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Thread: Differences between SEE-ESFp and IEE-ENFp

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    Default Differences between SEE-ESFp and IEE-ENFp

    I was reading (and bored too) about this 2 type. MBTI said that ESFP are fun people, down-to-earth, and love new 'things' (music, food, whatever (information here)) . However, Wikisocions said that SEE are generally wary and mistrustful of new things, ideas, and behavior styles that they have not heard of, seen, or conceived of before., which, as I see, is completly the opposite things to MBTI's idea. Follow to this, I remember to myself that IEE are seekers of new things and generally they like to live in world of new ideas because of their , He enjoys the beginning stages of just about anything - new projects, acquiring new skills, experiencing new people and relationships.
    My question finally was, Which type in which way act more positively to new things in their life?

    Maybe (and just my opinion) the SEE type likes to discover things to his own proper pace and he doesn't like that people says to him what new things are out there in the worlds.

    What do you think?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dee
    role Ne is exactly as you described, different positions of Ne in the model would give different attitudes to the new.
    That's why I ask. SEE have Ne in their third function, and like a wrote above, the description is somehow different as a MBTI descripcion IN THAT WAY.
    MTBI Sucks, but I need a best understanding about this point. I mean, can SEE still get fun about getting new ideas using their Se as primary function? Because wikisocions says that are wary about this (for their weak Ne), even if the new idea (for example) is a challenge.

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    SEE are pretty fun orientated people. They like to party pretty hard. The one i know likes to have house parties though, perhaps so he can control who will come?

    I tend to enjoy getting into strange situations. It doesn't happen that often but different groups of people tend to energize me. Just recently i hung out with a group of like 5 people i didn't know and one i did. Was really interesting to me getting to know the people and wondering what would happen. The same group of people can get a little boring after not long.

    ESFp's being Irrational are pretty chilled out though. As there role they would go along with new things but wouldn't actively seek them out as much. They are pretty confident people though so when something comes up they cruise through it quite well.

    I think i just told you obvious stuff though
    ENFp (Unsure of Subtype)

    "And the day came when the risk it took to remain closed in a bud became more painful than the risk it took to blossom." - Anaïs Nin

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    Your answer is very useful, since you are IEE. Thanks! Meatburger


    though when time brings them to them somehow, and they start considering them, sort of putting them through themselves, they are energized and use them or whatever with possibly high enthusiasm.
    I believe in this sentence too, maybe they are just looking/waiting for something new useful, practical and of course, funny. But after time they loose the enthusiasm and they forget them looking for new stuff or challenge.

    Anyway, is there ANY SEE here who is not the all day looking for gilfriends/boyfriends/friends on the internet who can answer this question?

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    Quote Originally Posted by normal
    Anyway, is there ANY SEE here who is not the all day looking for gilfriends/boyfriends/friends on the internet who can answer this question?
    Sadly not dude we dont have any regular SEE's here. A few people are suspected to be them but its never confirmed. Even if they did come they might not know how to answer
    ENFp (Unsure of Subtype)

    "And the day came when the risk it took to remain closed in a bud became more painful than the risk it took to blossom." - Anaïs Nin

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    Oh, how sad

    I used to believe that I'm SEE, maybe because I tend to looking for fun and girls n' stuff like that when younger, you know, but actually I don't think finding their own type is stereotypically dork. I mean, people like me like to know this kind of thing as a important resourse for my own self-discover so is very important (or at least, I give them the importance), how sad that I'm too changeable.
    Fuck

    Anyway, thanks dude

    (my intention with this were to find any SEE to see if we have something related)

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    hey ESFp here haha so yeah i think we are attracted to new things in terms of because then it's a new sensation, fun, adventure that I haven't experienced yet. For instance, I like trying foods I've never had before; particularly from another ethnicity so that I also learn a little bit about the culture in the process (oh how i love )

    Anyway, sorry to go on a tangent but yeah when it comes to people bringing up new theories or new ways to do something I'm mistrustful of it because if "it ain't broke don't fix it" also too i need the physical evidence or facts and stats in order for me to be open-minded to this new method, process, whatever.


    Hope that helps!
    ESFp-Fi sub
    6w7 sx/so/sp

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    LOL

    SEEs are very underated!

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    Default Differences of ENFps and ESFps in social settings

    like a party, where theres a gathering of people

    howwilleach compare/contrast to eachother?
    <Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not

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    I don't have a real convinced opinion on this one, but just to let you know, here are the differences:

    ENFP:
    1 talking for keeping up the relationship with others
    2 having a laugh for themselves / making fun of others
    3 Not so the center of attention
    4 Stating opinions

    ESFP:
    1 talking with a genuine interest for the other person.
    2 Trying to make the other person a laugh / making fun of themselves
    3 Usually noticable by everyone.
    4 Storytelling

    Both however are playful and joking.

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    I disagree that ESFps show a "genuine interest" in people and we don't. I'd say both are the same there. And I think both are into storytelling.

    ESFps are more boisterous generally, from what I've seen. I think the two are more alike than different. ENFps shy away from confrontation and ESFps don't, so if some kind of confrontation comes up you could look for that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker Mom View Post
    I disagree that ESFps show a "genuine interest" in people and we don't. I'd say both are the same there. And I think both are into storytelling.

    ESFps are more boisterous generally, from what I've seen. I think the two are more alike than different. ENFps shy away from confrontation and ESFps don't, so if some kind of confrontation comes up you could look for that.
    Really? I've seen some ENFp's really say their piece at times! And they can be quite stubborn when the mood is on them.

    @Jarno, overall I think what you wrote is quite good. Slackermum makes a good point about talking to someone with an interest in them personally for both the types, however I think the ENFp is more aware of how everyone is interacting with each other, hence the bigger picture of the relationships taking place, which I think is what you were getting at.

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    Well we aren't wilting violets, but if you compare functional use, ESFps have leading Se, which ENFps have weak and unvalued Se. So if you compare the two, that would be a difference. That doesn't mean we are never involved in confrontation, just we shy away when compared to ESFps.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
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    Heh @ the wilting violet comment.

    Yeah, SM is correct.

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    I had an ESFp ex, and when we went to parties together, he'd sorta get into "alpha male" mode and would be very loud, funny, dominant. He'd be the first to make fun of himself or others, would act out silly movements, etc. He liked to get people rilled up and get little competitions going like drinking contests, etc. I didn't have as much chance to talk with all of that going on, so I probably looked like an introvert.

    But, after we broke up, I kept the same circle of friends, and without him there I noticed that I was much louder and became the one to get everyone to have fun (but in a more subdued way). I was outgoing but less loud (and less likely to dance in a silly way for the amusement of strangers), and while I do also make fun of myself, it's in a quieter way and I probably wouldn't get strangers to partake in a drinking contest (however, w/ my close friends, I might if I was bored).

    It can be hard to tell because when ENFps are acting aggressive, we can look a lot like ESFps, but it's for a shorter time and it's when we're stressed out, not our default personality.

    Also, I knew a girl who was ESFp, and while she wasn't as loud, she was more forward in getting people drinks or food (making the drinks herself), where as I'm less hands on.

    Both ESFps and ENFps are welcoming of strangers, but ENFps seem to do better one-on-one w/ the new person (because that's where we can figure them out quickly and make them feel comfortable), and ESFps are better at welcoming either individuals or large groups (they don't seem to get intimidated).

    I noticed ESFps do come across as friendlier, and more likely to chat loudly in line with a stranger. More gregarious. ENFps are quieter until we feel comfortable and then we are loud and silly for periods of time.

    So like slackermom said, that Se makes for a big difference, though both types are warm, enthusiastic and friendly.
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

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    I'm pretty much having an "I agree with jewel" day and since I'm too tired to try to come up with my own words, I'll just second that post. Jewels, I think you did a good job describing the differences/similarities between ENFps and ESFps, as I've noticed between myself and my mom who is ESFp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    I don't have a real convinced opinion on this one, but just to let you know, here are the differences:

    ENFP:
    1 talking for keeping up the relationship with others
    2 having a laugh for themselves / making fun of others
    3 Not so the center of attention
    4 Stating opinions

    ESFP:
    1 talking with a genuine interest for the other person.
    2 Trying to make the other person a laugh / making fun of themselves
    3 Usually noticable by everyone.
    4 Storytelling

    Both however are playful and joking.
    this is pretty good but with standard subtypes you end up with yet another 2 scenarios or a division of the existing two.
    ENTP:wink:ALPHA

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    I don't have a real convinced opinion on this one, but just to let you know, here are the differences:

    ENFP:
    1 talking for keeping up the relationship with others
    2 having a laugh for themselves / making fun of others
    3 Not so the center of attention
    4 Stating opinions

    ESFP:
    1 talking with a genuine interest for the other person.
    2 Trying to make the other person a laugh / making fun of themselves
    3 Usually noticable by everyone.
    4 Storytelling

    Both however are playful and joking.
    Could it be that some of these characteristics are shared with other extroverted irrationals? E.g. I've seen ESFp characteristic #2/3 in ESTp's as well.

    I'd like to see a cool matrix of some kind.
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    Could it be that some of these characteristics are shared with other extroverted irrationals? E.g. I've seen ESFp characteristic #2/3 in ESTp's as well.
    Yep I agree.

    Though we could make another division with ESFP and ESTP.

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    Default IEE vs SEE

    Simple question, how are they different? How are they similar? How would a relationship with an SLI be different with an SEE than with an IEE? What would be some key ways to notice the difference? Should these differences be glaringly obvious? I've tried to go off quadra preferences and what not and I'm still at a loss.

    IEE's have you ever confused yourself for SEE? If so, why? SLI's, do you also have trouble differentiating between the two?

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    both are warm and energetic. But look for Se! If you see Se or hear sensory details in conversation that's a ESFp! Fi is there for both.

    ESFp are a bit more upfront about being louder and more outgoing in a "take control" way and ENFps are a bit quieter (or at least take a bit longer to open up before they start being all gushy about how wonderful you are).

    Also ESFp will do silly things to make people laugh in a physical way, like doing a ridiculous dance in public, where as an ENFp might be too shy. Or the ENFp will do a silly dance for 3 secs and go back to standing where as the ESFp will continue w/o shame.

    Both like to talk about people's motives, but the ESFp understands it from the tactical approach someone may be taking to get what they want (Se), example, "that guy is working that angle because he wants to take over that whole team." where as the ENFp focuses on that person's motivation from an emotional side (Fi) "she's feeling insecure right now so she's hitting on that girl's boyfriend, which is so wrong, but I understand it."

    ESFp talk about real things. "I saw this movie w/ so and so actor and then my friend did such and such and I said he was an idiot." ENFp likes to talk about themes, theory, "Your friend reminds me a lot of your other two friends -- I wonder if all of your friends are pretty quiet people?"
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

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    SEE - smash iron bars into smithereens the feel bad about it.

    IEE - have lots of iron bars and twists them into all sorts of unusual shapes then name them things like "Fred", "Albert" and "Loopy-do" and gives them to people as random presents, then feels bad that they got the shapes wrong and wants to make them other things.

    This post is stupid, btw.

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    hmmm interesting

    I have such a hard time noticing how different Sensing and Intuition are in the real world. Unless it's extremely obvious (which it probobly hardly ever is) I can't identify it. I guess maybe since i'm so grounded in reality, it's hard for me to pick up on, I dont know. Maybe I'm going off MBTI too much here...you can't just focus on one function as they all play an equally important role in typing someone. I might have to resurrect the IEE famous person's thread (if it exists). I need real life examples here.

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    SEE --> they reject new ideas

    IEE --> they embrace new ideas
    ILE "Searcher"
    Socionics: ENTp
    DCNH: Dominant --> perhaps Normalizing
    Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
    MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
    Astrological sign: Aquarius

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    IEEs are light and fluffy, and also have social grace.
    SEEs are solid and have a grounded grace to them.

    Both are personable. One type needs practical intuitional help, another type needs practical sensory help.


    I know, these things are so straightfoward when I say them, but it really comes down to being able to realize the functions, feel them as per how people use them. If I knew the words your mind used to designate certain feelings or reactions, I'd use them.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
    Simple question, how are they different? How are they similar? How would a relationship with an SLI be different with an SEE than with an IEE? What would be some key ways to notice the difference? Should these differences be glaringly obvious? I've tried to go off quadra preferences and what not and I'm still at a loss.

    IEE's have you ever confused yourself for SEE? If so, why? SLI's, do you also have trouble differentiating between the two?
    Ah, I didn't really read all of that.

    Those are good questions to ask


    One thing I would expect to be noticeable, with two sensory types, is that you both might be fighting for control of "S" things. Both SEE and SLI will feel "responsible" to take the lead on S things and to arrange S things to their liking (be it eating, touching people, how they feel (physically), etc).

    That is what stands out when I'm with other S people.

    There might be a nice sort of chemistry in that one person is F (Fi creative) and the other is T (Te creative), which works out really nicely. Those kinds of relationships seem very comfortable.

    Compared to SEE and IEE, SEE seems a lot more focused on the "now", where as IEEs are more scatterbrained and following various mental leads. SLIs see IEEs as less intrusive that way and feel more comfortable establishing and leading in S matters with IEEs.


    SEE SLI can be somewhat enjoyable, especially if you are going to be doing mostly physical things.



    Why do you ask, Jessica?
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    All obvious reasons point to IEE but what really get's me here is our relationship. If it's duality, it's disappointing. I know duality isn't absolute perfection and understanding and bliss but I'd at least like to feel like you'd be excited and energized by your dual. That's really where my confusion is coming into play. I think this person is IEE but if I were to base it off the relation description only, I'd say it was SEE/SLI.

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    What kind of excitement do you think should be there. What are you missing?
    What are you looking for?

    What do you want this person to provide you with?


    Duality can be 'boring' in that such complementary people don't "challenge" you, but it depends on where you're coming from, and what your quadra's take on duality is.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    One thing I would expect to be noticeable, with two sensory types, is that you both might be fighting for control of "S" things. Both SEE and SLI will feel "responsible" to take the lead on S things and to arrange S things to their liking (be it eating, touching people, how they feel (physically), etc).
    Yeah, usually I notice this immediately too but I don't with this particular person. I don't necessarily notice the "N", it's just more like a lack of "S"....or a completely equal balance of both. It's extremely confusing to me. I'm not sure if what I'm noticing as a likeable feature in this person is just related to the 'F'. He very well could be SEE and i'm just liking his 'F-ness'. Argh, does that make sense? I don't know how else to explain it.

    Compared to SEE and IEE, SEE seems a lot more focused on the "now", where as IEEs are more scatterbrained and following various mental leads. SLIs see IEEs as less intrusive that way and feel more comfortable establishing and leading in S matters with IEEs.
    I never feel like I have to be the one to carry out the 'S' matters...but then i'm wondering if that's just related to 'I' vs 'E'...? Is that MBTI here that's confusing me?


    Duality can be 'boring' in that such complementary people don't "challenge" you, but it depends on where you're coming from, and what your quadra's take on duality is.
    Yeah.. It's comforting, it's nice, but not challenging and lacking a bit of excitment. We're not romantically involved--the thought has arouse a few times but that's just not going to happen. This is just out of curiosity..

    I can't gather my thoughts right now for some reason. More later maybe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
    I never feel like I have to be the one to carry out the 'S' matters...but then i'm wondering if that's just related to 'I' vs 'E'...? Is that MBTI here that's confusing me?
    I was using different layers of generalization, but yes, I can see how it was unclear.

    Instead of "being the one to carry out S matters", perhaps more like you feel a certain responsibility for S related things (sensory things, including both Si and Se). Tension, possibly (theoretically) could arise because both of you would have an S function in your ego block - that is, it would be something that both of you feel 'responsible' for. That's not bad, but the different preferences might be strange - particularly Se vs Si.

    What you'd ultimately miss, though, would be the Ne that your dual would provide. Related, an aggressor might not let you "care for them" enough. As an SLI, that might not really register anyways, because SLIs can be very hands off on most things. But, if you don't feel useful or like you are helping someone - doing anything for them, then, that might make you feel like there isn't that much there.


    To be honest, I've never had issues with how SEEs go about S related things, so, I can't really say in comparison to myself. They don't strike me as pushy or anything.



    However, all I've done in this post is present different theoretical approaches. I don't think anything I'm saying is diagnosis of the situation, because I still don't know what the situation is.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Duality? Boring? Well, if it's a new experience, then there's often a thrill. After that wears off, you're still energized by your dual... but not excited. Just... recharged.

    Source: Experiencing Dual Relations



    LII-Ne

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    I've always found my husband to be comfortable, not really energizing, though as I understand it the extravert and the introvert have different experiences as far as that goes. But what was most noticeable to me immediately was a lack of conflict.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    It will seem boring if you're coming off of relationships with other people that are based on lots of excitement and doing things. (That is, when you're not really dualized and perhaps don't realize the value of dual interactions. when you're not acclimated to the goodnesss of duality).

    I think recharging, yes, is a great way to put what duality is. And yes, @ slacker mom. For me it's more "relaxing", as in, this is someone who I do not have to put effort into in terms of just living with or doing things with that person.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    It will seem boring if you're coming off of relationships with other people that are based on lots of excitement and doing things. (That is, when you're not really dualized and perhaps don't realize the value of dual interactions. when you're not acclimated to the goodnesss of duality).
    This is very true. I think maybe i've been comparing my relationships I've had with Beta's and that's obviously going to be a lot different than how my relationship are with Deltas. The relationships I've had with Beta's have been intense and explosive and I think I made the mistake of thinking that was healthy... and a gage of how interested the other person was. Maybe without that, that's what's making me feel "bored".

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    Jessica, I recommend you reading about Epicurus and specially his book "About happiness". I'm not sure what type he was, but definitely Delta NF.

    Risking spoiling it, I will just say excitement doesn't really make you happy. Excitement is an unstable state, impossible to maintain for long. Unreal. And the more you become addicted to the "highs", the more harshly you will experience the "lows". Emotions are chemicals within the brain, identical to any commercial drug.

    True happiness is a state of serenity, where nothing hurts or bothers you. And even if he didn't said it explicitly, Epicurus was thus probably the first person to realize the true importance of a dual in our lives. Only those who have experienced such serenity can claim being truly happy.
    [] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)

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    If they're Delta*

    Duality? Boring? Well, if it's a new experience, then there's often a thrill. After that wears off, you're still energized by your dual... but not excited. Just... recharged.
    Quoth the man with the golden eyeball Fe DS

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    I think excitement should be there, dual or not. Not an unhealthy sorta edge of my chair I'm freaking out sort of excitment, but at least a sorta "ooh I'm excited to see this person!" thing.

    From the variety of ISTps I've met, it's been run between competely boring to completely exciting. I don't think that part is type related -- whether that is platonic friends or romantic too: you can be excited to see platonic friends when they're fun people.

    I think duality is sort of like when a left handed person sits at a dinner table and they are NOT hitting into a right handed person's hand. It's better for everyone that way. But all it tells you is that. What kind of person they are and if you like them is a whole different thing -- but yeah, duality is a great starting point.

    But like I posted before, I met a hideously boring ISTp who I really disliked...so there is a lot more to people than type. Like the way they smell, how their voice sounds, how smart or talented (or not) they are, their life experiences, their subtypes, their culture, their goals and potential (or lack of) -- and I think that combination of everything together is what draws us together or repels us. I think boring might just mean you have no way to grow from spending time together? Just a theory...I dunno
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

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    Upon further thought, I don't think this person is IEE. SEE is much more probable. It's all making sense now. Thanks for the input.

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    It's comforting, it's nice, but not challenging and lacking a bit of excitment.
    Actually, I feel more initial connection and 'euphoria' with ILIs than SLIs. Then they look to me for more Se.. initiative? motivational energy? pursuit? I don't know what, but the relationship stalls out very quickly. And I feel like there's a gap in understanding that's not being bridged. Ever. We have interesting conversations, but no really deep connection, or intrinsic comfort around each other.

    Duality isn't euphoric from the get-go - not in the Hollywood OMG I LOVE THIS PERSON SO MUCH AND WE'VE JUST MET WE'RE GOING TO BE HAPPY FOREVVVVVER.

    In fact, with the SLI I'm seeing (?), our dates have been pretty comfortable, with a smidge of typical barely-know-this-person awkwardness. But for once, I also feel like I'm not trying to entertain him. And I don't HAVE to entertain him. I'm just being myself - and "myself" is off-and-on talkative and quiet, tbqh. It takes me a while to get used to someone.
    IEE

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiny_dancer View Post
    Actually, I feel more initial connection and 'euphoria' with ILIs than SLIs. Then they look to me for more Se.. initiative? motivational energy? pursuit? I don't know what, but the relationship stalls out very quickly. And I feel like there's a gap in understanding that's not being bridged. Ever. We have interesting conversations, but no really deep connection, or intrinsic comfort around each other.
    This is exactly how it is for me and SEE's. Almost exactly. The main problem being the gap in understanding and lack of a deep connection. It feels very superficial...nothing ever getting deeper than how it feels to have a casual conversation with an aquaintance. It's so frustrating. Yeah. If I could sum this relation up, it'd be frustrating. It gets old fast. And one thing I notice, I'm very nervous around this particular person...people don't usually have that effect on me so it's really upsetting to me when i feel that way. It's sort of a..."now what" sort of feeling. None of that nice dual comfortable-ness we hear of.

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