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Thread: Static vs Dynamic information aspects

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    Joy's Avatar
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    Default Static vs. Dynamic information aspects

    First and foremost, I think it's important to note that all of one's conscious functions are either static or they are all dynamic. As a result, I think this dichotomy is perhaps the most difficult to grasp entirely. (I'm not sure it's even possible, to be honest.) I'll try not to describe static information aspects from a purely dynamic perspective though.
    • Static types (EP, IJ) generally seem to view dynamic information aspects as being a state that changes.
    • Dynamic types (EJ, IP) generally seem to view static information aspects as a snapshot of an event.
    Neither of these is correct, of course, but I felt the need to make a note of this to aid in communication about statics and dynamics.




    Static information aspects are about state. (States can change, of course. Everything changes. Change is, however, not relevant.) Augusta and Gulenko (and probably others that I'm not aware of) have related statics to being about space. From what I understand of a couple of the translated articles I've read, "space" can refer to one's surroundings, or more so what's in one's surroundings.

    Dynamic information aspects are about events. Augusta and Gulenko have related dynamics to being about time. They contrast "space" to "time", which is important to understanding how space relates to statics and time relates to dynamics. Dynamic information aspects are not about changing states, but the changing itself: Activity.





    Let's take a look at how these apply to each of the information aspects/elements. But again, it's impossible to use only one information element at a time, so try to look at the overall idea in each of the examples, particularly as opposed to the it's dynamic/static opposite (such as Ne and Fe).

    Ne vs. Fe
    • Fe is about the internal (or beneath the surface, underlying) activities or events in people/things/situations. An example would be "she's getting really pissed off".
    • Ne is about the internal (or potential, hidden) states of being of people/things/situations. An example would be "maybe she's actually a man" or "maybe she's got PMS". (the Ne types can help me think of a better example if they want to, lol)
    Se vs. Te
    • Te is about the external (or readily observable, immediately apparent, explicit) activities or events of people/things/situations. An example would be "she's leaving the room".
    • Se is about the external (or readily observable, immediately apparent, measurable) states of being of people/things/situations. An example would be "her face is really red".
    Fi vs. Ni
    • Ni is about the internal (or underlying, beneath the surface, abstract) connections of activities or events; past/future/underlying cause and effect relationships. An example would be "she's probably mad because that guy is ignoring her, he may be ignoring her because he's trying to make her jealous, and she's probably about to storm out, and if she storms out he'll probably try to find her in a little while"
    • Fi is about the internal (or underlying, beneath the surface, implicit) states of connections/relationships; internal/underlying connections between states. An example would be "she doesn't want to date him anymore" or perhaps "she doesn't deserve to be with an asshole like him".
    Ti vs. Si
    • Si is about the external (or immediately apparent, surface) connections of activities or events; immediately apparent (such as physical) cause and effect relationships. An example would be "if she opens the door right now, the cat may escape from the house" or "if she storms out without her coat, she's going to be cold" or "I can't hear what my friend is saying because she's yelling so loudly".
    • Ti is about the external (or readily observable, measurable) states of connections/relationships; external/measurable connections between states. An example would be "the temperature outside is lower than the temperature inside" or "she is older than he is".
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Ne vs. Fe
    • Fe is about the internal (or beneath the surface, underlying) activities or events in people/things/situations. An example would be "she's getting really pissed off".
    • Ne is about the internal (or potential, hidden) states of being of people/things/situations. An example would be "maybe she's actually a man" or "maybe she's got PMS". (the Ne types can help me think of a better example if they want to, lol)
    • so Fe/Ne would be possible implications of Te/Se?
    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Se vs. Te
    • Te is about the external (or readily observable, immediately apparent, explicit) activities or events of people/things/situations. An example would be "she's leaving the room".
    • Se is about the external (or readily observable, immediately apparent, measurable) states of being of people/things/situations. An example would be "her face is really red".
    • provide structural outline for the Ne/Fe implications. clearly, if Te gathered instead that she was vanishing into thin air, as opposed to physicallly, intentionally leaving the room, Ne/Fe information would change accordingly?
    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Fi vs. Ni
    • Ni is about the internal (or underlying, beneath the surface, abstract) connections of activities or events; past/future/underlying cause and effect relationships. An example would be "she's probably mad because that guy is ignoring her, he may be ignoring her because he's trying to make her jealous, and she's probably about to storm out, and if she storms out he'll probably try to find her in a little while"
    • Fi is about the internal (or underlying, beneath the surface, implicit) states of connections/relationships; internal/underlying connections between states. An example would be "she doesn't want to date him anymore" or perhaps "she doesn't deserve to be with an asshole like him".
    • is it necessary to include Fi information in Ni? that is to say, is the implied question "why is she mad?" necessary?
    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Ti vs. Si
    • Si is about the external (or immediately apparent, surface) connections of activities or events; immediately apparent (such as physical) cause and effect relationships. An example would be "if she opens the door right now, the cat may escape from the house" or "if she storms out without her coat, she's going to be cold" or "I can't hear what my friend is saying because she's yelling so loudly".
    • Ti is about the external (or readily observable, measurable) states of connections/relationships; external/measurable connections between states. An example would be "the temperature outside is lower than the temperature inside" or "she is older than he is".
    • the first part seems a bit unclear to me. for what you said about Si, in the first example i see something like if x1, then y1 (direct link between two separate objects (x and y / cat and girl). for example 2, i see if x1, then x2 (a direct link between an action upon oneself (x) and how that affects one's state. for example 3, i see that person a is yelling loudly, presumably at person b, which is affecting my ability to hear what another person (c) is saying. in other words, i see slight variation between your examples, which makes me wonder if i am seeing what you intended or am getting off track.
    Last edited by reyn_til_runa; 01-22-2008 at 07:56 PM.
    whenever the dog and i see each other we both stop where we are. we regard each other with a mixture of sadness and suspicion and then we feign indifference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reyn_til_runa View Post
    so Fe/Ne would be possible implications of Te/Se?
    Maybe? Fe and Ne are implicit, and Te and Se are explicit. Both Fe and Te get information from Se, Si, Ne, and Ni though. What I mean to say is that in a way, there doesn't have to be a direct relationship between Te and Fe (and Se and Ne), but in a way, they're all connected. We all use all of our functions.

    provide structural outline for the Ne/Fe implications. clearly, if Te gathered instead that she was vanishing into thin air, as opposed to physicallly, intentionally leaving the room, Ne/Fe information would change accordingly?
    To expand on what I was saying above:

    I think that information initially comes to you through irrational information elements, particularly external irrational information elements, Se and Si. Ne and Ni provide additional information. Then Te, Ti, Fe, and Fi process the information.

    is it necessary to include Fi information in Ne? that is to say, is the implied question "why is she mad?" necessary?
    Well, aside from the whole "we all use all of our functions" thing, no. The example is simply a rather Fi/Fe heavy one, pretty much because it makes it easier for me to come up with the Fi and Fe aspects.

    the first part seems a bit unclear to me. for what you said about Si, in the first example i see something like if x1, then y1 (direct link between two separate objects (x and y / cat and girl). for example 2, i see if x1, then x2 (a direct link between an action upon oneself (x) and how that affects one's state. for example 3, i see that person a is yelling loudly, presumably at person b, which is affecting my ability to hear what another person (c) is saying. in other words, i see slight variation between your examples, which makes me wonder if i am seeing what you intended or am getting off track.
    Si is about physical or immediate cause and effect relationships in events.

    "If she opens the door right now, the cat may escape from the house."
    Cat wanting to go outside, door opening, cat running outside.
    "If she storms out without her coat, she's going to be cold."
    Girl not putting on coat, girl leaving, girl being outside, girl being cold.
    "I can't hear what my friend is saying because she's yelling so loudly."
    Friend talking, me listening, girl being louder than friend is talking, not being able to hear friend.

    Whether an information aspect is static/dynamic, it still deals indirectly with the other. Everything changes, including states. States cannot exist without some type of event before, after, and between. Also, events cannot exist without there being states that change accordingly.
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