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Thread: quadra ideas

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    Default quadra ideas

    I remember something a while back that said that Alpha comes up with new ideas, Beta tests them, Gamma measures them against what's tried and true, and Delta... accepts or rejects them?

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    Default Re: quadra ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    I remember something a while back that said that Alpha comes up with new ideas, Beta tests them, Gamma measures them against what's tried and true, and Delta... accepts or rejects them?
    Refines them, and gives them a human touch?

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    Default Re: quadra ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Gamma measures them against what's tried and true
    Nope; Beta tests them, and when the test is passed, they become "tried and true"; so Gamma refines them to obtain maximum efficiency.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    from toronto with love ScarlettLux's Avatar
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    CLEARLY Beta has got it good


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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux
    CLEARLY Beta has got it good
    well, i think they're all equally good
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux
    CLEARLY Beta has got it good
    well, i think they're all equally good
    But subjectively, shouldn't she see Beta as having the best role, seeing as she is one?
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    I dunno, I think Alpha tests them; Beta actually uses them for their intended purpose. Gamma refines. Delta makes use of the refined product.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux
    CLEARLY Beta has got it good
    well, i think they're all equally good
    But subjectively, shouldn't she see Beta as having the best role, seeing as she is one?
    I don't think so, people should always be objective
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    I dunno, I think Alpha tests them; Beta actually uses them for their intended purpose. Gamma refines. Delta makes use of the refined product.

    So you're saying Alpha gets two steps? Inventing AND testing?

    What does the bolded mean? That each quadra has a step, but Beta just uses the ideas as opposed to contributing to the full product the quadra's seem to be trying to form? And the same with Delta? Only after Gamma refines it?

    I'm actually not seeing any sense in this ordering >.> So I'll stop..
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    Well, Alpha experiments and tosses things around to see what's feasible; this looking like "two steps" is only a product of grammar. Once there's actually something there, Beta takes it and puts it to use. Once it's been used, Gamma takes it and fine-tunes it to how it needs to work based on what worked and what didn't in the Beta stage. Delta takes the finished product and uses it productively.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux
    CLEARLY Beta has got it good
    well, i think they're all equally good
    But subjectively, shouldn't she see Beta as having the best role, seeing as she is one?
    I don't think so, people should always be objective
    Is this a joke?
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by ScarlettLux
    CLEARLY Beta has got it good
    well, i think they're all equally good
    But subjectively, shouldn't she see Beta as having the best role, seeing as she is one?
    I don't think so, people should always be objective
    Is this a joke?
    Not always, but for example there can't be a better option among those, just like there can't be a better type, just like nobody should ever say Fe is better than Fi, even if they are a Fi or Fe type.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    But it makes sense that she is attracted to her Quadra's role, no? Isn't that the way it should be?
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    My point is... I have seen what Alpha does vs. what Gamma does pointed out and attributed in some way to Ti.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    But it makes sense that she is attracted to her Quadra's role, no? Isn't that the way it should be?
    Uhm, I unwilligly admit that yes it makes sense, even if it'd be better if she remained impartial
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    The Alpha role sucks!!!!

    Okay, now that I have gotten that out, I think every type can invent something new, its just that they all go about it differently. Heck I even know of an inventive ISFj (no offense to ISFj's on here). The gamma quadra by nature (via information metabolism) is the most conservative when concerned with doing something different. Alphas are the least structured in this area and the other two quadras are somewhere in the middle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean
    Okay, now that I have gotten that out, I think every type can invent something new, its just that they all go about it differently. Heck I even know of an inventive ISFj (no offense to ISFj's on here). The gamma quadra by nature (via information metabolism) is the most conservative when concerned with doing something different. Alphas are the least structured in this area and the other two quadras are somewhere in the middle.
    I think Betas and Deltas are the most conservative quadras. Aristocracy=conservativism (in my experience)
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    btw, I think Alpha is too naive and idealistic to test ideas the way Beta can. The way Alpha "tests" them is probably more similar to "Beta testing".

    And I do think a lot of what Gamma does is measuring new ideas against what's tried and true and has withstood the test of time. Gamma isn't afraid of change, but don't see any value in change for the sake of change. It's all about what works.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    And I do think a lot of what Gamma does is measuring new ideas against what's tried and true and has withstood the test of time. Gamma isn't afraid of change, but don't see any value in change for the sake of change. It's all about what works.
    HELLO USE YOUR NI FUNCTION, IF GAMMA IS AFTER BETA AND THOSE ARE HISTORICAL CYCLES, THEN WHAT GAMMA HAS AT ITS DISPOSAL IS EVERYTHING DONE BY BETAS, AND THAT'S WHAT IS "TRIED AND TRUE"
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Alphas are silly babies and Gammas are open-minded yet realistic
    Oh, ok. That makes sense.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Alphas are silly babies and Gammas are open-minded yet realistic

    I would say that is true most of the time. But not always

    Also, as far as testing versus inventing, I actually do more testing and application than inventing. So this whole business about new ideas going through quadras is not as simple in reality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    IF GAMMA IS AFTER BETA AND THOSE ARE HISTORICAL CYCLES, THEN WHAT GAMMA HAS AT ITS DISPOSAL IS EVERYTHING DONE BY BETAS, AND THAT'S WHAT IS "TRIED AND TRUE"
    What's "tried and true" is from previous cycles. It has to be implemented by Delta before it falls into the category I refer to as "tried and true".

    Let's say people are already doing A. Alpha comes up with B, Beta tests it and fixes stuff if necessary, then it goes to Gamma. Gamma evaluates whether B is of greater value than A. If it is, it's implemented by Delta and then becomes what is "tried and true".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana
    I don't think it's quite as simple as A->B->G->D Think instead of everyone as a network, everything is happening simultaneously, and these roles of each quadra get blurred and merged. When working with things and ideas, it's not so separated out like that. An ENTp might be improving something an INTp developed, while an ISTp is testing it, and an ENFj is coming up with ways to introduce the idea to the public, or whatever.
    There, that is my experience.

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    I think there's something to be said for Beta in terms of finding was to utilize Alpha's ideas. There's also something to be said for Delta in terms of ethical evaluation of the ideas and the implementation of the ideas.

    (And I agree with Diana.)

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    Alpha doesn't change thing for "change" sake, it wants things to change based on how they view the world should be run.

    Alpha creates the idea, beta makes the idea workable, gamma runs the idea, and delta protects the idea.
    "To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"

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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean
    Okay, now that I have gotten that out, I think every type can invent something new, its just that they all go about it differently. Heck I even know of an inventive ISFj (no offense to ISFj's on here). The gamma quadra by nature (via information metabolism) is the most conservative when concerned with doing something different. Alphas are the least structured in this area and the other two quadras are somewhere in the middle.
    I think Betas and Deltas are the most conservative quadras. Aristocracy=conservativism (in my experience)
    ?!?!?!


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    A few ideas on quadra development and implementation:

    (this doesn't really examine the ethical side of the quadras):

    Alpha-

    Begins things, develops them. this could be science, technology, even entertainment. A very original quadra.

    These new things lead to new facts and ways of thinking about the world.

    Beta-


    In a Te society:
    Takes the new things and institutionalizes them. This means takes new science facts(like food sanitation) makes laws and uses institutions like government to implement them. Also willing to destroy the sense of order if they think there is a better means.
    In a Ti society:
    Tends to more radical implementations of order based on belief of what is 'good' for society. communist societies, many middle eastern governments are obviously more Ti oriented.

    Gamma-

    Takes in all the new things, and order and finds out what is honestly happening. Whereas Betas want to introduce order in the environment, gammas want to organize things for practical gain rather than consistent order, and law(this conflicts with Ti who say that order and belief create a working society. Gamma sees a working society as one where everyone benefits from practical gain). Think more economically than society-wise. Occupy the more analytical sides of western government(most western capitalist governments emphasize gamma/delta values). Economists always strike me as the heart of the gamma ideal.

    Delta -

    The perfectionist quadra. Labor down and up. Highly skilled with money, work, anything. Less analytical than the NTs, but more practically skilled. The guy who builds your house, and the guy who does your surgery. The wholesome quadra, ahaha.


    rough look at quadras with various stereotypes, but it is simple. There is a link between alpha and delta as well. Quadras are interesting and i can't think of them without thinking of governments.
    asd

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    Default Re: quadra ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    I remember something a while back that said that Alpha comes up with new ideas, Beta tests them, Gamma measures them against what's tried and true, and Delta... accepts or rejects them?
    I guess the question here is whether what is "said" is actually true. I mean, so someone said this. Why accept it as fact?

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    Default Re: quadra ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    I remember something a while back that said that Alpha comes up with new ideas, Beta tests them, Gamma measures them against what's tried and true, and Delta... accepts or rejects them?
    I guess the question here is whether what is "said" is actually true. I mean, so someone said this. Why accept it as fact?
    She never said she did. What she is trying to figure out, it seems, is the basic framework and ideas behind such a proposition.
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