Type Reconsideration (And For Good Reason)

[Expat]

- I annoy people to no end, for my own pleasure
- I am distastefully arrogant, and deliberately so, to annoy people

Why exactly? Can you elaborate on that?

Also, briefly, why not Enneatype 7?

[discojoe]

http://the16types.no-ip.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3763&highlight=stratiyevskaya+enfj

No, I am not like Hamlet. I studied this play in depth for A Level English Literature. The typical phobic 6w5 who swings to counterphobic just before his death.

Did you read it, or did see "Hamlet" and jump to a conclusion? That's a Russian description; they use nicknames to refer to the types.

Hahaha. I read a few paragraphs and got bored. But the jist of what the article was about was about a character like Hamlet.

It's this tragic bullshit element you see in the ENFj. Ain't me.

So, you know next to nothing about ENFjs but are sure you're not one? You really, seriously need to learn more about the functions before saying anything else like "I'm really aggressive and walk like a car salesman, therefore I am and S type!" I think you're still using MBTI criteria.

As far as projecting an image goes, your natural state may be to due so, making you essentially unaware that you do it and therefore in difficulty trying to picture someone like this. This also does not imply insincerity.

[XoX]

Based on VI Ezra reminds me a bit of Matt Damon who is apparently ESTj. However the values he is projecting (or whatever word you want to use) doesn't seem ESTj values at first glance.

So as said before ESTp, ENFj or perhaps ESTj with somewhat twisted values.

Ezra here is a couple more questions (a bit humorous but )

Which would be more natural position to you:
a) A dictator of a country
b) An airline pilot

a) would point to ENFj and b) would point to ESTp

Then do you see yourself more as
a) manager
b) leader

a) would point to ESTj, b) would point to ENFj (I'm not sure how ESTp fits in this).

I think one of the ways for you to proceed is to learn more about the functions and see which Quadra values you really hold.

Alpha Quadra Values: Fe, Si, Ne, Ti
Beta Quadra Values: Fe, Ni, Se, Ti
Gamma Quadra Values: Te, Ni, Se, Fi
Delta Quadra Values: Te, Si, Ne, Fi

Also you could describe what would your perfect partner (=dual) be like? ENFj, ESTp and ESTj have quite different natural requirements.

[Ezra]

I identified with Gamma Quadra for this reason:

"Types from the Gamma Quadra have a realistic, materialistic outlook on life, relationships, and society"

Besides, I didn't say I identified with that massively, I said it was Delta Quadra I identified most with.

I did a bit of research into the types on http://www.socionics.com/, and I identify most strongly with ENTp. Pretty much the whole description I felt was me. ENTj didn't really resonate with me. ESTp began too, but then it said they have "self-restraint and tact" which I do NOT have. The first bit of ESTj made me laugh, because it's precisely how I've been described many times before:

"ESTjs have a characteristic upright posture often appearing as if their backs are inflexible giving the impression that they are executing a military drill. In many cases ESTjs are slim."

But the conservative attitude is too unlike me for me to an ESTj.

[Khamelion]

I identified with Gamma Quadra for this reason:

"Types from the Gamma Quadra have a realistic, materialistic outlook on life, relationships, and society"

Besides, I didn't say I identified with that massively, I said it was Delta Quadra I identified most with.

I did a bit of research into the types on http://www.socionics.com/, and I identify most strongly with ENTp. Pretty much the whole description I felt was me. ENTj didn't really resonate with me. ESTp began too, but then it said they have "self-restraint and tact" which I do NOT have. The first bit of ESTj made me laugh, because it's precisely how I've been described many times before:

"ESTjs have a characteristic upright posture often appearing as if their backs are inflexible giving the impression that they are executing a military drill. In many cases ESTjs are slim."

But the conservative attitude is too unlike me for me to an ESTj.

ENTp was my second idea, I just wasn't going to put it out there, but since you did first...

[Ezra]

- I annoy people to no end, for my own pleasure
- I am distastefully arrogant, and deliberately so, to annoy people

Why exactly? Can you elaborate on that?

Because when I'm bored, I've got extra energy to spare, so I will often annoy my feet-hating friend by sticking my foot in her face. It makes me laugh every time. It's a simple pleasure. Understand, or would like me to elaborate some more?

Also, briefly, why not Enneatype 7?

Because I like to be in control. I also hate KC And The Sunshine Band.

[Ezra]

So, you know next to nothing about ENFjs but are sure you're not one? You really, seriously need to learn more about the functions before saying anything else like "I'm really aggressive and walk like a car salesman, therefore I am and S type!" I think you're still using MBTI criteria.

No no no. I didn't read that, but I read a few profiles of the ENFj. One on socionics.com, and another on http://www.the16types.info.

[Expat]

ESTp began too, but then it said they have "self-restraint and tact" which I do NOT have.

Neither do ESTps, typically, so if that description said that, it's a crappy description.

[Khamelion]

ESTp began too, but then it said they have "self-restraint and tact" which I do NOT have.

Neither do ESTps, typically, so if that description said that, it's a crappy description.

I think self-restraint and tact come with ESTp maturity...like my dad.

As far as projecting an image goes, your natural state may be to due so, making you essentially unaware that you do it and therefore in difficulty trying to picture someone like this. This also does not imply insincerity.

...and I second this.

[discojoe]

- I annoy people to no end, for my own pleasure
- I am distastefully arrogant, and deliberately so, to annoy people

Why exactly? Can you elaborate on that?

Because when I'm bored, I've got extra energy to spare, so I will often annoy my feet-hating friend by sticking my foot in her face. It makes me laugh every time. It's a simple pleasure. Understand, or would like me to elaborate some more?

Humorously, my ENFj ex did the exact same thing. I don't hate feet though, so I don't know why she kept doing it. She thought it was funny.

You seem uber beta. Just admit it. I think your general attitude would tend to piss off gammas.

You =

[Expat]

Because when I'm bored, I've got extra energy to spare, so I will often annoy my feet-hating friend by sticking my foot in her face. It makes me laugh every time. It's a simple pleasure. Understand, or would like me to elaborate some more?

Yes -- what is the reaction that pleases you the most, when doing that, and which reaction frustrates you/annoys you the most? It's a serious question.

Also, briefly, why not Enneatype 7?

Because I like to be in control. I also hate KC And The Sunshine Band.

On the other hand, doing stuff "because one is bored" and "with energy to spare" are typical 7 motivations.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Slacker]

Not having much self-restraint is an Ep trait, isn't it? It could point equally to ESTp or ENTp.

[FDG]

- I annoy people to no end, for my own pleasure
- I am distastefully arrogant, and deliberately so, to annoy people

Why exactly? Can you elaborate on that?

Because when I'm bored, I've got extra energy to spare, so I will often annoy my feet-hating friend by sticking my foot in her face. It makes me laugh every time. It's a simple pleasure. Understand, or would like me to elaborate some more?

Humorously, my ENFj ex did the exact same thing. I don't hate feet though, so I don't know why she kept doing it. She thought it was funny.

You seem uber beta. Just admit it. I think your general attitude would tend to piss off gammas.

You =

He generally pisses me off, too. I really wish he could be more genuine.

[discojoe]

He generally pisses me off, too. I really wish he could be more genuine.

Denial/projection?

[FDG]

He generally pisses me off, too. I really wish he could be more genuine.

Denial/projection?

Ew, you think I act that way? It's pretty clear to me that I don't take myself an inch as seriously.

[discojoe]

He generally pisses me off, too. I really wish he could be more genuine.

Denial/projection?

Ew, you think I act that way? It's pretty clear to me that I don't take myself an inch as seriously.

I meant him.

[FDG]

He generally pisses me off, too. I really wish he could be more genuine.

Denial/projection?

Ew, you think I act that way? It's pretty clear to me that I don't take myself an inch as seriously.

I meant him.

Ah; well, I don't know - I think he is too young to be able to introspect the way he does, and thus his introspection comes across as less genuine than it would if it was done not purposefully. I've told him multiple times to go play football more and come back in 2 years.

[discojoe]

Ah; well, I don't know - I think he is too young to be able to introspect the way he does, and thus his introspection comes across as less genuine than it would if it was done not purposefully. I've told him multiple times to go play football more and come back in 2 years.

Both ENFjs I dated impressed me as being very introspective and intelligent. Something enchanting about being around them.

[posablethumb]

Holy fucking shit you guys are fucking retarded. Se is the ego, plain and simple. Everybody has an ego, everybody has Se. We are all born with this ego from the getgo, and our experiences with it helps position it within our 8 function places, along with the usage of the other functions. Se does not gather info anything like Ne, they are rote memorizationers. They are our will-powers, our motivation. It's the self-esteem that we need to pedestalize by getting it approved by those around us. Although Se types do have SOME Ne, they do not understand it because it beats at their ego. It is authority, something Ne despises, and believes has no place in this world. The only way we can get rid of Se(authority), is to realize that we are worthless. No one is worth any-fucking-thing. Nobody can help us realize this but ourselves. Those experienced with Se are skillful with it, as they are ingrained with society's standards and know what to expect. SOCIETY STANDARDS ARE SUBJECTIVE! It's external sense is irrational, and this dude has no Se. His ego seems primal, which is what it should be. It shouldn't be built up with fancy jewelry, cars, wants and all those shit. This guy is fucking ENTp, not ENFj. Not enneatype 3. This guys is full blown 8, he understands everybody's psychology in this whole damn board, don't you get it? The way you guys objectify against him shows your fucking insecurities, you guys don't know socionics. SE IS TRYING TO CORPORATIZE THE WORLD!! ARHGRGRGRHGRGHRGRHGRHGRGHRGRHG!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego#Ego

[FDG]

Ah; well, I don't know - I think he is too young to be able to introspect the way he does, and thus his introspection comes across as less genuine than it would if it was done not purposefully. I've told him multiple times to go play football more and come back in 2 years.

Both ENFjs I dated impressed me as being very introspective and intelligent. Something enchanting about being around them.

Explain yourself - do you think he comes across similarly, or you agree that his introspection looks forced?

[discojoe]

Ah; well, I don't know - I think he is too young to be able to introspect the way he does, and thus his introspection comes across as less genuine than it would if it was done not purposefully. I've told him multiple times to go play football more and come back in 2 years.

Both ENFjs I dated impressed me as being very introspective and intelligent. Something enchanting about being around them.

Explain yourself - do you think he comes across similarly, or you agree that his introspection looks forced?

Oops, I forgot to mention that they also seemed foolish and overly-idealistic, probably due to their age.

[discojoe]

Holy fucking shit you guys are fucking retarded. Se is the ego, plain and simple. Everybody has an ego, everybody has Se. We are all born with this ego from the getgo, and our experiences with it helps position it within our 8 function places, along with the usage of the other functions. Se does not gather info anything like Ne, they are rote memorizationers. They are our will-powers, our motivation. It's the self-esteem that we need to pedestalize by getting it approved by those around us. Although Se types do have SOME Ne, they do not understand it because it beats at their ego. It is authority, something Ne despises, and believes has no place in this world. The only way we can get rid of Se(authority), is to realize that we are worthless. No one is worth any-fucking-thing. Nobody can help us realize this but ourselves. Those experienced with Se are skillful with it, as they are ingrained with society's standards and know what to expect. SOCIETY STANDARDS ARE SUBJECTIVE! It's external sense is irrational, and this dude has no Se. His ego seems primal, which is what it should be. It shouldn't be built up with fancy jewelry, cars, wants and all those shit. This guy is fucking ENTp, not ENFj. Not enneatype 3. This guys is full blown 8, he understands everybody's psychology in this whole damn board, don't you get it? The way you guys objectify against him shows your fucking insecurities, you guys don't know socionics. SE IS TRYING TO CORPORATIZE THE WORLD!! ARHGRGRGRHGRGHRGRHGRHGRGHRGRHG!

I'm afraid suicide is your only option.

[posablethumb]

i was not looking for options, im looking for some damn sense!

[FDG]

i was not looking for options, im looking for some damn sense!

you're looking for extraverted sensing?

[discojoe]

i was not looking for options, im looking for some damn sense!

you're looking for extraverted sensing?

I think he's looking for to make sense of the giant paragraph of insanity he posted.

[Ezra]

Please.

Please.

Please.

Tell me.

You are.

ALL.

Taking.

The.

Piss.

This is unbelievable. I can't believe you can't trust what I'm saying!

And if your plan is to get me off this board, good luck trying to do it. It ain't happening. You will never get me to admit the falsity that I an ENFj.

[FDG]

i was not looking for options, im looking for some damn sense!

you're looking for extraverted sensing?

I think he's looking for to make sense of the giant paragraph of insanity he posted.

Ah, I can give it; posablethumb, everything you wrote is bullshit. Now, go in peace.

[discojoe]

Please.

Please.

Please.

Tell me.

You are.

ALL.

Taking.

The.

Piss.

This is unbelievable. I can't believe you can't trust what I'm saying!

And if your plan is to get me off this board, good luck trying to do it. It ain't happening. You will never get me to admit the falsity that I an ENFj.

Wanker.

[Ezra]

I think he is too young to be able to introspect the way he does, and thus his introspection comes across as less genuine than it would if it was done not purposefully. I've told him multiple times to go play football more and come back in 2 years.

Aye, indeed you have, and have you succeeded? No. FDG, as I've said before, I'm non-conformist. I don't like to subscribe to the whole bullshit culture of going out and getting trashed in the park, playing footie until you're old enough to club and get pissed every other night of the week on the town.

I just wish someone would believe me.

I really do feel massively insulted by everyone thinking I'm putting a front on. It's a nightmare for me, really, it is.

COME ON FDG! You know me from EIDB! Tell them I'm not fucking with anyone!

[posablethumb]

up the ass

[discojoe]

"Non-conformist" is Teenager for "conformist".

[discojoe]

up the ass

I'm sure you'd like that.

[posablethumb]

Holy fucking shit you guys are fucking retarded. Se is the ego, plain and simple. Everybody has an ego, everybody has Se. We are all born with this ego from the getgo, and our experiences with it helps position it within our 8 function places, along with the usage of the other functions. Se does not gather info anything like Ne, they are rote memorizationers. They are our will-powers, our motivation. It's the self-esteem that we need to pedestalize by getting it approved by those around us. Although Se types do have SOME Ne, they do not understand it because it beats at their ego. It is authority, something Ne despises, and believes has no place in this world. The only way we can get rid of Se(authority), is to realize that we are worthless. No one is worth any-fucking-thing. Nobody can help us realize this but ourselves. Those experienced with Se are skillful with it, as they are ingrained with society's standards and know what to expect. SOCIETY STANDARDS ARE SUBJECTIVE! It's external sense is irrational, and this dude has no Se. His ego seems primal, which is what it should be. It shouldn't be built up with fancy jewelry, cars, wants and all those shit. This guy is fucking ENTp, not ENFj. Not enneatype 3. This guys is full blown 8, he understands everybody's psychology in this whole damn board, don't you get it? The way you guys objectify against him shows your fucking insecurities, you guys don't know socionics. SE IS TRYING TO CORPORATIZE THE WORLD!! ARHGRGRGRHGRGHRGRHGRHGRGHRGRHG!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego#Ego

I will quote my post, because it is so quote-worthy.

[Ezra]

This is actually highly energising. I'm enjoying this. Fighting against all odds. No supporters. No clear definitions. This is what it is truly like to be an 8 - how I wish you could all feel it.

I FEEL ALIVE.

[discojoe]

This is actually highly energising. I'm enjoying this. Fighting against all odds. No supporters. No clear definitions.

I FEEL ALIVE.

I could kick your ass.

[posablethumb]

my final answer: this dude is an ENTp.

[Ezra]

This is actually highly energising. I'm enjoying this. Fighting against all odds. No supporters. No clear definitions.

I FEEL ALIVE.

I could kick your ass.

[discojoe]

my final answer: this dude is an ENTp.

my final answer: you are gay.

[Ezra]

discojoe, that is LOW man, very low.