UDP is right, Joy. These threads depend on people's opinion of my type, as opposed to what type I actually am.

[Joy]

Yes, but there's something to be said for intertype relations. If most of the Betas thought you weren't Beta, it might mean something. It doesn't mean much if they think you are though. Similarly, if most of the Gammas thought you were Gamma, it might mean something (but it doesn't mean much if they think you're not).

(I say "doesn't mean much" when votes correspond to long standing general consensus. It doesn't mean they're not right, just they're not offering any new information. We already know that the general consensus is that Ezra's SLE.)

[discojoe]

no

[BLauritson]

I don't really know Ezra well enough to judge his type or quadra. I know there's countless type threads about him but I haven't really got the patience to read them all, so.. I'd probably be more certain if I knew him IRL, but I suppose that's the case with most people anyway.

[Ezra]

Yes, but there's something to be said for intertype relations. If most of the Betas thought you weren't Beta, it might mean something. It doesn't mean much if they think you are though. Similarly, if most of the Gammas thought you were Gamma, it might mean something (but it doesn't mean much if they think you're not).

(I say "doesn't mean much" when votes correspond to long standing general consensus. It doesn't mean they're not right, just they're not offering any new information. We already know that the general consensus is that Ezra's SLE.)

The consensus is pretty clouded according to your two polls. 50/50 think I'm Gamma and not Gamma. 50/50 think I'm Beta and not Beta. In this case, I think it's fair to say that the people's opinion means nothing, because a) they probably don't care and b) they clearly don't have sound enough judgements.

[liveandletlive]

im so fucking sick of these people wanting other people, who've never met them or truly know them outside of their forum/online persona, type them.

[olduser]

,to type them. ,to type them. yeah, i agree though. i think ezra is gamma. he has that positive upbeat attitude. he reminds me of american football players in this regard. i imagine him speaking in third person and such. but anyway, gamma. and it's always me me me with ezra. never us us us like most betas i've met.

[Joy]

he reminds me of american football players in this regard. i imagine him speaking in third person and such.

I don't see that at all.

but anyway, gamma. and it's always me me me with ezra. never us us us like most betas i've met.

good observation

(I don't think me me me is a bad thing, btw. I think everyone should be like this, in a healthy way. And I don't think Ezra does it in an unhealthy way.)

[Elro]

i think ezra is gamma. he has that positive upbeat attitude.

Gamma has a positive upbeat attitude?

[Joy]

Gamma has a positive upbeat attitude?

The extroverts do.

[olduser]

I don't see that at all.


good observation

(I don't think me me me is a bad thing, btw. I think everyone should be like this, in a healthy way. And I don't think Ezra does it in an unhealthy way.)

i agree. i was trying not to give a negative description of ezra. and yeah, the third person thing was an exaggeration. I see ezra as more of a guy who talks a lot and talks specifically alot about what he thinks about things. i mean, a lot of conversation is like this, but i can see ezra being insistent upon addressing what he thinks in conversation.

[olduser]

Gamma has a positive upbeat attitude?

oh most definitely. have you ever met any entj? a lot of them are superiorly outgoing and friendly, interested people. some are dorky, sure, but others aren't. a good entj stereotype: the pragmatic engineering major who is really interested in how things work, etc. There are shitloads of these types where i live.

[crazedrat]

he's not beta. most people in beta are retarded with typing people, that is all. They look toward specific demonstrated behaviors, which varies too much with the situation.

[Joy]

I think a lot of LIE's are more interested in enterprising (business and investing) than in acadamia though. It's too easy to start/acquire businesses and high yield investments in the US not to draw many LIE's to interests such as these. Most of them may have regular careers, but the company pension plan and social security are probably the last things they look to when they're making long term financial plans. I think there are a whole lot without regular careers too though. They'll get into a specific field for five or so years (often for the purpose of starting a business or learning stuff that'll help them invest), then get interested in another field. Even the ones who spend a decade in school often do so with the intent of using their knowledge/credentials for business/investing purposes.

Te subtypes are very open and will never shut up about the latest thing they've learned/done/planned.

This is probably true of most LIE's, I would think. There's also almost always going to be a casual interest in science.

[Expat]

im so fucking sick of these people wanting other people, who've never met them or truly know them outside of their forum/online persona, type them.

I've met Ezra 3 times now.

In my opinion, Beta or Gamma are a given; Alpha or Delta can be safely dismissed.

If he's Gamma, then I think SEE rather than LIE. But I still think SLE is more likely.

[Ezra]

Well, Isha with her biblical Ni has just given me a new, fresh perspective. No Ni ego. No no no. I know what Ni is, and I know I want it, and I know I'm not it.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

Well, Isha with her biblical Ni has just given me a new, fresh perspective. No Ni ego. No no no. I know what Ni is, and I know I want it, and I know I'm not it.

I know it's not the best to compare like this, but do you see yourself as more like Herzy or Expat?

[implied]

i think i agree with expat that i would still imagine SLE to be more likely.

[Phaedrus]

I've met Ezra 3 times now.

In my opinion, Beta or Gamma are a given; Alpha or Delta can be safely dismissed.

If he's Gamma, then I think SEE rather than LIE. But I still think SLE is more likely.

Okay, if you are right about that, Ezra is necessarily either a LIE or a totally confused SEE or SLE. The most simple explanation is of course to assume that he is a LIE.

To assume that Ezra is more most likely an SLE and more likely an SEE than a LIE is an insult to his intelligence in the same way that you habitually insult other people here by questioning their self-typings and thereby indirectly assume that they are completely lost and deluded. It is of course not totally out of the question that some people here really are lost and deluded, but such explanations always have an irritatingly conspiratory touch, and are therefore not likely to be true. The most likely explanation is without doubt that Ezra is a LIE.

[Logos]

Biblical?

That was my question too.

[Ezra]

By biblical, I mean prophetic; revelatory; brilliant; fantastic. I was giving a massive compliment.

I know it's not the best to compare like this, but do you see yourself as more like Herzy or Expat?

Expat is LIE. I am not LIE. I am Se ego, almost certainly Se leading.

Same, though I'm leaning towards SEE>SLE at this moment. He can have the dubious pleasure of being my dual.

I can still be your semi dual.

Okay, if you are right about that, Ezra is necessarily either a LIE or a totally confused SEE or SLE. The most simple explanation is of course to assume that he is a LIE.

To assume that Ezra is more most likely an SLE and more likely an SEE than a LIE is an insult to his intelligence in the same way that you habitually insult other people here by questioning their self-typings and thereby indirectly assume that they are completely lost and deluded. It is of course not totally out of the question that some people here really are lost and deluded, but such explanations always have an irritatingly conspiratory touch, and are therefore not likely to be true. The most likely explanation is without doubt that Ezra is a LIE.

Shut the fuck up, Phaedrus.

[Phaedrus]

Expat is LIE. I am not LIE. I am Se ego, almost certainly Se leading.

You are the same type as Expat. And Expat is not leading.

Shut the fuck up, Phaedrus.

No. You need to accept the facts. Accept the facts. Stop treating the empirical evidence like dirt. Stop inventing your own version of Socionics. Stop believing that you are leading. You simply don't understand that function.

[marooned]

By biblical, I mean prophetic; revelatory; brilliant; fantastic. I was giving a massive compliment.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic. I hate the internet.

[Brilliand]

No. You need to accept the facts. Accept the facts. Stop treating the empirical evidence like dirt. Stop inventing your own version of Socionics. Stop believing that you are leading. You simply don't understand that function.

Now what types treat empirical evidence like dirt?

[Joy]

While Ezra's overall "feel" fits SEE better than LIE, I don't really have any big problems with his being LIE (though he does seem to be more comfortable complimenting others than the typical LIE, I don't think that necessarily means that he's not LIE). I do, however, have a problem with SEE, and that's Ti.

Anyone remember my first topic here? Instead of describing myself, I came in and listed my types in like 3 other systems, asking what that would make me in Socionics. This isn't unlike Ezra's approach concerning correlating Socionics with other systems. (I think he gets too caught up in it sometimes, but perhaps that's to be expected from someone who was so familiar with other systems before developing interest in Socionics.) Is this how we'd expect a SEE to think?

I think the way his intertype relations have played out since he's been here have shown that he's Gamma > Beta, and I think that functionally it makes more sense for him to be LIE than SEE. And while I don't think that we should use other typology systems to type him, I do think that his being an enneagram 8 and an MBTT ENTJ suggest LIE > SEE.

[Elro]

No. You need to accept the facts. Accept the facts.

Who decides what the facts are?

[implied]

ah, wow! i haven't thought of that in ages! i never liked them much though! (maybe less now that i realize that the authors were "stan & jan berenstain.")

[aestrivex]

somebody tell me why everybody is suddenly jumping on the gamma bandwagon as opposed to SLE.

[Joy]

somebody tell me why everybody is suddenly jumping on the gamma bandwagon as opposed to SLE.

Everyone? Other than FDG, who else is there?

My only two recent Beta to Gamma type switches have been ScarlettLux and Ezra.

[implied]

Everyone? Other than FDG, who else is there?

My only two recent Beta to Gamma type switches have been ScarlettLux and Ezra.

fdg thinks ezra is gamma? i didn't know this. at any rate, i still think SLE is probably more likely and beta quadra makes a lot of sense. he has some Se traits but you really can't be SeFi if you're not showing much Fi. perhaps i'm missing it but i haven't seen it yet.

[aestrivex]

Everyone? Other than FDG, who else is there?

My only two recent Beta to Gamma type switches have been ScarlettLux and Ezra.

you misunderstand. i'm saying tell me why you and others have suddenly decided that ezra is SEE/LIE instead of SLE.

[Joy]

fdg thinks ezra is gamma?

No, he thinks he's gamma.

[Khamelion]

No, he thinks he's gamma.

is that tiramisu? o_o

[Khamelion]

All I have to say on the matter is that...Ezra makes me think of Naruto almost immediately.


Oh, and that I'd greatly enjoy spending time with him. Half of the reason being that I'm intrigued, the other half because I'm failrly confident I would not be bored much at all.

[Joy]

you misunderstand. i'm saying tell me why you and others have suddenly decided that ezra is SEE/LIE instead of SLE.

The way forum members respond to him, and the way he responds to forum members.

From the beginning I said that my preliminary typing of him was SLE, but that we'd have to wait to see how his interactions would play out over time in order to have a better idea of what his type was. At this point, people from other quadras has said that he pretends to be tough and that he speaks too highly of himself. From what I've seen, it's been the Gamma quadra members here who don't have these complaints about him. And he's been more complimentary of Gamma quadra members than any other.

And I dunno, if I was younger and had higher levels of testosterone, I could maybe see myself being somewhat similar to him.

[Joy]

is that tiramisu? o_o

haha yes!

(funny that you asked me that after quoting a post about FDG)

[implied]

but you could be some other ethicist who ignores Fi. that was my _initial typing for Ezra and IIRC at the time FDG was skeptical of ESTp/ENTj too.

maybe i shouldn't have flinched. (still not quite sure i understand Se yet though so this suggestion is not binding.)

yeah i agree you can be other fi-ignoring ethicists. (; and i had a similar impression. i do think though i'll have to see some presence of Fi (err, in either plus or minus form, haha) in some form to really consider gamma though.