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Thread: what relations/functions can you see from this conversation?

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    eunice's Avatar
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    Default what relations/functions can you see from this conversation?

    I had an IM conversation with an IXFx close friend of mine last night and we brought up an extremely trivial matter and had different opinions about it It was a rather immature topic but I believe that it clearly delineated where our preferences lie:

    [middle of conversation. Content changed a little to get rid of local slang and make it more understandable.]

    *Stacy: you know what? I feel that we used to be only acquiantances in secondary school, and it was only after college then did I regard you as a close friend.
    *Me: You are confusing me. I always thought I was in your special circle all this while.
    *Stacy: Really? What made you think so?
    *Me: If you only regard me as an acquiantance, why did you bother to go an extra mile for me? Acquiantances don't usually celebrate birthdays in a small group (our four-person clique in school) and give a personal touch to them. Moreover, we (as a clique) frequently hang out together after school and during the holidays and we have a lot of personal conversations going on between us.
    *Stacy: yeah, but our clique was formed because we share a common friend [my best friend Linda] and that was it. I treated you as any other acquiantances in school then. My friends back then were categorised into two sets: the secondary school ones (including you) and the close ones. The close friends are those whom I trust and share my personal problems too. Anyway, why are you so bothered by where you stand in my circle?
    *Me: I'm not really bothered. I'm just surprised that that was how you felt all this while.
    *Stacy: I see. You know what, girl? You really think too much. I can't believe you brought up something that happened so long ago. What really matters is the here and now. What's really important is that we are all happy now.
    *Me: I know. I'm just curious about it. That's all.
    *Stacy: yeah. You should stop bringing up about old stuff. Besides this friendship matter, I realize that you seem to bring up past events once in a while these days.
    *Me: I guess they just cropped up in my mind sometimes and I just want to make some clarifications so that I won't be bothered by unanswered questions.
    *Stacy: Well, don't even think about them at all. What's past is past.
    *Me: Well, I prefer to think it that way, but I guess your past sort of dictates who you are presently. I mean, what you are like presently is due to the decisions you have made in the past. It's all about cause and effect.
    *Stacy: I see. Hmmmm......just forget about them. There's nothing we can do but concentrate on the present. :wink:

    [the conversation continues.]

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    That Stacy girl would annoy me. Only focused upon the here-and-now? Obviously lacking any kind of Intuition what-so-ever.

    Edit: And any kind of strategic thinking, too.
    INTP/ILI(Ni) /5w4

    "When my time comes, forget the wrong that I've done.
    Help me leave behind some reasons to be missed."

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    Expat's Avatar
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    From this exchange, Stacy seems to be a Ne-Si quadra type rather than Ni-Se, where eunice seems more Ni focused.

    Stacy is also Fe>Fi, so if correct it would make her an Alpha type, most likely ISFp.

    I know that eunice has typed herself as ISFp lately -- but from this discussion, I'd say INFp is more likely. So the relationship would be of look-alike. And it makes sense. eunice is basically disappointed at realizing that she was not really part of the real "clique" - only in appearance - where for Stacy, the concept of "clique" was less important and she doesn't seem to understand why eunice should worry about it so much, especially now. eunice argues by focusing on Ni and Stacy replies by saying that Ni is irrelevant.

    Another way of interpreting it would be to see eunice as a Fi type, but then she'd be more likely ISFj and I'm not sure if that works.

    eunice -- were you disappointed that Stacy wasn't as close a friend as you thought, or rather that you feel "downgraded" in the clique, or both?
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    She doesn't sound like the best of friends...at least I wouldn't keep her very close...social heirarchy bullshit. =\
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    [21:29] hitta: idealism is just the gap between the thought of death
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    implied's Avatar
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    haha she reeks of Si/Fe.
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    Don't forget the the thehotelambush's Avatar
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    I think Expat is right about this. Maybe you should consider INFp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    From this exchange, Stacy seems to be a Ne-Si quadra type rather than Ni-Se, where eunice seems more Ni focused.

    Stacy is also Fe>Fi, so if correct it would make her an Alpha type, most likely ISFp.

    I know that eunice has typed herself as ISFp lately -- but from this discussion, I'd say INFp is more likely. So the relationship would be of look-alike. And it makes sense. eunice is basically disappointed at realizing that she was not really part of the real "clique" - only in appearance - where for Stacy, the concept of "clique" was less important and she doesn't seem to understand why eunice should worry about it so much, especially now. eunice argues by focusing on Ni and Stacy replies by saying that Ni is irrelevant.

    Another way of interpreting it would be to see eunice as a Fi type, but then she'd be more likely ISFj and I'm not sure if that works.

    eunice -- were you disappointed that Stacy wasn't as close a friend as you thought, or rather that you feel "downgraded" in the clique, or both?
    I actually felt both ways. I felt shortchanged after knowing that the same level of friendship wasn't reciprocated, and by describing me an "acquaintance", she was implying that she didn't even consider me as a friend. I would have preferred her to treat me normally (like an acquaintance ), rather than gave me the wrong idea that we are good friends through her actions.

    Even though our acquaintance phase had passed, I can't help but wonder whether I was considered merely a tag-along or outsider (in her opinion), especially after she mentioned that my best friend was the "glue" that put the four of us together. Although I have been "promoted to the rank of close friend", there was no difference in the way we interacted. Therefore, she left me quite confused and surprised after she mentioned that she had only regarded me as an acquaintance before we entered college.

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    HA Okay this conversation sounds familiar! I have been told on more than one occasion by an ISFp friend that I should relax and not worry about past events or feelings or whatever. That whole "you think too much" and "what's past is past" nonsense. Frustrating although I've learned that that's just the way he is. Soooo familiar though. hmph.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron
    HA Okay this conversation sounds familiar! I have been told on more than one occasion by an ISFp friend that I should relax and not worry about past events or feelings or whatever. That whole "you think too much" and "what's past is past" nonsense. Frustrating although I've learned that that's just the way he is. Soooo familiar though. hmph.

    But this Stacy person was tell her to let the past go as a way to divert attention away from her catty/mean/girl behavior.
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    [21:29] hitta: idealism is just the gap between the thought of death
    [21:29] hitta: and not dying
    .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clover
    But this Stacy person was tell her to let the past go as a way to divert attention away from her catty/mean/girl behavior.
    I don't think she was been mean. I find it hard to imagine an ISFp been one.

    I notice that Alpha types can be overfriendly in their interactions with people in general, to the extent that they seem to treat everyone like their best friend even though it might not be the case. I initially liked their ability to make everyone feel warm and welcome. However, I started to realize after a while that they seem to treat everyone the same way and it can be rather frustrating (especially when your boyfriend is one) because you know that you aren't treated more specially as compared to the rest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChibiKeba
    Are ISFp's really like that? That's not the impression I had of them at all, and the fact that so many people have thought of me as an ISFp or ANYTHING like that really annoys me now.
    One major reason for people to see you as ISFp is your art, which is Fe, Si, and suggests Ne.

    And no, ISFp's are not necessarily "like that", but they are more present-focused and that was one key issue there.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    escaping anndelise's Avatar
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    the conversation reminds me of the one i had with my istp best friend back in junior high...the conversation was when we were in 7th grade, walking home.

    i considered her my best friend, we always hung out together in school, we walked each other home,
    but we didn't spend time together past that...cuz my father never let me go anywhere

    i asked her if i was her best friend
    she looked at me funny and said no
    this totally surprised me
    then i asked if i was her second best friend
    again she said no
    you mean she's got two people that she prefers over me????
    then i asked if i was her third best friend
    she laughed and said no, and told me not to worry about it
    (ok ok, i admit, by this time i was acting kind of needy/desperate)
    she pointed out that we spend our school time together, we have fun, we're obviously friends, so what more is needed??

    it took me months to get over this devestating blow
    until i started to realize that just because she was my best friend doesn't necessarily mean that I am hers
    and which is more important to me? having her as my best friend....or being considered her best friend?
    i wouldn't have changed the times we spent together at all

    there were times when our friendship was tested:
    in high school, my father went through a lot of effort to try to keep her and i away from each other,
    calling the school to insist they seperate our classes, telling the school lies about her
    it got so bad that the school called her parents to find out what was going on
    her parents sat her down one evening and had a talk with her
    she explained to them a lot of what was going on in my home
    they informed her that if she wanted to continue being my friend, and wanted to fight the crap my father was doing, that they would support her
    and she did, she remained by my side through all the crap i went through
    she was a very very good friend to me

    alas, i wasn't such a good friend to her
    after i ran away, she invited me out to eat, or to hang out, etc
    but i was generally so caught up in my own little world that i never returned the attentions
    but, she didn't seem to mind....i don't know what she thought of those times, but i think if i were to ask her now, she'd say something like...."life happens"

    every once in a while we look each other up, catch up, and then "life happens" and we lose track of each other again
    but when we do talk...it's like ....like we're still "best friends"....and she still teases me about that conversation!!!




    which is more important to you, eunice?
    how she considered you a while back....or how she considers you now?
    and what IF she were to not consider you as her best friend..even now? does that change the fun you have with her? does that change how you feel towards her?
    which is more important to you? how you feel when you are with her...or how she feels about you?
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    it took me months to get over this devestating blow
    until i started to realize that just because she was my best friend doesn't necessarily mean that I am hers
    and which is more important to me? having her as my best friend....or being considered her best friend?
    which is more important to you, eunice?
    how she considered you a while back....or how she considers you now?
    and what IF she were to not consider you as her best friend..even now? does that change the fun you have with her? does that change how you feel towards her?
    which is more important to you? how you feel when you are with her...or how she feels about you?
    This is a really good question. I tend to have just a few very close friends and there is always one person I consider my "best" friend. It's not the title "best friend" that I need to have, it's just the feeling that I want to be considered special to them, as they are to me. And for some reason, the past matters to me. I don't know why! I just know that I would feel disappointed if I thought that in the past someone had been my best friend but that they considered me just one out of 5 other good friends they had. I know that's crazy, but it would make me feel somehow less important to them and thus it would taint my feelings about our friendship. Even though I wouldn't change any of the good times we had had, it would be my overall impression of the friendship that would suffer. Is that selfish? I strive for mutuality I guess. It definitely IS important how others feel about me, not just how I feel when I'm with them. Both are equally important. I wouldn't care as much how they felt about me if I didn't feel so strongly about them. The two go hand in hand for me.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    it took me months to get over this devestating blow
    until i started to realize that just because she was my best friend doesn't necessarily mean that I am hers
    and which is more important to me? having her as my best friend....or being considered her best friend?
    which is more important to you, eunice?
    how she considered you a while back....or how she considers you now?
    and what IF she were to not consider you as her best friend..even now? does that change the fun you have with her? does that change how you feel towards her?
    which is more important to you? how you feel when you are with her...or how she feels about you?
    This is a really good question. I tend to have just a few very close friends and there is always one person I consider my "best" friend. It's not the title "best friend" that I need to have, it's just the feeling that I want to be considered special to them, as they are to me. And for some reason, the past matters to me. I don't know why! I just know that I would feel disappointed if I thought that in the past someone had been my best friend but that they considered me just one out of 5 other good friends they had. I know that's crazy, but it would make me feel somehow less important to them and thus it would taint my feelings about our friendship. Even though I wouldn't change any of the good times we had had, it would be my overall impression of the friendship that would suffer. Is that selfish? I strive for mutuality I guess. It definitely IS important how others feel about me, not just how I feel when I'm with them. Both are equally important. I wouldn't care as much how they felt about me if I didn't feel so strongly about them. The two go hand in hand for me.
    Always remember the past, because things tend to get repeated a lot.
    INTP/ILI(Ni) /5w4

    "When my time comes, forget the wrong that I've done.
    Help me leave behind some reasons to be missed."

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    eunice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by ChibiKeba
    Are ISFp's really like that? That's not the impression I had of them at all, and the fact that so many people have thought of me as an ISFp or ANYTHING like that really annoys me now.
    And no, ISFp's are not necessarily "like that", but they are more present-focused and that was one key issue there.
    Yeah, definitely. It didn't occur to me that she was been mean and tactless. She probably assumed that I would be as present-focused as her and would not be bothered by how she thought of me in the past.


    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    which is more important to you, eunice?
    how she considered you a while back....or how she considers you now?
    and what IF she were to not consider you as her best friend..even now? does that change the fun you have with her? does that change how you feel towards her?
    which is more important to you? how you feel when you are with her...or how she feels about you?
    How she considers me now and how I feel when I'm with her are definitely more important. I can relate to what redbaron had mentioned as well. I would be disappointed if she didn't consider me as special as I have thought to be, but I don't think it would deter me from hanging out with her as usual. However, I will treat her more normally as a result-eg. become less concerned about her problems, share fewer secrets with her as compared to my good friends, become less willing to do her a favor when it is to my inconvenience etc.

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