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Thread: Dynamics of Beta Quadra Social Groups

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Default Dynamics of Beta Quadra Social Groups

    This appears to be a pretty controversial issue, as some people are hesitant to identify with Beta values on the basis that their groups tend to be too loud, rowdy, etc.

    Now, I'm part of a Beta "pack" at school, and we basically find our identity in NOT being the loud, drunken slops who go out and get shitfaced and act like assholes. We are stoners. Most of the time, we sit around and play video games, debate, play pranks on each other, and so forth. When people of this other drunken, sloppy variety join up to hang out with us for an afternoon, they say we're "too much," that they feel like they have to be on their toes instead of just being carefree and drunk and not giving a shit about how they act. They don't like it, and they usually dismiss it as immature.

    There's an underlying power dynamic in the group, a constant kind of one-upsmanship: even in something like a video game, there's clearly a kind of competition beyond just winning or losing the game, and when one person wins, they take no qualms in berating whoever they lose, albeit in a jokey fashion. Even in a conversation, if you do or say something silly that shows that you're not really all there, you'll get a little jab or poke of an insult; not hurtful or mean, but just a little teasing to keep you on your toes mentally.

    There is, however, a good bit of drama, and there's no denying it. You can pretty much count on the fact that someone has done something questionable recently and given that we're a pretty tight knit group, it probably involved at least one other person from the group, so everyone is going to be talking about it. We don't create drama; if anyone was suspected of that, they would be completely shunned, no questions asked. But when you've got as many nutty people as us in one place, drama just happens.

    Another one of the things that characterizes our group is our propensity for "events" and entrepreneurial activities. We generally have disorganized, impulsive activities and just hang around, but once or twice a week we'll pool our efforts and money and do something together, even if it's as small as rolling a bunch of blunts and driving to wal-mart to goof off and buy new shit to improve our rooms or whatever. Sometimes it's a camping trip. Sometimes it's a drug deal. Sometimes we make art. Sometimes we build stuff. It's just our way of reminding ourselves that we can do more together than apart, I guess.
    Last edited by Gilly; 01-02-2008 at 08:25 PM.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  2. #2
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Betas have a big thing with emotional support too, I find.

    I'm really not big on letting people in on my emotional life. I keep my feelings and my problems to myself. In a Beta group, these lines of privacy are definitely respected and rarely breached, but we do help one another. When someone is having a hard time, and it's hard enough that we can tell it's wearing on them, we'll draw them out, and make them tell us what's up. Now obviously only the person who's having problems can fix them, but we can tell when something is affecting someone enough that someone else needs to at least get them to open up a little, and maybe we can even brainstorm with them on solutions. Sometimes really deep feelings are discussed, sometimes they're left out, but the point is that the person is made to talk about the problem and think about it, and it becomes a little less intense and internal and a little bit more manageable once it's put into words and made finite.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  3. #3
    Creepy-Diana

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Yeah, I'm not saying that all groups are like mine, and the loud obnoxiousness definitely can be a part of Beta; probably moreso than any quadra. I even enjoy it from time to time. But it's definitely not always there.
    Last edited by Gilly; 12-30-2007 at 10:37 PM.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Creepy-Diana

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    .

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    zenbrat's Avatar
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    Betas gather to experience life in many colors, from every possible angle and viewpoint. We want to share thoughts, ideas and significant experiences. Sometimes, just vibing in on someone elses stream of consciousness *is* the experience.

    It's never just sensory bs'ing around, even if it centers around a predominately "sensor" activity like getting high or kicking around en masse. It's intelligent, whimsical, conversational, philosophical interaction.

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    Kristiina's Avatar
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    what I most like about beta interaction is that it keeps the person on it's toes and keeps the mind active. There is a lot of energy. Fast dialogue and energetic tone of voice. Playful insults to battle against.
    <3
    EIE, ENFj, intuitive subtype.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina View Post
    what I most like about beta interaction is that it keeps the person on it's toes and keeps the mind active. There is a lot of energy. Fast dialogue and energetic tone of voice. Playful insults to battle against.
    <3
    Yesss, I thrive on that

    Bit leery of 'playful' insults don't them to go over the top, but I do like to pull the leg on peeps teasingly.
    INFp

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    It seems that the key phrase here is "on your toes." Glad we're on the same wavelength.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    It seems that the key phrase here is "on your toes." Glad we're on the same wavelength.
    In a relaxed sort of way. You don't need to keep your guard up, just alert to the banter or action. It's ok too zoom out for a bit too, it's not like it is warfare heh. There's lots of implied () and () in the banter. It can be very draining to be in an environment where people do not pick up on clues like that.
    INFp

    If your sea chart does not match reality, go with reality (Old mariner saying)



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    bibliophile8's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wittmont View Post
    In a relaxed sort of way. You don't need to keep your guard up, just alert to the banter or action. It's ok too zoom out for a bit too, it's not like it is warfare heh. There's lots of implied () and () in the banter. It can be very draining to be in an environment where people do not pick up on clues like that.
    Can you give an example? I feel like this might be missing from my beta interactions. Could an example of this be a betan refraining from criticizing you when you know you really screwed up or suck?
    type #33
    but maybe LSE, and maybe E3w4(p)

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletsAndDoves View Post
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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wittmont View Post
    In a relaxed sort of way. You don't need to keep your guard up, just alert to the banter or action. It's ok too zoom out for a bit too, it's not like it is warfare heh. There's lots of implied () and () in the banter. It can be very draining to be in an environment where people do not pick up on clues like that.
    Right. It's not hostile; you just have to keep up. And yeah, it can definitely seem like ball-busting if you're not used to it.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  13. #13
    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    This appears to be a pretty controversial issue, as some people are hesitant to identify with Beta values on the basis that their groups tend to be too loud, rowdy, etc.

    Now, I'm part of a Beta "pack" at school, and we basically find our identity in NOT being the loud, drunken slops who go out and get shitfaced and act like assholes. We are stoners. Most of the time, we sit around and play video games, debate, play pranks on each other, and so forth. When people of this other drunken, sloppy variety join up to hang out with us for an afternoon, they say we're "too much," that they feel like they have to be on their toes instead of just being carefree and drunk and not giving a shit about how they act. They don't like it, and they usually dismiss it as immature.

    There's an underlying power dynamic in the group, a constant kind of one-upsmanship: even in something like a video game, there's clearly a kind of competition, and when one person wins, they take no qualms in berating whoever they lose, albeit in a jokey fashion. Even in a conversation, if you do or say something silly that shows that you're not really all there, you'll get a little jab or poke of an insult; not hurtful or mean, but just a little teasing to keep you on your toes mentally.

    There is, however, a good bit of drama, and there's no denying it. You can pretty much count on the fact that someone has done something questionable recently and given that we're a pretty tight knit group, it probably involved at least one other person from the group, so everyone is going to be talking about it. We don't create drama; if anyone was suspected of that, they would be completely shunned, no questions asked. But when you've got as many nutty people as us in one place, drama just happens.

    Another one of the things that characterizes our group is our propensity for "events" and entrepreneurial activities. We generally have disorganized, impulsive activities and just hang around, but once or twice a week we'll pool our efforts and money and do something together, even if it's as small as rolling a bunch of blunts and driving to wal-mart to goof off and buy new shit to improve our rooms or whatever. Sometimes it's a camping trip. Sometimes it's a drug deal. Sometimes we make art. Sometimes we build stuff. It's just our way of reminding ourselves that we can do more together than apart, I guess.
    This I identify with. In fact, I have a little squad of Betas. An SLE, an IEI, me - an SLE, and what I think is more Delta, but he kind of joins in on the whole poking fun thing; but it's primarily at me for some reason. He likes to scapegoat me. Maybe he doesn't feel comfortable around me or something. We normally play Dawn of War as a collective, and sometimes we'll go out drinking. It is basically a game collective though (Halo 3 is the one that the possible Delta joins in on).

    The only thing I don't agree with is your construction and entrepreneurship. This could just be because I don't feel properly 'grouped' if you get me. I hang around with quite a few circles of friends. Three at the moment while I'm at uni in my halls. I've got the Beta squad, a kind of weird collection of what I think are Alphas with a few Deltas and Gammas (I don't really fit too nicely, but I can enjoy myself nonetheless) and then a group of Alphas (one of which I get on with very well, but sometimes I can be a bit much for her). Your group, Gilly, is the kind of group that said Alpha group is pretty much opposed to.
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bibliophile8 View Post
    Can you give an example? I feel like this might be missing from my beta interactions. Could an example of this be a betan refraining from criticizing you when you know you really screwed up or suck?
    Absolutely. I think Betans want a positive environment. And if you have screwed up and know you have screwed up I wouldn't criticize you since it would be redundant. Negative nitpicking drives me up the wall, so I don't do that to others (it would drive myself up the wall too). (I might tease you about it later tho depending what kind of screw up it was)

    I don't really have a good example either I'm afraid. It is as HC says an element of teasing your friends. One, extreme, example I can think of is when I once was out traveling with a few mostly beta friends and my INFp-Fe brother. It had been quite hectic for a few days so on the way back home I stole away at the airport to get away from them. I went to a caf&#233; to have a cup of coffee, read a good book for a bit and enjoy the peace and quiet and absence of my friends, before the return flight home. (Baby had a good point about the need for balance). They couldn't find me so my rascally brother and our friends cooked up an idea, exactly what the guys below did (only my brother and friends used a nickname my brother had made up for me previously, very innocent really nothing naughty )

    A couple of guys in the UK pretended to be Taxi drivers waiting for foreign customers at Heathrow Airport. They went up to various airline desks and asked the clerks to call for their clients, as they couldn't find them. So the guys gave their supposed clients' names to the clerks who went ahead and called for them over the airports' PA system. The 'names' are below... (The two guys actually managed to get all but the last one done at done before they got busted and kicked out heh, the last one is from another airport as Heathrow security got on to their act...)

    Looks Like…
    Reads Like…
    Arheddis Varkenjaab and Aywellbe Fayed
    I hate this fucking job, and I will be fired

    Arhevbin Fayed and Bybeiev Rhibodie
    I‘ve just been fired, and bye-bye everybody

    Aynayda Pizaqvick and Malexa Kriest
    I need a piss quick, and my legs are crossed

    Awul Dasfilshabeda and Nowaynayda Zheet
    Oo-ah, that ‘ s better and now I need a shit

    Makollig Jezvahted and Levdaroum DeBahzted
    My colleague just farted, and left the room, the bastard

    Steelaygot Maowenbach and Tuka Piziniztee
    Still, I got my own back and took a piss in his tea

    The one my brother and his friends came up with involved the word Gorilla and a pun on my name >_<, so it was very innocent. Needless to say my brother and I had a good laugh about it all when we came across this story recently. My brother's prank happened quite a long time ago.

    Anyroad, I don't think teasing as such is Beta only and it shouldn't be exaggerated as an ever present part of Beta group dynamics. Hostage Child describes it well, and Baby's description about the need for balance is spot on.
    INFp

    If your sea chart does not match reality, go with reality (Old mariner saying)



  15. #15
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Obviously this kind of behavior is not exclusive to Beta, but I think all groups that are predominantly Beta, or at least have influential people who are Betas in them, will exhibit a similar dynamic to some degree.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina View Post
    what I most like about beta interaction is that it keeps the person on it's toes and keeps the mind active. There is a lot of energy. Fast dialogue and energetic tone of voice. Playful insults to battle against.
    <3
    ....And people actually thought we were duals : /....

    That is one of my least favorite things about beta quadra. Not saying anything is wrong with betas, but, it's just not my bag, baby. That's not how I relax, and it is not how I have fun, and it is not how I want to interact with my family or people who are close to me.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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