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Thread: Examples of INTp Fe PoLR remarks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    I just don't put it as main priority in my decision making process there needs to be balance between ethos and logos. If someone were to ask why I do not donate money to starving kids in Africa?
    Say would you give birth to 10 or more kids if know you couldn´t feed them? Of course not!

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    I also get very frustrated and irritated when someone presumes to tell me what feelings or facial expressions I should be expressing. (Usually an Fe ego type) If someone exerts to much emotional pressure I slip away when no one's looking, or death stare them down then storm off, or explode into a hyper-rational condescending analysis of their views and character until decimated every shred of dignity, pride and self worth depending on who I'm talking to and the circumstances. Hopefully this give everyone an idea what it like having Fe PoLR at least from an ILI's perspective.
    MBTI: INTJ
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    @Phantom Shadow

    I don´t get what you are saying. Emotional pressure? What do you mean with emotional pressure? And do you seriously believe you could conquer an ethical type with logic?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    @Phantom Shadow

    I don´t get what you are saying. Emotional pressure? What do you mean with emotional pressure? And do you seriously believe you could conquer an ethical type with logic?
    My Definition:
    Emotional Pressure is when someone expects or wants you to feel or express an emotion(s) your not feeling. They use guilt, shame, and self righteous rage to try change your ethical position; emotional and/or ethical intimidation to convert you to the ""Greater Good""
    Essentially Fi versus Fe
    MBTI: INTJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    My Definition:
    Emotional Pressure is when someone expects or wants you to feel or express an emotion(s) your not feeling. They use guilt, shame, and self righteous rage to try change your ethical position; emotional and/or ethical intimidation to convert you to the ""Greater Good""
    Essentially Fi versus Fe
    You believe that cannot attempt to shame or guilt someone into changing, nor use emotional or ethical intimidation to achieve a certain result? Or did I misread what you are trying to say here?
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    I KNOW that any and all conclusions adopted by someone out of necessity or convenience will ring hollow in meaning and value if they lack the knowledge, wisdom, and experience to comprehend the answer. The solution is meaningless if you do not understand the process in which it was derived from and how it connects to the bigger picture.
    MBTI: INTJ
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    Political Position: Independent
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    @Phantom Shadow Do you plan to address my question?
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    Phantom Shadow Do you plan to address my question?
    I did

    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    I KNOW that any and all conclusions adopted by someone out of necessity or convenience will ring hollow in meaning and value if they lack the knowledge, wisdom, and experience to comprehend the answer. The solution is meaningless if you do not understand the process in which it was derived from and how it connects to the bigger picture.
    Its not a question of can you do it, its a question of should you do it. And what are the consequences and repercussions of those choices? Is it best way to resolve the situation?
    MBTI: INTJ
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    Political Position: Independent
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    I did
    It did not appear to actually address my question in any way (and still does not), so I assumed you meant it for someone else.

    Its not a question of can you do it, its a question of should you do it. And what are the consequences and repercussions of those choices? Is it best way to resolve the situation?
    Nor does this.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johannes Bloem View Post
    You didn't answer my question.
    he will just pray 2 his father 2 4give u
    unholy water sanguine addiction

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    I also get very frustrated and irritated when someone presumes to tell me what feelings or facial expressions I should be expressing. (Usually an Fe ego type) If someone exerts to much emotional pressure I slip away when no one's looking, or death stare them down then storm off, or explode into a hyper-rational condescending analysis of their views and character until decimated every shred of dignity, pride and self worth depending on who I'm talking to and the circumstances. Hopefully this give everyone an idea what it like having Fe PoLR at least from an ILI's perspective.
    I'd say this ILI response has a decidedly Sp-Sx flavoring to it, since I see this in my ILI sp-sx friend but not in my own behavior.
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    I'd say this ILI response has a decidedly Sp-Sx flavoring to it, since I see this in my ILI sp-sx friend but not in my own behavior.
    Why Sp-Sx? Is there a reason beside what you stated above?
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    Why Sp-Sx? Is there a reason beside what you stated above?
    Phantom Shadow's sp-sx under his avatar, my understanding of the differences between sp-sx and other types reacting socially, and my sp-sx irl ILI friend.
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Yes, I agree. All things being equal, Gamma is "meaner" than Delta - although I wouldn't see Philip's remarks as "mean".
    I disagree. Each quadra, rather, has a specialized ability to be mean.
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    My Fe PoLR manifest itself when people say, or imply that I'm not compassionate, empathic, and/or sympathetic to other when in fact I am. I just don't put it as main priority in my decision making process there needs to be balance between ethos and logos. If someone were to ask why I do not donate money to starving kids in Africa? I would say, "Millions of dollars are donated to starving Africans a year in spite of this there has been no significant changes. If people there are so desperate for their survival why don't they move somewhere else, or band together fix the cause of the problem, or take the resources they need. By giving them what they've not earned all have taught them is dependency on others kindness. Not mention that their starvation is merely a symptom of a greater affliction that has yet to be addressed."

    "If you seek to aid everyone that suffers in the galaxy, you will only weaken yourself… and weaken them. It is the internal struggles, when fought and won on their own, that yield the strongest rewards. You stole that struggle from them, cheapened it. If you care for others, then dispense with pity and sacrifice and recognize the value in letting them fight their own battles. And when they triumph, they will be even stronger for the victory."
    ―Kreia
    It is patently true that aid isn't useless. Actually, there are quite a lot of examples of people being so impoverished and near death that humanitarian aid, versus developmental aid WAS crucial for them. While I, too, champion independence and respect for individuals, that doesn't change the fact that some humans are currently on death's door and that WE are their resources in what are to us small ways but mean their continued existence to them.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_aid versus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_aid
    http://us.macmillan.com/thehistoryan...BronwenEverill


    if they are correct about corruption in leaders, I'd like to stress that this is not due to something inherent about Africans but perhaps IS influenced by social dynamics in place: http://www.how-matters.org/2011/04/2...n-colonialism/
    ENTj-Ni sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    It is patently true that aid isn't useless. Actually, there are quite a lot of examples of people being so impoverished and near death that humanitarian aid, versus developmental aid WAS crucial for them. While I, too, champion independence and respect for individuals, that doesn't change the fact that some humans are currently on death's door and that WE are their resources in what are to us small ways but mean their continued existence to them.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_aid versus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_aid
    http://us.macmillan.com/thehistoryan...BronwenEverill


    if they are correct about corruption in leaders, I'd like to stress that this is not due to something inherent about Africans but perhaps IS influenced by social dynamics in place: http://www.how-matters.org/2011/04/2...n-colonialism/
    Why did you do such a thing? Such kindnesses will mean nothing, his path is set. Giving him what he has not earned is like pouring sand into his hands. :::: And would that be a kindness? What if by surviving another day, he brings a greater darkness upon another? :::: The Force binds all things. The slightest push, the smallest touch, sends echoes throughout life. :::: Even an act of kindness may have more severe repercussions than you know or can see. :::: By giving him something he has not earned, perhaps all you have helped him become is a target. Seeing another elevated often brings the eyes of others who suffer. And perhaps in the end, all you have wrought is more pain. :::: And that is my lesson to you. Be careful of charity and kindness, lest you do more harm with open hands than with a clenched fist.
    -Kotor 2 Kreia

    "The pathway to hell is paved with good intentions."

    "No good deed goes unpunished; No evil deed goes unrewarded."
    MBTI: INTJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    It is patently true that aid isn't useless. Actually, there are quite a lot of examples of people being so impoverished and near death that humanitarian aid, versus developmental aid WAS crucial for them. While I, too, champion independence and respect for individuals, that doesn't change the fact that some humans are currently on death's door and that WE are their resources in what are to us small ways but mean their continued existence to them.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_aid versus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_aid
    http://us.macmillan.com/thehistoryan...BronwenEverill


    if they are correct about corruption in leaders, I'd like to stress that this is not due to something inherent about Africans but perhaps IS influenced by social dynamics in place: http://www.how-matters.org/2011/04/2...n-colonialism/
    How would you answer the claim that by aiding the survival of people in a starvation situation due to environmental locale by feeding them actually makes the problem worse unless you can implement a way for them to feed themselves? Because those people, should they survive, are going to have kids. And then we have to feed them too. And their kids. And so on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    Why did you do such a thing? Such kindnesses will mean nothing, his path is set. Giving him what he has not earned is like pouring sand into his hands. :::: And would that be a kindness? What if by surviving another day, he brings a greater darkness upon another? :::: The Force binds all things. The slightest push, the smallest touch, sends echoes throughout life. :::: Even an act of kindness may have more severe repercussions than you know or can see. :::: By giving him something he has not earned, perhaps all you have helped him become is a target. Seeing another elevated often brings the eyes of others who suffer. And perhaps in the end, all you have wrought is more pain. :::: And that is my lesson to you. Be careful of charity and kindness, lest you do more harm with open hands than with a clenched fist.
    -Kotor 2 Kreia


    "The pathway to hell is paved with good intentions."

    "No good deed goes unpunished; No evil deed goes unrewarded."
    It must be easy of you to have such an opinion, especially since you most likely grew up and now live in an affluent first world country with basic human rights, shelter, food, safety. I would love for you to reread your post when your own life suddenly takes a turn for the worst

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wacey View Post
    It must be easy of you to have such an opinion, especially since you most likely grew up and now live in an affluent first world country with basic human rights, shelter, food, safety. I would love for you to reread your post when your own life suddenly takes a turn for the worst
    That's a rather ironic, hypocritical, and paradoxical thing of you to say. Your implying that I would not be able to hold such beliefs if I were in a similar situation, due to the fact that I may have been spoiled by the luxuries, and the kindnesses of modern society. Yet here you are offering that very same thing to them. It is only through the contrast of experiencing conflicts, pain, suffering, and strife that one learns to appreciate the gifts of life. Why do wish to rob them of this?
    Last edited by Phantom Shadow; 01-03-2014 at 07:00 AM.
    MBTI: INTJ
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    Political Position: Independent
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    That's a rather ironic, hypocritical, and paradoxical thing of you say. Your implying that I would not be able to hold such beliefs if were in a similar situation, due to the fact that I may have been spoiled by the luxuries, and the kindnesses of modern society. Yet here you are offering that very same thing to them. It is only through the contrast of experiencing conflicts, pain, suffering, and strife that one learns to appreciate the gifts of life. Why do wish to rob them of this?
    "Spare the rod and spoil the child"

    The rod; war, famine, pestilence and death

    The child; humanity
    MBTI: INTJ
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    Political Position: Independent
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    Government Structural Preference: Meritocratic Republic

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    I was just winding you up bud.

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    If I lack something.... Why would I put myself in a position where I would need it?
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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    he died with a felafel
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    try something like murder, but without even being aware of it happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by felafel View Post
    try something like murder, but without even being aware of it happening.
    Got it. A psychopath or a narcissist trait, if it's basically said without knowing what will happen next.
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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    I'm not trying to be rude. I'm saying that it suggests that you may have brain damage and are incapable of learning ...
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenneth Chesney View Post
    And you're kind of like the love child of Satan and Sauron.
    Attachment 3200

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    Quote Originally Posted by Whoobie77 View Post
    LOL, well done sir

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    WHY DID YOU MAKE OPRAH MY MIRROR.
    Becky Rosen: Honestly... the only place people understood me was the message boards. They were grumpy and overly literal, but at least we shared a common passion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by truck View Post
    WHY DID YOU MAKE OPRAH MY MIRROR.
    I'm sorry truck. Noone made Oprah your mirror. She was born that way.

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    Wow, I didn't know hugh grant was an ILI. That seems like a pretty spot on typing for him and a good find.

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    I offended my wife today with a sarcastic remark that was meant to be funny and instructive. I cannot seem to help it. We were coming up with ideas for remodeling the house and once I have an idea that fits it seems to be the only idea I want to pursue. I'm unfortunately too dismissive of other people's ideas once I form my own. It is best to separate my analytical abilities from my personal life.
    It takes faith to believe, and it takes courage not to, and who is to say which is the deeper and more truthful.
    It takes faith to believe, and it takes courage not to, and who is to say which is the deeper and more truthful.
    --Herbert Weisinger

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmers View Post
    I offended my wife today with a sarcastic remark that was meant to be funny and instructive. I cannot seem to help it. We were coming up with ideas for remodeling the house and once I have an idea that fits it seems to be the only idea I want to pursue. I'm unfortunately too dismissive of other people's ideas once I form my own. It is best to separate my analytical abilities from my personal life.
    Come now. What was the remark?

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    Well, I suggested that we remove a bad section of the house and she later stood in the room that I suggested tearing down and she said after we tore it down that we should build a mud room with a door and a stairwell, and I said, "You mean we should just leave it the way it is."

    It was suppose to be funny dammit! hehe.....oh well, you win some, you lose some.
    It takes faith to believe, and it takes courage not to, and who is to say which is the deeper and more truthful.
    It takes faith to believe, and it takes courage not to, and who is to say which is the deeper and more truthful.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmers View Post
    Well, I suggested that we remove a bad section of the house and she later stood in the room that I suggested tearing down and she said after we tore it down that we should build a mud room with a door and a stairwell, and I said, "You mean we should just leave it the way it is."

    It was suppose to be funny dammit! hehe.....oh well, you win some, you lose some.
    WTF is a mud room? Lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    WTF is a mud room? Lol
    A room, usually small, which is common in rural homes; a place to remove your wet or muddy clothes/shoes as you enter the home.
    It takes faith to believe, and it takes courage not to, and who is to say which is the deeper and more truthful.
    It takes faith to believe, and it takes courage not to, and who is to say which is the deeper and more truthful.
    --Herbert Weisinger

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmers View Post
    A room, usually small, which is common in rural homes; a place to remove your wet or muddy clothes/shoes as you enter the home.
    So an anteroom.

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    I think this is an example of fe Polr.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    That was extremely awkward. Could be a legit example.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Shadow View Post
    My Definition:
    Emotional Pressure is when someone expects or wants you to feel or express an emotion(s) your not feeling. They use guilt, shame, and self righteous rage to try change your ethical position; emotional and/or ethical intimidation to convert you to the ""Greater Good""
    Essentially Fi versus Fe
    This isn't how I see Fe types try to enforce Fe most often. In the vast majority of cases, they try to somehow infect you with their emotions through their own emotional expressiveness. In a way, it's something that overrides a person's internal feelings, especially if they are Fe PoLR types. They often try to act in a simpering sort of way to get you to feel what they feel. The best way to describe Fe from my perspective is "emotional contagion." ILIs and their lookalikes don't deal well with situations in which someone tries to get them to feel a certain emotion. Usually it's not by someone saying directly, "You should feel such and such a way," but by acting out their own emotions in a way that directly affects the feelings of others around them. This is how demonstrative Fi works. They demonstrate their own feelings in order to get others to feel them. Fi demonstrative working in support of Fe lead. It makes so much simple sense that it's hard to see how people miss it.

    Another term I'd use for it is "invasive feeling."

    There are going to be moralizers of every type. Moralizing has absolutely nothing to do with Socionics.

    In a way, this is also why people can't tell what's going on with Fi types and their feelings. They don't really try to affect someone else's emotional experience, so it's impossible for Fe types to know what they are feeling. In a sense, the only way to know how someone is feeling is for that person to affect your emotional experience. Fi types don't really do that so much, so you aren't going to sense anything coming from them. What you do in this case is to watch their behavior and then gauge their emotions indirectly through those unrelated expressions.

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