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    Default Mirror Relations: Stories and Experiences

    I would like to start a new thread about mirror relations that are romantic.

    Im just wondering if others feel that their mirrors are more attractive than their duals, your romantic experiences with them, theory about why they affect you a certain way, if NTs STs SFs and what have you are more likely to form mirror couples, etc.

    Yes, there is personal motivation for this but I don't think it really matters. I'll take the answer off the air. (Basically i'm just confused as to why i'm so attracted to my mirror and wonder if others have the same experience, etc). Im not trying to make it about me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington View Post
    I would like to start a new thread about mirror relations that are romantic.

    Im just wondering if others feel that their mirrors are more attractive than their duals, your romantic experiences with them, theory about why they affect you a certain way, if NTs STs SFs and what have you are more likely to form mirror couples, etc.

    Yes, there is personal motivation for this but I don't think it really matters. I'll take the answer off the air. (Basically i'm just confused as to why i'm so attracted to my mirror and wonder if others have the same experience, etc). Im not trying to make it about me.
    I don't think mirrors are necessarily more attractive than their duals; I do think that mirror couples are very common, because they share the quadra values and the club, so mirrors are people who often share common interests and views, at first seemingly more than duals. Mirrors are perhaps easier to undertand even before getting to know them well.

    For instance, following cliches (which have some basis on truth), who are more likely to hang around in the same circles and do the same kind of actitivies, INTjs and ESFjs, or INTjs and ENTps? I think that's the main factor.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    INTjs are always hiding from me.
    I can never find one!

    Well, there was this one who was studying
    to be an architect
    who told me he would build me a house,
    but I wasn't into his style (wraparoundporcheskindofstuff),
    so I declined.

    But man, I loved his hair!
    No one else did, but wow.
    It was like brown and curly and past his jawbone
    and it was like big enough to hide things in
    and it was seriously like the most
    amazing hair I have ever seen and I wanted
    to put my phone in it so bad
    and then call it to see if he knew
    because I would probably just think
    that it was just in my head
    but not him because he was so smart
    and would definitely have noticed
    a cell phone in his hair cause he was just
    that kind of cell phone in the hair noticing kind of
    person right right?




    On second thought, he might be another type.
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    One of my best friends is married to her mirror. They met in grad school and were drawn together through similar intellectual interests. They happen to be INTj-ENTp and they have a very good marriage (going on 15 years). The one major negative (and imo it's a pretty big negative) is that there's a lack of emotional expression (positive, towards each other) in the marriage. Neither of them are good at this and they both need it. On the other hand there isn't much negative expression either and the home is a very emotionally even-keeled one and quite logical (which I admire myself and wish we had around here!) Sex life is sketchy also but they're the best of friends and do love each other deeply. When I talk to her, I can clearly see how she would appreciate MY husband (her dual, ESFj) because he's so expressive and doesn't hold back his feelings. We have the opposite problem around here (SO much emotion, positive but negative too), lots of sex (not that that's a problem), LOL

    As for me, I admire my mirror but I've never been attracted to that type in that kind of way.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Mirror's are sooo attractive... it's like finally finding someone like you, just a tiny bit different. I think I'd be very happy with a mirror relationship but there'd probably be something telling me that I needed something else and off I'd go hunting for that again. Maybe anyway.
    ENTp... love it

    3w2

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    I love mirror relations.. for me personally, they're second only to dual relations, although both relationship types are fun in their own ways. I've never been in a romantic relation with a mirror, although there is a female LIE on a college course I'm doing that I've sort of got my eyes on. Based on what interaction I have had with LIEs, I find that working together works very well (we seem to naturally understand eachother's ways of going about tasks) and conversation is usually quite fun. I haven't had enough extensive interaction with mirrors outside of work to really comment on that, but I don't think I've ever had a bad experience with an LIE.
    ILI (Indescribable Lovemaking Inc.)
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    I'm not sure how a mirror relationship for me would be. The only male INFj I know is my coworker, and he seems pretty cool and laid back. He's really easy to talk to.. I get along well with them, but some issues I've had with a couple female INFjs were that they seemed to look down their nose at me for certain things.. That would drive me freakin' crazy if I knew my significant other was looking at me with condescension for things that I'm not very good at (ie - organizing every last detail of my life). I always get the feeling they're trying to be my mom. Who knows, though. Maybe I'll end up meeting a guy and think differently...

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    I came back from the dead to answer this.

    I personally find my mirrors very attractive and I'm more often attracted to them instead of my duals.

    But I kinda feel like although I'm usually more attarcted to my mirrors I'm still more compatable with my duals. Does that make sense?

    Not to say that I'm not attracted to my duals.
    There's actually one ENTp that I find insanely attractive.
    It's just more often it's an ESFj than an ENTp that I'm attracted to.

    But I think maybe there needs to be a distinction between compatability and attraction...seems weird but I think it's possible for us to be attracted to people we're not compatable with. Expat, what do you think about all this?

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    Does anyone else have anything to say about this topic?
    Theories?
    Personal experiences?
    Anything?

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    Quote Originally Posted by theMime. View Post
    Does anyone else have anything to say about this topic?
    Theories?
    Personal experiences?
    Anything?
    Who was i talking to.. Someone on the forum who said that Mirror relationships are lacking a certian fire to them. Mrs Kensington i think? I actually agree with this. I had a date a while ago with an INFj girl and we both went all quiet and didn't talk much. It was fairly comfortable though. I think the poor thing was shocked when i said we should just be friends, because she took it personally (when she was awesome). She also agreed the sexual attraction wasn't really there.
    ENFp (Unsure of Subtype)

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    I'm dating an ESTj right now. One of the first things I noticed about him is that he was wearing the same kind of shoes I was. After several months of just being friends-of-friends, we learned enough about one another to realize that
    1) we're a lot more reliable about doing what we say we'll do than our other buds
    2) we both like going dancing and playing pool (and since then he's taken up table tennis for me and I've taken up footbag for him)
    3) we both like to make extremely cutting jokes, and to keep up witty banter for as long as possible, but then can drop it as soon as it gets tiresome for either of us
    4) we both have an inordinate appreciation for well-shaped female rear ends, and delight in pointing them out to one another
    5) we're both workaholics while at work, and like to work as little as possible away from work - also we can't stand people who don't think for themselves; either of us could have come up with that "work smarter not harder" cliche (a lot of our conversation ends up being about logical inconsistencies we are forced to endure at our respective wage-slave-pens)
    ...
    All this eventually led to us discovering that not only do we wear the same kind of shoes (which each of us bought long before we met one another) ...
    we also wear the same kind of socks (white Hanes)! (If it isn't obvious, we figured this out the first time we slept together)
    We still crack up about that.

    Oh yeah, and neither of us is good about talking about "us". We don't use endearments like "honey" or "dear" nor do we have "our" song. It was mainly just two friends who have fun together who decided to become fuck buddies and then eventually something else developed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Bukowski
    We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.
    SLI

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    I seem to have a cold detatchment to INFj's, while not minding to hang around them
    YES. But why... WHY?!

    I agree, it's pretty weird. I'll never understand it.

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    I like my mirrors, duals, semi duals, hell i can even respect my conflictors.

    But my supervisors can go fuck themselves
    "Those who make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities..."

    - Voltaire

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    Quote Originally Posted by LokiVanguard View Post
    I like my mirrors, duals, semi duals, hell i can even respect my conflictors.

    But my supervisors can go fuck themselves
    really?

    weird how that is...some of us love supervisory relationships and some of us hate em.

    the only ESTj I know, I like.

    I like my kindreds. =)

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    Default Chris Crocker is my mirror

    "However, Mirror partners are often very good friends. When they work together on the same project, their mutual correction and adjustment becomes a constructive criticism that is usually accepted as useful."

    This is so true. I corrected Chris on one of his videos and he actually listened to me and edited the part I didn't like out. (He never told me thanks for this or was very warm about it, he just did it.) Don't know why exactly he did that, since you'd think he would go "Fuck you I'm a fag I do what I want, BITCH!" but he found the information useful.

    This socionics stuff really seems to be working, although I hope I'm not just finding evidence for what I'm trying to see. I'll continue to do more tests though.

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    Hah!

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    hah!
    "Those who make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities..."

    - Voltaire

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    from toronto with love ScarlettLux's Avatar
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    Lmao, I love that guy for some reason.


    Dress pretty, play dirty ღ
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    I don't know about love, but we would get along together as friends. Chris can also be surprisingly practical at times while still providing the warm, loving & encouraging atmosphere that I need. (I know that sounds deceptively ESFj, but he's just way too activist-y and 'I want to change the world' instead of, 'I want to use the world's resources to be comfortable.')

    ESFjs (er ESEs sorry I'll try to talk in correct socionics-speak) make horrible activists because they are just too concerned with providing comfort in exchange for really, honest change in the world- which requires more push and and uncomfortableness. In fact I have never met any good ESE activist, I just couldn't picture it. Oh well we'll bash alpha another day.

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    Default Mirror relationship

    It sucks.

    Yes you are good friends, but next to that, you only quarrel, both don't understand what the other person is trying to say. You get accusations etc etc. Both think the other person is stupid.

    I say it's the worst quadra relationship, both romantically as for friendship.

    What are your experiences?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Allie View Post
    Um, are you sure you're typing your mirrors correctly? They're not like that at all.
    how are mirrors then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Allie View Post
    Ugh. I hate when people ask questions like that. What do you want, a description? Mirrors are a lot of things.
    Yes I would like to know why you think hot disputes like I have described aren't part of a mirror relationship.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Allie View Post
    You pick out "hot disputes" from a number of other characteristics you described in your post and ask me why this isn't found in mirror relations. Please, obviously I am not disagreeing with one specific trait, but rather, the entire impression of the relation you described.
    The hot disputes, which have all the elements which I have described are the frustrating part of the mirror relationship which (in my case) seem to overwhelm the good parts of the relationship.

    It might be because a mirror relationship in my case consist of an ILI and LIE who are both known to not back up when discussing a subject. Discussing is something they both like, and therefor it often ends up to a so called hot dispute.

    Just wondering how it is in other mirror relationships.

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    I dont think mirrors are the worst quadra relationship. I think identicals would be worse (i see relationships as long term and i dont think identicals would ever work long term). I also think Mirror relationships would be better than a whole lot of other out of quadra relationships thats for sure.

    Interestingly, an INTp and ENTj relationship of my friend just disintegrated recently out of the blue. They were together for about 5 years. Everyone thought they were a wonderful couple (i mostly did too), and they didn't ever seem to fight. Then one day she said shes moving, he didn't want to and poof all over.

    I actually understand the arguments that Jarno is talking about. I find INFj's do want to argue with me every now and then. Its very annoying and draining to me and it does push me away. I also perceive some level of competition from them. My INFj friend tells me things like "I really think this move will be good for you, you really need to do something with your life". While this is true, comming from him its laughable because he really needs to take his own advice. Its also just socially unacceptable the way he just blurts it out.

    I also think all mirror relationships are different, and some are better than others. When mirror relationships are good, they can be soo warm and nice and fun and awesome. I dont think im gonna persue one if i can help it though.
    ENFp (Unsure of Subtype)

    "And the day came when the risk it took to remain closed in a bud became more painful than the risk it took to blossom." - Anaïs Nin

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    It sucks.

    Yes you are good friends, but next to that, you only quarrel, both don't understand what the other person is trying to say. You get accusations etc etc. Both think the other person is stupid.

    I say it's the worst quadra relationship, both romantically as for friendship.

    What are your experiences?
    I would like to add that ENTj is not the easier person to get along with.
    (D)IEE~FI-(C)SLE~Ni E-5w4(Sp/Sx)/7w8(So/Sp)/9w1(sp/sx)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    1)
    A girl who I want to date, asks me: well first tell me how tall you are?
    My reply: well I will answer that, if you first tell me how much you weigh!

    2)
    A girl I was dating said she was oh so great at sex etc, but she didn't do blowjobs.
    My reply: Oh I'm really romantic etc, I just will never take you out to dinner.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mpiazza000 View Post
    I would like to add that ENTj is not the easier person to get along with.
    Yes I agree, they are competitive and assertive. Two things that really fire up the disputes.

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    Hm. Well, my mirror SO and I have been together for about 14 months now; living together for 10 months. We get along great.

    The only time we argue about anything is when it's so trivial that we're willing to. For example, I said his couch was grey and he insisted it was green. We discussed at great length where to draw the line between the two, and finally we both pulled out our digital cameras, loaded pictures onto the computer, and compared where the color histogram came out. We had smiles on our faces the whole time because we knew it was silly, but neither of us was going to back down.

    In contrast, when our opinions differ about something substantial, we will calmly and respectfully discuss it until we see closure on the issue, which might take what we both later admit was a longer time than we thought it would. I'm trying to think of an example, but until I do, I'll just mention that it happens a few times a month. Sometimes I get frustrated because it seems like we've wasted time talking about something for 30 minutes or more that in the end seemed like it should have only taken 5 ... but most of the time it actually turns out that we actually want the same thing, and we're just explaining it differently. And to be perfectly honest, it's usually my argument that I end up concluding was not succinctly presented, necessitating some hashing out of basically semantics. If I were looking for an excuse, I'd attribute it to my IP-ness.

    We work together very well, possibly due to both focusing on efficiency and competency in completing tasks. We usually play well together, too, as long as I don't beat him too badly in something (for example, he won't play pool with me any more; but he shows a lot of patience with me as I learn to play hackeysack, something he's quite good at, from scratch). We share chores and bills quite equitably. And we're both fairly self-sufficient, so if one wants to do something the other doesn't, neither acts insecure about doing things apart.

    We're quite obviously not what socionics models as a dual pair, but I like the way the relationship is going. If I were to make any predictions on upcoming friction, I would wonder if he's going to get frustrated by how unfocused I am in my ambitions (which again I could make excuses for by claiming IP-ness), and/or if I might get frustrated that he's so ginger he's practically afraid of the sun and thus unlikely to play outdoors as much as I like (which got nuttin' ta do with type, probably). But the future never turns out the way we anticipate anyway ...
    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Bukowski
    We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.
    SLI

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    Sounds good.

    thanks for your input.

    I'm seeming to get along a bit better lately with my mirror, now I'm focussed on not letting the discussion get out of hand. Although we still sometimes have this thing, that we misunderstand eachother slightly. It's weird. We both mean to say good things, but the other person assumes it's meant as a bad thing, a serious remark when it's a joke. etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord View Post
    no.
    at all attracted to ENTj female then?
    (D)IEE~FI-(C)SLE~Ni E-5w4(Sp/Sx)/7w8(So/Sp)/9w1(sp/sx)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    1)
    A girl who I want to date, asks me: well first tell me how tall you are?
    My reply: well I will answer that, if you first tell me how much you weigh!

    2)
    A girl I was dating said she was oh so great at sex etc, but she didn't do blowjobs.
    My reply: Oh I'm really romantic etc, I just will never take you out to dinner.

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    I have several friends in mirror marriages. They seem to be pretty happy from what I can tell. I don't think I've ever dated an EII though.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    ILE - ENTp 1981slater's Avatar
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    Default x

    I've noticed most mirror couples are ethical. What do you think about this?
    ILE "Searcher"
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    I've noticed most mirror couples are ethical. What do you think about this?
    Now that you mention it, all the mirror couples I know are ethical. I hadn't noticed that before.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


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    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker Mom View Post
    Now that you mention it, all the mirror couples I know are ethical. I hadn't noticed that before.
    That's because only ethicals can get in relationships. Logicals are too busy being idiots...

    ;_;
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    Quote Originally Posted by 07490 View Post
    at all attracted to ENTj female then?
    Hehe just not in relationship with one I know my answer was kinda vague, because I thought it would be funny to say that.
    ...the human race will disappear. Other races will appear and disappear in turn. The sky will become icy and void, pierced by the feeble light of half-dead stars. Which will also disappear. Everything will disappear. And what human beings do is just as free of sense as the free motion of elementary particles. Good, evil, morality, feelings? Pure 'Victorian fictions'.

    INTp

  35. #35

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    I guess you deserve a serious answer.

    I don't see why INTp-ENTj relationship wouldn't be possible, there's probably lot more of those in practice than INTp-ESFp relationships.

    I generally like ENTj's. And of my personal experience with ENTj girls. There was a ENTj girl at my old workplace, and she seemed to be happy and interested in talking with me, maybe more with me than with other people in general. It was bit taxing though, because it was like both were waiting for the other to connect on deeper level, but neither made an iniative. She was the one who was engaging the conversations though. There was also another ENTj girl that talked with me on MSN, it was quite similar. These descriptions could be all in my head though, I'm not sure at all about this type of stuff. So I don't know what they really thinked about me and the situation.
    ...the human race will disappear. Other races will appear and disappear in turn. The sky will become icy and void, pierced by the feeble light of half-dead stars. Which will also disappear. Everything will disappear. And what human beings do is just as free of sense as the free motion of elementary particles. Good, evil, morality, feelings? Pure 'Victorian fictions'.

    INTp

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    Quote Originally Posted by 07490 View Post
    has anyone been in one?
    Yes, couple of months ago, I made a thread about it, how our disputes were a bit to agressive. She was LIE-ni

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    Quote Originally Posted by 07490 View Post
    has anyone been in one?
    There's been at least 2 threads on this topic that I've responded to, so I will try to not repeat what I've already mentioned. FTR, he's LSE & I'm SLI.

    My SO & I weren't going to date at first; just be friends-with-benefits. But we kept hanging out more and more often, and eventually we were showing affection to each other (like holding hands) even in public, and when people asked if we were dating, it became official. Things have progressed very naturally since then, with matters like how to divide paying for things, moving in together, hanging out with our nonmutual friends, meeting family, and going on long trips not being discussed at length except as the need arises.

    Overall, we have a very comfortable coexistence with lots of mutual respect and general silliness. The roughest parts of the relationship are in communication, because we tend to say very similar things in such different ways that we can spend minutes just figuring out that we don't disagree. Sometimes it's amusing; other times it's frustrating because each of us likes being efficient. Fortunately, it doesn't happen often, and it has yet to trip us up in a time-sensitive situation.

    There's been a few situations where I thought to myself that we could really use some an Fi-type around ... but overall, I think we relate to each other just fine, and he is great with other people, so as long as he doesn't afterwards subject me to a lecture about it, I let him handle all the "I'm doing great today, thanks!" kind of interactions (and grateful to be able to do so!).
    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Bukowski
    We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.
    SLI

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    Default Subtype and mirror relations

    How does subtype play a role in mirror relations? I've seen stuff written about subtype's role in activity and dual relations but nothing on the mirror relation. For instance, would an LII-Ne subtype typically prefer ILE-Ti or ILE-Ne? Or is there a difference?
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    From my own personal experience it's most fun to have corresponding subtypes.

    So both producing in my case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by warrior-librarian View Post
    How does subtype play a role in mirror relations? I've seen stuff written about subtype's role in activity and dual relations but nothing on the mirror relation. For instance, would an LII-Ne subtype typically prefer ILE-Ti or ILE-Ne? Or is there a difference?
    Generally, (to use your example,) a Ne-LII would get along better--at least, be more on the same page with--a Ti-ILE than a Ne-ILE.

    For example, in my case, I tend to get along better with Fe-INFps than Ni-INFps. (producing subtype betas > accepting subtype betas.)

    Even with corresponding subtypes, I've noticed that the rhythms (j/p) in mirror relationships can cause some problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Isha View Post
    I really imagine that personal differences will have a greater difference than subtype.
    This is probably true.

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