Stories, observations, and experiences with LIEs-ENTjs

[Khamelion]

I'd like to hear more about them. Give up the info!

[aestrivex]

they're a bunch of sociopaths with an uncanny hatred of the tamias canipes species of chipmunk, green paint, and wristwatches. they all also weigh exactly 3,209 pounds and have high-pitched voices which can only be described as "a mixture of nails, cheese, donuts, penicillin, and 2-methyl 4-ethyl, methly propynol."

[liveandletlive]

They're awesome- basically a SEE's wet dream They are NASTY at explaining ANYTHING in order to get u to understand things and never, ever make u feel dumb or degrade u in the process. but don't get me wrong, they do joke around a lot and poke fun but it's all good they're just trying to get their HA in haha. they know a lot of people and are usually very worldly- know a lot about everything. they tend to travel a lot because of this- they like other cultures a lot. they're very bouncy and energetic, always on the move and involved in a bjillion things at once... i really have no idea how they get it all done. they're very eloquent and all the ones i have known have been interested in law. they're have no shame, or are very foward, or lack tact... i still have yet to decide which one- maybe a combination of all 3. they're great with words- they're eloquent and use double entendres all the time. IMO and experiences they're also horny mo fos lol. they're pretty awesome... the only negative thing i would have to say is that for me personally, they kind of freak me out in that they can be a little too controlling for my taste... go be a control freak in your own life, but the second u try to control any aspect of my life i'll see u later. but that's just me, and my experiences- that may not be necessarily related to type.

[FDG]

An ESFp's wet dream? eheh dunno if it's just what happened to me but almost all the SEE's I've met considered me a real nerd that for some error of nature happened to be also good at sports but that doesn't have anything to do with them

On being controlling: I know what sounds that way. Many times I may ask my girlfriend "so what are you doing tonight" or "where are you going this afternoon". The reasons are two: 1)I may have something to propose! So I wanna know if she's already busy or I can ask her 2)I may be bored and seeing if she's going to do something cool, in that case I might want to tag along!

Although if I don't clarify that this is my objective, I totally see why it may come across as controlling. Ah yeah I also don't allow my girlfriends to smoke.

[Joy]

Wouldn't it a lot be easier to just not date smokers?

[FDG]

Wouldn't it a lot be easier to just not date smokers?

Yeah but most girls I know smoke just a bit. Like 1-2 cigs a day just to calm themselves down or something like this.

[Joy]

Anyways, SEE's usually say that I'm knowledgeable, interesting, and good at explaining things. I get the impression that they like me because I offer a type of stimulation that they usually don't get. I think it has as much to do with Ni as it does Te... when I talk about my philosophies on life they can't seem to get enough of it.

There's something irresistible about SEE/LIE relations... all of the power and energy of Se quadra extroversion plus positivism. They're also both Ni quadra strategists. Just imagine what they could do together, and how much fun they'd have in the process. (Though without someone around to take care of tactics I'm not sure how much of what they plan would actually get off the ground, and I could see them being too optimistic about deals or plans.)

the only negative thing i would have to say is that for me personally, they kind of freak me out in that they can be a little too controlling for my taste... go be a control freak in your own life, but the second u try to control any aspect of my life i'll see u later. but that's just me, and my experiences- that may not be necessarily related to type.

I think I know what you're talking about...

The reason I've never been in a serious relationship (or any romantic relationship, really) is because I'm too possessive of my mates, to be perfectly. SEE's are fun and bouncy and magnetic and flirty. They love going out an doing things and have a seemingly endless appetite for social interaction. I couldn't see myself being able to keep up with them long term when it comes to going out and doing stuff, such as going to parties or clubs or whatever. I do love that they drag me out to those (and other) places, but when I don't feel like it (I'm more of a homebody than any SEE I've known would want to be) they have to be able to call around and go out with friends and whatnot, and while I don't mind if my mate spends time with friends when I'm not there, I wouldn't want that to be something that happens all that frequently.

There's also the matter of their flirtiness. Things that an ILI wouldn't care about would bother me. SEE's seem to enjoy getting people to be attracted to or interested in them. It usually never goes anywhere, and they're loyal when they're in happy relationships (at least the ones I've known have been), but they're still one of the flirtiest types, and I simply cannot see myself with a flirt. (There are even introverts who are too flirty for my tastes. )

I'm pretty sure that's why I've never been close to a male SEE. I'd have a hard time not getting involved, and they seem extremely dangerous to be emotionally involved with. The closest I ever came to being involved with an SEE was a mutual crush I once had with a coworker. When he flat out asked me if I'd ever date him, I simply said, "No." He was sort of surprised and asked why, and I said, "I could never own you." He was like "wth" and walked away irritated. Of course, I was exaggerating for effect when I said "own", but it successfully got the idea across. He asked me similar questions on other occasions, and I told him that he was too much of a flirt for my tastes. He said he doesn't cheat, and I said, "I know." He said, "So why does it matter?" I think that conversation captures the essence of the reason I've never been with an SEE.

Another obstacle was that their attitudes on relationship status are different than mine. I need to know exactly what the status of a relationship is. SEE's have a casual attitude towards establishing a definition of what the relationship is. They tend to get far more involved with someone before wanting a commitment than I could handle. I need relationships to be well defined, leaving no room for questioning or doubts, before I'm willing to invest myself all that much emotionally, and I can't be left to wonder what's going on for any amount of time. I usually lose my patience after a couple of weeks or so. Indecisiveness or hesitation is seen as a sign of potential danger. If things are left undefined (or not clearly defined) for too long, I get spooked and decide that no matter how much I may be attracted to this person, and no matter how compatible we may be in many ways, we're better off just being friends because our different attitudes and perspectives on relationships would quickly drive me out of my mind. I'd feel hurt and insecure when the SEE didn't even do anything wrong. And if I could stay in spite of that, there would probably be a lot of fights. Yep, definitely better off being just friends.

Not that an SEE and LIE couldn't have an awesome relationship. I think there are differences to overcome, primarily due to rationality vs. irrationality, but I'm sure it could be done. If a SEE/LIE couple could get past that, I'll bet they'd be awesome together.

[Joy]

Yeah but most girls I know smoke just a bit. Like 1-2 cigs a day just to calm themselves down or something like this.

oic

[Blaze]

i like joy's narrative about SEE-LIE relation above. it captures this very well and comes kind of close to the way i experience SEE's for some reason.

i really like them in groups. but i can't even be close friends with them, they're just too random, even for me, and (sorry) but way too relationally manipulative. i could never go out with a male esfp either. i know a few and they all cheat.

by way of contrast, i don't really need my relationships to be defined in a step by step way; for me it's more like you stop every so often, look back, analyze and comment on what happened, reach conclusions, and keep going, all in a constant cyclical spiral. there's enough security for me in this type of arrangement. i think i'd feel hemmed in by too much ongoing defining. i'd rather process after the fact, it seems more explorative and mysterious or something. like anything could happen, but yet sort of like, "we're on this path together, let's see what happens next" so there's enough safety but yet enough flexibility and mystery. irrational stance, i spose.

*end of sidebar*

[Khamelion]

WHOA! Whoawhoawhoa, good stuff.


First off,

they're a bunch of sociopaths with an uncanny hatred of the tamias canipes species of chipmunk, green paint, and wristwatches. they all also weigh exactly 3,209 pounds and have high-pitched voices which can only be described as "a mixture of nails, cheese, donuts, penicillin, and 2-methyl 4-ethyl, methly propynol."

heheheh [;

considered me a real nerd that for some error of nature happened to be also good at sports

Oddly enough, this is exactly what happened with the ENTj in question (what inspired this thread) He is a huge nerd but also an athelete, plays ice hockey. Also with what you said about smoking, he has said nearly those exact words. Just a coincidence probably, but interesting!

They're awesome- basically a SEE's wet dream They are NASTY at explaining ANYTHING in order to get u to understand things and never, ever make u feel dumb or degrade u in the process. but don't get me wrong, they do joke around a lot and poke fun but it's all good they're just trying to get their HA in haha. they know a lot of people and are usually very worldly- know a lot about everything. they tend to travel a lot because of this- .they like other cultures a lot. .they're very bouncy and energetic, always on the move and involved in a bjillion things at once... i really have no idea how they get it all done.. they're very eloquent and all the ones i have known have been interested in law. .they're have no shame, or are very foward, or lack tact.... i still have yet to decide which one- maybe a combination of all 3. they're great with words- they're eloquent and use double entendres all the time. .IMO and experiences they're also horny mo fos lol.. they're pretty awesome... the only negative thing i would have to say is that for me personally, they kind of freak me out in that they can be a little too controlling for my taste... go be a control freak in your own life, but the second u try to control any aspect of my life i'll see u later. but that's just me, and my experiences- that may not be necessarily related to type.

and o.m.f.g. heh. This sounds fucking dead-on in relation to the person I'm talking about. I bolded all the parts that hit directly.


Sounds so far like I really have met myself another ENTj. Hooray for me!

Oh, and the controlling bit...he exhibits that behavior too...I've just found a way to battle it so we stay at middle ground. And the circumstances in which we've gotten to know each other prevent him from letting himself be too controlling. It's hard to explain.


pssst...liveandletlive should pm me [;

[Khamelion]

Heh oh yea, I've done a few experiments, and also taken what Joy told me to heart the other day about defining a relationship. My experiment was asking him about his future plans to which he passed the ENTj test with flying colors (haaahahaaaah)

Now the defining thing, well it SEEMS to be working so far...

[discojoe]

Dual monitors are so stupid.

[Khamelion]

Dual monitors are so stupid.

he be at work in that one :]

[Khamelion]

So does he look ENTj or wut? Lulul....more info!

[liveandletlive]

So does he look ENTj or wut? Lulul....more info!

definitely! my boss has the same face as him... friggin creepy! PMing you now love!

[Mediator Kam]

I know an ENTj who sits in front of me in one of my classes. I kinda like her, but whenever I act like "myself" around her, she gets reeaaalllly irritated. I'm obviously hitting her super-ego block or something. Also, she doesn't like my jokes.

The "controlling" aspect of ENTj's is something I cannot handle. I'd rather be free and open-ended in a relationship, friend or not. The idea that someone needs to ask me "What are you doing tonight?" and "We're doing this now" gets on my nerves.

[FDG]

The idea that someone needs to ask me "What are you doing tonight?"

Well...depends for what, doesn't it? If I'm asking just to know what you're doing, it's obviously bad...if I'm asking because I wanna ask you to go out with me, I don't think it is?

Btw...I look nothing like that guy...

[Joy]

Sigh.

[Khamelion]

Sigh.

??

[Joy]

??

That was in response to FDG.

[FDG]

obviously bad?? why can't it just be a normal part of conversation? i like to know what's going on, not necessarily out of distrust. but what if you have to change schedules? or what if you need to get in touch with them, etc.? and i wouldn't ask anyone anything i wouldn't want to be asked.

but i don't mind when someone asks me questions about what i'm doing. maybe there's something appealing about having some sort of unspoken trust. but i find it appealing when someone outwardly cares about and is interested in what i'm doing. maybe it is a rational/irrational distinction. (or maybe just an ifmd95 distinction.)

I don't have a problem when somebody asks me, but I'm paranoid of being perceived as controlling so I avoid asking. This probably comes from a bad past relationship though, nothing type related.

And Joy, why do you sigh?

[Joy]

The controlling thing isn't like... actual control... it's just needing to define the relationship, needing to know if it's exclusive, and needing a partner who isn't a flirt. I can understand how that could seem controlling to an SEE though, which is why I responding to it as I did.

And Joy, why do you sigh?

In all honesty, I'm exasperated by your still thinking you're LIE. If I had to pick one person on this forum who is most obviously Se dominant, it would be you. However, you're free to think whatever you want to think, obviously, and I don't want to turn this into a thread about your type. (But if you don't mind my starting a new thread about your type, I'd be happy to do so.)

[FDG]

Ok, do it.

Do it, and I'll wreck havoc on the forum for days.

[Joy]

Does that mean that you do want me to or don't want me to?

[Blaze]

agree that FDG isn't LIE. to me, he seems SLE. always has.

[FDG]

Does that mean that you do want me to or don't want me to?

I was just mocking what the stereotypical response of a Se dominant would have been, you're obviously free to do anything you want, including a topic on my type of course...

Blaze: what about aristocracy in myself?

[Khamelion]

What some call control, I call interest....

[Blaze]

Blaze: what about aristocracy in myself?

are you saying that you are not aristocratic and this is why you can't be SLE? i don't put that much stock in that dichotomy i guess. and with SLE, you don't notice aristocracy as much as you notice leadership.

i see more Ti than Te with you, and the things you're interested in and the way you express yourself seems more SLE/Ti. the way you relate to the other people on the forum seems less LIE than SLE. the people you appear to get along with better seems to point more to beta than gamma, esp a lot of the LII's.

i understand you perfectly, don't mind reading your posts. they're never long winded. they're usually short and to the point.

you separate into short paragraphs and don't go off on long tangents. you seem different than joy and expat.

but what the hell do i know?

[Khamelion]

Well anyway, I'm pretty much certain he is ENTj. So if you want to use it to debate Fabie's type be my guest.

[FDG]

Blaze's points are good. I don't know, if Joy wants to open a new type thread on me, I'm okay with that, but I'm not big on focussing the attention of so many people on myself, feel like there are issues that are more worth it.

[Gilly]

Ok, do it.

Do it, and I'll wreck havoc on the forum for days.

You know, you're totally right, you're not Se dominant at all.

[ScarlettLux]

SLE always seemed "off" to me ... mustachio/Herzy/FDG have more playful airs, FDG is scarier.

[Khamelion]

You know, you're totally right, you're not Se dominant at all.

My thoughts exactly, rofls

[FDG]

You know, you're totally right, you're not Se dominant at all.

Look at my post above, I said that on purpose to get exactly the reaction you have gotten now...

[Khamelion]

Look at my post above, I said that on purpose to get exactly the reaction you have gotten now...

I kinda figured that too...you people and your mind games!

[redbaron]

I just realized that this woman I know is probably LIE. She lives down the street from me, has three kids and is pretty intense. She's friendly, but in a business-like way. She will usually say hello but seems focused on what she's doing. If she's with someone else and involved in a conversation, she either doesn't say hello at all or will give a nod and go back to what she was going. I've learned that you can't expect her to necessarily include you. (and that's okay with me) She's loud, aggressive and opinionated. I respect her actually, for speaking her mind on things. She never beats around the bush. She seems SUPER busy. "laid back" is about the LAST term I'd use to describe her. She's always running her kids here and there, as well as other people's kids. She reminds me of the saying "it takes a village" and SHE is that village. haha She's very involved in the school and knows EVERYone. Her pace of life is frantic, far too frantic for me. She leaves me behind in the dust and I'm happy about that. lol I get along well with her husband, although he is kinda flighty. I'm thinking INFj for him. They are both concerned with larger societal issues and tend to see much more of the big picture than I do. She takes everything very seriously. I like seeing her laugh because I worry that she's too serious and that the stress of that is going to catch up to her one day. She's rather fascinating actually because she's so different from me. What do you think--does she sound LIE?

[FDG]

I'd say she sounds more ESTj to me.

[redbaron]

I'd say she sounds more ESTj to me.

Oh yeah? Hmmm, could be. The reason I might doubt it is because she works pretty closely with an IEI at our church. They seem to get along fine. But I guess I don't know that for sure as I'm not privy to the ins and outs of their relationship.

[FDG]

Oh yeah? Hmmm, could be. The reason I might doubt it is because she works pretty closely with an IEI at our church. They seem to get along fine. But I guess I don't know that for sure as I'm not privy to the ins and outs of their relationship.

Ok, that is a good reason to think that she isn't an LSE, you're right. I was just trying to fit the image you conveyed with the image of the LIE females I know (3) and it didn't seem to match exactly, but part of it could be due to age differences or simply personality differences. Or maybe what I perceive as "laid back" could be your "high strung".

[redbaron]

Ok, that is a good reason to think that she isn't an LSE, you're right. I was just trying to fit the image you conveyed with the image of the LIE females I know (3) and it didn't seem to match exactly, but part of it could be due to age differences or simply personality differences. Or maybe what I perceive as "laid back" could be your "high strung".

When I read the descriptions, she does seem to fit the LIE more than the LSE but there are plenty of things in the LSE description that seem to match her so it's not an outlandish idea.