A Declaration

[Ezra]

1. There are no LSEs on this forum - they would find personality theories far from interesting. They are doers, not thinkers. They would find socionics to be a waste of time.

2. The only SLEs on this forum are those who joke around and arouse arguments and laughter in people. No SLE would drag out an extended personality theory in writing, carefully and methodically.

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

[Creepy-bg]

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

- those who are here generally to fuck around or talk with people they've become friends with and whose interrest in socionics has become secondary.

[xyz]

I don't challenge you on anything. It seems the majority of the posts are dominated by those that you mentioned.

Bionic goat, I am one of the minorities now (again!) <high5>

[Ezra]

- those who are here generally to fuck around or talk with people they've become friends with and whose interrest in socionics has become secondary.

True. STs and SFs. But they're much rarer than the aforementioned. Hence, they do not belong to that statement.

[aut0]

Hm I guess I don't exist then, lets see:

I'm extremely healthy - Check
I work out 7 days a week - Check
I work on my car/play sports for fun - Check
I go to school full time - Check
I'm fucking damn good looking - Check (This should probably be up first )


I find use in socionics because its helped me to understand why I didn't get along with people in my past, and can help in dealing with people in the future.

You = retarded.

I will give you this though, I have so much time to post on the forums because I don't have a job right now, and since I don't have a job I refuse to let myself date, therefore plenty of free time to argue on the internets

[Not A Communist Shill]

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

- those who are here generally to fuck around or talk with people they've become friends with and whose interrest in socionics has become secondary.

- Subterranean

[Ezra]

Clearly people didn't take note of this:

This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people

So go fuck yourself aut0. It seems the true retard is the one who doesn't read.

[aut0]

You insinuated that every person here was a complete loser, would you like to back up your claim by posting a pic of yourself? You obviously seem to think that you're an SLE

[aut0]

I'm playing Macho man in my head while I await your pic

[snegledmaca]

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

Well, misutii translated the filatova articles and I have translated the article about reinin's attributes. I also have some personal theories about socionics but I don't post them (With one exception) because they are incomplete. And kioshi regularly voices his theories. Your association with the divisions are wrong.

[Ezra]

You insinuated that every person here was a complete loser, would you like to back up your claim by posting a pic of yourself? You obviously seem to think that you're an SLE

I'm surprised you haven't noticed the thread.

http://the16types.info/forums/viewto...longest+thread

http://the16types.info/forums/viewto...hread&start=75

They're not very up to date. If you have a facebook account, you can see these too:

http://www.facebook.com/photo_search...1&id=627218507

Also, please note that I do not think I'm an SLE - half this forum does. The other half scoffs at the way I portray myself as a macho tough guy. I think LSE and LIE are equally likely possibilities.

[Ezra]

You insinuated that every person here was a complete loser

I don't remember making that claim. Please quote me.

[Creepy-bg]

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

Well, misutii translated the filatova articles and I have translated the article about reinin's attributes. I also have some personal theories about socionics but I don't post them (With one exception) because they are incomplete. And kioshi regularly voices his theories. Your association with the divisions are wrong.

just to screw with the legitamacy of this guys statements... I've also done my share of translating too.

[Joy]

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

I have a few to add:

-People who LOVE to talk about themselves
-People who are seeking intellectual stimulation
-People who value either Ne or Ni

[Creepy-bg]

What about people who LOVE to talk about themselves?

yeah, like Joy

[aut0]

You insinuated that every person here was a complete loser

I don't remember making that claim. Please quote me.

1. There are no LSEs on this forum - they would find personality theories far from interesting. They are doers, not thinkers. They would find socionics to be a waste of time.

2. The only SLEs on this forum are those who joke around and arouse arguments and laughter in people. No SLE would drag out an extended personality theory in writing, carefully and methodically.

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

Hm I guess I don't exist then, lets see:

I'm extremely healthy - Check
I work out 7 days a week - Check
I work on my car/play sports for fun - Check
I go to school full time - Check
I'm fucking damn good looking - Check (This should probably be up first )


I find use in socionics because its helped me to understand why I didn't get along with people in my past, and can help in dealing with people in the future.

You = retarded.

I will give you this though, I have so much time to post on the forums because I don't have a job right now, and since I don't have a job I refuse to let myself date, therefore plenty of free time to argue on the internets

My fault you didn't accuse everyone of being a loser, you just accused me of being a loser, considering if LSE is my type than I must be some half-wit that mistakingly figured out how to use the interwebs.

You insinuated that every person here was a complete loser, would you like to back up your claim by posting a pic of yourself? You obviously seem to think that you're an SLE

I'm surprised you haven't noticed the thread.

http://the16types.info/forums/viewto...longest+thread

http://the16types.info/forums/viewto...hread&start=75

They're not very up to date. If you have a facebook account, you can see these too:

http://www.facebook.com/photo_search...1&id=627218507

Also, please note that I do not think I'm an SLE - half this forum does. The other half scoffs at the way I portray myself as a macho tough guy. I think LSE and LIE are equally likely possibilities.

Sorry, I'm allergic to threads over 90 pages. You = ISTJ, but I don't even think I'm going to go beyond this, when I imagine a conversation with you I imagine talking to a brick wall, or see a dog chasing its tail.

This sentence works too: The purpose of this sentence is to explain the purpose of this sentence.

[detail]

The two kinds of people you are referring to are actually two different ways of interacting on the forums that are used by people regardless of their clubs. I figure providing examples will be useless because you will call them exceptions, based on what you answered to others thus far so i will say read the forums (You will see that NFs also contributed a lot to the theory and translation and that NTs are using the intertype relations system probably as much as the NFs do). The use of "primarily" also serves you to use the same concept pointed out in the Sorites paradox, in this case: When does an exception ceases to be an exception?.

The main flaw in your reasoning is that you establish a one to one direct correlation with one behavior and one person, when actually most users on this forum have more than one motive. Take for example the subforum "Anything Goes". It contains approximatively 40% more posts than the second subforum with the most posts. If people who joke around are a minority, then who is responsible for as much as ~25% of the total posts on the whole forums? One could argue that posts on "Anything Goes" take less time to write but we're still talking about over 70000 posts which means ~40% more than in the "General Discussion" section. To ensure that my memory wasn't playing tricks on me, i paid a little visite to the aforementioned subforum and saw that many of the posts were signed by users who belong to the NF and NT clubs. In case you don't believe me, you can always look up for yourself. Now you could still use a cheap debate tactic and tell me "Hey, i said they are interested by X or Z part of socionics, not that they weren't fooling around LOL" but your reply to Bionicgoat indicated that you associate this behavior exclusively to a minority of STs and SFs who don't belong to the statement #3.


So i guess we could summarize your mistakes this way:

-You assume a direct 1-1 correlation between one behavior and one person. (And most probably between one part of the socionics theory and one person)
-You create a relationship of mutual exclusiveness between two different behaviors.
-It leads you to believe that actions in themselves are "kinds of people" that are mutually exclusive.
-You dissociate from pre-categorized people actions that go into another direction than the one you associated them with.
-You associate these with another group that consists of a minority.
-You argue against reality based on the rules of your system instead of the rules of reality, such as the evidence found on the forums that i provided here, using the vagueness of your initial claims to adjust your system so that it fits reality when argued.

[FDG]

1. There are no LSEs on this forum - they would find personality theories far from interesting. They are doers, not thinkers. They would find socionics to be a waste of time.

2. The only SLEs on this forum are those who joke around and arouse arguments and laughter in people. No SLE would drag out an extended personality theory in writing, carefully and methodically.

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

A declaration? Hell Abram Lincoln

[Ezra]

-People who LOVE to talk about themselves

SFs and Betas.

-People who are seeking intellectual stimulation

NTs. They are already accounted for.

-People who value either Ne or Ni

?

[Ezra]

What about people who LOVE to talk about themselves?

yeah, like Joy

I'm pretty sure Joy didn't actually say that.

[Ezra]

Now you could still use a cheap debate tactic and tell me "Hey, i said they are interested by X or Z part of socionics, not that they weren't fooling around LOL" but your reply to Bionicgoat indicated that you associate this behavior exclusively to a minority of STs and SFs who don't belong to the statement #3.

Can't remember who it was, but someone once said that this forum was essentially an NT fest. This was to prove his point that there is a lack of sensers on this forum.

[Joy]

-People who LOVE to talk about themselves

SFs and Betas.

And extroverts and... I don't know, I think just about any type could fall into this category. I also think that people who are seeking self-discovery (especially extroverts) are likely to enjoy talking about themselves.

As a general rule in dealing with people, the more you can get people to talk about themselves or their interests, the more they'll like you. The best way to win friends or people's loyalty or business is to make them feel important, generally by taking an interest in them and the things that interest them.

-People who are seeking intellectual stimulation

NTs. They are already accounted for.

No. Any and every intelligent person will seek intellectual stimulation if they are not in frequent contact with other highly intelligent people who are compatible enough to stimulate them.

In other words, intelligent people of any type.

-People who value either Ne or Ni

?

Otherwise known as "everyone".

What about people who LOVE to talk about themselves?

yeah, like Joy

I'm pretty sure Joy didn't actually say that.

I said that before the edit.

[detail]

someone once said that this forum was essentially an NT fest. This was to prove his point that there is a lack of sensers on this forum.

Yes there are many *NT*s, more than *S**s but it is in itself a useless piece of information and it doesn't even come close to be similar in form to your first post in this thread, which was erroneous. If your first post is what you refer to as a proof, i have to object for the reasons stated in my reply.

[aestrivex]

1. There are no LSEs on this forum - they would find personality theories far from interesting. They are doers, not thinkers. They would find socionics to be a waste of time.

2. The only SLEs on this forum are those who joke around and arouse arguments and laughter in people. No SLE would drag out an extended personality theory in writing, carefully and methodically.

3. This forum is populated primarily by two kinds of people:

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

I challenge you to challenge any one of my statements. I'll ignore and disregard them if you don't back them up with why my statements are incorrect.

your assertions are based on stereotype and Ti-related bullshit. you are ignoring the very obvious situations that there are some sensory types here whose types are widely agreed upon. of course we could be wrong, but if you claim that we're wrong for every single person simply because "it shouldnt work that way," then you're an idiot who is being extremely naive, stereotypical, and ignorant of the reality right in front of him.

[cracka]

- those who are here generally to fuck around or talk with people they've become friends with and whose interrest in socionics has become secondary.

I'm part of this party crowd.

[CuriousSoul]

cracka is one. i think. he just feels so much as an ESTj i know who i think is ESTj because he talks always about Te stuff and Si stuff, is logical, and is not an SLI. he also looks like an ESTj (mix of al pacino and van damme). if you read cracka on the forum, he always talks of Te, is very comfy (Si), but does not feel like any of the ISTps around, more energy, more E stuff.

I have always thought of Cracka as ESTJ and still do.
Now that I know I am ESFJ all the more so.

[cracka]

cracka is one. i think. he just feels so much as an ESTj i know who i think is ESTj because he talks always about Te stuff and Si stuff, is logical, and is not an SLI. he also looks like an ESTj (mix of al pacino and van damme). if you read cracka on the forum, he always talks of Te, is very comfy (Si), but does not feel like any of the ISTps around, more energy, more E stuff.

I have always thought of Cracka as ESTJ and still do.
Now that I know I am ESFJ all the more so.

lol, I felt this same type of thing when UDP said he is an estj... I see us as so different that I can't accept being the same type as him, making me think I'm way more of an ESFJ than I already had. Not meaning this in a bad way, just that we're sooo different if I compare myself to him.

[Ezra]

My fault you didn't accuse everyone of being a loser, you just accused me of being a loser, considering if LSE is my type than I must be some half-wit that mistakingly figured out how to use the interwebs.

That is completely untrue and unjustified. I have much respect for LSEs.

Sorry, I'm allergic to threads over 90 pages. You = ISTJ, but I don't even think I'm going to go beyond this, when I imagine a conversation with you I imagine talking to a brick wall, or see a dog chasing its tail.

As I've explained, LSI is certainly a possibility. However, the descriptions don't fit me, and nor does the IJ temperament.

[Slacker]

You lack imagination. There could be millions of reasons why different people would choose to read about socionics.

[mikemex]

1. There are no LSEs on this forum - they would find personality theories far from interesting. They are doers, not thinkers. They would find socionics to be a waste of time.

Although I do agree with your statement that LSE are generally not interested, you're going too far with stereotypes.

2. The only SLEs on this forum are those who joke around and arouse arguments and laughter in people. No SLE would drag out an extended personality theory in writing, carefully and methodically.

There have been plenty of SLE scientists, mostly in areas close to engineering. A good example was Von Braun.

- Those who are interested in the intertype relationship aspect of socionics (who are, primarily and surprisingly, not SFs but NFs). They are the ones who come up with ideas about why relationships work, how their own relationships correspond to socionics etc.
- Those who are interested in the theory of socionics i.e. NTs/Researchers. They are the ones who translate all the articles, the ones who come up with new theories and ideas about socionics and how they logically fit into the existing system.

According to your definition I'm NT. I'm far more interested in finding out how the mind works than anything else.

[XoX]

My fault you didn't accuse everyone of being a loser, you just accused me of being a loser, considering if LSE is my type than I must be some half-wit that mistakingly figured out how to use the interwebs.

What made you choose LSE over SLE for yourself? I mean perhaps you are the SLE and Ezra is the LSE in the end.