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Thread: Enneagram transitions: integration and disintegration

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    Default Enneagram transitions: integration and disintegration

    Where can I learn more about them?

    Particularly, 5 to 8 and 1 to 7?
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    So, you believe you're a 5 or 1? Sounds like my best friend - he considered 1 for a while. He's a 5w6.

    A good place to look in would be Riso & Hudson's The Wisdom of the Enneagram, which talks about how one can climb the levels of health to reach their potential as human beings. Helen Palmer's The Enneagram is also quite a good source for integrating into your security type. (For me, it's going from 8 to 2, which I've briefly talked about in my long thread.) There's also a very short introduction to each of the types and a "Paths of Development" for tips about integration you can find here:

    http://www.enneagramworldwide.com/ex...ram-type-5.php

    For 5 and here:

    http://www.enneagramworldwide.com/ex...ram-type-1.php

    For 1.
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    Not enough specific information on transitions. They are not explained much anywhere I look, always vague.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    What I want to know is how one would be able to tell if they're trying to head from their stress to their true type, or their true type to their growth.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    I'm on the list as well.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    ...been here longer than the fucking monarchy Ezra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP
    Not enough specific information on transitions. They are not explained much anywhere I look, always vague.
    They're explained in places where money is necessary.
    Ideas don't determine who's right. Power determines who's right. And I have the power. So I'm right.

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    not worth it
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

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    I've got the books, I'll type that shit up when I get home.
    "To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"

    "Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."

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    Quote Originally Posted by MysticSonic
    I've got the books, I'll type that shit up when I get home.
    *waits patiently*
    INTp
    sx/sp

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    Default Re: Enneagra Transitions

    Quote Originally Posted by UDP
    Where can I learn more about them?

    Particularly, 5 to 8 and 1 to 7?
    There's some info about these lines of integration in Wisdom of the Enneagram by Riso & Hudson. I'd also recommend Naranjo's Character and Neurosis.
    socio: INFp - IEI
    ennea: 4w5 sp/sx

    **********

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Twain
    Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we'.

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    A few questions, if you don't mind...

    Someone once told me that the transitions are sort of... irreversible? Like, if someone starts heading towards their growth, they won't end up heading back towards their stress, and vice versa. It sounded like he was saying that these things aren't related to ones level of health as it changes with their situation back and forth over the years. I have a really hard time accepting that if someone is healthy and becoming more well, they can never become unhealthy, and vice versa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    A few questions, if you don't mind...

    Someone once told me that the transitions are sort of... irreversible? Like, if someone starts heading towards their growth, they won't end up heading back towards their stress, and vice versa. It sounded like he was saying that these things aren't related to ones level of health as it changes with their situation back and forth over the years. I have a really hard time accepting that if someone is healthy and becoming more well, they can never become unhealthy, and vice versa.
    In all my years of enneagram pondering, I've never heard that the lines are irreversible. But then, I've never heard them called "transitions" either. I also think the idea that you can "change" type this way is rather a fringe concept.

    Basically, every person has a "range" within the 3 bands of health (high-functioning, average, unhealthy) which can be shorter or longer -- you can habitually operate between say, Level 2 and Level 7 of your type. Others can be just able to access Level 4 to Level 9. That range may change with growth, so that you don't dip down into the unhealthy levels as often and/or that you begin to access the higher ones.

    As far as levels of health and the lines of integration/disintegration, it's possible to be a 5w4 at 6th level of health, distintegrating to 7. By that, I understand, would mean the 5 would pick up common traits of type 7 at that level. Personally, I'm not really clear on exactly how that works myself. Been able to recognize elements in myself and others, but the one thing that is stressed is that a 5 NEVER becomes a 7. They're still a 5 picking up aspects of type 7 behavior, and expressing it through the 5 fixation.
    socio: INFp - IEI
    ennea: 4w5 sp/sx

    **********

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Twain
    Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we'.

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    Thank you, that makes a lot of sense.

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    Doing you think a person could test as their "stress" type when they're really stressed out or particularly unwell?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Doing you think a person could test as their "stress" type when they're really stressed out or particularly unwell?
    It's possible.

    The test is meant to be indicative of life patterns/strategies as a whole, not one particular period. Each type has associated key motivations and "superego messages" that function as the core of the fixation. While two types may look alike on the surface, their motivations always support the basic fixation/passion ("superego message") underneath.

    Most of the books touch on combos of "mistyping" between two potential types.
    socio: INFp - IEI
    ennea: 4w5 sp/sx

    **********

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Twain
    Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we'.

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    Well, I think I tested as a 5 because I hide/avoid emotions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    Well, I think I tested as a 5 because I hide/avoid emotions.
    So do 8s though -- as well as 1s, 3s, 7s (negative ones, that is). Lots of types have difficulty with emotional expression. Except Fours of course, (who revel in all of their emotions, both negative and positive). Twos can express genuine warm emotions, but have difficulty with negative ones (like 7s). And so on...

    But WHY do Fives hide emotions...? A: Fives don't want to be controlled by their emotions and they don't want to need anyone too much. The 5 "passion" is avarice. They hoard their feelings, as well as their time, attention and energy, often believing they don't have enough to share. And not wanting to get entangled in others' expectations.
    socio: INFp - IEI
    ennea: 4w5 sp/sx

    **********

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Twain
    Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we'.

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    that sounds like me at my worst (read: the last couple of years)

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