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Thread: Alpha and career management

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    eunice's Avatar
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    Default Alpha and career management

    I have made an interesting observation that Alpha types tend to be less likely engage in job-hopping and seem to stay in an organization longer than average. I thought it is interesting since most people tend to have the misconception that Alpha types are flaky and random people. Btw, I am not implying that they are stuck in a rut since they still undergo healthy career advancement within the organization. I have a fair share of job interviews with Alpha SFs and I have learnt that they have been in the same establishment since they graduated from college or/and have been part of it for a decade on average.

    For jobs which they are passionate about, Alpha types are only compelled to change their jobs when their level of comfort and security are been threatened eg. disharmonious supervisor-subordinate relationship, too much familiarity with the job scope to the extent that it dulls their working experience, change in management which leads to immediate realization that their jobs are in danger of redundancy etc.

    I believe that what motivates them to stay with the company is seeing the organization as a family (if they feel happy working with their co-workers) with everyone working together as a group while having individual goals at the same time, basically supporting each other to reach one's potential. Even when they are "stuck" in a repetitive or/and deskbound job, they are still capable of seeking humor in the simple things in life, basically turning a lemon into a lemonade. They also see a job not only as a means to make ends meet, but also to support their hobbies, an area which they are esteemed about. In some instances, they might even place more importance on their hobbies than their career paths. In contrary to conventional viewpoints, they can be suspicious when someone switches his job too often (*coughENTjcough*) and question his commitment.

    In terms of remuneration, I have mixed observations about their attitudes to it. I have known a few Alpha SF types IRL who regard it as the most important feature in a job, and most are not particular about it as long as they are been compensated fairly.


    (After reading my post, in case you are wondering, that's not the reason for my current signature. It is just an observation I have made from a bystander's point of view.)

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    normal's Avatar
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    yeah, maybe a bit obssesed about ALPHA SF. But anyway, my inner-sei told me about a few things about job.

    - I don't like routine.
    - I like to be in a place when people told each other what thing is good or bad done without prejudices. That level of confidence (you call it a "family") its great.
    - Money its, probably the most important about job. Without money, you can't get any good pleasure.
    - Motivation probably is not the correct word; perseverance it is. You can get really motivated about doing a job (probably because is good for people, youll get some good experience or you would something new), but my lack of will strike my motivation... probably send him to hell, and game over. You have to start all over again, waiting/looking again for motivation/oportunities and avoid doing the same fucking shit all the day...

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    I would also imagine that if anyone from their in-job "family" quit or changed jobs, they would somehow feel betrayed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logos View Post
    I would also imagine that if anyone from their in-job "family" quit or changed jobs, they would somehow feel betrayed.
    maybe.
    I wouldn't feel betrayed though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eunice View Post
    I have made an interesting observation that Alpha types tend to be less likely engage in job-hopping and seem to stay in an organization longer than average. I thought it is interesting since most people tend to have the misconception that Alpha types are flaky and random people. Btw, I am not implying that they are stuck in a rut since they still undergo healthy career advancement within the organization. I have a fair share of job interviews with Alpha SFs and I have learnt that they have been in the same establishment since they graduated from college or/and have been part of it for a decade on average.

    For jobs which they are passionate about, Alpha types are only compelled to change their jobs when their level of comfort and security are been threatened eg. disharmonious supervisor-subordinate relationship, too much familiarity with the job scope to the extent that it dulls their working experience, change in management which leads to immediate realization that their jobs are in danger of redundancy etc.

    I believe that what motivates them to stay with the company is seeing the organization as a family (if they feel happy working with their co-workers) with everyone working together as a group while having individual goals at the same time, basically supporting each other to reach one's potential. Even when they are "stuck" in a repetitive or/and deskbound job, they are still capable of seeking humor in the simple things in life, basically turning a lemon into a lemonade. They also see a job not only as a means to make ends meet, but also to support their hobbies, an area which they are esteemed about. In some instances, they might even place more importance on their hobbies than their career paths. In contrary to conventional viewpoints, they can be suspicious when someone switches his job too often (*coughENTjcough*) and question his commitment.

    In terms of remuneration, I have mixed observations about their attitudes to it. I have known a few Alpha SF types IRL who regard it as the most important feature in a job, and most are not particular about it as long as they are been compensated fairly.


    (After reading my post, in case you are wondering, that's not the reason for my current signature. It is just an observation I have made from a bystander's point of view.)
    Wow, You have me pegged. If I were to ever write anything like this I easily could have written what you did word for word... well, except the word remuneration... that's a bit much for me...lol.

    Other than being a little entrepreneur before I was legal age to work, I've only had 4 actual jobs. One of which I started and then made the decision to go to college soon after, so that one was the only one I've ever done for an amount shorter than 2 years. During high school I had a job for a bit over 2 years. Then I started tech school and had the same job for the 2 years I did that. Finally, after getting a degree I've been with the same company for 7.5 years. Though, I have moved around in this company a bit due to some of the reasons you posted above. For me to change jobs things just have to look "right" to me. I wouldn't leave a job for lower pay and I wouldn't leave a job because I "don't like somebody" like many people I've known in the past have done.

    My moves within this company have all been due to circumstances that came up where I felt that a change needed to happen. I've worked in three Fabs (place where we make silicon wafers into microprocessors) since I've been with this company now. When I moved from my first Fab to the second one it was due to wanting to get into a newer place that was just built where I could find more advancement. I went from a place where I was just another person at the bottom of the totem pole and there were many that had been there for ages... causing people to have more "respect" due to how long they'd been there and nothing due to the quality and efficiency of their work. So, when I moved I went to a "new" Fab where we were all on somewhat of the same level and I quickly bounced up the chain due to a great work ethic and ability to get the job done. Once I was noticed it was much easier to get the "respect" I felt I had always deserved. With this "respect" comes more money also.

    When I decided to move from the second Fab I was in back in Arizona to the place I'm at now in Oregon, it was due to many factors but first and foremost because I broke up with a g/f. How sad huh? lol.
    Before I put in for the job I have now, the company had decided to convert the first Fab I was in to a different process. Meaning, instead of using 8 inch wafers they were moving up to using 12 inch wafers. This was a HUGE step as far as the company is concerned, also where the semiconductor industry was headed anyway. I put in for a job in the other fab as a Seed. Seed positions are a group that goes to Oregon to train on a new process and then takes that back to their Fab to train everyone else in the Fab they are training for. I'd put in for one of those seed assignments, for much the same reason as I'd moved earlier in my career, 2 years prior to that.
    So, people start getting calls telling them if they've been accepted or not. I never even received a phone call about it so I questioned my manager about it. She then told me that she'd pulled my name out of it since my area "couldn't lose me" due to the role that I had on my team at the time. While this is good for my ego, I didn't like how it affected my career. So, I just got mad about it and got over it a few weeks later.
    Fast forward a month or two and me and my g/f of 2.5 years break up. She moved out and about a month later I found out that there were positions up here in Oregon working with technology development. In short, doing what I did in AZ but with the best technology available along with being pretty much the starting point for anything new that we put out on the market. So, with the drama I had going on in AZ I pounced all over the thought of getting away and just not dealing with it anymore.

    So, I got the job here in Oregon. I'm #1 in my area in pretty much every way a person can be. This has led to getting a nice promo this past year along with a monster raise. I work with the newest equipment and automation to get people from other Fabs across the world trained on what I do. I've trained people from Ireland, Costa Rica, Israel, and all the Fabs we have across the US. I'm actually still looking at getting a Seed assignment for 2 years in China, but that Fabs start date has been pushed out a couple years due to whatever.
    So, with all that said, you were spot on as far as staying in a place for a long time unless problems arise or something better comes along.

    As for why I love my job...lol, I get massive amount of time off... not just including vacation... I only work 7 of every 14 days and have a 4 day weekend every other week. This gives me very very much time to take care of any hobbies or interests I have or find.

    As for being passionate about my job, there's nobody I've ever worked with that wouldn't agree that I am. Hell, I loved going to work when I was at Dairy Queen... seriously, who does that...lol.

    Yes, other than people I knew growing up in Tennessee 90% of my friends and acquaintances are from work and I've always looked at it as family. A real company man is a good way of putting it. Though, there are those times I'm reminded that in the grand scheme of things I'm really just an 8 digit number. But I'm ok with that knowing that the people around me that have worked with or know me will never forget me.

    *I could seriously talk about work all day if I had the right audience or people actually wanted to hear about it...lol.*

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    i thought the first alpha was a fluke, but now that there are several responses I feel compelled to say that I don't identify with that very much at all, especially feeling betrayed. I'ts work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by normal View Post
    - I like to be in a place when people told each other what thing is good or bad done without prejudices. That level of confidence (you call it a "family") its great.
    - Money its, probably the most important about job. Without money, you can't get any good pleasure.
    Yeah, I would love to be in an environment where people are open and direct with one another, giving constructive feedbacks for improvement. However, I believe that such an environment is relatively uncommon since people tend to be guarded against one another, especially in most companies in the private sector. Speaking of that, I notice that most Alpha types (including the NTs) would enjoy working in the government sector or statutory boards. I have the impression that government organizations are more structured, transparent with the salary scale, have more defined job scopes, supportive of upgrading of skills etc.. Moreover, they have attractive fringe benefits and work-life balance. As such, an Alpha type would consider such an organization desirable. As for the issue about money, I agree that it is the strongest motivating factor to make someone persevere on, especially when occasionally faced with unpleasant tasks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Logos View Post
    I would also imagine that if anyone from their in-job "family" quit or changed jobs, they would somehow feel betrayed.
    Hmmmm, not necessarily. I guess they would most likely feel that their work arrangement has been disrupted since they would have to adjust to a new member in their team or take over the duties of the person who left. On the other hand, a Gamma type might be least likely affected by such changes, since they are prone to be constantly seeking new opportunities irregardless of the amount of time they have spent in the organization. They tend to be loosely tied to an organization and are always on a lookout to gain new experiences to enhance their career portfolio.

    ~.~.~.~.~.

    (On a side note, I also notice that Alpha types are the most common ones in the general population, followed by Delta, then Beta and lastly Gamma. I meet Alpha types everywhere I go. I guess it helps in my observation about Alpha attitudes.)

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    Landlord of the Dog and Duck Subteigh's Avatar
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    I really don't like change very much...but I think the difficult thing for me is deciding which job out of millions I want - there are many things I want to do, but I think I would really hate job insecurity.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subterranean View Post
    I really don't like change very much...but I think the difficult thing for me is deciding which job out of millions I want - there are many things I want to do, but I think I would really hate job insecurity.
    Same. I feel uneasy when my future is uncertain because anything can happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carla View Post
    I agree with Logos on this one. I was telling UDP once about my ESTj friend, and how when I and my (small) group of alpha buddies ask her to hang out or come to a movie with us, she often declines and prefers to stay at home. We used to kind of feel betrayed, as if she was "snobbing" the group; but then I saw that it just comes down to different quadra values. She's a workaholic at uni (all Te) and then goes home. We (my alpha buddies and I) have this "Fe group bonding" thing going on when we get together, which consistently "hangs" around us at uni and then carries on over with us to after-uni activities.

    Anyway, the situation mirrors one that can be built up in the workplace.
    LOL. This sounds familiar. I remember asking an ESTj once why didn't he hang out with his uni mates after classes. He was like, "I have my own life after classes, aren't you tired if you see them 24/7?" I understood his rationale of having time of his own to pursue his hobbies, but I was taken aback by the harshness of his statement.

    As for the workplace, I understand that people come and go and it would be unfair if I try to keep them in the organization if they can have better career prospects elsewhere. I would prefer them to be happy with their jobs at the end of the day. Talent mobility is very prevalent in the place I am living in. Besides the Alpha types, most people tend to stay in a company for at most two to three years and leave for better career prospects. As such, I couldn't fathom what Logos meant about feeling "betrayed" if anyone from the team quits or changes job since it is a common phenomenon here.

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    also, i don't think that having inertia problems and being stuck in a rut necessarily have to be the same thing (ie, still have advancement, still have individual goals to do better). but i see it as wanting stability (which I do agree with) and I do see the helping out/supportive thing (fe+si). I think I was confused because I see loyalty in all instances even in a job situation as something more of a concern of Fi types (not that they act more or less loyal, but that it is more of a concern in their job hopping).

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