Elro

[Elro]

I'm probably about to stop posting as much, since it seems like I'm getting addicted to this place and that needs to stop. (Though I'll still be around, just less so.) In the meantime, since right now is probably the best time for something like this:

What type do you think I am and why?

Emphasis on the why - please justify your typings (at least somewhat) so I can get an idea of where you're coming from. Also, please don't let past typings (like the type I came in here with or the type that's probably most actively promoted by its wielders (neither will be mentioned in this post to help fight the inertia of typings)) influence your decision. I've noticed in the past this has seemed to impact consensus greatly, but that's not always helpful if those types are off.

[Joy]

You have a Delta feel to you. Ne/Si > Ni/Se, Te/Fi > Ti/Fe

I'd say ENFp is likely. Then ISTp, then INFj. But I don't have much to go on there. In our conversations, you often tell me why people say the stuff they do. It seems like ethical Ne, as ENFps do something similar (if not the same).

[Creepy-bg]

some type of delta NT or alpha NF... I'd have to have a blood sample to narrow it down.



(serriously... ENFp if not some alpha)

[eunice]

some type of delta NT or alpha NF... I'd have to have a blood sample to narrow it down.



(serriously... ENFp if not some alpha)

Was that intentional?

[olduser]

i don't really know anything about him. he should give us personal observations about his behaviour, and we should hypothesize. I only actively observe a few people's behaviour in a socionics context, and that is only when i think they are the wrong type.

[Logos]

Honestly, who isn't being typed as ENFp these days?

[UDP]

Why do you see yourself as an ESTj?

I would say I am much more ESTj than you are.

[Elro]

i don't really know anything about him. he should give us personal observations about his behaviour, and we should hypothesize. I only actively observe a few people's behaviour in a socionics context, and that is only when i think they are the wrong type.

Yes, I know. I hesitate to do that, because I'm afraid subconsciously I'll slant the description towards one type or another, since I'm starting to get too familiar with the types. I was hoping my recent spurt of activity here had given people some fairly decent material to work with. If enough people want me to, though, I'll throw something together.

Why do you see yourself as an ESTj?

I don't. It's not impossible, but the whole ESTj sig was intended more as a joke. (Although I don't mind efficiency, I would hardly call myself its "paragon" while being serious. Actually, if I'm even using the word "paragon," I'm probably joking. Though not now.)

[olduser]

Yes, I know. I hesitate to do that, because I'm afraid subconsciously I'll slant the description towards one type or another, since I'm starting to get too familiar with the types. I was hoping my recent spurt of activity here had given people some fairly decent material to work with. If enough people want me to, though, I'll throw something together.

get your mom to write a description of you.

[Elro]

"My son is a dear boy that everyone loves, and he would never hurt anyone, and I love him so much and could never see him any other way, even if the truth was horrible, oh so horrible."

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[olduser]

lol

[Mea]

"My son is a dear boy that everyone loves, and he would never hurt anyone, and I love him so much and could never see him any other way, even if the truth was horrible, oh so horrible."

[Logos]

"My son is a dear boy that everyone loves, and he would never hurt anyone, and I love him so much and could never see him any other way, even if the truth was horrible, oh so horrible."

There really is no way around seeing that one.

[Elro]

Okay, okay.

Less laughing, more graphing:



(That's bar graph format in case it's confusing.)

And just because I put up an image like that doesn't mean I'm expecting you to use it - in fact, it would be better if you explained your viewpoint instead (or as well).

If you think I'm Ne-ego, do you mean dominant, or creative? And what of the judging function? Etc etc.

Thanks for your responses so far.

[Joy]

Okay, okay.

Less laughing, more graphing:

I think this points towards ENFp.

[Joy]

Okay, I know this isn't exactly what you're looking for...

Delta > Alpha > Gamma > Beta

ENFp > INFj or ISTp > Alpha NT > anything else

[Logos]

Okay, okay.

Less laughing, more graphing:

I think this points towards ENFp.

Why?

[Mea]

Okay, I know this isn't exactly what you're looking for...

Delta > Alpha > Gamma > Beta

ENFp > INFj or ISTp > Alpha NT > anything else

Yea. I kinda agree with this.
But I think I'm pretty sure Elro is an Ne dominant.

[Joy]

I think this points towards ENFp.

Why?

I was half joking, but I could see how a Te hidden agenda Ne type would like to receive information in a format like that.

[Logos]

Well Elro, to what capacity do you use ?

Edit: for Elro :wink:

People believe that you have to some prominent capacity, and they seem to say that it is most likely your leading function, which would narrow your type down to ENTp and ENFp. If you are an ENTp, then you have a PoLR, but if you are an ENFp, you will of course have a PoLR. So there is no getting around the fact that your type is dependent in this case upon your creative function and whether or not you think that you have a vs. creative function or whether or not you see or as your PoLR. So when I ask you to what capacity that you use , I am essentially asking a quite loaded question of the aforementioned.

The individual easily generates logical systems and formulations to explain a set of phenomena that he has experienced or studied. However, these logical systems or explanations are not viewed as permanent or all-encompassing, but can be improved upon or even discarded as new experience and information is added.

VS.

The individual is very adept at perceiving, establishing, and maintaining personal bonds between people. However, these bonds are often perceived as being situational and flexible rather than static. The individual is inclined to focus on establishing personal bonds with other people in the context of realizing or following perceptions from his base function.

[Elro]

Edit: for Elro :wink:

Thanks for the clarification.

People believe that you have to some prominent capacity, and they seem to say that it is most likely your leading function, which would narrow your type down to ENTp and ENFp. If you are an ENTp, then you have a PoLR, but if you are an ENFp, you will of course have a PoLR. So there is no getting around the fact that your type is dependent in this case upon your creative function and whether or not you think that you have a vs. creative function or whether or not you see or as your PoLR. So when I ask you to what capacity that you use , I am essentially asking a quite loaded question of the aforementioned.

See, you're asking me to make a case for my own type, using my own knowledge of a system I'm not confident I completely understand yet. Thus I hesitate. But I will try to answer your question as best I can.

The individual easily generates logical systems and formulations to explain a set of phenomena that he has experienced or studied. However, these logical systems or explanations are not viewed as permanent or all-encompassing, but can be improved upon or even discarded as new experience and information is added.

VS.

The individual is very adept at perceiving, establishing, and maintaining personal bonds between people. However, these bonds are often perceived as being situational and flexible rather than static. The individual is inclined to focus on establishing personal bonds with other people in the context of realizing or following perceptions from his base function.

My default reaction to Ti descriptions ("logical systems," "formulations," "phenomena," etc.) is kind of negative actually. I'm not sure if the way they are presented is supposed to appeal to Ti types or not. Personally I try to avoid more complicated terms than necessary, which is probably due to intellectual laziness or something, not sure. (When I was younger, oddly, I was better at reading that kind of language.) But overall: it's talking about working with cause and effect, right? "Easily generates logical systems... to explain a set of phenomena he has experienced or studied." So, in simpler terms, one tries to explain why one thinks things happened the way they did? This is something I do a lot: other people will be talking about something they don't understand, and I'll say "maybe it's because x, since y." And I DEFINITELY view my theories on explaining things as changeable/impermanent. If you can't tell.

creative Fi: I think I'm good at relating to people. This may be Fe, though. I am to a decent extent aware of who likes who (not in the gossip sense, just in the observation sense). And I actually do kind of crave relationships with others. However I would hardly call myself adept at it - in fact I seem to suck. I don't keep friendships well. I seem to be able to befriend people pretty easily, but then get bored, or the other person gets bored, or whenever I stop doing whatever day-to-day activity I was doing with that person, the friendship fades. At this point I still don't like it but I accept it.

And that's more than you wanted to hear.

Edit: see the bolded, I did it without even thinking about it. Anyway, that's what I was referring to, and what I interpret as .

[Logos]

I got those 2nd function descriptions from the Wikisocion, which means that they were probably written by Rick, Expat, or found and pasted from elsewhere. Both of which are in the Serious dichotomy, which may explain what you may perceive as a bias against .

[Elro]

I got those 2nd function descriptions from the Wikisocion, which means that they were probably written by Rick, Expat, or found and pasted from elsewhere. Both of which are in the Serious dichotomy, which may explain what you may perceive as a bias against .

I don't think so. That is not to say I have not detected a general bias against Ti around here, but it's a different kind of bias. More an emphasis on negative but nonessential forms of it (e.g., stubbornness).

Here is an example of Ti talk from another thread that makes me kind of glaze over. I can figure it out, but it takes a little more effort than I'd like (from the "On Ni" thread):

What's interesting here is...assuming that Minde is right that she's FiNe...might FiNe ever appear to use something like Ni that is really FiNe?
That is to say, might using acc-Fi in a way that focuses Ne a bit result in a sort of imagination activity that's different from Ni imagination? And if so, how would one tell the difference?

Similarly, suppose one dwells for awhile in an imagination of a very appealing sensory world....would that be some sort of mixture of Ni and Si? would imagining some sort of internal structures be combining Ni and Ti? I suppose considering Tcaud's ideas one might consider these cases of Si or Ti exertion (or maybe it's the other way around....Ni exertion)?

It's probably also unfamiliarity with some of the terms that throws me off. But I hated Kant for similar reasons.

My version of Kant's style (exaggerated, of course).

Let A be this piece of floss.
Let B be a finger's length.
Let C be the gap in between my front teeth.
Let D be the bacteria that are slowly assaulting the enamel on my front teeth.
Let E be my front teeth.
Therefore, C is the "gap" property of E, and D is the bacteria assaulting E.

If one were to take B of A and place it in C, E would be relieved of D for the foreseeable future.

Yes, I know, this argument is far from deductive - in fact, it depends on knowledge I didn't bother to notate. But now imagine you have extremely short-term memory (unless you try fairly hard). And then you are presented with:

If one were to take B of A and place it in C, E would be relieved of D for the foreseeable future.

after skimming through

Let A be this piece of floss.
Let B be a finger's length.
Let C be the gap in between my front teeth.
Let D be the bacteria that are slowly assaulting the enamel on my front teeth.
Let E be my front teeth.
Therefore, C is the "gap" property of E, and D is the bacteria assaulting E.

This means a lot of back and forth reading and reclarifying of terms and the like... I associate that with Ti too, and THAT aspect of it I hate. Is this a misclassification of terms? (And is misclassification a word?)

[Logos]

Part of that may simply be because since , much like in a way, is a personal subjective system. So sometimes, even if you are dominant it is a matter of adjusting yourself to understanding someone else's system of thinking. Then once you are able to grab at the essence of their system () and understand how they think, their reading their reasoning becomes much easier. Also, the A = 1, B = 2, etc. thing fairly standard type shorthand in all philosophy and not just dominant ones.

[Luke]

I'm probably about to stop posting as much, since it seems like I'm getting addicted to this place and that needs to stop. (Though I'll still be around, just less so.) In the meantime, since right now is probably the best time for something like this:

What type do you think I am and why?

Emphasis on the why - please justify your typings (at least somewhat) so I can get an idea of where you're coming from. Also, please don't let past typings (like the type I came in here with or the type that's probably most actively promoted by its wielders (neither will be mentioned in this post to help fight the inertia of typings)) influence your decision. I've noticed in the past this has seemed to impact consensus greatly, but that's not always helpful if those types are off.

I think I'm detecting strong Ne with slight Fi. The ENFp diagnosis seems reasonable to me.

In Augusta's theory on Information Aspects, Ne is "internal statics of bodies". Thus it is more concerned with concrete groupings of data (bodies), such as a physical object, or perhaps a diagram. Unlike Se it is capable of reading between the lines, i.e. internally. And it is static (unlike Fe, but like Se) as it is a means of percieving the external world without applying judgment to it.

That's the theoretical deconstruction as I interpret it. I'm LII so my auxiliary is Ne. For me, where concrete "for instance" information is presented, it's generally through an intuitive filter. The connections are seen, but not in a logical order the way Te would have it. I then associate things logically in very general terms, trying to test (in subtle ways that weaken or strengthen rather than fully proving or disproving) various complex and tenative hypotheses. That is basically what Ti does. It does not seem like what accompanies your Ne, as the way you word your requests is asking for more complete proofs along Te lines. But it is more of a vague request, not a demand, so Te is probably a super-id trait. I figure Te-HA (EXFp) is reasonable.

[Blaze]

Se is not felt from him so not ENTp and general lack of Se and Se provocations imply not valued Se. Logical type overall - just an overall impression. Ti over Te as logic seems more about explanations and state of things. Fi does not seem to be valued as no calls for establishing particular Fi bonds are made, feels like the person is more for strings-free objective discussions than forming bonds with anyone for any reason. Though Fi judgments made, could be Fi role or whatever. Fe is not scorned at and avoided, on opposite, shown interest in and seems to like it. Alpha so, INTj therefore most likely along this reasoning.

seems right. and elro's overall writing style in this thread is more Ti.

[Mea]

Naw, I personally think Elro has Te in his super id; Te hidden agenda.

[Elro]

So apparently the leading theories are ENFp and INTj. Oy.

I could kind of see myself in Alpha or Delta. My self-image is more Alpha, but I see similarities with Delta, and interestingly one of my RL friends was quite certain I was Delta when he saw the descriptions. He's probably Delta himself, though, so maybe he was projecting his own image of me out there. But I don't see it as impossible that I could be Delta, or even ENFp. It does seem a bit odd that one leading theory is Ti-dominant and the other Ti-PoLR though.

Maybe it would help if I knew a bit more about how INTjs supervise ENFps. I think at some point someone suggested that supervision is basically the supervisor thinking the supervisee is using the shared function incorrectly. So, Ti-Ne would think that Ne-Fi's usage of Ne was wrong, or inefficient or something. How would that work? Or would it be better to start a separate thread on that?

[FDG]

Definitely an extravert, Elro. Remember what you said about yourself in the job thread?

[Elro]

@ Elro: ESFj or ISTp?

The ESFjs I know irl are three, I think. My grandfather, a former Spanish teacher, and a former coworker. My grandfather I get along with great, but I don't think he really notices my presence or what I contribute. This could be the beginnings of duality (extravert overlooks the introvert), but it could be benefactor relationship too, I'm not sure. The Spanish teacher and I got along great once she identified my existence. My coworker... I'm not even sure he was ESFj, but he seemed like it. The EJ temperament was pretty clear though. Pretty much all we did was work, work, work when he was around, which got old. He also was a little over the top with guests. But, I guess that's just a host thing. (I resisted, but, I guess that's just an Elro thing.)

ISTps I know fewer of. I have a friend that MIGHT be ISTp. We've never argued (as in fought; we've "argued" many, many times), and those times that we did start to argue were resolved eerily easily. I'm not sure of his type though, or if we're actually duals. Or if he has an Fe PoLR, or etc. One of my bosses at work MIGHT have been ISTp. (He could also have been ISFp, but I lean towards ISTp.) He was the one that hired me, and was almost always incredibly calm, like he'd taken an anger management course or something. I appreciated that he stayed calm in urgent situations, which was reassuring when I was getting worked up. On the other hand, he did sometimes stay back deliberately WHILE we were beginning to panic so that we would learn how to handle it ourselves. I don't like panicking. But he was good at finding stuff you were weak at (but were improvable) and getting you to work on it, which at the time I would kind of resent but later appreciate.

So, in summary, I don't really know.

[Elro]

actually, you probably know which shows are what quadra, so which do you prefer? (from alpha or delta, or any other if you like)

Based on the movies in these threads:
http://the16types.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=11180
http://the16types.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=11182

In-depth analysis:
Alpha
"The Life Aquatic with Steve Zissou (most Alpha movie EVER EVER EVER)" - No, although I had trouble hearing about half the lines
"Office Space" - yes
"Monty Python and Holy Grail" - YES
"The Truman Show" - yes
"Wallace and Gromit" - yes
"Groundhog Day" - yes
"Groundhog Day" - yes
"Airplane!" - when I was younger, yes. After watching it again recently, I kind of wonder about my younger self.
"Amélie" - what I saw I liked
"I Heart Huckabees" - YES
"Napoleon Dynamite" - not so much, actually
"Rushmore" - yes
"The Royal Tanenbaums" - yes
"Back to the Future series" - from what I remember, somewhat. Mostly the earlier one(s?)
"Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" - yes, both versions
"The Demented Cartoon Movie" - obviously
"Finding Nemo" - sort of
"Toy Story" - yes
"Mary Poppins" - meh, although I haven't seen it in a long time.
"Dr. Strangelove" - yes

Delta
"Happy Gilmore" - yes
"Little Miss Sunshine" - yes
"Who Framed Roger Rabbit" - yes
"To Kill a Mockingbird" - yes
"Charlotte's Web" -mmmaybe, it's been a while since I've seen it.
"Lord of the Rings" -nonono. But I arbitrarily dislike Peter Jackson, and that plays a big part of it.
"The Incredibles" - YES
"The Brave Little Toaster" - yes
"The Muppets Take Manhattan" - From what I remember, yes
"March of the Penguins" - haha.. NO, I hated that one. It was about three times as long as it needed to be, and shamelessly manipulative of the audience.

"Hi, I'm Morgan Freeman. Here are a lot of penguins. They are happily marching. But not for long. Because watching over them are birds. These birds will wait for the penguins to lag behind, and then..." Dramatic, heart-wrenching footage. "It is done. The birds are fed, and the penguins must go on. Some will survive. Many..." Zoom in on dead baby penguin. "...will die. Such is the eternal cycle of life."

Yes, well, duh. Now stretch that into 90 minutes and you have a movie. A very seat-squirming movie.

Back to Delta:
"Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind" - YES

OK, that concludes the ones I've seen. See how utterly conclusive doing that is? But at least now you know how I spent much of my childhood.

[Elro]

Maybe try ...

Elro, say you just got fired from a job that you really like. What would you prefer to happen next:
a) A female friend (who you aren't really attracted to in a boyfriend-girlfriend way, because you think of her as more of a sister really) comes up to you and looks sorry for you, and pulls you along by the hand to a local cafe and sits you down and pats you on the shoulder and puts her arm around you and tells you how she felt when she got fired from her favourite job that time, 6 months ago. Then she encourages you to talk about your feelings and you do and it feels nice and warm and fuzzy. Later, you go home still pissed off at the employer, but a lot happier because you got a lot of things off of your chest and had a lovely talk with your friend which made you feel better.

b) A female friend comes up to you and says "Oh, bugger. Fuck that mate. Come with us. A group of us are going to the uni bar. There's a good band playing and they're having an outdoor BBQ and there'll be stacks of people there." You go with them and have a really good time, just hanging around and soaking in the atmosphere, and you forget about that bitch employer except for a few nice explicatives that you throw occasionally around about him throughout the night. You go home still pissed off at the employer, but a lot happier because you've got lots a friends around who stuck up for you and took you out to have a good night.

I'd prefer that I not get fired in the first place. But if I had to choose, A. B seems more like escapism - it might be fun while I was out there, but once I came back I'd still have stuff to stew about. A at least addresses it, and maybe I'd come to some sort of better way to look at it. Although I'm not so sure about the draping all over me and "tell me your deepest feelings" - that reminds me of a girl I know that really managed to get on my nerves with stuff like that, very intrusive and wouldn't stop asking me about stuff even when there was nothing wrong. And seemed really fake. Definitely seemed to think she was closer to me than I actually wanted. But yes, I'd definitely want to rant to someone about it for a while if possible. Preferably not cornily, just to burn off some steam.

[Mea]

Personally, I don't like both the choices.

I would've preferred just meeting ONE friend, and just go out and chill, chat. I'd likely rant about that mean boss or whatever for a short while, and not wanna talk much about him/her after that.

O.. I hate it when people prob. And ask me to talk about my feelings. Makes me very uncomfortable.

I don't think the choices were very good. But that's just me.

[implied]

"March of the Penguins" - haha.. NO, I hated that one. It was about three times as long as it needed to be, and shamelessly manipulative of the audience.

"Hi, I'm Morgan Freeman. Here are a lot of penguins. They are happily marching. But not for long. Because watching over them are birds. These birds will wait for the penguins to lag behind, and then..." Dramatic, heart-wrenching footage. "It is done. The birds are fed, and the penguins must go on. Some will survive. Many..." Zoom in on dead baby penguin. "...will die. Such is the eternal cycle of life."

Yes, well, duh. Now stretch that into 90 minutes and you have a movie. A very seat-squirming movie.

best thing i've read all week. i loved the movie, btw. didn't find it shamelessly emotionally manipulative, though.


i don't know your type. based on what you've said, i suppose INTj or ENTp could be a possibility. i feel like i have some slightish similarities to you, though, based on what we've talked about in PMs.

[Exodus]

Naw, I personally think Elro has Te in his super id; Te hidden agenda.

Why do you say that exactly?

[Mea]

I don't think the choices were very good. But that's just me.

Bugger.

Anyway, I would have picked B. I hate it when people probe and want to talk about feelings too. Putting their arm around me while I cry and say "Why?" and swear and stuff is fine though (that's really good actually).

Really? My ESFj mom does that all the time. Probe and bugs me to talk about what I'm feeling. Bla bla.

[Elro]

3.) There are people who would prefer to keep their types ambigious, such as Elro and implied who don't seem to want to be typed, or myself who just prefers not to discuss my type.

Bzzt. Wrong.

In the spirit of this message, (and in the spirit of my not feeling like walking back to the dorm yet, and I'm not going to get much sleep anyway), and because I have been typed everywhere from INFj-Ne to ENTp to INTj-Ne to ENFp, I now present a self-description. It may be flawed. It may be more of a description of how I see myself than how I actually am. It definitely will be long. But at least then you all will have something to go by, especially those of you who don't associate posts with names, or avatars, or what have you.

If it gets exorbitantly long, I will split it up into multiple posts to make it easier on the eyes. I will also periodically throw in words like "exorbitantly."

So... I'm not sure where to start, so I'll just ramble incoherently and hope you get an overall picture. In real life I am goofy like I am here, but I am also serious like I am here at other times. It's sort of like I switch between them freely, like I'm schizophrenic. This bothers me, actually, as it's not very useful, but I'm trying to work on blending the two styles so that I'm being both entertaining and serious at the same time... I've always liked humor - it is a great feeling to get someone to laugh. And I enjoy good humor myself. Especially absurd humor - Looney Tunes, Marx Brothers, Woody Allen (standup/written), Monty Python... others: Calvin & Hobbes, The Daily Show, some LucasArts games (Monkey Island, Sam and Max)... Probably not type-related, but if you enjoy humorous stuff, those are excellent sources. Excellent, excellent.

Overall, I am not usually a very moody person emotionally, but in terms of productivity I am very much so. That is to say - if I don't feel like working on something I am very bad at forcing myself to do so. For instance, my Mechanisms homework. The textbook sits to my right at the moment... I've done 1/4 of the assignment, which took a ridiculous amount of time, and there's no way I'm going to do any more of it before I go to sleep. Usually I actually get most if not all of my homework done (at the last minute), but I have a test tomorrow, and [insert lame excuse for an excuse here]. I don't have great self-control. If I decide I'm not going to do something (e.g., speak during Lent), I can easily avoid doing it. But if I don't really care, I have trouble regulating myself. I don't like procrastinating but I do. All the time. I'm actually pretty hard on myself overall (although I try not to show it except through humor sometimes), but I'm not hard enough on myself. (I am hard on myself for not being hard enough on myself, though, although only sort of, because I continue not being hard on myself, so I guess I'm not being hard enough on myself.)

I hide behind humor. I'm doing it again.

Um... I don't have many friends, and the ones I have have an annoying habit of not sticking around (they are good friends, but they tend to drift away every couple of years, and new friends show up, only to drift away, etc). I used to have really close friends, but when I hit teenage years I got slightly annoyed at them and shut everyone out of my life for a while... I think that was when my troubles keeping friends began... I think we just run out of things to say, or something, and unless we're in an environment where we run into each other often, and have constantly emerging things to discuss, things kind of drift. Comma splice! Maybe things will be different after school, I'm not sure.

I'm not really that interesting a person, I think. I like to learn about all kinds of things, though, so I'm up to interesting THINGS. It's just that, on my own, I'm not sure there's much to say. Speaking of learning, that is my hidden obsession. I have a tendency to get really interested in a subject, find as much as I can on that subject, bookmark/download it, plan to start studying it, and then get distracted by another interesting subject and never get around to learning about cryptography, or world history, or watch those excellent Physics lectures, or teach myself jujitsu, or learn to program in Assembly, or start an internet forum, or read all of those Calvin & Hobbes strips, or invent my own soup, or read that obscenely long list of philosophy books. Mom would probably point out that I'm never bored, but I would point out that I'm never really doing what I want to do. I'm always planning, never really doing. Again, that ties back to my moodiness thing. Maybe it's more of an interest thing than a moodiness thing. Something has to hold my interest for me to go through with it.

Hmm, what else. I am at least good at figuring things out and explaining them to others... if we're both learning it at the same time, especially, because I kind of have to translate things into my own language to understand it. I read some quote somewhere that attributed that trait to fools, so I guess I'm a fool - but I'm a useful fool, because when I explain it to others they seem to get it a bit better. I hope eventually to become a writer, and to learn all I can about science and philosophy so I can write books explaining it to people who are less inclined to devote their lives to understanding that kind of thing. I haven't really figured out much about the meaning of life (if that phrase even means anything), but maybe if I can do that for future generations they'll be able to get further in the same amount of time, since it's already pre-digested for them.

End Part I

[Elro]

Part Deux

I'm somewhat of a picky eater, though trying to improve in that area. I think pickiness just comes from lack of being exposed to something, at least for me. If I listen to a new song enough, I'm likely to find something in it that appeals to me, and then eventually the whole thing is enjoyable. (And then, it gets old, and time to find a new song.) I love music, too. My roommate seems to listen to music more often than I do, but about half the time I'm on the computer there's something blaring. (Not really loudly, though.) Classical rock, classical, jazz, video game music, jam bands, oldies, marching songs, ragtime, pop, a little bluegrass... I listen to a little of everything.

In real life on first appearance I look like someone that's really shy, and I don't open up to many people. If someone talks to me I will talk back, but won't say much unless there's something I like about the person - I think they're funny or a really swell person or whatnot. I tend to keep people at a distance at first but gradually start to open up more around them, at rates variable to the person (one guy irl, who reminds me of Bionicgoat, I was joking around with almost immediately ). When I don't know you, I come across as quiet and fairly serious but a little unusual. When I do, I become more like I generally am around here - alternately silly and serious. I try not to ask much of others (I probably ask a little too little, actually, but better that than the other). I try to be reasonable - I am perpetually on the lookout for my own biases or mistakes and try to correct them so as to get a clearer picture as to what is actually going on. If I see that I'm mistaken I will drop my old position very quickly.

When I am your friend, I am a damn good one I'd say. Generally at first there is an avalanche of communication when I've first found someone knew to talk with that I like, and then it settles down to a low but more or less steady traffic (assuming there's actually a friendship there). Like, my best friend right now and I first met freshman year and exchanged an obscene amount of e-mail on all kinds of different topics, but now I haven't e-mailed him in a few days, though we did just eat lunch earlier today. That avalanche at the beginning can probably be overwhelming to many though. As a friend I will help out with favors and stuff on very short notice unless I'm morbidly slammed. And will talk about just about anything. If they've got problems, I've got potential answers. Not always great answers, but answers. Unfortunately though, none of this really matters if people start to drift... I'm not really good at maintaining a friendship after a certain point. I was very close to one of my friends a couple years ago but haven't heard from him in three months and hadn't heard from him in six months before that. Not really much of a friend any more. I have older friends on Facebook, too, but never really am able to restart anything unfortunately. I guess it's just the way it goes.

I run my own club, too. (I was talking to someone about this earlier in a type-related context, so it might be worth mentioning.) I formed it so that people could learn the stuff I learned in this subject much more quickly than it took me to learn it. In high school I did this too, and really enjoyed the group, but once in college I got tired of standing up in front of people and handed it over to someone much more charismatic and enthusiastic about stuff than me. I'm still vice-president, and perform the vital role of poking the president strategically to get him to get stuff done, because otherwise he doesn't do it in time.

Oh yes, and I know I'm self-centered. I'm an only child, and mostly keep to myself. I care about other people, but I can only speak from my own perspective most of the time.

That's all I can think of. It's probably plenty.

So, what do you think?

[Elro]

Elro - ILE

If your self-description is accurate.

Yeah, I was thinking about what I said, and was leaning towards typing myself as ILE based on that. Also, I checked the Wikisocion on Fi PoLR, and it has been changed recently I think. While I can't say it screams, "Elro, this is you!" I CAN say that it seems more plausible now than it did when I first saw it. Especially: "The individual has difficulty evaluating interpersonal relationships between himself and others, and between other individuals, beyond those based on achieving mutual goals, including mutual amusement." (I think this might relate to what I described with friends drifting if we're not doing stuff together.)