snegledmaca

I feel the same as scarlet. According to your descriptions expat I'm a Ni subtype as well.

dreamer

Well, it's not impossible as it seems like Fe subtypes gets more insecure about how they present to the public so it's possible for Ni subtypes to be more sociable as they're not as anal about it. Just a fleeting thought.

__________________
INFP

Herzy

All of them!

__________________

7w8 sx/so

Baby

Oh, right. I'm versatile.

__________________
"... have patience with everything unresolved in your heart and to try to love the questions themselves as if they were locked rooms or books written in a very foreign language. Don't search for the answers, which could not be given to you now, because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps then, someday far in the future, you will gradually, without even noticing it, live your way into the answer."
- Rainer Maria Rilke, Letters to a Young Poet

Expat

I wrote them based on my understanding that INFp-Fe---> closer to ISFp, and INFp-Ni ----> closer to INTp, with a bit of my understanding of Meged's descriptions and of people I know.

Perhaps my descriptions are rubbish, but on the other hand it would make sense -- after all, aren't you closer to INTp than to INFp? Also as a 5?

Could you tell us precisely how you identify more with Fe than Ni, especially in Meged's descriptions?

__________________
, LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp

snegledmaca

Yes to both. And just so you don't get the wrong impresion, I don't find your descriptions rubbish at all, quite the contrary, they're making me seriously consider Ni as my subtype.

Well they both fit well and to be honest I can't really make a choice from reading the descriptions as no single part of the profiles can be extracted from which I can make a choice.

But on a general scale of what the profiles are trying to convey, I identify more with the Fe subtype cause it describes people who seem to be emotionally manipulative in themselves and others more then the people in the Ni subtype description.

On myself, I'm very much dependent on monitoring the internal states of people for reassurance of things being right. And this includes active manipulation of such states to ensure my safety or as you put it the heading of my boat. This is my modus operandi.
IMO this describes dependency on the usage of a producing function that deals with internal states of objects or in other words Fe in INFp-s (Or ISFp-s). I just can't see myself where a state of manipulation of images takes precedence over this.

Expat

Yes, but this is the essence of the INFp type, that is, producing Fe ----> accepting Ni. This doesn't change with subtype.

To carry the boat image further, I think that both subtypes would be sitting at the observation point enjoying the journey itself, but the Fe subtype would check the emotions of the people on the boat more often; the Ni subtype would concentrate more on the river itself, focusing on those people a bit less. But it's the same mechanism, the same interaction. It doesn't really change.

__________________
, LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp

snegledmaca

Yes, that had occurred to me as the functions are independent from each other and contrasting them one only gets two separate processes.

But is this really so?

I do the monitoring and heading control automatically and intertwined, a change in course implies a change in mood and vice versa. You could say the mood is how I steer the ship so a preference for one would automatically imply a preference for the other.
I'm now puzzled and skeptical as to how can a preference even exist. Better mood control implies better steering, better steering implies better mood control.

Expat

Ok, what about this - -

Both the INFp and the INTp's Ni receive input from both Te and Fe.

In the case of the INFp-Fe, his journey is influenced by Te only minimally, perhaps less than 10%.

For the INFp-Ni, getting closer to INTp-Ni, it's perhaps 20% Te, 80% Fe.

So there is a preference, but it doesn't change, it's on automatic pilot, as you seemed to indicate.

For the INTp, it's the reverse.

And a 50-50 Fe-Te preference would be the famous INXp crosstype, assuming that they exist.

__________________
, LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp

snegledmaca

You're implying a fluid state of psyche, you're implying fluid roles of functions in the psyche as oppose to static one.

I could see that.

Ok, let's say it's so. The influence of Te is lessened in the Fe subtype. What about the dominant position? What makes one think that it wouldn't play at least a little part in the dominant position, if only a fraction of a 1%? How would this reflect on the subtype?

If the fluid state is actual it would imply that all functions are in all positions just distributed over them. If you add up all the percents of the roles they play you should then get 100%.

EDIT: Perhaps fluid isn't the right word as your not implying that these percentages can change. More like intertwined, overlapping.

Expat

Well, it starts to get complicated. But we all know that we don't use only our dominant function. We use all the functions.

If I were to take it to the dominant function and look at the ISFp, Fe ----> Si. The ISFp is also there at the ship, but probably not concerned so much with the journey. He's concerned about his sensorial senses, his sense of physical we-being, and that is provided by the emotional state of those people in the ship.

If we stay only with INFp/ISFp, since INFps also use Si, we can also say that the Fe input they get affects their Si, but now which proportions are we talking about?

It starts to get complex, and it certainly is -- as complex as the psyche of a real human being, rather than a simplified type.


Well perhaps they do change, this is one of the discussions here. According to Smilingeyes's interpretation, even the dominant function changes along the temperament.

But I am trying to explain here how the subtypes may differ, assuming that they are more or less fixed, even as remaining still the same type.

__________________
, LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp

snegledmaca

I'm not really following you here. What are you talking about, what proportions of affect? Only through basic interactions can functions influence each others functioning. The Fe input/output cannot affect Si-s input/output, it can only affect the conglomeration of Si – Fe or the input/output of Fi, Te or Ti.
The Fe input influences the ISFp who then influences the Si. The same for INFP or any other type for that matter. Are you talking about this proportion of influence? I understood that you were talking about a direct influence.

Expat

I'm not sure I'm following you there. Are you seeing Fe-Si as a sort of rigid block, as Fe-Ni for INFps? That is the case according to model A, but if we consider subtypes as INFp-Fe getting closer to ISFp-Fe, we have to assume that these blocks may be more flexible.

__________________
, LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp

snegledmaca

No, I mean these blocks exists.

Consider it like a regular 2D figure where each corner is connected with a line to another corner, say an octagon. One of these lines is between Ni and Fe and by affecting say Fe we affect all of the lines it possesses.
But that's affecting the lines and by affecting Fe we do not affect Ni despite the fact that we affect the line between them.
We're just moving the Fe corner around.
But by moving the Fe corner we are affecting the Fi, Te and Ti as they are all mutually dependent as they process the same information.
By moving the Fe corner we move the Te, Ti and Fi corners as well.

That's what I'm trying to say.

A INFp Fe subtype would in no way influence or bring that person closer to being a Si type as the Fe doesn't affect Si at all. But it might make them appear to be similar.

Expat

Well, that's possible. Personally I don't think that my Te is only affected by Ni, I think it can also be affected by Si.

I think that Fe subtypes of INFp and ISFp do appear to be similar, even as they remain different types, sure. But as to Fe not affecting Si at all in the case of INFps - *shrugs*. I wouldn't think so, but then we are getting in the area where we could only be totally certain if we could actually enter the minds of other types.

__________________
, LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp

XoX

Well, I'm not a Fe-subtype if I'm INFp.

misutii

Guys if it helps at all this year I made a giant socionics compendium and combined all the information i could find into it. Also edited the russian translations to make more sense (subjective translation, of course, but I'm INFp so it may actually help) I have 3 descriptions collected for each subtype, I didn't write ANY of these, only translated them from Russian sources with an online translator, then made them work in the English language:

-----------------------------------------------------------------
INFp SUBTYPES



Intuitive (Ni) subtype: (The Idealist)

(Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The intuitive subtype appears as a quiet, tactful, languid and diffident individual. They seem torn off from reality, inert and poorly adapted to life. However, such impressions are erroneous, for they possess a fine intuition, which aids them in establishing useful connections and obtaining support from influential people. Seem externally serene but sentimentally are disposed to experience moodiness and bouts of melancholy. While their voice at times seems monotonous they often induce a light surprise, even full interest, from the interlocutor. Outwardly are pensive, slightly strained/intense.. Prone to emanate sadness masked in sardonic irony. Speech is measured, smooth and intimately heart-felt. On their face they almost constantly exude a polite half-smile that easily wins people’s trust. Gestures are modest, shy. Gait is ponderous, elegant.

(Victor Gulenko) Facial expression is typically interrogative, and they seem calm, dreamy, and contemplative. Their line of behaviour is frequently passive. Romantic spirits. They live in the world of illusions, and they attempt to avoid negative emotions. They can be optimistic. They shrink away from conflict situations and support compromises. They are restrained in their clothing, elegant and refined. They can fulfill the functions of an abstract thinker, work in psychology and psychotherapy.

(Sexual behaviour) Act slowly, are patient and shy. Romantic, elevate themselves in feelings and dream about a great and prolonged love. Yielding in everyday demands (will try to be economically practical if their partner desires). Appear sexually timid, but their aim is for sexual harmony and the reaching of spiritual and physical perfection. Often act somewhat unsure of themselves. Require a volitional, decisive, active and energetic partner, whom possesses feelings of humor and inspiring confidence.




---------------------
Ethical (Fe) subtype: (The Diplomat)

(Valentine Meged & Anatoly Ovcharov) The ethical subtype provides the impression of a soft, charming and emotional person. Usually look inspired and optimistic. Possess a fine sense of humor allowing them to list their problems and failures while smiling. Are ironic, crafty, unpredictably and inconsistent in behaviour and conversation. Creating original contrasts, they can unexpectedly prick and then just as quickly embrace/kiss. Artistic and charming; are eloquent in dialogue, occasionally portraying shades of familiarity and impudence. They’re generally affable, kind and careful. Easily draw attention and thereby attract people; talent towards persuasion: states requests in such a manner that it is difficult to refuse them. Movements are graceful as is their gait. Speech is emotional, rich with shades, sometimes melodious.

(Victor Gulenko) Flatters and is charming and communicable. If they see negative emotions in the people around them, they will try to arrange things so that people will calm down. They will mobilize well in dangerous situations. Loves to be in the centre of attention and dramatize proceedings, possesses a sense of humour. They easily manipulate by intonation and voice; can work successfully as a journalist --- They easily succeed in enticing the person they talk to. Outwardly they can appear extravagant; frequently takes a bohemian and bright form.

(Sexual behaviour) Strongly emotional and they express their emotions easily. Are coquettish, enticing, and dress with taste. The aesthetes in relations, they value good manners. Know how to provoke their partner’s initiative. Usually remain diplomatic but sometimes become capricious, exacting and easily agitated, however they are easily appeased. Love sexual games and prolonged preparations. Need a strong, loyal, practical, sensitive and initiative-taking partner; and sufficient support in their lives.

__________________
INFp-Ni

Starfall

Thanks for the descriptions misutii.

__________________
"Outside is pure energy and colorless substance, all of the rest happens through the mechanism of our senses. Our eyes see just a small fraction of the light in the world. It is a trick to make a colored world, which does not exist outside of human beings"

MOP

I you tubed infp and I came across these two videos. They are may or may not be infps but if they are they are different subtypes.

The question is who is who ?






Type 1 seems more confident, speaks well and is very charming.




I have noticed Type 2 has similar vocal patterns to ScarlettLux

her voice tends to go up and down and she pauses at unusual times, seems sleepy

Jarno

I'm quite confident that the first one is IEI-Ni.

I'm just slightly confident that the second is IEI-Ni.
Though she might the other subtype or even another type.

__________________
ILI -Te