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Thread: Iee > Eii

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    Default Iee > Eii

    I'm really starting to believe IEE > EII for myself.

    After rummaging around for EP/IJ examples that I could apply for myself, I'm really starting to believe EP makes more sense for me.

    I focused more on body expression and how I tend to pose in more candid pictures.

    I'll cross-post the "Champion" video, and I'll add this picture from a few years ago:



    (EE Senior Lab Project)

    http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fusea...&videoid=80110

    Maybe a crappy Heisman pose from almost 6 years ago will do?



    I'll post one more crappy (but fun!) video from 4 1/2 years ago (when I experimented with a crappy hair style)



    I'm aware of the ratio of actual movie to outtakes. It was just something to do to blow off some steam.

    INFj

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    Don't forget the the thehotelambush's Avatar
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    Yeah, I think ENFp makes way more sense.

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    sorry this a bit offtopic, but what do you think of Ezra's typing of you as IEI?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hellothere View Post
    sorry this a bit offtopic, but what do you think of Ezra's typing of you as IEI?
    Did he type me IEI? I'll have to rummage through some posts to find that. Hmm.

    Edit: Ok, I see it now in his user list on the wikisocion.

    Ezra, how do you feel about an IEI being a 9w1 so > 4 so?

    Would it make more sense for an IEI to be 4 so > 9w1 so?
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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    I have no qualms about either. They both make perfect sense. Even IEE makes sense for both. Do you know which you are? From your first video I'd say you were a 9. However, your content seemed to be somewhat 4ish. I may have posted this before, but if not, read it:

    Misidentifying Fours and Nines

    Some average Nines think that they are Fours because they have artistic talents and creative inclinations of one kind or another. As in the case of love not being the sole domain of Twos, artistic capacity is not the sole province of Fours. Other types can be, and often are, artists.

    Even so, the artistry of Fours is much more personal and self-revealing than that of Nines. The art of Nines often expresses idealized, mythological, and archetypal worlds–usually the real world glossed into something fantastic and wondrous. Nines are often gifted storytellers in which "...and they all lived happily ever after" is assured. (There are no unhappy endings in the Nine's world of make-believe.) By contrast, the art of Fours is generally more personal and realistic, the expression of the Four's (and of everyone's) deep longing for love, wholeness, and meaning. Fours often deal in the tragic, finding redemption in self-transcendence; Nines deal in the commonplace, finding comfort in ordinary lives and simple situations.

    The principal reason these types may be confused is that they are both withdrawn types. (PT, 433-36). Fours withdraw from others so that they can protect themselves and give themselves time to deal with their emotions. Nines, on the other hand, are withdrawn in the sense that they remove their attention from people or situations that threaten them, disengaging themselves emotionally so that they will not be anxious or upset. They cut off their identification with others (or never identify with them in the first place), identifying instead with a private idealized version of reality. Average to unhealthy Nines tune out any unpleasantness by dissociating from whatever upsets them, whereas Fours do just the opposite, brooding over their anxieties in an attempt to come to terms with them. Fours are certainly not detached from their emotions–just the reverse, they are keenly aware of them, perhaps too much so.

    Both types can therefore be shy, absent-minded, confused, and detached from the real world. The difference is that Nines are detached both from the external world and from their emotions, whereas Fours withdraw from whatever has caused them pain. (In the end, that may add up to quite a lot.) Nines see the world through rose-colored glasses, and their view of it is comforting, whereas Fours see the world from a garret window as outsiders and are not comforted: everyone else seems to be living a happier, more normal life. Contrast the personalities of Mahler (a Four) and Aaron Copland (a Nine), Saul Steinberg (a Four) and Norman Rockwell (a Nine).
    I could see you as both an IEI and an EII, simply because I haven't yet fully understood the difference between them, besides the fact that the IEI values Se/Ni and Ti/Fe, and the EII values Si/Ne and Te/Fi.
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    If you are an IEE, you are a 7, tereg. Can you see yourself as a 7? If not, you are probably not an IEE.

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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus View Post
    If you are an IEE, you are a 7, tereg. Can you see yourself as a 7? If not, you are probably not an IEE.
    tereg, ignore Phaedrus. He is talking bullshit. A 4s and 9s can be EIIs, they can be their mirrors too.
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    tereg, ignore Phaedrus. He is talking bullshit. A 4s and 9s can be EIIs, they can be their mirrors too.
    No.

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    Misidentifying Fours and Nines

    Some average Nines think that they are Fours because they have artistic talents and creative inclinations of one kind or another. As in the case of love not being the sole domain of Twos, artistic capacity is not the sole province of Fours. Other types can be, and often are, artists.

    Even so, the artistry of Fours is much more personal and self-revealing than that of Nines. The art of Nines often expresses idealized, mythological, and archetypal worlds–usually the real world glossed into something fantastic and wondrous. Nines are often gifted storytellers in which "...and they all lived happily ever after" is assured. (There are no unhappy endings in the Nine's world of make-believe.) By contrast, the art of Fours is generally more personal and realistic, the expression of the Four's (and of everyone's) deep longing for love, wholeness, and meaning. Fours often deal in the tragic, finding redemption in self-transcendence; Nines deal in the commonplace, finding comfort in ordinary lives and simple situations.

    The principal reason these types may be confused is that they are both withdrawn types. (PT, 433-36). Fours withdraw from others so that they can protect themselves and give themselves time to deal with their emotions. Nines, on the other hand, are withdrawn in the sense that they remove their attention from people or situations that threaten them, disengaging themselves emotionally so that they will not be anxious or upset. They cut off their identification with others (or never identify with them in the first place), identifying instead with a private idealized version of reality. Average to unhealthy Nines tune out any unpleasantness by dissociating from whatever upsets them, whereas Fours do just the opposite, brooding over their anxieties in an attempt to come to terms with them. Fours are certainly not detached from their emotions–just the reverse, they are keenly aware of them, perhaps too much so.

    Both types can therefore be shy, absent-minded, confused, and detached from the real world. The difference is that Nines are detached both from the external world and from their emotions, whereas Fours withdraw from whatever has caused them pain. (In the end, that may add up to quite a lot.) Nines see the world through rose-colored glasses, and their view of it is comforting, whereas Fours see the world from a garret window as outsiders and are not comforted: everyone else seems to be living a happier, more normal life. Contrast the personalities of Mahler (a Four) and Aaron Copland (a Nine), Saul Steinberg (a Four) and Norman Rockwell (a Nine).
    You have posted this for me before, and I told myself that I'd have to come back to it because I couldn't come to a clear answer.

    I agree with you that the content of the stuff I put up on YouTube is more 4 > 9. Most of the things I create are personalized, realistic, self-revealing things.

    As far as when I withdraw from people, this is very close imo. I actually see myself making both a Four and a Nine's "justification" when removing myself from something. But I think first comes the Nine's, and then the Four's after that as kind of an afterthought.

    In other words, the procedure will go something like this in my head: "I don't want to go because ____ will see me and it will probably bring up bad memories and they'll probably want to ask me what I've been doing and I don't really feel like dealing with it right now. Besides, it will give me a chance to be away for a while, gather my thoughts and be able to more clearly deal with my emotions."

    So it goes 9 -> 4.

    And then as far as what I actually do to deal with incoming anxiety, I think, again it goes in this 9 -> 4 road. I'll detach and "try" to dissociate from whatever it is, but the decision grows on me as time goes on.

    I think it's more common for me to look through Four's glasses, unfortunately.
    INFj

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    Hi.
    Last edited by glam; 04-07-2011 at 01:20 AM. Reason: removing my quote ;)
    INFj

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    7s are Adventurous, correct?

    Yeah, um, that is not me. I think it's a good thing to have, but I just don't have that kind of spirit or self-drive for it like I see others have.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    7s are Adventurous, correct?

    Yeah, um, that is not me. I think it's a good thing to have, but I just don't have that kind of spirit or self-drive for it like I see others have.
    If you are an IEE you must find a way to see yourself as a 7, Adventurous or not. Everything must fit your type if you have typed yourself correctly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wikisocion
    Sevens: Enthusiasts, Adventurers, Sensationalists

    Sevens are adventurous and busy with many activities with all the energy and enthusiasm of the Puer Aeternus. At their best they embrace life for its varied joys and wonders and truly live in the moment but, at their worst, they dash frantically from one new experience to another, too scared of disappointment to actually enjoy themselves. Sevens fear being unable to provide for themselves or to experience life in all of its richness.
    Ego fixation: planning
    Holy idea: work
    Passion: gluttony
    Virtue: sobriety
    Stress point: One
    Security point: Five
    So, maybe it's incorrect for me to markedly see 7s as simply adrenaline junkies. In a sense, I can identify with this need for me to move from interest to interest. Weeks, sometimes months are focused intently on whatever it is that I'm interested in at the time. And then it can just suddenly change if something grabs my attention. So, I don't identify with "living in the moment", per se, but rather a more prolonged sense of enjoying something in intense (albeit brief) periods of time

    Regarding passion, I would love to be able to just let go and just delve into something face first and not look back. But there is a sense of, as said above, "too scared of disappointment to actually enjoy themselves".

    So, in a way, I do identify to a 7 to some degree, but not in the traditional "living in the moment" timeframe.
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    Your DNA is mine. Mediator Kam's Avatar
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    Then the conflict with your father was just a coincidence?
    D-SEI 9w1

    This is me and my dual being scientific together

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamangir View Post
    Then the conflict with your father was just a coincidence?
    I've also been thinking about that. If I'm IEE, then that would make my relationship with dad a Look-a-like relation. That would actually not be out of the question.

    I'm not denying that there are places where I feel emotionally handcuffed around him, and feel that conflict. But, when I look at it a bit further, I don't feel so conflicted that I feel agitated around him. Just more subued and handcuffed.
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    Wouldn't it be Super-Ego (if he's ESTp)?

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    Based on everything you've said since you've arrived, I'm more inclined towards IEE than EII, but in a marginal way. I guess what it breaks down to is that I see a substantial amount of Ne and Fi, but I get the impression that your Fi is in a more creative capacity than my own (which in itself maybe isn't the best method of comparison) as well as your Fe which I think you emanate very naturally (i.e. instinctually).

    Some of the latter can definitely be attributed to your strong, valued Ne I suppose, especially since in most of the videos I see you in you're alone and sometimes I do go that route in private. Haha, this probably hasn't been that helpful at all, but you just seem to be more engaged with the world around you than I am (though really that's not saying much). I think IEE > EII, but I'm certainly inclined to view you as either my identical or mirror.

    A pertinent question to ask though might be what you think of the patterns of dualization between IEE/SLI and EII/LSE? Where do you think you would fit in the big picture of such and such an imagined relationship?
    Moonlight will fall
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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    Wouldn't it be Super-Ego (if he's ESTp)?
    Whoops, you're right.
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    Quote Originally Posted by munenori2 View Post
    A pertinent question to ask though might be what you think of the patterns of dualization between IEE/SLI and EII/LSE? Where do you think you would fit in the big picture of such and such an imagined relationship?
    Well. I actually know an LSE girl (I'm about 95% sure she's LSE). And um, well, that's a long story that I've been working out in my head for the past 2 weeks how I want to explain it. Anyways, it's difficult to say whether if it's duality or activity. She and I are good friends (and only friends for a reason I will explain at another time), and we get along really well. Really well. The conversations are dynamic... there's an energy there. It's clearly obvious to me that she's strong in and .

    Anyways, I can't say that I've been able to pinpoint any SLI's in my life. So, I don't know what that would be like.
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    Let's go to fairyland Minde's Avatar
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    This probably isn't any help in your type search but speaking of possible ENFps and videos that involve clumsiness...

    (don't turn up the sound, just leave it at medium... you'll see)

    http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fusea...ideoid=4431122


    I'm fairly sure the star's an ENFp. Anyway, this is probably a pretty useless post, but maybe you enjoyed it, at least.

    /distraction
    INFj / EII / FiNe
    ()


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    "Have courage and be kind." - Cinderella's mom

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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    Well. I actually know an LSE girl (I'm about 95% sure she's LSE). And um, well, that's a long story that I've been working out in my head for the past 2 weeks how I want to explain it. Anyways, it's difficult to say whether if it's duality or activity. She and I are good friends (and only friends for a reason I will explain at another time), and we get along really well. Really well. The conversations are dynamic... there's an energy there. It's clearly obvious to me that she's strong in and .

    Anyways, I can't say that I've been able to pinpoint any SLI's in my life. So, I don't know what that would be like.
    lol tell me about it. I've had similar experiences in my life of late. I'm glad you know some deltas though. It's a fantastic feeling, is it not?
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    .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    This probably isn't any help in your type search but speaking of possible ENFps and videos that involve clumsiness...

    (don't turn up the sound, just leave it at medium... you'll see)

    http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fusea...ideoid=4431122


    I'm fairly sure the star's an ENFp. Anyway, this is probably a pretty useless post, but maybe you enjoyed it, at least.

    /distraction

    Ahaha. Good one, Minde.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    Ahaha. Good one, Minde.
    Thank you. It wasn't me throwing myself around for the camera, though, you know, so most of the credit should go to our "clumsy" friend. It would take quite a lot to get me to do something like that.


    Also, what I mean by I'm fairly sure he's ENFp - I know him personally and have typed him that way, not just from the video.
    INFj / EII / FiNe
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    "Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." - G.K. Chesterton

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    You know him personally? He certainly does seem ENFp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    You know him personally? He certainly does seem ENFp.
    I do indeed know him personally. He's a dear boy and a good friend. I love being around him. He's made an appearance before in one of my type threads.
    INFj / EII / FiNe
    ()


    "Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." - G.K. Chesterton

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    ezra, aside from enneagram correlations, why INFp?

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    I think you're more Ep-ish than Ij-ish, personally.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    This probably isn't any help in your type search but speaking of possible ENFps and videos that involve clumsiness...

    (don't turn up the sound, just leave it at medium... you'll see)

    I'm fairly sure the star's an ENFp. Anyway, this is probably a pretty useless post, but maybe you enjoyed it, at least.

    /distraction
    lol, last night I watched this video and didn't know if my sound was on... I even remember reading the little sound disclaimer... so being the smart person I am I'm sitting there just turning the knob and not hearing anything... then a very loud THUMP! I pretty much jumped right out of my chair... then i just busted out laughing hysterically... but it was half because the video and the other half because of my ignorance. It would have been funny to actually have a camera on me at that point. Definitely an entertaining video though.

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    One thing is for sure, Tereg needs an ST in his life.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    This probably isn't any help in your type search but speaking of possible ENFps and videos that involve clumsiness...

    (don't turn up the sound, just leave it at medium... you'll see)

    http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fusea...ideoid=4431122


    I'm fairly sure the star's an ENFp. Anyway, this is probably a pretty useless post, but maybe you enjoyed it, at least.

    /distraction
    I did enjoy it. He does remind me a little bit of me in mannerisms.
    INFj

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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    One thing is for sure, Tereg needs an ST in his life.
    He does indeed.

    The question is, what method does he prefer? Pushing and shoving, with a regimented regime, or tips on how to effectively achieve his goals as well as actions that will help the individual to relax.
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    a regimented regime
    lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    He does indeed.

    The question is, what method does he prefer? Pushing and shoving, with a regimented regime, or tips on how to effectively achieve his goals as well as actions that will help the individual to relax.
    What my heart tells me: Tips on how to effectively achieve my goals as well as actions that will help me to relax > pushing and shoving with a regimented regime

    What my head tells me: Pushing and shoving with a regimented regime > tips on how to effectively achieve...

    ... if that makes sense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    What my heart tells me: Tips on how to effectively achieve my goals as well as actions that will help me to relax > pushing and shoving with a regimented regime

    What my head tells me: Pushing and shoving with a regimented regime > tips on how to effectively achieve...

    ... if that makes sense.
    As in, one you think you probably need and the other would feel nicer?
    INFj / EII / FiNe
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    "Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." - G.K. Chesterton

    "Have courage and be kind." - Cinderella's mom

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    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    As in, one you think you probably need and the other would feel nicer?
    Yes.
    INFj

    9w1 sp/sx

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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    Yes.
    I can sympathize, then.
    INFj / EII / FiNe
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    "Fairy Tales are more than true; not because they tell us that dragons exist, but because they tell us that dragons can be beaten." - G.K. Chesterton

    "Have courage and be kind." - Cinderella's mom

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    I am fully convinced after reading this: http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=IEE_domain that I am an IEE.

    I mean, that description is perfect. The content, the way the page itself is structured and organized. Every bit of it is piercingly true.

    The ideal work schedule, the difficult but liberating things to say, the vast interests I undertake.

    Like this part:

    What's the point of getting to know people who you have nothing to do with? Who knows. Maybe it's a way of learning about the world — through other people's experience and sentiments. By talking to a Catholic you learn about the world of Catholicism. By talking to a scientist you learn what it's like to be in the academic community. It's like an internal, personal view of life — as opposed to an impersonal description. By talking one-on-one to a person, you get to see what things they emphasize as being the most important, as well as their personal sentiments about their experience. This way, it seems, IEEs can learn by proxy about vast areas of life that they might otherwise have little contact with.
    I mean... there it is. Something I desparately tried to explain but couldn't quite do it right, and here it is, spelled out. This is 100% true for me.

    PoLR and HA make the most sense now to me, now that I see it so clearly laid out.

    As far as subtype goes, I actually think that IEE-Ne makes more sense to me now than IEE-Fi. I'm not completely sure about that, but it's starting to make more and more sense to me.

    Whoever wrote in that domain, you are awesome! You have just clarified a lot of concepts that I struggled to communicate. Thank you.
    INFj

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    That is, of course, assuming that what's written in that section is a valid representation of IEE. I suddenly just got really concerned that I'm jumping to a conclusion too soon without validating the article.

    INFj

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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    That is, of course, assuming that what's written in that section is a valid representation of IEE. I suddenly just got really concerned that I'm jumping to a conclusion too soon without validating the article.

    That section seems to have been written by Admin who = Rick DeLong who if I've kept track of things correctly, is the author of the Socionist blog (http://socionist.blogspot.com). I read in a thread before that his IEE description is excellent (http://socionist.blogspot.com/2007/0...scription.html), from what I gather he is an IEE himself.

    Hopefully this should get rid of most of the concern, and leave you free to enjoy the feeling of knowing your type!

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